What went wrong? No seriously, what is it about Super that is just so infuriating? Yes...

What went wrong? No seriously, what is it about Super that is just so infuriating? Yes, DBZ was dumb but it relished in its over the top chaos and had its own unique charm to it that people still love it and enjoy it to this day. What is it that Super lacks and why does it just make people cringe?

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Honestly your image alone should be enough. It looks like a goddamn chinese knock-off. Dragonball's artstyle has only gotten worse through the years and Super is the peak of shit visuals.

You like DBZ because you watched it as a kid. You were able to overlook the flaws and just enjoy it, so now you look back on it fondly because it is a symbol of childhood pleasure. Whereas you watch Super as an adult and notice all the flaws, and they are exaggerated compared to your rose-tinted memories of enjoying DBZ as a child.

Pretty much this. Take a look at this visual and it's blatantly obvious that Toriyama stopped giving a shit years ago. Super is just more Dragon Ball purely for the sake of more Dragon Ball since it's guaranteed to make money.

Super is bad! Z is bad too but MUH CHILDHOOD XD: The Thread

At least the art and animation was good.

Why the fuck did Toriyama complain about DBE when this shit it's at its level? Since when brain dead Goku with rainbow transformations is better than Holywood Goku?

it's just you user.

>At l-least the other shit w-was less smelly XD

The city of DBcucks

Is it safe to like GT now?

Yes, it's been retroactively approved

You must have some sort of brain damage.

In a year you'll all be liking Super when the next DB series comes out.

Bullshit. Even as a child, me and everyone else were aware of Dragon Ball's flaws. We would all constantly joke about how it took 50 episodes for shit to actually happen along with the rest of the power level nonsense. What Z had over Super is one obvious thing: Personality.

You see, DBZ and Toriyama were incredibly self aware about how nonsensically over the top they were and they just relished in it. Throughout the majority of the series you could tell that Toriyama was just having a blast telling such an over the top action story.

Super on the other hand is just blatantly shoehorned and forced when Toriyama has long since moved on from Dragon Ball and would rather work on something else, but he can't since Dragon Ball is the only thing he can make that'll sell. Toriyama has lost all his passion and interest in Dragon Ball, so of course it'll just come off as dull, shoehorned, and uninspired.

Toriyama has lost all his passion as an artist and has become an empty hollow shell of his former self, and Super is a reflection of his current state: a man who stopped giving a shit and only cares about making his next paycheck. It's actually quite sad.

Super is fun in a lot of ways but it's egregiously derivative. Remember Frieza? Remember Future Trunks? Most character moments hit similar Greatest Hits notes.

The fact so much of its time has been spent on underdelivering tournaments doesn't help either, especially when the multiple universes reveal in BoG at one point seemed promising and expansive.
Dragon Ball is a legitimately good manga, despite Toriyama's issues with plotting and character juggling. Toyotaro isn't bad but there's really no comparison.

user, are you stupid? How much time do you think it takes to make an anime?

Z was some very similar shit, you were just younger or something.

The only good DB part is DB.

>Super is fun in a lot of ways
Good joke, the only good and funny episode was Pan's.

>Winnie the Pooh is a dragon ball villain
Wow.

>You don't like my generic shonenshit? d-do you have brain damage or something XD

The absolute state of DBcucks

Soon

It is shonenshit, doesn't mean it's not entertaining.
Keep throwing that cuck word around though, maybe the meaning will change.

>W-well you're right, it's shit b-but I like shit XD

I'm glad you finally accepted it

>What is it that Super lacks
A soul.
>and why does it just make people cringe
The fact that the franchise has been milked into oblivion. It should have died a long time ago but people didn't learn from GT.

Meaning that it's not deep, but manages to be entertaining in other ways.
Not everything has to be some san-gatsu like show to entertain.

Do you have a stutter in real life as well?

At least with GT the writers were actually trying to do something interesting. With Super, nobody's even trying.

