MacBook Pro

Is the current MacBook Pro worth getting, or should I wait for the next update?
Anyone know when that might come?

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=w2rX9KgLqbc
notebookcheck.net/Dell-XPS-15-2017-9560-7300HQ-Full-HD-Notebook-Review.195668.0.html
maltron.com/store/c34/Dual_hand_keyboards.html
9to5mac.com/2016/11/03/2016-macbook-pro-thunderbolt-compatibility-issues
youtube.com/watch?v=NYVjIjBMx6o
howtogeek.com/198043/how-to-merge-folders-on-mac-os-x-without-losing-all-your-files-seriously
twitter.com/NSFWRedditImage

facebook machine

?

IMO you should look for an older 2015 model which in my opinion is their last best one as it has the most functionality with more ports and versatility than the new ones

Agreeing with this
We get it, nobody cares, go back to the thinkpad thread

the thing is id be using mine primarily for video editing, and the 2015 model has an outdated processor and gpu. I'd like to save some money with the 2015 one, but i just dont think it'll hold up
>inb4 get a desktop for video editing
i need a laptop

Do you mind no outdated ports? If not, get it right away. If you do, consider whether they are really THAT important and whether you'd want to use a dongle. Only if you're totally opposed to that I'd go for 2015, although it seems pretty hard to find for a decent price these days.

>video editing
>laptop
no laptop will be good at it. You ought to get a real desktop that'll process that video miles faster than your laptop will

>I need a laptop
no you don't I guarantee you theres a desktop solution here and you'd rather pay more for the convenience of portability than actual video editing functionality.

Wait for the next revision. Apple themselves have a feeling they're not quite good enough and they'll probably pull an Nvidia soon.

more like remove even more ports and charge another hundred dollars on their last year's price

If you need FCPX go for it. It's not like it's a bad machine just a little expensive.

Premiere is shit for OS X you might as well get a cheaper Windows laptop with better components then

>outdated
Haswell to Skylake is not that much of a performance leap

i am travelling all the time and editing on the go
i wouldn't even have where to keep a desktop
so i'd say i definitely need a laptop, friendo
i don't give a shit about the ports desu
you think they'll make it even more expensive?
i've been an fcpx user for 6 years, i'd like to stay on
not a fan of premiere
not a fan of windows either
got myself an xps 15 recently but it's just awful, gonna get rid of it
really? the issue of the graphics card still remains...

>really? the issue of the graphics card still remains...
its really not that big of a deal

it's quite important in video editing

The only thing that would change is the speed slightly. the IRIS 6100 is actually pretty gude and the dedicated GPU is even better. The difference in your editing would only be slight at rendering time

hmm

Its up you you dude, but the 2016 MBP has literally no functionality without tons of dongles. At least the 2015 still has USBs

I don't mind the ports
i can get the 512gb + 4gb gpu model for 2100 pounds
idk i just feel it'll last me longer than the 2015 one

Dumbass OP

He asks for advice but when given he doesn't want to follow. Instead he seems to be waiting for a reply affirming what he already wants or will do.

The 2016 MBP is garbage compared to the older model in terms of specs but it has that extra new luster. The performance isn't that much better on the new model, and actually it gives worse battery life. That's important in a laptop.

Looks like you already made a choice OP. Youre lucky Sup Forums even gives this shitty thread the time of day. Now fuck off.

I own a 2013 Macbook Pro, so let's just get that out of the way.

The new Macbooks are no longer worth it in any respect. They have no good characteristics or features that set them apart from the competition. None. The only thing is that they look nice and are fairly thin with good build quality.

You no longer need MacOS for the software since all relevant software is on Windows.
The hardware has long been outdone by hardware running Windows.
The previously mentioned design has been outdone/copied/improved on the competition so you can get a pretty much identical looking laptop for the same price that performs 10x better.
MacOS usability is no longer hugely better than Windows and Windows 10 is very good.
The battery life has also been outdone by the competition
The screen, while nice, is no longer the best out there and modern laptops are just plain better in this regard.
Rival laptops have more ports.


You say you want to do video editing. How are you going to do that properly without a powerful machine? Editing on a Macbook Pro is slow as fuck and absolutely not worth the price.

