Brother borrows computer (laptop) for several months. Does not so legal stuff on it from what i know, scared about what i dont know.
I want this shit nuked. Like im talking if feds roll up i want it to be able to pass all their data mining tools. Heres why i came here.
After reading it appears impossible to fully erase everything off a hard drive. So Sup Forums, is it possible? After a hard drive wipe and laptop factory reset and overwriting all bits of data there are still tools that can determine the data before it was over written.
Be honest. If i want to make this laptop v& proof do i need to take a hammer to it?
format it using the secure erase feature in macOS or download a similar tool that supports multiple passes for deleting files
Robert Cooper
DBAN - do a 35 pass Gutmann wipe. It's overkill but, like you said, overkill is totally fine.
Gabriel Peterson
several sources from the internet ive read state that LEA tools can retrieve those files, albeit at a price. Not sure how i feel about the 7 data erase wipe
Austin Martinez
7 pass erase (DoD long) is more than enough for modern hard drives. The reason different methodologies exist for hard drive wiping is due to different methods of reading data from different disks (PRML, MFM, NPML) having different "best methods". Most are PRML or NPML nowadays which a 7 pass wipe is more than enough. DoD says 7 pass wipe is sufficient for destruction of data on sensitive computers (followed by a disk destroyal usually) so you should be fine.
Jayden Reyes
I just wrote thisLike i said the 7 times mac data erase i feel isnt secure enough.
This DBAN 35 pass you speak of, is it thorough? I mean flawlessly thorough. like no bits of data still being stored in unused. No programs holding on to potential file names?
Also, as for doing the dban 35 pass wipe, would it be even more secure (overkill, i know) to do the wipe, then overwrite all data (0s) then do the wipe again?
stupid question probably as overwriting the basic bits seems redundant if doing a 35 pass again
i guess the question is, could using the 35 wipe more than once increase probability of 100% nuked HDD? and is how legitimate is this DBAN
you can flame me for being paranoid or stupid, its okay
Adrian Anderson
my question is if the 7 pass was sufficient why would they suggest a disk destroyal?
>Like i said the 7 times mac data erase i feel isnt secure enough. Don't use mac data erase, use the 7 times erase in DBAN. It's more than enough for anyone's purposes trust me here.
>This DBAN 35 pass you speak of, is it thorough? I mean flawlessly thorough. like no bits of data still being stored in unused. No programs holding on to potential file names? There's no getting a slice of that data back period.
>Also, as for doing the dban 35 pass wipe, would it be even more secure (overkill, i know) to do the wipe, then overwrite all data (0s) then do the wipe again? It wouldn't make it any more or less secure.
>i guess the question is, could using the 35 wipe more than once increase probability of 100% nuked HDD? Not really, no. There is this thing called "overkill" even for the standards of people a lot more important and illegal than you.
>and is how legitimate is this DBAN Well documented and secure, FOSS.
Joseph Diaz
They suggest a disk destroyal because that's part of federal law for disposing of computers with sensitive data. Shit they even destroy system RAM when decommissioning PCs.
John Flores
why not just put a ubuntu live disc in then, dd if=/dev/random of=/dev/sda 20 times and then smash it with a hammer
Dylan Robinson
Open up the hard drive and pour acetone on the disks
Jack Perez
the 35 pass gutmann wipe is overkill extreme. As in it uses certain passes that are optimised for outdated storage methods.
>"Daniel Feenberg of the National Bureau of Economic Research, an American private nonprofit research organization, criticized Gutmann's claim that intelligence agencies are likely to be able to read overwritten data, citing a lack of evidence for such claims.[5] Nevertheless, some published government security procedures consider a disk overwritten once to still be sensitive".
i read that as governments admit they can recover information overwritten once. Just once, or can they do it to data overwritten 10 times?