Toei is cashing in and the guy behind it is now rich and no longer the coked up geniis mangaka manwhore who'd get into drunken brawls and bang schoolgirls and cakes three at a time.

He's a beaten down older man who's been dragged out of happy retirement to work on/repair toei's bullshit.

He's also the punching back and man who'll be responsible for all of the stupid bullshit that goes on. with this clusterfuck of a series.
The only thing that he actually brought to the table was a wafer thin outline that is more then likely bullshit that toei claims exists and the S cells thing that is actually once you think about it a neat way to bring back the REAL saiyajins without them all being bullshit super powerful or going SSJ with only tingles and dyke rage and being called mean things.

Now onto the problems

Substandard art
Shit tier battle choreography
Terrible writing
Complete misunderstanding of why DB(Actually DBZ)became a phenomenon
An actual distaste for the IP
No ability to create decent villians stories or battles
Marketers in suits and VAs throwing their weight around were steering the project.
Not a coked up prime toriyama that was between bar fights and whores and having to listen to at the time(in some cases if you ignore the buu and teen gohan saga)shitter editors.
Oh and goku is voiced by an octaganarian. Even the people from back then were slightly offput by goku's still childish voice when they first heard it.
She can kill it and SHOULD have been Gohan's voice. But her as adult Goku? Someone should have been fired.
This is also the Goku, then Saiyajin, then whatever the producers think the can get the idiot children to buy series.

For gods, sake. SSJB exists as a tie in for TORIKO!

Z, especially in America, became big over how hardcore it was. Super is even less serious than Dragon Ball; it has no idea on how to manage drama. Its tone is light despite focusing on a life or death battle royale effecting the fate of multiple universe and unlike with Dragon Ball its jokes, used at the most inappropriate of times, are unfunny. Meanwhile Goku, the MC of the show, has become unlikable.

I'm okay with Super.

GT was terrible and worse than Super so they clearly didn't try hard enough.

Nothing went wrong. I'm okay with it.

I mean, its a hell of a lot better than the usual garbage SoL and CGDCT every season. Feels like once the shounen dries up, I'm just going to go back to playing video games and grind FGO.

Yes. GT is bad.
But is SUPERIOR to Super.
That is the bad thing.
A handful of well done battles(no that kefla thing or any UI thing isn't it)using a prettied up Z style does not make up for how overwhelmingly bad it's all been.
The hand full of things and tiny speck of potential it had was SQUANDERED in favor of shiling nonsense.

Super takes all of Z's flaws and amplifies them, which is why you find Z easier to stomach despite having similar issues. Power level inconsistency, transformations, tone. All of these things existed in Z, but got much worse in Super.

That said, Super is still fun to watch.

This is a true crossboarder. Ive seen that term thrown around so much here but this is the first time in a while ive seem a post that deems it appropriate

>But is SUPERIOR to Super.
Nope, keep trying Pedro

modern toei just sucks

>You like DBZ because you watched it as a kid.
I watched alot of things as a kid

I can still go back to dbz and have fun

The only thing I truly hate is how cheap the fights feel. There are just some uber lazy ones where it's nothing but fast moving and lens flare explosions that annoy the fuck out of me. I'm not saying all of DBZ was great, but it was a series that pioneered fighting action, and yet so many of its siblings outdo it in this day and age.

It began by rehashing two story arcs we had already seen without really contributing anything extra.

It has, at times, been plagued by truly awful animation with well animated episodes being few and far between.

The Universe 6 arc was fairly decent, it kept things simple and potentially introduced some new storylines.

Black/Zamasu arc was really enjoyable with it's dark future narrative and giving us future trunks back, but really really fucked up with the asspulls and weird shit at the end.

Universal Tournament arc......... fucking amazing idea, but it was far too ambitious and as a result the execution has been abysmal and it failed to live up to expectations.

I'd have loved to see more interaction between the other universes, rather than almost everything from u7's perspective. Lots of fights felt rushed, and so much has clearly been pulled straight out of someone's ass without a second thought as to how it tarnishes the integrity of the series overall. So Jiren is now super arrogant and very vulnerable, despite the last year building him up to be this supremely noble superhero type figure.

