/tpg/ - ThinkPad General

Previous thread: IRC: #/tpg/ on irc.rizon.net

Other business laptops are also welcome in /tpg/ (e.g. Dell Latitude/Precision, HP EliteBook/ZBook).
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If you're looking for purchase advice, READ THE BUYERS GUIDE FIRST. Then post, stating budget and requirements (e.g. size and performance).
Don't buy anything OTHER THAN T, X AND W/P SERIES if you want the Real ThinkPad Experience™

Recommended models:
T420 - 14", normal size
X220 - 12.5", ultraportable
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Why ThinkPad? (also applies to other business laptops)
>Used machines are plentiful and cheap.
>Excellent keyboards - tactile feel and quiet.
>Great durability: chassis uses a magnesium rollcage for structural integrity, with high quality plastic body panels.
>Utilitarian design: e.g. indicator LEDs, 7 row keyboard layout on older models.
>Docking stations that easily turns your laptop into a desktop.
>Easy to repair, upgrade and maintain thanks to readily available service manuals for every model. Spare parts are easy and cheap to obtain.
>The best trackpoint (that red thing in the middle of the keyboard). Great for those who type a lot or hate swiping their fingers all over a touchpad.
>Excellent GNU/Linux & *BSD support.
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Used ThinkPad buyers guide:
ktgee.net/tpg

xsauc buyers guide:
dankpads.com

EPP discount for new ThinkPads (USA & Canada only, usually 15%+ off):
pastebin.com/JVwVGVTW

Helpful links and resources (Wiki, lookup tools and wallpapers):
pastebin.com/DYjEnVq1

Other urls found in this thread:

thinkpad-parts.com/42T5283-Thinkpad.html
twitter.com/SFWRedditVideos

New X1 Carbon for $1090, why shouldn't I pull the trigger?

So with an original lenovo 6 cell battery on my x220 on hackintosh I get about 2 hours 45 minutes of usage (with shit playing on safari tabs, be it video or music)

Is this considered good? For my usage it's fine, but I'd like to check your opinions

No full size Ethernet, only two USB Type A ports, no VGA, no Slice battery, no Dock option.

What would you do with a new X1 Carbon that you can't do with an X230?

I want one too but waiting for MUH REVIEWS

>own a thinkpad T420 and an ideapad Y510p
>love both for their particular niches, even as they represent contrasting ends of Lenovo quality (former being a brick shithouse designed to not need a trip to the factory to repair, latter having paint flaking off and chassis material chipping away and just generally falling apart even though it doesn't seem to want to give up the ghost just yet)

>the fact that they swap the placement of the Fn and left Ctrl between the two drives me up the wall more than the other character quirks of either machine

Who the fuck decided they couldn't standardize just this one quirk?

It's the only thing that makes switching between the two a pain in the ass, I always end up shifting my key presses off by a column.

Can't you just replace the keyboard?

There's a bios setting to swap fn and ctrl, as long as you don't mind your keys being labeled incorrectly.

>Y510p

>replace anything

top kek

>HD4000 vs HD630

>5 hours vs 14 hours battery life

>What would you do with a new X1 Carbon that you can't do with an X230?


gee I don't know, that's a tough question hmmmm

I'm getting around 12-20 hours of life from my X230T.

I had a Y510p for a year because I took a job with a lot of traveling when I got out of university, so I still wanted to play MUH GAEMS on the go.

I did not think it was a completely horrible computer, definitely better than the consumer laptops my friends were using, but it was no up to the standard I was used to. Screen wobbled when you typed, touchpad was atrocious to the point of being unusable, no TrackPoint, generally mediocre keyboard. It did, however, pack a lot of power for the money, and the screen was nicer than anything I've seen in a non-W series Thinkpad.

I sold it after only a year and a half of ownership when I took a desk job and generally quit video games. Bought for $950, sold for $750, I don't think I did too bad. But I was glad to be back on my T400, the comfiness was worth the loss of speed.

