IT'S FUCKING OVER: RUST IS FINISHED

blog.ntpsec.org/2017/01/18/rust-vs-go.html

tl;dr: It's over. Rust is an unmanageable language, even writing a simple 50 line script takes days with this garbage language.

Other urls found in this thread:

ada-auth.org/standards/12rm/html/RM-TOC.html
rust-lang.org/en-US/friends.html
nomad.so/2015/03/why-gos-design-is-a-disservice-to-intelligent-programmers/
twitter.com/AnonBabble

Rust is doomed if it doesn't become more opinionated.

Putting a cuck like Steve Klabnik anywhere near the Rust Team was a big mistake.

> In practice, I found Rust painful to the point of near unusability. The learning curve was far worse than I expected; it took me those four days of struggling with inadequate documentation to write 67 lines of wrapper code for the server.

> Even things that should be dirt-simple in Rust, like string concatenation, are unreasonably difficult. The language demands a huge amount of fussy, obscure ritual before you can get anything done.

RUSTACEANS BTFO

Crust destroyed

damn, it's truly over

ESR is a hack

Holy shit, #rekt.

>it took me those four days of struggling with inadequate documentation to write 67 lines of wrapper code for the server
what the fuck. i had no experience in rust and wrote a parted-like application in two evenings and i'm pretty stupid.

Sure. What do you even mean by parted-like? You mean a proper CLI making use of some parsing library for switches and flags? Or did you actually create something usable that can freely modify partitions?

Somehow I'm more inclined to believe the guy writing the NTP implementation than you, stealth-bragging about your skills, on an egyptian scripts forum.

It accepts command line commands only.
I think I was able to do this because I don't do anything fancy. It's just File IO and some parsing. He had to deal with concurrency and networking.

$ cloc lba0/
18 text files.
18 unique files.
10 files ignored.

github.com/AlDanial/cloc v 1.72 T=0.04 s (278.4 files/s, 10912.5 lines/s)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Language files blank comment code
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Rust 5 75 19 293
JSON 5 0 0 5
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SUM: 10 75 19 298
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
$ sudo lba0/target/debug/lbazero /dev/sda
Disk signature : 15F3DD60
MBR signature : AA55
# Boot Start Size Id
0 0 512 500G ee

GPT Signature found

GPT signature: 5452415020494645
Header CRC: 313050A2
# Start Size Name
0 1M 536M EFI system partition
1 537M 16M Microsoft reserved partition
2 554M 188G Basic data partition
3 189G 4G
4 193G 42G
5 236G 161G
6 397G 102G Basic data partition

Okay, so it wasn't just empty bragging -- sorry. That's neat, but yes I suspect the same as you: threading, networking, implementing traits and structs (requiring more heavy interaction with the borrow checker) and maintaining a code base greater than three lines is probably exponentially more complex.

Rust is SJW garbage.

You are a fucking idiot, keep your idiotic ramblings to yourself or actually write down something sensible. You are helping no one with what amounts to your childish crying.

Rust is SJW garbage.

>WAHHHHHHH
special snowflake got triggered.

fuck off SJW scum and take that shit language with you.

Any memory-safe, concurrency-focused, modern alternatives out there?

It really isn't. The guy is most likely paid. How is
concat!(a, b);

"unreasonably difficult", for example? Let alone the fact that this is comparing to C and not, say, python.

Pretty much only clean and ats, but I wouldn't exactly call them valid alternatives.

>needing a macro to concatenate strings
wew fucking lad

>needed anything but x86 asm
huh....

hehehe, yes goys, go back to writing C, it's much more secure

>I need handholding to make a secure application
Bruh. You can write the most secure shit on the planet, if the compiler tries to optimize out your security checks then it's going to be shit anyways. See the tun device check if null optimization for reference.

you could also use push_str, +, or [a, b].join among many other options.

not sure if clinically retarded or pretending.jpg

Really made me think ada-auth.org/standards/12rm/html/RM-TOC.html

Either way, I don't understand how abstraction equals security

Rust never seemed to take off for... Well... Anything.

I have yet to see it be used for something. Anything meaningful.

Anyone have an example?

You can attack all the strawmen you want, but why would anyone else care?

>rust except shit
lol

rust-lang.org/en-US/friends.html

I will never use anything other than C99.

Ebin

>I will never program anything more complex than fizzbuzz

Name one advantage of ada over rust. Go ahead, I'm waiting.

can actually get you a steady job?

>DUDE I tried to *code* a website using x86 assembly and then also with php... ASM is so bad!!!1 XDD its so difficult and it took me like FOREVER and then with PHP it was so simple and easy: you don't even need to understand what u are actually doing, it just werks! :D php4evar #yolo
> [comment this article on HN]

Faster, ISO, field proven

a function just to concat? Seriously? That is some ugly shit.

a = a + b

Hows that for clean simplicity?

this

It can't get you a steady job any more than rust can actually.

