actually, everybody knows that CTRL should always stay at the bottom left corner, easy to find, comfortable to be pressed with any other combination of keys.
So, why do manufacturers implement stupid solutions like the "Fn" key where the "Ctrl" key should be?
Adam Williams
Just switch places with the physical keys and then remap them.
John Myers
>CTRL should always stay at the bottom left corner, easy to find Yeah, but for most non-power users, it's probably more important to find Fn than to find Ctrl. There are so many "normies" that don't use the control key, for example they rightclick->copy and rightclick->paste. The Fn key functions (I assume are mostly for hardware controlling) probably have more use for them than Ctrl. Yes, I agree that Ctrl should be there, but I have a feeling the userbase that is the biggest, which manufacturers cater to, are clueless normies.
Aiden Baker
>using ctrl makes you a power user
mind fucking blown
Lincoln Hill
In the mind of your average dads, grandmas and 11-year old, yes, it does.
Adam Jackson
>not mapping CTRL to the useless Capslock key
Git gud.
Aaron Nguyen
most people don't even know what the Fn button does and most of these people use ctrl
Brandon Sanders
If someone doesn't use ctrl, they will never use function keys, therefore fn is even less useful for them
James Brown
but cPSLOCK ISN'T USELESS AT ALL
Justin Morales
>Who is right? FN on the right of right alt
Christian Campbell
man i would get so tilted using my friend's thinkpad because the fn key bullshit. ctrl obv belongs on bottom left, it's used 1000x more than fn and needs to be easy to get to
Christopher Stewart
These people dont use keyboards anymore.
Cooper Lee
depends on your previous laptop
Gavin Cooper
Who agrees Fn should be between right alt and right ctrl
Jason Jackson
fucking degenerate MODS!
Jackson Cooper
My T450s has it but I can swap it in BIOS ez-pc
Nolan Cooper
Control should be where Caps Lock is. Who wants to reach all the way to the corner for control?
Windows-ism.
Carson Morgan
If normies don't even use ctrl, they sure as hell won't use the fn key.
Nathan Wilson
They will, it's color coded with media, volume, and brightness for ease of access.
Benjamin Allen
I prefer the ctrl key to be on the right.
Ctrl on the left is good if you play games that use wasd as directional controls. But the benefits ends there. The home row is one key to the right of that, and this is where you should find yourself to automatically rest your hands.
Xavier Moore
It should be on the right, since it's directly below where your pinky rests on the homerow.
Elijah Butler
>easy to find you should already know exactly where your keys are at all times, fucking retard normie. nobody wants to do finger stretching exercises to reach for ctrl on the bottom left.
ctrl ===== right
Nathaniel Bennett
I don't give a shit
I have laptop(s) with each of those configuration. You just need to get used to it
Dylan Sullivan
You can flip it in the bios anyways so who cares
Leo Evans
thinkpads are not better you can switch keys in bios but its retarded
Jeremiah Peterson
Thinkpads have a bios switch to switch them around
Cameron Walker
Fn shouldn't exist in the first place
Nolan Scott
you faggots get triggered with the dumbest shit. if it bothers you stop buying laptops.
Grayson Lopez
This
Cooper Evans
do go on
Andrew Davis
1005HA is right.
Whenever I use a keyboard like the top one I always hit Fn instead of Ctrl when I go for it because I expect it to be in the very corner.
The fact Alt is moved across a bit is less of an issue.
Connor Cox
Literally the only sane layout. There is no need to have capslock at all. FN sits nicely in the blank spot between meta and alt
Liam Phillips
>So, why do manufacturers implement stupid solutions like the "Fn" key where the "Ctrl" key should be?
Does anyone besides Chinknovo do that?
Alexander Hill
obviously on the left.
what is much more important to discuss is how some layouts apparently don't have the thing but like a humongous left shift.
can't do, my keyboard layout uses that for non-alphanumeric characters
Luis Gutierrez
>Whenever I use a keyboard like the top one I always hit Fn instead of Ctrl when I go for it because I expect it to be in the very corner.
this
Ethan Flores
Ya but if you want to ctr+something without moving your hand from the mouse its kind of annoying.