Just do yourself a favour and get something with more power. Buying a Macbook right now is idiotic, even more so now than before.
>No discrete GPU
>Doing video editing on an integrated GPU and a slow processor

Just don't bother. I am perfectly content with using my Macbook as a school laptop where I write reports and assignments on it, as well as a portable media machine, but I know I can't do anything heavy on it, and neither will the latest Macbook Pro.

OP just seems like a wannabe cool kid, no idea what he'll even use the MBP for, all he knows is that it'll make him look good

I don't agree with all your points but gettting an MBP with "video editing" in mind really might turn out to be an awful idea. The touch bar isn't and probably never will be part of a real video editing workflow for anyone who's serious about it. That alone should dissuade anyone from getting any of the newer MacBook Pros.

>MacOS usability is no longer hugely better than Windows and Windows 10 is very good.

I have the 2014 model.
My mother got the latest new model and honestly its super light and small but the keyboard is dog shit.

In terms of usability Windows 10 has made great strides. MacOS isn't hugely better than Win 10 at this point when compared to previous versions of windows and mac operating system versions.
As for Windows 10, I've been using it since it came out more or less, and even though the start was a shitshow with bugs out the ass and missing features, it is much improved now, and works fairly well.
I haven't had a crash or any sort of issue with Windows 10 for months, no slowdown either.


Seems to me more like the OP is under the impression that Windows as an operating system, and that windows hardware as a complete product is still at the same level it was 10 years ago, which is to say, utter garbage.

I don't fault him for that notion, I know plenty of normies that still think a Windows laptop is a 5kg Thinkpad that lags and bugs out and makes lots of noise and not a modern, sleek, light and functional laptop.
These same normies hold the Macbook as the pinnacle of laptops because they don't know any better and are just going by previous experiences.

Sounds like a shitty bait but of well...

>The previously mentioned design has been outdone/copied/improved on the competition so you can get a pretty much identical looking laptop for the same price that performs 10x better.
Bullshit on every level.

>MacOS usability is no longer hugely better than Windows and Windows 10 is very good.
When did MacOS randomly restart for updates or molest your screen with ads like time?

>The battery life has also been outdone by the competition
Bullshit too. No Windows laptop with similar dimensions/resolution comes really close.

>The screen, while nice, is no longer the best out there and modern laptops are just plain better in this regard
There is more to screen quality than resolution and Windows shits itself at 4K either way. Overall Macbook screens are still easy one of the best.

>Rival laptops have more ports.
More outdated ports. When it comes to modern ones, they have fewer.

Oh nice, a Macbook thread.

I'm getting one soon and am wondering how powerful does it need to be in order to run mpv and watch movies. Most movies will be downloaded 4K Blu-Rays. What model of the Macbook Pro can handle these using mpv?

Any one. I cant watch these on my 2012 non-retina. I've bumped up to 16gb ram but otherwise stock

OP here, just ordered it

It keeps getting worse with every update

chinkbook > macbook
youtube.com/watch?v=w2rX9KgLqbc

Wow. I thought you needed one of the most expensive Macbooks to watch high-resolution movies.

This will definitely make it cheaper for me as my Macbook will just be used for photo editing, note taking in classes and music listening/movie watching.

Get a thinkpad.

The p51/p71 are being refreshed and were supposed to be released this month, but were pushed back to May.

P51/P71 are configurable with i7s or Xeons, P51 is 15.6" comes with a quadro m2200m, fine for premiere, and P71 is a 17" with a P5000 if you want to lift weights while traveling.

Poorfags BTFO.

The 2015 is the best model. It will probably be the best MacBook period until about 2020. Get one second hand right now

If you don't give a shit about keyboard quality and like OS X, go for it. The XPS is still a better choice for me.

>Bullshit on every level.

What is the Razer Blade

>When did MacOS randomly restart for updates or molest your screen with ads like time?

It can do that if you don't pay attention. Just like with Win 10. (Hasn't happened to me a single time for instance)

>There is more to screen quality than resolution and Windows shits itself at 4K either way. Overall Macbook screens are still easy one of the best.

Key words : -one- of the best. Not THE best. There are plenty of windows laptops out there with better screens, both in terms of resolution and quality

>More outdated ports. When it comes to modern ones, they have fewer.