It's significantly slower though. Rust also has a standard, that's not a point. Field proven is a point. Know what else is field proven? Java.

Good thing rust can do that then.

> Significantly slower
Proof?
> Rust also has a standard
That changes every few months

>Rust also has a standard
You don't even know what a standard is.

nice me.me

I have no idea why Rust keeps getting compared to Go, they are vastly different things. The only similarity is they are both supposed final solutions to the C and C++ problem though Go is primarily network and systems/userland priority whereas Rust wants to do everything by allowing literally anybody to come a long and cram complexity into their spec guaranteeing it will never get out of beta.

One big advantage of Go is that core packages exist for most of the things you might want to do on a server. Those packages are mostly maintained by Google employees and are used within Google, so the packages are exercised and maintained. Rust, like Python, has a large collection of packages maintained by random people and not under organized maintenance or testing.

Rob Pike et all also did a good job creating a simple systems language that actively discourages complexity, so Sr. Devs can't do stupid risky shit they think is safe but will crash with no survivors, and Jr. Devs won't hang themselves so easily as they would with C/C++

I imagine Rust will remain a disorganized clusterfuck for sometime until somebody comes a long and reinvents it with some clarity and major financial backing to curate critical libraries.

a := b is even simpler

Rust has exactly the same problems as D all over again. They're even forking the standard library.

>More generally, a lot of crucial information about the language in practice is not yet documented at all; you have to be part of the swarm around the development group and follow their communications channels to learn it.
It feels so good reading that Rust is losing.

can you do
a = "literal " + b

It's like being back in third grade and kicking the younger kids' teeth out just to hear them cry.

This is true if you read the Rust 'teams' HN posts, they are just crammin' away features and not documenting fuck all for the most annoying reasons.

'We want people to be exposed to Rust positively and not be scared off by all this complexity" is literally their sad excuse. It makes zero sense just write two books, the Rust Lang beginners guide and a working spec draft so we can actually understand wtf is going on

Not at all.
When you described is just mean.
This is like doctor telling you that your cancer is benign.

Well there's no point now, the emperor's clothes have come off and the whole project is going down in flames. Getting BTFO by the father of open source is a death sentence. Rust can never come back from this, ever.

It's like keying a liberal's car right on their Hillary bumper sticker.

Look. They're doing it to themselves. Their practices are causing their project fail which is a direct implication that their practices are wrong. You keep describing negative things that I am actively doing to someone. No, this is not in any way similar. Please stop.

Oh, okay. I get it.

It's like seeing a homeless person get hit by a car.

I have nothing against homeless people and I wouldn't be happy if one got hit by a car.

It is more like seeing a fag at a pride parade getting ran over by a muzzie in a semi

Getting warmer.

One big disadvantage of Go is that it's a god awful language that goes backward in language design to the point of stupidity.

It's worse than Java even, which is quite literally hilarious given how obnoxious it's strongly OO design can make it cumbersome in some places.

One look at Rust shit and you know most of them came out of the web meme language world. Half-arsed docs and the clusterfuck of shit third-party libraries are straight outta the JS/Node world

kek, driving a pride parade float would make that so easy it isn't funny

Go feels like C made into a script language

Which is why it's shit compared to literally any modern language.

It's just like C to me except more abstract with memory safety (which you can turn off btw, disabling GC is possible in Go and you can also write careful code that cuts down use of GC to minimum)

That was the point of go though, a really good tool for systems/networking type shit that google does like Kubernetes, IRC servers, basically any network facing daemon, and they wanted it portable like C so can drop a binary in any OS and it 'just works' instead of bringing in an entire framework like Python.

For it's specific use case scenarios nothing beats Go. You wouldn't write an OS kernel in Go of course, but you also apparently wouldn't in Rust either since nothing is documented

Except that D has already left that phase behind and is getting better and better.

> nervous D user says for the 16th time

yeah totally bro, im sure this is the year of D. I looked into D, it's a total clusterfuck. They have a million disjointed features, they still dont even have a good IDE, they have nothing appealing what so ever. Nothing they do is particularly great or better than what others are doing. It's literally mediocrity as a language.

They're both bad, idiot.
nomad.so/2015/03/why-gos-design-is-a-disservice-to-intelligent-programmers/

>strawmanning so god damn hard

I've been waiting for this moment... Since it first appeared...

You don't know what a strawman is.

Whoa.... double trips.....

>REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
>MUH TRIGGERS!

>Rust also has a standard
bwahahahahahaha

>disabling GC is possible in Go
is it decently supported?

>muh coq

Rust will be a dead language by the end of the year.

>A straw man is a common form of argument and is an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument that was not advanced by that opponent.
I never argued that D was better than any other language. So yes, your post was a strawman in its entirety.