It's been 3 years since I've started programming mostly in C++ (11, mind you), and I fucking love it

It's been 3 years since I've started programming mostly in C++ (11, mind you), and I fucking love it.

Why does it still get so much hate? C++11 is fantastic.

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because you're using y and i use x

Cum pile times

>not putting your IDE on an SSD that's run through PCI
>not having an 17-6950X with 126gb RAM at 3000mHz

Yeah, I really am a pleb for not having that compile server farm.
/thread

>17-6950X
>17

Java is better because nothing is better than getting faster and faster computers that run 10x slower code in virtual machines.

Tell me about the learning process

>3000mHz
3Hz?

It's aight. Main complaint is preprocessor (not really C++'s fault) and syntax is getting progressively grosser as more features are added.

C++ is a great language, but I still find the hardest task to be solving the BS surrounding it.

Like figuring out why cmake doesn't link correctly or what you missed to set up the environment.

I agree. Most of the bullshit with c++ is the c++ environment. Linking libraries, garbage standard library, etc..

Some discover that they like to eat shit. It's not because they like to eat shit that shit is good. I'm glad you enjoy shit and eat it user.

what is wrong with the standard library?

>I've only used C++ to make a hello world in class and I currently have no job

still slow as fuck to compile

wait, then what alternative to C++ do you suggest if compile times are the main drawback for you? please dont say rust

Bullshit.
It's annoying, sure.
But once everything is set up and works
it's fine.
You don't have to touch often.

However, the langauage itself and the standard library are a constant struggle.

there are people love it and there are people hate it. people who love it are idiots.

Yes.

No,

everytime i start to learn c++ i find myself asking "why not python?" i then cease learning c++ and go back to work

because this is a board full of pajeet javafags, hipster webdevs, and elitist Cfags

>C++11 is fantastic.
Only if you don't look carefully.

Because it's very easy to fingerprint different styles and so it's very easy to catch CS majors cheating by copy-pasting. Therefore everyone hates it and prefers autistic languages that force one style like java and python.

That's true for literally any language.

>that force one style like java and python
That's just formatting.
It's really the least distinguishing thing about your coding style.

People shouldn't like what I don't like

C++ is an insult every practice built by computer scientists over generations.

> problems stop being annoying once they are solved

wew

Java is never near 10x slower... Maybe 3x BEFORE jvm warmup

java is 100x slower than c

Not even remotely true

The point is you setup your build system ONCE.
You have to deal with C++ bullshit ALL THE TIME.

because this is Sup Forums and everyone hates the language they don't use and loves the one they do.

it depends on the vm and code that is running. if it's pure algorithmic code without io, and if jvm is a standard stack machine implementation (dalvik on android is register based), it would be 100x slower than optimized C code.

>you will never decide which language to learn because of intimidating flame wars

It hurts

Pick any. It really doesn't matter.
They're all shit one way or the other.

if in doubt learn C. first programming language is the most important one because it shapes your brain, the way you think, if it's basic, you can never be a good programmer again, as master dijkstra states.

No it's not, that's a totally baseless claim. No benchmark has ever shown Java being remotely close to 100x slower than optimized C. Even most benchmarks don't bother with the warmup phase which compiles the code to native.

C/C++/java are all a good place to start. Not everything about them is initially intuitive which is why I think it's a good place to start. If you can hack it in these languages, you can pretty much hack it in anything until you start getting into things like assembly.

Afterwards. Go directly to python. It's easy to pick up and you can learn more advanced things and make some neat stuff.

Look at this: benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/java.html

These are all pure CPU algorithms compared between languages. Worst case Java is 3.5x slower, other times it's almost equal. I don't even think they warmed up the JVM before doing these benchmarks anyway so it's almost totally irrelevant.

>ide

My company doesn't use a compiler that is fully C++11.

C, D, Pascal, Ada, Zig. Also, Rust, because unlike with C++ their compile time issues aren't because of a flawed design but a flawed implementation.

I like it. I feel like I get the pros of Java and C with C++.

args*

*

>I'm retarded and can't grasp how computers work, so I prefer to use languages designed for retards

fake, I learned haskell and now am learning c
c goes about a different way and is more barebones. causing me to shift my thinking

int main(int argc, char* argv[])
{
return 0;
}

int argc is how many arguments are provided
char* argv[] is a char pointer array of the arguments provided

are you disabled?

ARG

cliché
é

>I'm too dumb for pointers
kys, you deserve python

C++ is great for something like an in memory dbms working on futuristic shit like non-volatile memory.

C++ is a nightmare for large distributed systems and networking like what google was doing for 10 years before they invented Go for that work.

It wasn't a strawman, you are literally that retarded.
also if you think C/C++ is "really hard" maybe you're not cut out for CS

I don't hate it, I dislike it. It's neat to make something on Linux and run it on Windows, for ex. in Java or Python.

