Problems with the programming community?

What do you feel are the biggest problems with the programming community at large?

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dijkstra's_algorithm
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Commercial, closed software

The growing acceptance of proprietary software and SaaS

SJWs

Freetards.

-javascript being used for things it was never intended to
-""""""""coders""""""""""""" with all they faggotry and incompetence (note "coders" not "programmers")
-programmers buying into memes like javascript frameworks, meme languages, meme designs like flat
-politics (SJWs, sexist/racist shit like gender quotas or skin-color quotas, patent trolling etc)
-big companies baiting idiots into working for them FOR FREE with BSD/Apache2.0 licenses like android, llvm etc
-faggots like this one:

found the free faggot tard

SaaS

Frameworks

People using Frameworks with poor understanding of the underlying language/how to actually write a solid computer program

Indians

Karli Kloss Koderzzzzzz

Non GPL licensed code

Web"apps"

"native" apps which are just web brrowser + javascript bundled together

shitload of frameworks that mostly bring bloat

Lives are too short for the required amount of knowledge to be obtained

SJWS

Programmers are very bad with people in general. Arrogance happens a lot. It is a shame to see such an illogical behavior from a "logical" field.

either pajeet or people pushing their politics on it

Replacing mature code with "innovative" new versions that break what used to work and doesn't do the "new" features at all.

See: Everything for the last 5-10 years.

social justice and the academic establishment

-Elitism

-Trend hopping to $next_big_thing without a metrics-driven decision

-SJWs distracting people from real engineering problems to submit a pull request against "problematic master/slave wording"

-Re-inventing the wheel- if people would improve their current projects rather than abandoning them for new ones we might have robust software, but this is ok when it's absolutely necessary

-Low barrier to entry to certain subsets of the industry (windows admins, webdevs, etc) means that it can be difficult to separate yourself from the noise

-Interviewing: no company does this well, not even google/fb/amazon/etc


The javascript community is the catalyst in programming demise, exhibiting many of these problems. It's elitist, not because of merit, but because they think they have THE answer. It is the epitome of trend-hopping with a new framework every week. Because it has a low barrier to entry, it has a ton of SJWs and it's hard to separate yourself from the noise.

code monkeys
code monkeys who think using the word coder is bad ()
"it works on my machine" syndrome (= non portable code)
it works, so I don't need to improve it
C is old language and should not be used or taught
recursion is more obscure than a while loop

Misogyny. We need to get more people that aren't 20 something white males interested in programming.

SJWs and code monkeys

>recursion is more obscure than a while loop
hmm sure thing kid
Transverse a binary tree in 5 lines using a while loop.

Maybe not the biggest problem, but obsessing over little details. Spending 3 hours figuring out whether to use underscores or camel case, and then pulling overtime and feeling like a hard worker because for some reason the job didn't get done in 8 hours.

SaaS isn't *that* bad
Lets be honest cloud based computing ain't going anywhere anytime soon

the web as we know it needs to fucking stop. like HTTP\HTML are doing shit they were never intended, it's become long in the tooth and nobody can stop it

I hate the overwhelming reliance of Electron, while i see it's purpose, some apps really don't justify it.

I hate seeing people say "Well computers are powerful enough now so fuck it" Now i'm not saying autistically microoptimize but i mean you can take some smarter steps in development without making a simple app be so resource intensive

Most software education is a fucking joke, i think i taught this one kid more helping him with his HW than his class... Where i come from they teach antiquated ASP.net (not even like the new shit or MVC or literally any fairly decent web paradigm...

Developers that are reliant on stack
Developers that are heavily reliant on libraries (see NPM memes)
Developers are kinda retarded when it comes to UI, Documentation, and people skills.

Pretty much only agree with the JS and Politics thing. There's an overabundance of political autism and i hate it. Luckily i work in normal-people landia where mosty companies care about people that get shit done, and not shit like skin and gender...

>tfw don't work in Commiefornia
>tfw my job and jobs around me are not cucc'd
>tfw comfy job with comfy money in comfy ohio

Sorry, I didn't agree with that I was quoting code monkeys. My fault.

your story would be far more believable with microoptimizations >Do i do it like x or like y

ANITHING THAT WEB BASED SOMETHING, HOLY SHIT LE TIT DIE ALREADY
ALL CAPS BECAUSE FUCK WEB, WHY USE SLOWASS SHITTY WEB TECHNOLOGIES WHEN YOU CAN USE NATIVE SHIT
THE ONLY REDEEMING WEB SHIT IS CSS AND MOST PEOPLE DONT KNOW HOW TO GET THE MOST OF IT

Sorry for misunderstanding you and *autistic screeching* at you.

Anything I don't like.