If you are implying USB-C is somehow useful and that it's an advantage to have to use dongles for everything then you are retarded. Until everyone moves on to USB-C those ports are nothing but a detriment. Especially when Apple ships the Macbook with nothing but USB-C ports.

>Is it worth getting
No.
But since this is the best thing that Apple can out with, then you should still get it. While the windows alternatives have become better there is still something about macs that is much more ideal.

>ITT: Retards who fail to realize you buy a Mac for MacOS

This is why you're poor and stuck with Windows that was coded by filthy poo in loos.

But it's not better than Fedora...

>What is the Razer Blade
A shitty laptop that can't even get the battery life right.

>It can do that if you don't pay attention.
Only if you configure it that way.

>There are plenty of windows laptops out there with better screens, both in terms of resolution and quality
Resolution, sure. When it comes to quality it's more complicated, given they have some strengths and some weaknesses. Overall, there isn't THAT one laptop screen yet. Same for phones too tbqh.

>If you are implying USB-C is somehow useful
It's certainly more future proof and objectively the better port. Whether you need dongles or not depends a lot on what you plan to do and how new the rest of your hardware is.

Show me a single Windows laptop with a IPS screen that can reach 1,200:1 contrast ratio. Pro tip, you can't. Only the new Macbooks can reach that. Also Macbook has support for DCI-P3. No Windows laptop has that.

>If you are implying USB-C is somehow useful and that it's an advantage to have to use dongles for everything then you are retarded. Until everyone moves on to USB-C those ports are nothing but a detriment. Especially when Apple ships the Macbook with nothing but USB-C ports.

Apple is the single, largest driving force behind USB-C. By enforcing it on their products they're forcing peripheral makers and accessory makers to adopt USB-C faster than they otherwise would if Apple hadn't done this. It's a good thing.

The only problem is that with the Macbook Pro you get 4 ports. Ideally you'd get 6 or 8 ports at least plus an SDcard Reader.

Fagbook machine

Ok so we went from "it has the best screen" to "it's more complicated", amazing backtrack. Anyway, see the link below for an objectively better laptop screen.
Also funny how you always pick the points where the MBP excels like the screen and trackpad, but never something like the ultra-shit 0.5mm travel keyboard, because that would imply admitting your toy has flaws.

Then why not add ONE USB-A port? I can totally get using USB-C, but really, not a single one of the most used port in the world?

Here you go:
notebookcheck.net/Dell-XPS-15-2017-9560-7300HQ-Full-HD-Notebook-Review.195668.0.html

Worse resolution and worse color management + backlight bleeding.

Not better than the Macbook.

yeah but check out these quads

>worse resolution
What? It's a 4k screen.
Meanwhile better contrast. So even if it's not better at everything, neither an assert laptop X has the best screen of all.

>but never something like the ultra-shit 0.5mm travel keyboard, because that would imply admitting your toy has flaws
Because it's subjective shit. The bitching about "fewer old ports" is the only legitimate objective complain and even here the relevance hugely depends on the user. It never was a big deal for me but I know tons of people for who it'd be horrible. Same with keyboard.

Things like screen quality, battery life and trackpad are pretty objective and universal.

What's the point of getting a very expensive Macbook Pro when you can get an iMac for the same price but with a superior screen and much better performance?

I really want to know.

I may be reaching but perhaps it has something to do with one being a PORTABLE computer? Just a guess.

>it's subjective
No it isn't, less attenuation for when hitting your fingers millions of times a day (why do you think stenographers use mechanical switches with 4mm travel), less 3d contrast between keys when touch typing.
Funny how this "subjective" never pops up when discussing the trackpad, isn't it? No, there it's undisputable and anyone who disagrees is poor.

iPhone is portable.

>doesn't phone post while forever waiting for the best lap top
You are obsolete

>1200:1 is some unattainable shit that only MBP's can reach
How stupider can you be?

Not OP here:

>When people buy MacBooks, what do they usually use it for? Is it really a glorified Facebook machine?
>Which model/year should I get?
>What should I look out for when I'm buying second-hand/used MacBooks?

really like the look and the design of those.. but as a professional, i couldn't work with that in a sane way

Don't get the Macbook Pro. Wait for the refresh.