Yeah I liked it for the vidya pixel pushing myself, but the gripes you listed weren't my problems, hell I largely had no issue with those things other than gunk always finding its way into the touchpad.

No, it was the realization years later that the optical drive was unreliable garbage that could barely stream a DVD without stuttering let alone even burn a single disc without giving up immediately, and the SD card reader triggering BSODs without fail when used. Really bizarre character defects that I could never seem to fix that only get in the way in fringe scenarios, really, but boy did it blow chunks when those fringe cases cropped up.

I'm still holding onto it because it's better at being the unmoving desktop stand-in than the thinkpad, but the thinkpad is far better at being a laptop, and I can see the Think out lasting the Idea too thanks to being designed with field repair in mind.

How'd I do /tpg/?

>$30 R61 Thinkpad
>$8 T8700 CPU
>$5 new thermal paste
>$5 hard drive caddy
>$10 2 X 2gb ram
>$15 new battery
>$30 charger and dock
>FREE cheapo 240gb SSD
>FREE cheapo carbon fiber wrap

Total Cost: under $100

So the specs are:
>Windows 10 home
>Core 2 Duo T8300 @ 2.53ghz
>4gb DDR2 @ 332Mhz
>1440x900 15.4” LCD
>Nvidia Quadro NVS 140m
>240gb VisionTek SSD


It's pretty quick and runs really cool and quiet. Has the modified BIOS for the upgraded SATA speeds and for CPU compatibility. For those against the R model; the R61 was only slightly thicker than the T61 and didn't really miss any features of the T61. Plus it was dirt cheap on eBay so can't complain. It's a great beater laptop.

You could swap the t420 keyboard though

>buy t410
>urge to purchase more thinkpads despite mine running fine
why this

Wow, great job. I'd do that again if I could

Shoot I made a typo. The CPU I listed first was a T8700 which doesn't exist. It's the T8300 I listed in the specs.

Thanks man, sometimes you can find these torn down surplus ThinkPads for cheap on eBay. It was really only a $30 risk.

tis the life of a thinkpad owner

This is great
In true spirit of the Thinkpad

>What would you do with a new X1 Carbon that you can't do with an X230?
Look like a functioning member of society.
Kaby Lake 15w CPUs tend to outperform Sandy and Ivy 35w CPUs while using less than half the power.
New components and warranty.

The x230 is still a fine machine, but there are plenty of reasons to get a new X1C. The lightness and profile can appeal to those in professional settings who have the income to invest in a new machine. A new computer can be considered a luxury or pure capital. A used computer can give certain nostalgic satisfactions, and be very practical.

A valid question, though I feel that it's loaded with presumption..

Post specs and settings. Too much bullshit in /tpg/

Looks nice. There's not enough love for the R series IMO, some of them are capable machines. Why do you need the CF wrap though?

I only have 5 coming today.

If you only had pre-2009 ThinkPads to choose from, what would you be using?

no you dont, with that shit 99C gpu.

OK I jumped aboard the meme train and bought a refurbished T420. Unfortunately it now refuses to charge and will not turn on even when plugged in at the mains.

I have tried removing the battery for 30 secs and then pressing the power on button with no success.

Any idea how to troubleshoot this or should I just return it and get a refund?

The lid was scratched up to all hell. It was either Plastidip, disassemble and paint, or wrap.

Plastidip won't last and tends to be kinda grippy which you don't want for a laptop sliding in and out of a backpack.
Painting was just way too much work.
Wrap was fairly quick and easy, plus I had some extra sitting around. Modernized the look too. Doesn't look like a dinosaur anymore so it honestly attracts less attention.

The T series gets so much love it makes me worry the R is obscure for a reason

Does it have a rollcage?

The difference between the T61 and R61 were two things.
Size/weight
Performance Options

The T61 just had more options for better processors, better GPUs, and more ram, while being a little slimer and a little lighter.

The R61 still has a full roll cage. If you can deal with it being slightly thicker and heavier, then the R61 is the better deal. I can't speak for other models of ThinkPads though. Other R models have been known to skip out on bug features. The 61 just didn't have much variation between T and R.