Easily Indians.

easily

I want to program. It is fun, but when I need a break from it, I want to go for a walk and let my mind wander and recharge.
I see too many very obese or thin people around me.
Oh, and just because my boss wants to get home later because his life is nothing worth of value, it doesn't mean mine is, too.
I want to lift, visit some friends, wash my clothes AT HOME and not in a mental and maybe even literal shithole clothed in fancy job advertising.
And then this fucking scream matches which language is the better one, why you are a faggot for using another OS than theirs...
Like, get a live nigga.
Or make one

Why web? Because it is the most portable. Native code means writing a different app for every platform.

I though getting a programming job was going to be one hell of a fun ride having to solve problems every day and getting paid for it, now im super burned out, everything has become trivial and the days are blurring eachother, not sure how much i can resist this. I used to develop a shitton of apps and little games in my free time and now thats gone

bad programmers
people who think they can get good without being born with talent
lack of competitiveness

Sexism and misogyny

Think about this for a second.

What is natural about programming?

What is natural or instinctual about these abstract thoughts?

not that guy but, even if they are abstract thoughts about the implementation of something, we are still human and will naturally try to imitate the real thing, thats why OOP is a thing

Rewriting language functions because of unwillingness to learn how to use them.

Wrapping low level APIs or already wrapped functional libraries with wrappers.

Web languages, including SQL

Macros and preprocessors

>What do you feel are the biggest problems with the programming community at large?
The smugness for possessing a skill that's neither particularly hard to master (very much comparable to learning a foreign language) nor of much use outside of work. Not to mention that it's actually kinda boring to most people.

Freetards who complain about "le SJW boogeyman" but don't actually have a programming job.

>Web languages, including SQL

Recursion is more obscure than a while (or for) loop in most cases. When you have a divide and conquer or any other kind of tree tructure, then it's ok, but for most simple cases it's just overthinking things. Also using recursion creates new data implicitly (on each call), wich is more obscure than doing so explicitly on a iterative loop. Doing it on less lines of code doesn't mean it's less obsucure, see haskshell.

We don't need your Fortran on critical operations anymore grandpa

Here we are. The typical code monkey.
Hey we got one.

My arguments still hold.

No. TCO is a thing filthy code monkey. STFU, you're just an ignorant code monkey.

This

It's actually worse for them. Open source communities let this shit happen. I work at one of the big 4 in tech and no one ever talks about feminism they just do their work because they don't want to get canned before their stock vests. In open source the reason you do it is for the love of software unless you are sponsored by a company, so eroding your community with SJW bullshit is disheartening. They are right to complain.

>non stealable code

that picture is very pretty

software will always suck because people suck it's as simple as that. in little autistic groups people can agree and cooperate but the world at large will never have one OS, one file format, one anything that's universally compatible because everything is made to gimp along with code from half a century ago.

>macros and preprocessors

Kill yourself

If you ever had to write a recursive program in assembly, you would never again use it in abstract languages.

Recursion is nice when your algorithm either only needs O(1) auxiliary space, or if it can naturally be described by pushing into or popping from a stack.

If the data structures you operate on are a bit more complicated, it can quickly become much harder to read.

For example, a DFS is much shorter to write with recursion, but a BFS is better written iteratively imho.

I've been annoyed by this for a while and I've experimented with generalizations of stack calls using macros that desugar generalized "tail calls" marked with a special keyword into iterative code, where the calls are pushed into some priority queue which schedules the order in which they are executed, but that only works in languages with decent macro support and it's not widely adopted.

WTF are you talking about. Recursion is before the TCO pass. I won't do such a thing in asm.

Please stop doing code monkey things please. You lost, you lost.

I hope you're not . In any case the same for you. STFU code monkey.

Pajeets

People referring to themselves as software "engineers" and actually insisting on it (I won't bitch if someone calls me that but I'm a programmer nothing more nothing less)

IT/software "consultants"

(You) are very pretty.

T-Thanks

Lol. Try writing an recursive BFS with no extra overhead compared to the iterative version.

I'm a big fan of functional programming. But when I have to search through a grid mesh efficiently, I don't use recursion, because I know I'll be pushing into and out of queues and heaps a lot.

Honestly?

The startling lack of self-knowledge or insight into one's own behaviors.

We even have a word for it: anti-pattern, and yet we still keep making the same mistakes that were being made 50 years ago. The unproductiveness is stunning.

While we're still advancing, unless we somehow learn how to improve ourselves (the human aspect of programming) and our organizing and our organizations, we're going to hit a wall (if we haven't already).

To generate fibonaci numbers you can do it both in recursive and iterative ways. Leaving the performance cost aside (wich is an order of magnitede greater for the recursive solution), the recursive solution has less lines of code and reasambles more to the mathematical definition. However for the recursive solution you fill stack with data each time you do a call, and you do aprox 2^n calls. So that's a bunch of wasted memory and wated performance. With the iterative solution you know exactly how many memory you're using, and that's becouse it's less obsure, becouse you declare everything you use and you know exactly how many times something will be executed (you literaly specify it on for loop).

I personally use both, and find both useful for diferent kind of problems. But this whole trend of "recursive is better", "functional is better", "OOP is shit" annoyes me. If you want to do a simple search, a for x in will always be better than a T(n-1) recursion, even with TCO.