The Current MBP has too much new shit in it an Apple always drops the ball on their first-gen products. The Touchbar might get a 'Touchbar 2' the way the iPad did, or maybe they'll drop it entirely since the guy who made them left Apple. The butterfly switches MIGHT get a touchup, there were a ton of reported battery issues that appear to have been resolved, but I don't know if the WiFi issues ever were.

Wait for the refresh if you can, (might not come until Q4). It'll probably also come with a price drop. This current gen of MBP was a 'test kitchen' version of a bunch of new shit. Let other people be the beta testers for it.

>>When people buy MacBooks, what do they usually use it for? Is it really a glorified Facebook machine?
Anything. Some people buy it for school and general usage. Some people buy it for video editing, image editing etc. And some people buy it for whatever fucking reason they have.

>>Which model/year should I get?
Are you poor and/or on a tight budget? Get a used one, as new as you can get. 2015 models are pretty great.

If you're rich and/or on a large budget? Get the newest one.

>>What should I look out for when I'm buying second-hand/used MacBooks?
Everything. Personally I wouldn't buy anything used ever.

No, it's not a glorified facebook machine. The hardware is excellent at some shit (great screen, trackpad, SSD) and bad at others (keyboard, battery comes glued to the case). MacOS is like a distro that works great for Apple hardware, but if you're really into Linux, then it is worse at things like package management (no, homebrew is not a replacement for dnf). Also some weird crippling like not being able to use root. But other than it's great for everyday work. Much better than Windows for almost everything.
The filesystem is trash. It's being replaced soon, thankfully.

Get the 2015. Bigger battery, has USB-A, better keyboard.

When buying a MBP always see if the seller posted that photo that details the hardware state, stuff like battery wear level, ssd reallocated blocks.

It's just hard to justify my purchase when I already have a windows laptop (950m gtx), and a desktop.

Also, I've never used OSX before. I only have an iPhone 6 Plus.

>less attenuation for when hitting your fingers millions of times a day
How is that a bad thing? Sounds like less work/movement.

>stenographers
Most of their tech is still stuck couple decades behind. Besides it's not really a relevant example for laptops where the average travel distance ranges from short to very short.

>Funny how this "subjective" never pops up when discussing the trackpad, isn't it?
Because the Applel trackpad is literally better at everything by every fucking criteria when compared to other trackpads. You know. I know it. Everyone who ever used it knows it. You could make an argument for the clitmouse but most laptops don't have it either way.

>it's the your phone can replace a laptop autist

>Everything. Personally I wouldn't buy anything used ever.
i agree with this, second hand technology is a huge risk imo.
specially phones and laptops, something that people use on a daily basis who knows where it could have been..

Then you'll need to get used to some different stuff, like closing a window doesn't close the program, and cmd+tab cycling through apps instead of windows. Also cmd+tabbing to an app with no windows opened opens a new one, but it it's minimized it stays minimized.
DEFINITELY learn keyboard shortcuts.

>How is that a bad thing? Sounds like less work/movement.
Are you joking? Try typing on a touchscreen for 8 hours a day, let me know how that goes.

>Most of their tech is still stuck couple decades behind.
And?
>Besides it's not really a relevant example for laptops where the average travel distance ranges from short to very short.
Yes, laptops would be bad for stenography. This has nothing to do with my point, which you're averting, that there are objective metrics for keyboards, one of them is travel and more travel than 0.5mm would definitely be better for typing.

>Because the Applel trackpad is literally better at everything by every fucking criteria when compared to other trackpads. You know. I know it. Everyone who ever used it knows it. You could make an argument for the clitmouse but most laptops don't have it either way.
Ok, care to post some evidence? Or is it ok to use "we all know it" for things apple is good at, but when it comes to keyboards I have to type out a force diagram?

No. New ones are shit. The last great macbook pro was the mid-2012 non-retina. The last acceptable macbook pro is the last gen retina.

Seconding this, and I don't even like MBP's.

I don't think the guy you're replying to has every used a mechanical keyboard once in his life, which may explain the Stockholm Syndrome he has for the butterfly switches.

>Try typing on a touchscreen for 8 hours a day, let me know how that goes.
Given that there is no movement at all it's hardly comparable.

>And?
Hence we have no reason to assume it's the best method. Old habits die hard and all.