But at least they'll kept Mexico happy with the last couple of eps. All hail Goku Blanco

super making me nostiglic for GT

fuck you, super

GT didn't diminish Z with awful retcons. Zamasu, regarded as the least smelly shit in a toilet bowl of shit, was a kick in the balls to anyone who likes Future Trunks.

>You like DBZ because you watched it as a kid
I watched DBZ in waiting for BoG to come out, DBZ isn't nearly bad as Super. Stop using "nostalgia" as a reason why Super is so shit, it's still terrible in comparison.

>Z was some very similar shit
wrong

thanks to super, the good points of Z are more evident

Gotta disagree, GT is definitely worse.
It's 100% forgettable, soulless garbage. Nothing lingers. Not a single line of dialogue left an impact, not a trace of characterization comes to mind. I can't even recall the names of all 7 of those stupid dragons in the final arc. All that remains are basically the stupidest transformations and concepts they introduced.

In contrast, even if it's largely unimpressive in several ways, I can say that DBS has characters and moments that'll stick to me. I could go in deeper but that alone makes it better in my honest opinion.

GT was riding the creative train from Z

after 20 years, everyone has lost their spark

>GT was terrible and worse than Super
wrong

>Stop using "nostalgia" as a reason why Super is so shit

I'm not, I'm pointing out that DBZ was also shit and you changed, not anime

>I mean, its a hell of a lot better than the usual garbage SoL and CGDCT every season.
no. it's not

Zamasu, the gods of destruction, specially Beerus, are great user.

The manga does everything so much better...

but he went crazy with the power scale... it's all about goku and vegeta now...

>shonentards discussing about which shit smells better

Man I love this place

>It's 100% forgettable, soulless garbage.
fuck you

youtube.com/watch?v=DJcuDgVYjgI

>wrong
wrong

No blood

You're right. It did have a good OP. So, what parts of the anime really moved you, user?

Zamasu was without a doubt the worst and dumbest canon boss DB has ever had.
The GoD are good as a concept. Nothing more.
Beerus is outright MOGGED by Champa as well.

>posted smug image from shonenshit

sasuga, user-kun

...

what's the problem with zamasu...

my problem with this arc is about plotholes due to time travel.

>You like DBZ because you watched it as a kid. You were able to overlook the flaws and just enjoy it, so now you look back on it fondly because it is a symbol of childhood pleasure
You're literally describing childhood nostalgia, retard.

let me tell you your head canon didnt happen and you make a shitposting thread everyday filled with memes and over hype that you hate every little thing thats not a 100/100 episode

The character designs and transformations could be a lot better. Jiren and Toppo's destruction designs are pretty good though

It's still better then Super user.
That's saying something.

The fights were shit, a lot of the ideas behind it are bad and the villians were mostly shit.
But it was a better overall package.

That's embarassing.
SSJ4 is still considered more canon and is more well liked then technicolor hair saiyajins.

that looks pretty cool

what parts of db or z moved you?

Don't mind him, he's jsut some retarded tryhard who doesn't know how to troll

They truly were dragon Ball super

>Jiren and Toppo's destruction designs are pretty good though
>Generic muscle and Toppo: Edge mode
>good
Actually the worst type of Dragon Ball design.

He's poorly conceived
His reasons for doing everything managed to be illogical, stupid, and beyond fucking generic.
He exists as a way to handwaive the retardation of yet ANOTHER granny goku voiced evil goku.
The entire fucking story was idiot.

The CONCEPT and design of the character was better then the execution. The fact that black exists made the character outright shit and make no fucking sense what so ever.

I would have rather seen him get power from the demons and have been a former kai who was cast down for killing and destroying life and leading to the destruction of worlds rather then him being some edgy twink.
His wishes with and use of the super dragon balls STILL DOESNT MAKE ANY GODDAMNED SENSE

The entire idea is just a big goddamned waste of everyon'es time and that arc is the worst canon arc in DB history. YES IT BEATS OUT TEEN GOHAN!

most normies are totally down with super though. The people cringing are shitposters on Sup Forums

Your argument for it being better is that "it's better". I'm not convinced. You didn't address anything I said at all or provide a counterexample.