Nathan Campbell
I checked the source cited in the last sentence of that quote, and I believe it is referring to this part:
>If the overwrite process is successful, then it will be difficult for an attacker to recover data in the laboratory. However, the overwrite process is not always completely successful due to human error and/or the inability of software utilities that function at the application layer to overwrite bad sectors or hidden partitions, which may contain sensitive data. Given direct access to the hard drive, an attacker could recover that data using simple software tools, without the need of a laboratory. For these reasons, overwrite is not accepted as a stand-alone destruction method for disposal of magnetic media containing data that is extremely sensitive (Protected C or Secret and above)
Joseph Roberts
Also, is RAM a possible worry as well?
Landon Murphy
forgot to mention, they refer to triple-pass as their overwriting technique (IIRC all 1's, all 0's, psuedo-random). But seriously I doubt there is a realistic difference between 3 passes and 35 passes.
Owen Hernandez
Thanks.
Can you elaborate on this "magnetic media" is my macbook pro hdd considered "magnetic media"?
And i believe my macbook is encrypted, so what i pick up is i should really factory reset the things, then do the gutmann 35 pass?
Daniel Brooks
I'm pretty sure RAM is volatile enough that after like an hour or something without power there is no chance of recovery.
So if bro did some shit, then you turned off the computer, then there is no chance of getting the data back from RAM.
I'm 99% sure. I know Tails and TrueCrypt/VeraCrypt operate in RAM, so iassume it is more than safe to do dirty deeds on without manual clearing.
Kayden Adams
>"magnetic media" Yep, your HDD is magnetic storage.
>A modern HDD records data by magnetizing a thin film of ferromagnetic material on a disk. Sequential changes in the direction of magnetization represent binary data bits.
Is it an HDD or an SSD? I'm not as knowledgable about SSD, and I believe they are harder/different to wipe.
Jackson Martin
Did a quick check and I think it's SSD.
DO NOT DO THE 35 PASS WIPE.
SSDs store stuff differently, they are NOT magnetic media.
WHAT WOULD YOU DO? assuming this computer was used for the worst of the worst, ie downloading stuff no one should ever download ever (use your imagination).
I dont take chances, if shit can be stored in my hard drive and can be retrieved after wipes, then physical destruction seems like viable route.
Would you be safe with a law enforcement or fbi agent that had the tools and no cost limitations with this computer after doing the gutmann wipe? would you risk likely guaranteed jail time?
Brayden Torres
im fearing its an SSD too. my research points to the macbook pro being ssd but i think the cutoff eyar is around 2012, having problems locating exactly which hard drive i have.
SSDs seem harder to wipe, but magnetic media seems easier to recover after already wiped?
I could have this backwards or wrong.
IS it a good thing or bad thing if this is an SSD?
The more i look around the more helpless i feel. Bleach and hammers keep coming to mind even though itd be such a waste
David Brooks
>it appears impossible to fully erase everything off a hard drive
Here's the bottom line: You're too stupid to computer.
Get off the Internet, burn the computer with thermite, never touch a computing device again.
> Even the most retarded autist on Sup Forums could have googled for ten minutes and wiped HDD beyond recovery.
Aiden Scott
I have almost no experience with SSDs, but I don't think wiping with data will work since they use "wear-levelling", so you can't specify which data to overwrite. It will only reduce the life of your drive significantly without erasing all of the data. The link in suggests a couple of programs for SSDs, which I think will work fine. Try asking /sqt/ about securely wiping SSDs
I ( onwards) would do differently to you, since I think you have an SSD and I have an HDD.
For my HDD (will be wiping before new build, just because I want a fresh start, and let's be honest browsing Sup Forums ricing threads has probably loli thumbnails on my HDD (illegal here) ) I will probably do either a three or seven pass wipe.
ur a faggot and he has an SSD
Matthew Garcia
>Write intensive >35 sequential passes
It's certainly unnecessary and inefficient to DBAN an SSD, but it won't destroy it, or even significantly reduce its life.
Levi Mitchell
Don't forget, the NIC and the motherboard have unique embedded serial numbers, as do CPUs.
You can go through the trouble of replacing all that shit, but it's cheaper to just destroy the entire computer.
You never registered it with any information identifiable back to you, did you? Internet records of all the internal serial numbers would have been captured, recorded and retained by any service provider, all Internet servers that any traffic passed through, and of course any agencies that may have been monitoring websites/Internet connections/servers that any activities would have used.