> my point, which you're averting, that there are objective metrics for keyboards
A standard for a specific usage-case doesn't have to be related to objective metrics. Going by that logic old ass calculators are objective the best because they are forced on everybody.

>Ok, care to post some evidence?
Reviews where it's called the best? You probably know them all.

Had a pretty based Cherry once when they were the standard and not tech for autists, nice but nothing special compared to a 4€ rubber dome keyboard or butterfly switches. It was slightly faster to type on but felt less satisfying. Though my priority is long-term experience and I am yet to do a 7h+ marathon with butteryfly to see the effects.

You're the one with stockholm syndrome if you can't adjust to new technology, user.

just bought a macbook pro 2015 13.3 sealed, 2.7 8gb 128gb from ebay for $950..

was i ripped off? i really hope not having buyer remorse now..

Sounds fair although 128gb is pretty shitty and can be limiting.

>You're the one with stockholm syndrome if you can't adjust to new technology, user.
Nah, you're just projecting because I use Cherry, Gateron, and rubber domes. I can adjust, but I can't adjust to absolute shit "butterfly" switches.

but its upgradeable right? i know the ram isnt because its soldered, dont know about the SSD tho.

i do have an samsung evo 850 500GB that i dont use, maybe i can use that? dunno

>Macbook Pro 2015 13" 128GB for $950

Yeah that's a fucking ripoff.

just get a regular laptop and save the remaining money for your sex change surgery

All of the shit you mentioned is relatively close, hardly much of adjustment. How do you deal with chiclet keyboard on pretty much every modern laptop?

Upgrade, for sure. Though if recall I right it was some Apple specific faggotory, so good luck using your old one.

you are a fucking retard if you think gaterons are on "pretty much every modern laptop"

Apparently you forgot to invest in a decent screen with all of your keyboard fetishism. Or simply can't read.

Nice reading comprehension faggot.

>Given that there is no movement at all it's hardly comparable.
How? We're discussing attenuation when pressing a key. Your claimed less attenuation was better. A touchscreen has zero attenuation, so according to your claim it should be optimal for typing, but now all of a sudden it doesn't count... because it has no travel (i.e. no attenuation)? Isn't that EXACTLY why it would be bad?

>Hence we have no reason to assume it's the best method. Old habits die hard and all.
Can you post some evidence that stenographers use old hardware? Because I know at least one who uses a very recent keyboard (so no "old hardware" bullshit) that costs most more than a MBP, and it has about 3.5mm of travel - according to you shouldn't it be less, since somehow less attenuation is better?

>A standard for a specific usage-case doesn't have to be related to objective metrics. Going by that logic old ass calculators are objective the best because they are forced on everybody.
...What are you talking about? How is "key travel" a usecase? Stenography was an example for an argument, not the argument itself. Stop pretending to be confused, please.

>Reviews where it's called the best? You probably know them all.
How is this objective evidence? I have seen a ton of reviews calling the new MBP's keyboard bad, why are you not considering that.
And so the opinion of people who TYPE FOR A LIVING not acceptable, but all of a sudden trackpad reviewers are a golden standard of objectivity?

I have an IPS panel monitor. Suck my dick, bitches. You know what else I can do? Play Witcher 3 on Max settings, so suck it.

Actually he said he didn't adapt to chiclet, so it's included with the mechanical switches in the group of stuff he tried. How are they all pretty close?

>backpedalling

sorry

>Your claimed less attenuation was better.
To a certain point obviously. You don't want to claim that 6mm+ travel from a typewriter is better due more attenuation, do you?

Though I guess I should modify it to "less is better for certain scenarios". More travel seems better for max speed but one would also tire faster.

>Can you post some evidence that stenographers use old hardware?
The whole market is a fucking monopoly. "New" keyboards are barely any different than old ones. Compare Smartwriter from fucking 1987 with recent Diamante. It's TI cancer all over again, no progress nor innovation. They learn to type on the same machines and will use similar shit through their entire career. With the market being ruled by one company, it's unlikely anything will change, even if there would be a more ergonomic design. Not saying it makes the shit invaded but simply a very specific scenario, worth not much when the discussion is about laptop keyboards.

>How is this objective evidence?
If you want to be overly anal about it, it isn't. Let's call it public consensus then. Practically it's the same.