The only specific point you brought up were transformations. I'll say this now: I don't give a single shit about transformations. Transformations have been dumb since the Buu arc. It's all shit. SSJ3 is awful, Fusion is bad (The fusion characters tend to have interesting moves for fights, but the core concept is weak and the designs are terrible), SSG is bad, SSGSS is bad, SSJ4 is bad, etc. UI is a little bit fun because it has lead to some unique choreography and initially had an okay design, but UI (completado) is quick to correct that one virtue. The fact that people (not necessarily you, mind, just people I've seen on the internet) base which sequel they like better almost entirely on which transformation is "cooler" is legitimately mindblowing.

Oh, silly me
Thanks for the source

You're holding Super up to higher standards than DBZ, or in other words, you're giving DBZ a nostalgia pass.

It was explained in the manga that he fused with a human so he never forget the mistake of letting humans living in the world.

>Goku and Piccolo team-up
>Goku dying 5 episodes in
>Piccolo training Gohan
>Piccolo saving Gohan
>Z Fighters getting thrashed by Nappa
>Goku returning
>Krilling letting Vegeta go
>etc..

that looks like shit to anyone not from the southern hemisphere, which are the only opinions that matter.

Now fuck off and get back to doing a shitty fan animation of Blanco vs Jiren in the last episode so Toei can steal it from you and finish their work.

even if you compared super to modern shonenshit, it's very bad

>patrician tier
watched DB first

>56% tier
watched DBZ first

>underage tier
GT/DBS first

>grandpa tier
read the manga back in 1984

REMINDER SUPERFAG.YOU CAN SAY EVERYTHING YOU WANT.BUT GTFAG WILL GET THE LAST LAUGH.

>At least the art and animation was good.
No, DBZ had just as many problems as Super did. The internet back then didn't have the convenient tools to clip them and point them out.

goku died at the end of GT

Are they? The normies seem to take the biggest offense to Goku's voice and retarded, amoral character.

I only got to watch DB when I got a modem

>SSG Gogeta with a Fur Coat

>ssj 1 is just yellow hair
>ssj 2 is just the same shit but with static
>ssj 3 is just more yellow hair
>ssjg is just base form and anorexic with red hair instead
>ssjb is just, well, blue ssj
>UI is just goku with sparkles
>etc
This is why I love Oda so much, the designs are fuckin cash

no one cares about the opinions of spics and niggers

Did he I thought he just went with the dragon

>cant read
ESL detected

z had good episodes

all of super looks like garbage

>At least with GT the writers were actually trying to do something interesting.
Super rehashed a lot of ideas that have already been done.
Baby Vegeta arc was just plans to eradicate the saiyans, Super 17 arc was Super 13, and the Shadow Dragons were just the Red Ribbon army generals all over again.

>It looks like a goddamn chinese knock-off
Pretty much this. Everything about super feels like a fanfiction.

SS1 and 2 are fantastic, so are fusions. The rest can fuck off though.

Kaioken is best transformation.

>all of super looks like garbage
super has good episodes

>It's 100% forgettable, soulless garbage. Nothing lingers
SS4 will be remembered for much longer then anything that came out of super.

>Goku with red blue pink white hair
>vegita with kawaii bluer form
>Broly with boobs

wtf, fusions are great, SSJ2 was okay.

Toryama relied too much on transformations, I guess, mostly, to sell toys.

Kaioken is a technique not really a transformation. Only thing that changes is his aura.

Aura transformation, correct.

Super is better than forgettable run of the mill shonen like black clover or light novel adaptation #290121

*vegeta

>sell toys/animate
>"hey, let's just change the color of their hair... less work for y'all eh? :>)"
shit, I think I just red pulled myself