Understood, thank you.

send me thinkpads. thx

Using today?
If I only had one, a 14" T61p with a T7700 on a 42W7873 or 44C3924. I tend to prefer the former, but neither is worth meming over these days. A note is that the T61p with dGPU came with an improved fan and heatsink that will serve you well if you make a dGPU Frankenpad. Also, never forget to be wary of all dGPU T61 models with board manufacture before 08/08.

A close runner up would be the X301. I'm surprised more people aren't shitposting on these. Easily one of the best feeling Thinkpads ever made.

The X40, T42, R51, A31P, and of course the 600 come to mind as comfy machines to use.

That's my answer if I were only to have them "stock."

One sticker is arguably better than 20. I'm still looking for an accurate Thinkpad finish method.

They are a bit thicker and a bit heavier than their T counterparts, which can help with heat dissipation, and may or may not be a problem for you. Contrary to popular belief, they have been known for their sturdy subframes.

I can post up a the insides of an R51 later. No use doing the R61, as it was exactly the same as the T61.

That being said, the T Series is more desirable for many people, and offers better upper-end options. But build quality is found in both series. Several guides tell you to only buy the X, T, and W series. This is a good heuristic, but you are missing out on Thinkpads if you don't consider the R series, especially at the prices they go for.

I paid $900 for a refurb'd X1C3 after it been out for 6 or so months.

Get it

Very nice price.
I liked the thickness of them.

T61 i sold my aunt has a bad GPU. Thinking of heat gunning it and applying the FSB mod, maybe quadcore it?

I still have my goopy X61T and X300, so those I guess?

Yeah exactly. I don't like the "sticker bin" laptop lids.

You could sand it down and buff it like you would with car paint. Relatively cheap option and not too much work with an OEM like finish.
Also you can go onto AliExpress and buy a roll of vinyl wrap in whatever you want. They have all colors of carbon fiber and chromes, but you'll probably want a satin, matte, or gloss wrap. A satin red or gray might look really good.

And the R series really go for dirt cheap. The fixrupper T61s were $60 and the R61s were around $30.

I would rather have a T61 thickness but I can't complain for the price. It is heavy and makes me wish for a lighter 15" but again, nothing is going to beat that price and it's nice knowing that it's indestructible and even if I dropped my backpack in a puddle it'd probably be fine.

I also was thinking of the quad core route but it's not worth it for what I'm doing. Also my R61 has the dreaded Nvidia 140M but with some TPFan tweaking, new thermal paste, and different clock speed settings, it should be good for a while.

The X300 and X301 processors are a real shame.
The computers are so sexy.

how easy is it to replace an x200t screem

5 minutes. and something to unscrew the screws.
Just be sure that the screen connector is in place.

Has anyone here bought a refurbished laptop from Lenovo's outlet before? if so, how was the condition etc? Thanks

Thinkpads came. 2 of them are 15" 4:3 T60. One of them is a 15" T60p with 1600x1200 UXGA IPS.

There's about to be a new meme machine on the team.

I notice most of the T/X60s run pretty warm, is that normal/safe?

I dropped my t420 a few days ago, now it randomly goes into sleepmode and come outs of it again, everything else is working but it seems like it looses power for a quick second before coming back on, how to fix?

It's the wireless card used in that generation.

Can someone give a straightforward guide about getting an eGPU on an X230? Some recommend an EXP GDC Beast v8 while others post a different device, but I can't tell if that information is out of date or something.

Additionally, has the 16gb issue been fixed, or is it simply a matter of avoiding certain clock frequencies or manufacturers? I currently have some really shitty 799 mhz 2x4gb crap.

I own a GTX 770, the specifications on Geforce.co.uk say that it's 230W. Can I still use the regular power brick? Speaking of which, what is the regular power brick? For Expresscard I can't find it bundled.

If someone can give me a clear "I did x with y device and 16gb of memory it worked fine" then I'll sell my desktop and take my 770 and Korean 1440p 90hz IPS display with me overseas to uni this time. eGPU / 16gb / i7 would be one saucy machine. Cheers.