I actually don't mind the current layout of keyboards, although I would like a keyboard with the numbers on the bottom of the keyboard, right above the row with ctrl, super, alt, spacebar, etc. It would pretty much exclusively be used for mmo/rts games, which is kind of redundant since in those you can usually bind your actions to whatever you want, but binding shit to z, x, c, v, b with shift modifiers (what I currently do), just feels weird. But as I said, I dont want companies to start changing the keyboard layout around too much. Next thing you know someone at a development meeting will suggest the idea to cut out the escape key, or to turn the [];'./,./ keys into a single button that makes you scroll through a menu to choose which one you want, or something retarded like that
Ian Gonzalez
CTRL should be in the absolute bottom right. Always.
Anyways, just so Sup Forums remembers, your beloved ThinkPad x220 also follow the autistic placement.
>ctrl >power user I already feel the powah in muh blood user
Daniel Williams
>not having a touchbar instead of useless fn key Stay poor Sup Forums
Austin Evans
How can a power user live with the Ctrl key all the way to the left? Do they actually physically lift their hand from the home row to use it, or do they have more dexterity in their pinky than I?
Dominic Davis
why do you make up stories
Oliver Peterson
agreed
Isaac Ortiz
what are those keycaps called? is there a name for these types of keycaps?
Gavin Bennett
fagbuttons
Bentley Watson
Control key should go here.
Nolan Roberts
>fn is in the bottom left corner on all my thickbads and fagbooks The top one is correct.
CAPS LOCK IS FUCKING FANTASTIC!
Adrian Reyes
They do it because they're Fn stupid.
Samuel Johnson
HOW THE FUCK IS CAPSLOCK USELESS?
Juan Martin
Too bad the 1005HA chokes on Lubuntu; the keyboard is pretty nice.
Owen Lopez
The ideal is to have the FN button after the altgr and have the super button after then left control
Jace Jones
...
Grayson Reed
It's a IIgs keyboard.
Isaiah Myers
>not mapping caps lock to esc
Samuel Turner
WHAT THE FUCK
Easton Hill
I wouldn't use the 1005HA as an example of anything. But, I guess it was right this time.
Austin Scott
Lol, you're just retarded.
Brayden Garcia
I have a thinkpad with ctrl on the right, I keep trying to copy-paste things and then wondering why it didn't work drives me nuts
Christian Carter
this
Jaxson Morales
ultimately makes your keyboard smaller, unless you want to pick another key to make useless with AutoHotkey or whatever
Eli Green
i know apple did that with my mac to piss me off whenever i need to bootcamp into windows 7.
its kind of a necessary evil since laptops are too small to have dedicated controls for volume and screen brightness and shit.
Lincoln Turner
They say that those who use the ctrl key have more control over their work, but those who use fn are more functional users
Robert Powell
That's alt news
Wyatt Young
...
Ethan Anderson
on my x230 this was just a change in the bios
Ryan Wood
How often do you have to press Esc?
Ryder Hall
and I was sad when lappys lost the menu key and I had to learn ctrl+shift+f10
Hunter Sullivan
>How often do you have to press Esc?
You Emacs virgin.
Ryder Hill
>useless Capslock key Non-programmer detected.
Ayden Foster
Anyone who does not use fn
Thomas Sanchez
underrTED POST
Jaxon Taylor
>How can a power user live with the Ctrl key all the way to the left? Do they actually physically lift their hand from the home row to use it, or do they have more dexterity in their pinky than I? You know you can, like, pivot your wrist kind of toward you and to the right to extend the potential comfortable range of your pinky, right?
Jaxon Ross
>to exit different terminal applications >to pause games >to unfocus text fields >to close context menus >vim
The real question is why is there a >< key next to the spacebar.
They press fn and don't notice anything in the os, and they'll assume the key is broken.
Also this.
It should be on the right side of the board, together with del, home, end and that bunch. Given that the keys you pair it with are at the function row, you're going to use two fingers for each use case anyways, very differently from the use cases of control, alt and shift. I mean, you're not going to press fn+z or fn+c.