>I have seen a ton of reviews calling the new MBP's keyboard bad, why are you not considering that.
Hence I said it's subjective given reviews that praise it exist too. I have yet to see a review complaining about the Applel trackpad on the other hand.

>And so the opinion of people who TYPE FOR A LIVING not acceptable
It is. Just not enough for objectivity claim. Tons of people who type for a living do it on Macbooks. (Though to be fair I still have to see someone doing it on the new ones)

>all of a sudden trackpad reviewers are a golden standard of objectivity?
They review shit for a living.

>saying IPS like it's something special
At least your taste in vidya isn't shit.

>To a certain point obviously. You don't want to claim that 6mm+ travel from a typewriter is better due more attenuation, do you?
No, my entire claim was that 0.5mm was too little.

>More travel seems better for max speed but one would also tire faster.
Are you pretending not to understand how attenuation works? Again, try typing 8 hours on a touchscreen, it will hurt your hands way faster.

>The whole market is a fucking monopoly. "New" keyboards are barely any different than old ones.
What the fuck.
Let's for a moment pretend that your idea that stenographers desperately want to use keyboards with low travel, but that duh big bad market won't let them is true. Here is what is considered to beone of the best companies ergonomic typing:
maltron.com/store/c34/Dual_hand_keyboards.html
Are you telling me this looks anything like a keyboard from the 80's

>Practically it's the same.
>I have yet to see a review complaining about the Applel trackpad on the other hand.
>Just not enough for objectivity claim.
>They review shit for a living.
I think the problem here is that you don't know that word 'objective' means. user you could have a 100% rating on every review, it's still subjective. An objective metric is something that has a value regardless of the observer - how can a review, which is MADE BY AN OBSERVER ever be objective? This isn't being overly anal, it's using a proper definition instead of saying "it's better because a lot of people like it".
I never ever claimed that the keyboard was bad because stenographers liked it, I proved my point: fingers hit the key with force, more travel means that force is dissipated in a longer term, which is better for your joints compared to a sudden shift in momentum. It's the same reason why falling on a pillow feels better than on a hardwood floor. This isn't some opinion, it's biophysics. In contrast, there is NO objective metric whatsoever where the apple trackpad is better, just a bunch of "I like it".

>my entire claim was that 0.5mm was too little.
Because stenographers (aka. a specific user case) are used to more. Mhmm.

>Again, try typing 8 hours on a touchscreen, it will hurt your hands way faster.
Try typing 8 hours on an old typewriter, it will have similar results.

>maltron.com/store/c34/Dual_hand_keyboards.html
>stenographers
And here I thought you knew what you were talking about for a second.

>I proved my point: fingers hit the key with force, more travel means that force is dissipated in a longer term, which is better for your joints compared to a sudden shift in momentum. It's the same reason why falling on a pillow feels better than on a hardwood floor. This isn't some opinion, it's biophysics.
It only lacks actual numbers, since we're not talking about touchscreens, hence it's never the situation you described but variations between travel. You decided to draw the line at an arbitrary point. Why isn't 4mm too little?

ThinkPad X1 Carbon 2017

Proves you wrong at every level
>Lighter
>Matte IPS display (better than glossy, fuck you)
>Better battery life
>2x thunderbolt 3
>Better thermal performance
>Kaby lake

>Because stenographers (aka. a specific user case) are used to more. Mhmm.
Post proof of this claim. It's the third time I've asked you to prove a claim, so I'm guessing this won't be it.

>Try typing 8 hours on an old typewriter, it will have similar results.
Yes I agree, but when did I ever mention typewriters? Stay on track, user.

>It only lacks actual numbers, since we're not talking about touchscreens, hence it's never the situation you described but variations between travel. You decided to draw the line at an arbitrary point. Why isn't 4mm too little?
Wait, when did I ever say 4mm was optimal? I said 0.5mm was definitely below optimal, that was it.

tl;dr: stop with the endless conjecture and post proof of any of your claims. You said the trackpad was objectively better because reviews (lmao), but you never proved it. You said stenographers didn't change because they couldn't upgrade, but you didn't prove it, in fact stenographers spend absurd amounts of money on hardware and yet I've never seen a stenographer's keyboard go below 3mm.

