Sup Forums claim people are being replaced by machines "is good", since machines are more effective than people and require less "maintenance" (a wage to human workers is probably more expensive than keeping the machine working).
What will happen when we replace more and more people with machines, eventually pretty much eradicating jobs from the job market. What will happen then?
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Hopefully the people who were too useless to get a better-than-minimum-wage job will starve and die.
Either paying people for existing or going full on Elysium
Thissss
In a perfectly free market, people would simply reproduce less and those who are stupid enough to reproduce without being able to afford it would have very difficult lives, disincentivizing further reproduction. We'd eventually end up with a smaller population in equilibrium with our mechanized economy.
With socialism/communism you just end up with cycles of mass murder.
And what will happen when doctors, lawyers, teachers, etc become obsolete? The problem is deeper that just minimun wages jobs, automation and AI will find its way in almost every field
Hopefully they will violently rape you first, you fucking shit smear.
Guaranteed income
Say uncompetitive, shitter.
Show me on the doll where the wage disparity touched you.
then we will start building actually working socialism, we'll be able to afford it
Well then there would be a utopia wouldn't there?
Fact is a robot ran society won't happen but ideally they'd put that robot tax into effect and the money generated from taxing companies that replace human workers would be dumped into the system starting with probably stupid military bullshit, then health care and eventually a monthly minimum wage paycheck to everyone
Money goes to goods, goods are made by robots, robot money goes to people and repeat
Won't ever happen though
>eradicating jobs from the job market
The ideal is for machines to replace much labor, so people can work less but still afford to live. The reality is the workforce will concentrate down to a smaller number of full-time employees. The resulting mass of hungry unemployed then becomes a burden on society.
Whose going to buy shit when no one is employed?
These people designing AI somehow think that Joe Sixpack is suddenly going to be able to adapt from being a ditch digger to whatever is employable after they automate his work.
It doesn't work like that. The majority of the people on this planet are stupid.
AI is really the ultimate form of control. The needs of the many suddenly become completely dependent on the power that few control and understand.
In economics we have this concept called scarcity. Which means humans as a collective species have an unlimited number of wants and needs and yet only a finite number of resources exist in our universe. You cannot eradicate jobs through automation, its impossible.
we'll slaughter poor people with robot samurai for entertainment for half a century and then when the pop falls below 2 billion we'll live in harmony with nature and expand to the stars
sorry but it's true
we were all born at the birth of a dark age
true. 7 billion people is too much, and to put it simply, there's only a few groups of people that really deserve to live on planet Earth (Japanese, some other asians, elite whites, upper class from everywhere else)
the problem isn't too few jobs, the problem is too many people
It's ok, I'm sure you too will one day find a job that pays more than $7/hour
Singapore is the most densely populated area on the planet. And it's universities are probably the best in Asia.
Their issue is not too many people. They've just built tons of flats so there's spaces for them to live in.
get a computer science degree then not only will you survive but you can also profit from the AI revolution
Communism is the answer.
Implying most jobs are not 80% filler anyway, hell is the false morality of doing useless work to live.
We can ether work less or do more useless work.
a small densely populated area of people who average 115IQ is quite different than billions of Africans being given welfare forever
either we purge the unemployed or we get us that utopic general income for everyone
neither will of course happen and thus we will live in your generic dystopian future
Collapse of modern society and return to hunter-gatherer societies
DJT, will bring back the jobs. O.o
Aerospace welder/assembler here
F35 and f22 afterburners
Automation is good
It replaces easy low skilled jobs
And supplements high skill labor.
I use a few automated machines at my work
It helps me do my job better
Why spend 3 hours cleaning a part when an automated washer can do it for me?
Only low skilled shitty labor is gonna be affected
If your a 40yr old working at McDonald's at $9 an HR, you made some poor decisions.
I welcome automation.
Well it'll become increasingly absurd that the only people with any resources will be people who are lucky enough to own stuff.
If we're committed to capitalism, we'll move deeper into the welfare state. People will still own lots of nice stuff, but they'll pay high taxes and the state will hand out money to the plebs.
If not, we'll figure out some way to distribute all of the actual capital, and not just the money.