...

Kek, good to know you are a LARPer. You obviously don't know how a compiler works

People without formal mathematical education up to graduate level.

Some parts are okay. Large parts are shit though.

SHow me your code I will rewrite it with recursion and you will STFU little filthy code monkey.

the programming community itself
kill yourselves, fucking memer autists

Why would he? You don't understand assembly, it makes no sense teaching you just to prove you are wrong.

The level of code monkeys is fucking high here. I specifically told that I won't use recursion in asm.

All right. Implement Djkstra's algorithm with a provable worst case memory complexity of sqrt(V) when applied to a square lattice with a bounded number of patches removed.

People thinking all this matters. As soon as you bring politics into programming, which this entire thread is about, you become what the normies want you to be: time wasters.

Show me your code I will rewrite it with recursion and you will shut the fuck up.

I feel you Sup Forums.
I want to get better.
What book can you recommend be to learn to write better,optimized programs and to fully understand and use all well known algorithms?

Becouse opening wikipedia is too hard right? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dijkstra's_algorithm

I won't do effort to prove thing to code monkeys. SO code monkeys provide a for loop alg and I rewrite it with tail call optimization to enlighten the code monkeys. I do not need to be enlighten, you need.

this

Provide a solution to how get better Sup Forums. Lets do it.

Yeah, you are right. Similar discussions of how to optimize a utility that will get used by 3 people so their data loads 50ms faster. I enjoy that honestly but I can see I have a fucking job to do.

threads about problems with the programming community at large

-Copy/paste mentality.
-Reliance on other people's code.
-Brute force instead of efficiency.
-Lack of "ability certification". Doctors cannot call themselves doctors without a cert, but any retard can enrol in a 2-week "coding" course.

I was going to write a funny post but I couldn't think of it.

well see ya

Google is more Asian than white lmao like check your Asian privilege

The pseudocode is on the wikipedia, translating psudocode to an actual language is what code monkeys do (by the way, you have not specified the language).
And I think everyone here, well at least I (the great codemonkey you talk about) is capable of tranlating any iterative algorithm to recursive and viceversa. This whole thing is not about it being possible, it's about being better, and more accurately about being more explicit (less obfuscated), wich in general the iterative solution wins at that.

>wich in general the iterative solution wins at that.
spoke the code monkey

Prove me wrong.
>Protip: You can't.

>I hate seeing people say "Well computers are powerful enough now so fuck it"

So much this. This is the core problem to the current state of programming. SaaS, Frameworks, all the bloat all stems from this logic.

We should be making an effort to refine. Instead we've let every retard into the profession and we just have bloated hipster bullshit designed by idiots who just want more fucking lingo to throw around.

It's easy. The majority of developers think that iterative code is more readable than recursive code.

> I can't prove something so let's use fake statistics so that I don't look like I lost.
Try politics, you may have better luck there.

faggots who use js for everything
faggots who hate php, the greatest language for web dev
faggots

I gave up on you user.

Programmers who reinvent square wheels.

Half of the community is autists
This other half is SJWs

Everyone thinking they are smarter than everyone else thus feeling like they don't need to write clean and documented code.

Also for Sup Forums only the idea that everything should be written in C and everything higher than Java is for sjws only

>This other half is SJWs
this one gets me the most. I never realized that people that are suppose to be the logical ones are actually more white knightey. Then when I realize who are usually programmers, it makes sense.

Shitloads of blogposts with MACHINE LEARNING IS HARD! SOFTWARE DESIGN IS HARD! TIME ESTIMATION IS HARD! CONCURRENCY IS HARD!

We get it, you software niggers, your field is the most complicated discipline ever and mathematics, civil, electronic and mechatronic engineering are the easiest fields ever and have no right to complain about anything.

Shut the fuck up you whiny babies.

>compile to objective c and and java
>uses native components
>not native
Ok

SHITPOSTIING IS HAARD!!

template
void traverseBinaryTree (const Tree& tree, Functor& functor)
{
std::stack stack;
stack.push (tree.top());
while (!stack.empty())
{
Node* nextElem = stack.top();
stack.pop();
functor(nextElemen->data);
stack.push(nextElem->left);
stack.push(nextElem->right)
}
}

Here's 8 lines. The extra lines just make it a bit clearer to see what's going on.

It's no longer a niche field for dedicated experts.

> (({#define ME pajeet}))
> Highschool classes teaching java to normies
>They get to college and still don't know how to write a program.
>They graduate and don't know how to multiply by 2 using bit shifts.
>But it's cool because their trustfunded uni landed them an internship at a decent company.
>Making 50k a year and still learning fundamentals of programming

>They graduate and don't know how to multiply by 2 using bit shifts.
I didnt know how to either despite knowing how to use bit flags, but that's because I never saw a need for it until I had to optimize a program's cpu processes for a shittier hardware, and bit multiplication happened to give me a 30% processing speed increase.