Benjamin Bailey
Why would you use capslock for anything other than naming constants and macros and why would you need the capslock when you're just typing alphabetic characters (rather than switching back and forth between alpha and grammatical).
Julian Green
Emacs uses escape more often than Vim. You silly Vim folks think jumping in and out of Insert mode is so cool, but Emacs uses escape to compile the world.
Josiah Wilson
All other opinions are wrong
William Perez
This. On a mac.
Jack Myers
The bottom left corner, where Control normally always resides, is where it should be.
Juan Stewart
Oddly OS X makes this even easier than any Linux desktop environment.
OS X = best Unix™.
Gabriel Morales
You're a little baby.
Ryan Nelson
This, Command being the main key for keybindings is wonderful.
I like having Caps Lock and don't use Control even remotely often enough to justify having a nonstandard layout for it to be easier pressed.
Jason Johnson
How can is it easier on osx? It is really easy on Linux.
Brody Young
>go to system preferences >click keyboard >click modifier keys
Even FreeBSD is easier, in the setup you can choose 'swap control and caps' and it will stay, system-wide, even in X.
Most Linux distros have separate console and X configurations for the keyboard (as well as xmodmap being available) except Debian and family, where there is a universal keyboard config file. It's advised to read the manuals for all methods in any event.
Jeremiah Rodriguez
*in freebsd not swap, but caps AS control
Ayden Cruz
>Most Linux distros have separate console and X configurations for the keyboard Explain how is it a bad thing
Michael Torres
Needing two config files when one would suffice is bad.
Michael Rivera
I never said it was 'bad' but to figure it all out you're going to be reading man pages, editing config files, etc.
FreeBSD's method is easier because you have one easy option to switch it across the whole OS, and OS X's the easiest because you can just click on some fucking buttons and it's done in 2 seconds.
Andrew Smith
>implying their top row is primarily function keys and not the media bullshit They've no idea what the fn key or the function keys do
Henry Torres
so pic related vs clear lock clear control add control = Caps_Lock Control_L Control_R keycode 66 = Control_L Caps_Lock NoSymbol NoSymbol
Parker Reed
ctrl+fn lmao
Gavin Young
Do you use the TTY that often that this is a problem? I mean, unless you redesign the entire layout, does it really affect you that capslock is only ctrl when you use the computer normally?
Aiden Nguyen
Using it at all is enough for it to be a problem. I shouldn't need another config file for the same configuration.
Logan Martin
So your claim goes from "it is easier on osx" to bsd's config also works in tty so it is better? Just stop using the tty for anything more than fixing problems with X and use a terminal emulator like a normal person.
Ryder Cox
I never made either of those claims. >Just stop using the tty for anything more than fixing problems with X Even if I did this would still be an issue the moment I opened a TTY
Andrew Howard
You get problems with X? nice try apple shill.
Juan Gomez
No, even if I did only use the TTY for fucking with X it'd still be an issue because I'd either need that second config file or have to deal with fucked up keybindings.
Jackson Cox
you are describing an issue that is irrelevant to every linux user. The TTY is only used in emergencies. Having to stick to a stock keyboard in times of emergency is not a bad thing.
I have broken X a few times during the last decade and every time, I knew what I did and changing it back is not a lengthy process. Having the control where it says so on the keyboard instead of the more convenient placement is not a big deal. If you have to fix something on another persons computer, the keyboard would also be different, and that is more likely to happen than X breaking.
Daniel Cook
>you are describing an issue that is irrelevant to every linux user. >The TTY is only used in emergencies. 4u >Having to stick to a stock keyboard in times of emergency is not a bad thing Having my keybindings fucked up is certainly a bad thing >If you have to fix something on another persons computer, the keyboard would also be different The kind of person that'd need help fixing their computer isn't the kind of person that'd have keybindings in the first place and given it is a standard layout I'd be able to use it.
Ryan Williams
What keybindings are you talking about then? I was assuming you meant in your editor.
Mason Nelson
Just making shit function more like OS X
Brayden Hernandez
>The TTY is only used in emergencies. lol
Ryder Smith
please give an example where you would use the TTY over a terminal and the reason isn't "I don't have a terminal"?