...
get an education, if you don't you'll be poor same as now, no excuses
Jesus Christ, the edge in this thread is unreal. I bet most of you are first year CS majors who think you'll be the next Elon Musk or whatever.
Why keep the companies, though? Why not just take the means of production itself?
cool, then those will be less expensive
As a business owner... you're a fucking idiot.
Do you really think you aren't replaceable? Unless YOU are the owner of the company, unless YOU own the robots, you are replaceable.
Fortunately I don't work in software so I (probably) don't employ people like you, but do you really think that programming can't be automated?
Programs can be automated by, you know, programs.
You make it sound like people are going to be able to tell the computer what they want and have the computer spit out the program that they want.
no, programming can be automated...
but that's not the point. The point is that programming is essentially the career that automates intellectual tasks
if you automate the career that automates intellectual tasks, user, you're at a singularity. if that happens, nobody's employable and we have no way of knowing what will happen to humanity
>those who are stupid enough to reproduce without being able to afford it would have very difficult lives, disincentivizing further reproduction
This is already not the case. Poor people have more children.
It will be awful.
The vast majority of people will live off the government.
Mental illness and crime will skyrocket.
People from 3rd world countries will flood in to the promises of free accommodation and welfare.
Intelligent people will be outbred as the stupid have dozens of children while the few scientists, engineers and technicians don't even have kids.
Larger populations will have to be sustained by a rapidly decreasing minority
Riots will become commonplace as people demand more from government
Regulations and restrictions on freedoms will inevitably come due to the unrest.
Entire countries will be in debt to a small collective of individuals.
You can see the start of this already happening yet people have their heads in the clouds, thinking it's going to be a fucking utopia. Insanity.
>The resulting mass of hungry unemployed then becomes a burden on society.
And eventually, they upend the order and kill the others.
...
starving poors vs. an army of automatic tanks that roll off a robotic production line
hmm.
No, they'll just begin stealing and revolting.
The concept of working for money collapses when everything is provided to you with a push of a button. Expectations of living or what a normal life will change to where such an environment is allowable.
>revolting
Well you got one thing right about minwagecucks.
Why are you safe? how much of wall street is run by computers right now, the first AI will be i finance, you think it wont end up better at making money then a human can? it will own your ass.
You are taking about Communism.
We finally focus on space colonization.
I guess but without money, then it works....
AI can do that too.
>What will happen when we replace more and more people with machines, eventually pretty much eradicating jobs from the job market. What will happen then?
I become a billionaire. Fite my robot 1v1 noobs
we could focus on space colonization right now but welcome to the clueship headed for planet you for the rest of your life humanity is going to focus on saving africans from global warming
They can't want what they don't need.
Yes. I can't wait because then poor people and lazy twats won't exist. Everyone has a purpose and motivation to work will be pervasive among everybody.
Your neighbor won't care how competitive you are when you're eating a meal every night and his kid is starving.
How do you plan to make that happen?
This guy gets it.
>These people designing AI somehow think that
No no no, user. Believe me, the people designing these automated systems know EXACTLY what's going to happen. It's the common person, Joe Sixpack, who thinks that "the market will just adapt! new jobs will be created that we never dreamed of!"
To those people, I have a question: How the fuck many "social media management" positions are there? New jobs are always, ALWAYS niche and NEVER fully restore employment from the industries they crushed.
>You cannot eradicate jobs through automation, its impossible.
How many switchboard operators are there today? Automation completely removed that job from existence.
>I welcome automation.
Until everyone in your neighborhood can't afford to feed their kids and you show up in a BMW.
That's the case for most people who think "Ho ho, automation will never affect ME!" They think they aren't replaceable.
Pro tip: you are. And if you aren't yet, you will be soon.
>You make it sound like people are going to be able to tell the computer what they want and have the computer spit out the program that they want.
That's... Yeah, that's pretty much how it'll work. Automating programming is still a long way off, but we won't even hit that point before we start feeling serious ramifications from automation in other industries.
I don't think you're far off base at all.
>I own robots that produce everything for me for free
>my family and I are happy, healthy, taken care of
Now why the fuck would I take care of other people before MY family? I wouldn't. Neither would you. And neither do rich people.
>business owner
user, I own the business. I'm not in finance.
Are you some kind of super tard? SPACE IS FOR MACHINES, no human have left orbit for 40 years, robots are 100 or times cheaper.