How much for a 70++ battery for a quick sale?

Always check thermal paste on machines you buy now. They can run warm, the heatsink design is fastened at the CPU and held by spring tension elsewhere. However, the 42X4685 fan and heatsink assembly from the T61P can be fit in a T60 with slight modification to the T60 subframe. Also, most T60 heatsinks only have metal-and-compound contact on the CPU, whereas the T61p heatsink does not rely on a thermal pad for the GPU. It really makes a big difference.

Also, as mentioned, the wireless cards are generally replaced.

I actually never really used the optical drive in mine. I think it was only ever employed to rip music from CDs and install a few older games like Rise of Nations, Rome Total War and Civilization IV. There was one time where the computer was getting random BSODs for a while, and I could never figure out what it was. A later Windows update fixed almost everything. I think it was just shitty drivers.

The Idea line is still noticeably inferior to the Thinkpads, although the gap has been closing, and it is not a result of the Ideapads getting any better.

Definitely the X300 / X301 any day of the week. My dad still has an X300 from his high flyer corporate days, love that computer. I would be elated if Lenovo just gave these wonders better screens and updated the internals to give us an X380. I would be willing to buy it brand new, which is something I've never done with a Thinkpad before.

How are you liking the X1C? If the X380 never happens then I would definitely be checking that one out. Even if it is slightly less repairable than a T series, I feel the screen would be worth it.

The processor in the X301 is a substantial improvement over the X300, but yeah, they are both pretty long in tooth. I don't get why the computers struggle with so much shit on the modern internet, they are still more powerful than a lot of smartphones.

t430 best pad

I just happen to have a X230 and an eGPU.
And an EXP GDC.

It works well at expresscard 1.0 speeds.
At expresscard 2.0 speeds it might crash sometimes depending on cable placement and things like that (crashes occur randomly, they can happen three times ina row in 5 minutes or run pretty well for days and days before crashing again).

The problem is that the 1.0 speeds are low and the graphics card saturates the expresscard pci-express connection.

If 100% is the performance of a graphics card on a 16x PCI-express 3.0, we have:
>EC 1.0 with internal laptop monitor
60% speed
>EC 1.0 with external monitor
65-70% speed
>EC 2.0 with internal monitor
75-80% speed
>EC 2.0 with external monitor
85-90% speed

Always use an external monitor connected to the graphics card when possible, because that way the data only has to go in one direction (from pc to graphics card) and saturates the connection less. With an external monitor you also have far less crashes when running at EC 2.0 speeds.

The other connector usually mentioned doesn't crash at 2.0 speeds and is the better choice, but you have to pay some $20 compared with the EXP GDC.

If the graphics card has additional power connectors (it doesn't get all the power from the PCI-Express) you also need to invest on a power supply. A cheap $15 300W power supply is usually more than enough. You still need to connect the power brick to the laptop, of course.

Don't use 16GB of RAM.

And from what I've seen, temperatures using an eGPU are faaaar better than normal (the iGPU is deactivated), so the gaming session will be very silent and the CPU can push boost frequencies further without heating a lot.

How is W7 with thinkpads? Does it really get more battery life?

Windows 10 is the best operating system at managing battery life that I've seen so far.

win 10 > win8/8.1 > win7 = good linux distro > macOS > shitty linux distro

>5 hours
9 cell plus Slice gives you 20 hours

Best argument so far for a new X1 Carbon.

X61 tablet

So I got my memepad yesterday, fiddled with it, opened it (I'm surprised at how easy and modular this shit is), I thought it didn't have any flaws as I bought it refurbished and it was in pristine fucking condition, and then I noticed while typing.

The L key was broken. Specifically this white thing at the right side is missing (pic related, excuse the poor quality). I can put it back and it seems as though it's being held just fine, until I decide to type something and suddenly the key pops out again.