Portability is not a meme.

Watch this: youtube.com/watch?v=ASVB8KAFypk

And no, he's not pajeet

c is love c is life

The problem C++ was trying to solve was noble. the execution was a disaster. The language is too big. There are 1,000 different ways to do the same thing. People tried to overcome this with "patterns".
But, if you want to develop a large project that executes quickly. You don't have much of a choice but to use C++.

Why don't you learn Asm then?

for you

>First programming language is the most important
I started with Game Maker Language for fuck sake, he can learn C/C++ later

The one thing that annoys me most about C++ is that references can't be null. Also namespace access syntax and C backwards compatibility.

I already know various assembly languages.

I started with java then c then c++. I learn a new language from dummies guide to. Then more complicated books, it really doesn't matter.

there's still go

>GC

>python
I'll never understand why someone would truly like that language

How the fuck did nobody comment on the "126gb" of ram comment? Sup Forums you have let me down.

>The one thing that annoys me most about C++ is that references can't be null

I'll give a pro to C# in allowing me to check references for null

fake and gay
The only thing your first programming language needs to do, is do nothing that deviates excessively from the norm.

If you spent the first year or so learning some asinine shit like fucking Piet, you would probably pick up a bunch of stupid fucking habits that would take years to unlearn.

But if you learned something more towards the norm, be it C/++/#, Java, or literally any FP language and most imperative-like languages, you would be fine.

Granted, learning something like Assembly or VB is going to give you stupid habits like using gotos instead of structuring your code, or calling shit "if loops", but if those oldfags from the 80's could get used to shit changing and unlearn things, so can you.

c makes use of an "end string" char, correct?

Son, you are not allowed to love or hate programming language. Only your employer is allowed to. Don't fool yourself and think this is better and that's not. Programmers are like other forms of slaves. They are slaves to businessmen. They just happen to be smarter. Smart slaves.

pointers r ard.

Incredibly confusing early on. after years of never touching them. They should be used early by having people use C and coming across char* etc so the idea of how they're used sinks in early.

Nothings more confusing than coming across a piece of code that's a ball of single character variables covered in & and *. It's important syntax and functionality that I wish I'd come across years ago instead of having gone down the VB -> python -> java -> c# - >c++ path.

yes, a null terminator, ascii value 0 or '\0'

>Use a unity build in small to medium sized projects
>Still compile faster than using a build system

>Why does it still get so much hate?

Because it's hard and most of Sup Forums are the equivalent of Python hobbyists even though they think they're not.

The problem is, C++ is a huge language. It's almost like a family of langauges. This is a strength but also a weakness because it's very hard to learn and git gud. It's also an issue when you read someone else's code. You can be totally awesome in C++ standards and then you read code where some dude did "template magic" and you understand nothing at all..


This.

C teaches you a lot about computers, not only the structures and memory allocation, but also stuff like system signals, the stuff you can do with the console and so on..

Why not C++14? I used C++ a few times but with high level frameworks so didn't dive into it that much.

I have wanted to learn C for a while, but I can't think of anything interesting to do with it that wouldn't be more practical with a higher level language.

Lmao. (^: I woke up scared from a nightmare just now and this made me feel better.

Speed?

>he fell for the 126gb meme
better?

>Not just picking one and joining the flame wars.

Because it's not c

Well, when technology takes your job away. you'll want to be that kind of slave.

This

The problem I have with c++ is the books/tutorials.
They are "tutorial for beginners" but, as a beginner, I couldn't understand shit.
Microsoft did a great job with that c# step-by-step book.

benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/sometimes-people-just-make-up-stuff.html#jvm-startup-time

>learn just one

kill yourself.

i love python for trying something out fast or throw away scripts

>your language takes time to do self-optimizations while running

I want to learn C++. Can I ask you what books/sites/other resources are you using? What compiler and IDE?

learncpp.com

visual sudio community 2015 is the best IDE, and its free

>hwnd
>cluttering c++ discussion with Windows Api bullshit

Java has lots of pointers.. why did C teach you and not java (assuming your list is chronological order)

>using C++
>any year after the release of RUST
ISHYGDDT

>Java has pointers
When everything is a pointer, nothing is

Lol I am not trying to say Java does pointers well/efficiently or in a logical way...

I'm just saying, a newb programmer will certainly run into pointer issues while using java, which I think would pretty easily teach you what a pointer is versus an actual variable...

>faggots crying over pointers

jesus christ. they are simple as fuck.

one operator holds the address of the pointed to value.

The other points to the value held in the address.

WHATS HARD ABOUT THAT?

I honestly have never programmed in C++ or C. I've never had a need for it because, frankly, my job never required me to do so.

I'm interested though. What are some of C/C++'s true strengths compared to other languages?