>t. unemployed/underage autist neeting off mummy
From what I can see, the entire "robots will take our jobs" meme is not really a cause for concern, right now and in the foreseeable future. It is more a shitty argument that richfags use to scare people into not raising the minimum wage.
It's grow or die, and you need what to invest?
You people are genuinely fucking idiots.
Automation in the current political climate will collapse every nation that adopts it. Automation and mass socialism is only feasible in small, isolated socities. Every western nation will have open borders by the next generation and the majority of jobs automated.
Countries can't keep increasing socialization AND increase immigrants. It's an inevitable recipe for disaster. Either the country will collapse economically or there will be a revolution because people don't want to give away the majority of what they earn to people that they have no relation to and they despise and those who despise them.
>le epic "im totally a psychopath on the internet guise xD" meme
the reality is that society will break down into rioting, and then NO-ONE but the extremely rich 0.01% (we're talking queen of england-level shit here) are going to be safe
yes, yes, I see: the horseless carriage will destroy america through creating mass social unrest
social unrest isn't a big problem when you've got killer robot samurai
Energy companies will rape whatever company dependant on robots and AI, if that does not happen, the decline in population will bring doom to these companies because these machines will be producing too fast, maintenance prices will sky rocket while being forced to lower their prices if they desire to earn money, the buying power of a single shekel will be huge again.
maybe read more about economics before philosophizing about it, that was painfully hard to read and mostly nonsense
That slapping sound is Republicans jacking off fantasizing about your children starving to death.
Welcome to the wonderful world of capitlism.
Are you telling me government won't regularize the technician profession after a couple fuck ups? The companies certainly will demand that.
Unironically this. We have to cut off the deadweigh.
>People were killed before, thus killing Franz could not spark a war
Your analogy is shit and indicative of just how stupid you are.
Horses aren't people. A car requires more workers to manufacture than horse and carriage and it carries the same amount of people. It's an example of a creation of jobs and industry.
It's funny that you'd bring up the automobile industry since the automation of much of that work resulted in severe economic and social decline. When do people look at Detroit and say "yes, this is the future I want"?
The only way for the west to survive is by isolation or war and mass genocide. There is no alternative at this point.
your entire idiotic thesis about energy companies controlling companies dependent on technology isn't worth anyone's time
seriously that was bad
I'm trying to parse the rest of your discombulated shitpost and I think that you believe more robots will mean more robot repairmen so desu I can tell that you're not really equipped intellectually to contribute to this discussion
I wasn't trying to be mean, seriously just read more / grow up
>we can't automate things because it will cause social unrest
not how capitalism works at all user, btw try intellectual humility (or just macro "you people are fucking idiots" to like F3 or something and save yourself some time)
stuff's getting automated and social collapse isn't going to happen
>social collapse isn't going to happen
What happens isn't a sudden collapse, but a gradual slide. Imagine Detroit, but everybody and everywhere.
yes, fine
look at 2008 for an example of how resistant we are to actual collapse: the entire world economy shutdown (basically over a weekend) and millions of people lost their homes and an entire generation got wiped out financially and *nothing changed*
collapse is and always will be a feverish dream for malcontents
>Until everyone in your neighborhood can't afford to feed their kids and you show up in a BMW.
That's what they said way back in the age of Industry.
It will force people to step their shit up
As we won't need burger flippers
>a revolution because people don't want to give away the majority of what they earn to people that they have no relation to and they despise and those who despise them.
We see this happening with "refugees." And I already have little desire to help any American who isn't white, to be honest.
I'm Australian. I don't want to pay taxes so brand new African immigrants can get free trips through dozens of worthless certificates and be supported by welfare.
America hasn't been pure capitalist in.... Ever, I think? And what makes you think I advocate capitalism, moron?
Stuff is getting automated and the west will collapse. If there is no revolution then the west is going to turn into a global corporatist society where prior populations are displaced for whatever foreigner is willing to put with more shit.
Mass automation is going to result in problems. You're going to realize this if automated cars become legal and standard in businesses. You people never accept this because of its not explicit. What the fuck is a trucker supposed to do now? He's going to live off the government and scrounge for work if not resorting to crime. Is that trucker going to become a programmer or a technician in your fantasy land?