What can I do to fix this that doesn't involve spending 40 fucking eurobucks on another keyboard? I mean shit, this keyboard is like new.

noob here. I picked up an old T41 that has a bootloader that looks like pic related except the second option is some command line Unix OS. it BSODs every time I try to boot into Windows, and there's a blue Access IBM button that gives me a few options including restoring the system, and running a diagnostic utility. I tried the system restore option and it seemed to work but Windows just BSODs on boot again, though sometimes I see the logo for a split second. I thought maybe the hard drive was broken but I ran the diagnostic option and it didn't seem to indicate so. any clue what's wrong? I'll show pics of the diagnostic results if that helps.

I also tried running a live Xubuntu USB but every option on the startup screen makes the computer crash

>Post specs and settings. Too much bullshit in /tpg/
i5-3520M
8GB RAM, mixed DDR3/3L.
Samsung 840 PRO SSD (256GB)
6 cell battery + 6 cell slice
Brightness at 5/15
Wi-Fi on. Browsing websites, webconfig consoles, Wi-Fi site surveys.

Typically I get 12-14 hours, but if I am not in a bright location, I can turn the brightness down to the 0-3 range and get 14-20 hours depending on usage.

>Brightness at 5/15
I don't see how people do this. Do you all stay at home with the lights off?

worst fan tho

> Ö

Remap the L key to some other key duh.

>6 cell battery + 6 cell slice

this unpractical frankenstein shit doesnt count you stupid idiot.

>own a T420 for the last couple of years
>45C idle all day everyday
>today I turn it on, changed literally nothing, no updates, nothing software, hardware, I didn't even move it, not even the pieces of paper on my desk.
>all of a sudden 33C while idle, same load temps tho, @ same ambient temp.
>33C idle

what the fuck, are my thermals fucked? what now?

I fucked up my poor X40 by accidentally letting systemd reinstall and then my internet didn't work but through elite command line magic I undid it.

WHEW, I just cracked a beer in celebration.

T570 looks like it'll be pretty goo-
>940MX
Why would they ship a new laptop with last year's low-end gpu?

Why unpractical? It doesn't increase footprint.

>footprint.
I know you've got a lot of trash to store on your desk and you need the most area you can get. Sorry anyone here ever questioned your thick, heavy, inefficient laptop in favor of a new X1 Carbon.

>desk
Oh I get it now. Don't worry, we'll have that misconception resolved in no time. You see, there are people who have something called a "job". You might have never heard of it but the important part is: These people actually leave their home and sometimes use their laptop in places where little space is available. Sometimes they even spend 12 hours or more on the road without an outlet anywhere near. In that case, weight is only a minor concern. A switchable battery and full size VGA and Ethernet are more important. I don't expect you to understand that but maybe one day the Job Fairy will award you with work and income.

Hello, are there non-whitelisted old ThinkPads on which I can use a quad-core i7 CPU?

t520/t530

For your own sake, don't feed the troll.

>X1 Carbon
That thing has a chicklet board, fuck off Chang.

Thank you.

you know, thanks for the idea. I'm going to replace the retainer with some other key I don't use too often.

T420,430 and their 5xx counterparts along with the W series iirc

AFAIK I can't boot with this CPU with my T420, but thank you for the answer.

I haven't been paying a whole lot of attention, but didn't Nvidia completely skip 1000 series mobile GPUs? I know there's 1000 series MXM cards but they're full-power desktop chips.

which CPU?

I'm running a 2720QM T420, no additional configuration needed.

Oh wow, the retardedness is unbearable. Go ahead, use your "actually useful" laptop, Babby.

>keep thinking about getting a thinkpad x230 ((t))
>watch ebay and craigslist
>everything cheap is probably hiding a major flaw
>everything ""expensive"" is out of my price range for what i want to spend on this

Please send exttra help :(

thinkpad-parts.com/42T5283-Thinkpad.html
will this work with T430?

>everything cheap is probably hiding a major flaw

Dude. Buy a couple, or three, very cheap obviously broken things. When they admit to breaks, they won't mask much else. Get em for dirt, and then make one goof laptop out of the good parts.

That's the /tpg/ spirit.