Seriously. As serious as you're saying this shit was all about, destroy the computer and file a theft report with the police. Even if the computer was in your brother's hands months ago, you can make up some story about how you thought the computer was in storage or something. But, get an official, legal record of it having not been in your hands since before it was compromised.
Make sure that however you destroy it (thermite is one of the best ideas on that), there is no remaining debris that can be examined or identified, and no way to trace it to you. Incinerate it with a a couple of kilos in a deep hole in a remote area, then bury it so the remains can't be found for 20 years or more.
Destruction of evidence is a federal felony. So make sure there's no trail for that, either.
Your brother needs to buy you a new computer, without any evidence that he's involved in any way. Also, take steps to burn your brother should any law enforcement come looking for you. Like, since you file a theft report, make sure that any investigation shows that he was the one that stole it.
Brayden Ross
Sounds like some serious shit.
Was the laptop expensive?
Kayden Myers
Try to find out what illegal stuff was. This may be useful to you. Ignorance is never useful.
William White
>Also, take steps to burn your brother should any law enforcement come looking for you. With thermite do? Or melt styrofoam and gasoline to make DIY napalm and molotov him?
Dominic Robinson
>After reading it appears impossible to fully erase everything off a hard drive. So Sup Forums, is it possible? After a hard drive wipe and laptop factory reset and overwriting all bits of data there are still tools that can determine the data before it was over written. Depends on whether this is a HDD or an SSD.
HDDs are trivial to completely overwrite. Just fill it up with random data. SSDs are nontrivial to fully clear, but an ATA secure erase should do the job.
>Brother borrows computer (laptop) for several months. Does not so legal stuff on it from what i know, scared about what i dont know. Oh, yes, sure, your “brother” did it. Why don't you just tell that to the feds? :^)
Wyatt Richardson
>Oh, yes, sure, your “brother” did it. Why don't you just tell that to the feds? :^) Shut the fuck up man. My waifu started looking up cheese pizza last year and I got scared shitless.
Asher Russell
wait ... wat?
Are you saying that your brother is your waifu?
I don't think that either of them could have been doing anything more sick than that with your computer.
Kevin Price
No, I'm a different user. I was trying to make a joke.
Parker Myers
thanks for the input. Ill put you under the dont trust 7 pass wipes, similiar to how i feel.
$1200
you Couldn't Pry it out of me to even say what i fear was on here. just typing it makes me worry and i dont have these assumptions based off nothing. there were some tell tale signs
you can flame me for being a newfag to computers but heres a quote: >With a FileVault-encrypted startup disk, you can restart into OS X Recovery and launch Disk Utility to erase the volume. However, before erasing, you need to select the disk and then choose File > Unlock “volume name”. Enter the password for any FileVault-enabled user account, and the disk is unlocked and can be erased.
Erasing a FileVault-encrypted volume discards the key that’s associated with it, turning a disk into a nearly perfect cacophony of irrecoverable randomness. Without the key, which is uncrackable in any realistic period of time by any current technology, the erased data is as good as gone as if it had been written over millions of times"
So this encryption via filevault on macs, according to what this article says, means that if you destroy the vilevault key that all data stored through there is lost since the encryption key will not be able to be brute force hacked etc?
Not sure if i read it right. Correct me if im wrong (ctr shills welcome) but if using filevault all data stored on hard drive (ssd) was encrypted first, so if i delete wipe the volume and destroy the key does that mean that all remnants left behind on my hard drive are un recoverable?
or would the deletion of that volume in of itself save the damn data on my hard drive somewhere?
Computers, making you want to create thermite since the 21st century
Matthew Long
i undertstood your joke user
Jayden Nguyen
bumping about thoughts on filevault being used while the data i want gone was downloaded?
ie encryption of all data before being stored on ssd then wiping the volume and erasing key etc.
Cooper Gomez
what does Sup Forums think?
Jack Hill
You could get the same effect from doing a random wipe. And no, filling it with random data once isn't sufficient.