The problems with so many people, especially young people, today is that they're so bedazzled by technology and progressive politics that it doesn't click in their mind that maybe "progress" isn't that great.
>The problems with so many people, especially young people, today is that they're so bedazzled by technology and progressive politics that it doesn't click in their mind that maybe "progress" isn't that great.
en.wikipedia.org
Already happened in the past.
...
It looks like most people just don't care or are too stupid to understand the seriousness of the situation.
>
Stuff is getting automated and the west will collapse. If there is no revolution then the west is going to turn into a global corporatist society...
user i don't think you understand the west or anything at all
like you've made a severe, fundamental mistake that has ruined the entire foundation of your worldview
But in the age of industry there were actual armed insurrections because of living and working conditions, and people not having enough to feed their families.
There was a thing called the West Virginnia Coal Wars from 1912 to 1921, where the modernisation of mining and competition from foreign workers allowed the mine owners to stop providing for their workers safety or paying a living wage.
Throughout the Gilded Age, cities established mass graves for the working poor because factory workers were starving to death as they worked 14-hour shifts in dangerous, inhumane conditions for the richest people in history.
People didn't step their shit up, they died in droves until the Federal Government had to start sortieing strategic bombers in the Appalachian foothills to prevent revolution, prompting regulations to protect workers that automation can often conveniently circumvent.
>well this vaguely related thing happened in the past, and everything turned out fine
>therefore we can expect the same results today
user you are so shortsighted I don't even know what to say to you.
We aren't making "labor-saving devices". We aren't making automatic machines. We are making devices that automate human thought.
This has never happened before. We have no point of reference.
CEOs would probably be replaced as soon as possible. Think about it: board members wanting the maximum output from a company that can only be achieved through an A.I. that can manage everything to perfection. No job is safe
Machines will take all the jobs leaving us humans free to pursue higher callings without the burdun of wealth based slavery.
We can worry about that when we get there. This is no different than any other labor saving invention surge throughout history. They all resulted in more jobs, more production, and more people. This is the exact opposite of what we need to be doing so if we actually are approaching the apex then I'm all for it.
What exactly are these "higher callings"?
>What will happen when we replace more and more people with machines, eventually pretty much eradicating jobs from the job market. What will happen then?
Something very interesting.
If the job market is effectively destroyed because of automation then unemployment can no longer mean what it means now. There simply won't be jobs available.
That could mean that everyone will receive a minimum wage from their country, it could mean that products will lose their worth, who knows? It would definitely be the end of society as we know it.
Luddite detected.
how to activate as many pleasure centres in the brain for as long a possible time.
or pursue bullshit art courses and fuck and multiple and gobble up other worlds
I always hoped it would aid humanity to make that step from caring about surviving today to planing for tomorrow.
Kinda like when we first started to think about what we could achieve with our lives in a couple of years, if we just stop fapping and bickering.
I always imagined people would overwhelmingly join politics, creating a democratic system where truly every person is part of the political process.
Of course we could also just all end up on our couches.
money would become less important, robots can do everything for us
Normal jobs will become the pleb jobs.
What do you think happened to farmers once tractors came in? To the Horsestables and Horsekeepers?
They went somewhere else and got another job.
Now that doesn't mean there are no farmers. But Tractors made it very easy to keep growing within the season, increasing production. There are also "hipsters/hippies" who plant and sell themselves.
If your job is too easy to be automated then you should prepare yourself and get another profession, like linguistics, electricians, mechanics, and so on.
I do believe in the future even Managers will be replaced by a Software. But there will and must be supervisors around to keep check that everything is fine.
Programming on the other hand is hard to be automated, sure a software can help you build software easier, but you will always need a programmer to tackle new problems.
Those who believe AI will replace programming should read on Theory of Computability...
ideally they would just starve and die but in reality it's going to be a complete shit show in the U.S. where there are so many people with guns who think the world owes them something.
Once technology puts most everyone out of work, society and economics will have to be adjusted so that people can live without having a job.
Our economic model becomes irrelevant then and we will adapt to it.
Yeah everybody can make a good living from cutting each others hair.
>We are making devices that automate human thought.
How I know you have no idea what you're talking about. :^)