I don't know the exact serial number, besides that this is a quad-core Haswell i7 CPU.

At least, I know that when I boot with this I only get a black screen, without BIOS' ThinkVantage shortcut or something alike.

What is the alternative solution to the EXP GDC Beast? I'd prefer consistent 2.0 performance.

Can anyone give me a second opinion on the RAM stuff?

wait what i don't get it, are you trying to use a haswell processor on a T420?

Yeah sure

What's the nature of the performance decrease, particularly on the internal screen? Is it just like having a GPU that's a tier or two below the one you're using, or are there worse issues like stuttering or severe screen tearing?

Well of course it won't boot, Ivy Bridge doesn't work either unless you use Coreboot.

Try using a Sandy Bridge quad core.

>WITH A NEW MEGASLICE BATTERY THIS BABY GETS ALMOST 30 HOURS, FUCK YOUR NEW POWER EFFICIENT LIGHTWEIGHT NON-CHICKLET X1 CARBON LMAO MORE LIKE X1 SHIT AMIRITE?

Ok, thank you for the help.

Stop this

Check bplus com tw/Adapter/PE4C%20V3.0.html
The quality of the adapters is amazing and zero stability problems.

No stuttering or tearing, just decreased GPU performance. Less FPS.

>Look like a functioning member of society.
>Kaby Lake 15w CPUs tend to outperform Sandy and Ivy 35w CPUs while using less than half the power.
Do you know how I know you're projecting?

Carefully take it off and replace the two scissor bits from a key that you won't use (maybe a second ctrl key?) but just make sure the keytop clicks down and stays there. If that doesn't work see if you can get a replacement key mechanism or get a dead keyboard for cheap to use for spares.

Or you could just tell the seller that it just popped off or something, fuck.

I did that exactly. I put the retainer that was broken on the right ctrl key and put its good retainer on the L key.

At some point in time I guess I will change the keyboard, since it's not my layout anyways. But shit worked.

>actually leave their home and sometimes use their laptop in places where little space is available

Gee, I wonder why you would want a small and portable laptop then. You see, I actually do the shit you imagine yourself accomplishing. I can't be worried about whether the battery I'm buying off Amazon or eBay is "legit" or not. I can't be bothered with worrying about old hardware.

The used thinkpad circlejerk is a cancer and you are part of it. Maybe you could afford nice things if you got off of your ass and applied yourself. Stop telling people to buy $200 shit laptops only to discover they have to buy not one but two new batteries and an SSD to get the claimed battery life at 5/15 brightness.

Apply yourself.

kys

Hey paisanos
For models like the x200, x220 or x230, is linux that much better than Windows in terms of performance, or just minimal?

Or is it a case of "linux runs better on it because I'm using a tiling window manager and do everything through the terminal all day"?

I think I can somewhat settle this.
I currently work at the IT department of a mid sized manufacturer of spare parts for cars. Back when they were released the company ordered 100 X220s. That was before my time but they are still in active use. Since then the company has ordered a batch of batteries once every 2 years. Using laptops with non switchable batteries is, from a company's point of view, ridiculous. The boss is considering to upgrade at least some of them with X270s. We're currently reviewing some Dell Latitudes as well. This will have to be decided after the 70 series is released, whenever that may be.

What I'm trying to say is: Newer models aren't necessarily the better ones for every application but the X1 Carbon never is. The slim profile doesn't mean any advantage over a T or X series, it only leads to compromises in connectivity and maintenance.

BTW I should make clear that these are only used in administration/import-export and so on. For development (CAD and stuff) we obviously have desktop workstations. System requirements for office work and digital communication haven't changed a great deal since the X220 was released.

>Apply yourself.
Appry, you mean.

Wow. Looks like you really regret buying that Chinese piece of crap.

Seriously, I think it's more about preference. I can't say that Linux runs particularly better or worse than Windows on my X230. Though it cuts battery time almost in half so that's something you might want to consider. I know you can use stuff like TLP to counter that but compared to Lenovo's energy manager it's a pain in the ass to configure.