>better than glossy
Yeah, who wants vibrant colors anyway. Or do you really think sunlight/reflections are a problem with 500+ motherfucking nits? Also it's 16:9 trash either way.
>Better battery life
Nope, 2h worse with useless 1080p screen. Haven't seen review with QHD but it's bound to be even lower.
>Better thermal performance
It actually gets hotter.
>Kaby lake
So same shit, different name?

>Post proof of this claim.
You said it yourself that most of their stuff is in the 3mm-4mm range.

>when did I ever mention typewriters?
When did I ever mention touchscreens?

>I said 0.5mm was definitely below optimal, that was it.
Based on what? The objectivity of your claim only goes till "Travel is better than no travel" which nobody argued against. You didn't provide any proof that 0.5mm isn't enough.

>You said stenographers didn't change because they couldn't upgrade, but you didn't prove it
>Smartwriter from fucking 1987 with recent Diamante
Look em up. Note the huge difference with the keyboards. Oh wait.

>yet I've never seen a stenographer's keyboard go below 3mm
There are tons of laptops that go below 3mm, used by writers, journalists and programmers, who depend on their typing just as much. What now?

>You said it yourself that most of their stuff is in the 3mm-4mm range.
I asked for proof that 0.5mm is too little only because stenographers are used to more.

>When did I ever mention touchscreens?
But user, I mentioned touchscreens because you made the claim that less attenuation was better, here:
>How is that a bad thing? Sounds like less work/movement.
So bringing up touchscreens (zero attenuation) made sense as a counter-example. However I never claimed more travel was better (just that more than 0.5mm was better), so I don't understand why you're bringing up typewriters.

>Look em up. Note the huge difference with the keyboards. Oh wait.
So you have one model that looks similar, fantastic. Are you pretending not to see the Maltron link I posted? I sure wonder how they're in business considering stenographers supposedly don't buy their products.

>There are tons of laptops that go below 3mm, used by writers, journalists and programmers, who depend on their typing just as much. What now?
Ok, are you seriously misreading me on purpose? Do you understand what "stenography keyboard" means? A laptop is not a stenography keyboard, even if you use a laptop for stenography (which by the way none of those jobs are), you're still not using a stenography keyboard. I can use a toaster to cook steak, that doesn't make a it a steak grill.

Again, still zero evidence for your claims. It's almost like they're opinions.

I've used it. The keyboard is incredible. And I type for a living

>opinion

that's the best you're gonna get

>I asked for proof that 0.5mm is too little only because stenographers are used to more.
Uhh... what?

>However I never claimed more travel was better (just that more than 0.5mm was better)
Well, apparently Apple agrees with you since they upped it to 0.55mm with the Pros. So it's all great now?

>Are you pretending not to see the Maltron link I posted?
It's not a keyboard for professional stenographers due the layout alone. You won't type 250WPM+ on that thing. The company doesn't claim otherwise either.

>MALTRON ergonomic keyboards are designed to enable people with special needs to enter computer data much more easily and quickly than with conventional keyboards.
>In addition, Maltron fully ergonomic keyboards have been shown to relieve the symptoms of RSI (Repetitive Strain Injury) in hundreds of cases and have enabled many RSI sufferers to resume their careers.

>A laptop is not a stenography keyboard
True on every level.

>even if you use a laptop for stenography (which by the way none of those jobs are), you're still not using a stenography keyboard
Why yes, true again. But since you brought up the "typing for living" stuff, what matters here is that just like stenography keyboards, laptops too are used by professionals who type a lot. Most laptops got travel way below 2mm and these people are perfectly fine with that. Stenographers who are used to type with 3-4mm will probably not be fine with that, which leaves us with different typists working on different keyboards. (Almost like it's all subjective) Being all about evidence, you haven't provided any proof that the travel matters unless it's literally zero, which no one argued against in the first place.

>2006-2015
>trackpad impossible to click near upper edge
>extremely loose near bottom edge
>overall flimsy diving board piece of shit
>even applel admitted it's shit and went back to solid non-click touchpads
>still has no real buttons
>relies on pressure sensitive gimmick bullshit
>if you press too lightly or too hard it does something completely different than what you intended
>shit tier 1mm travel chiclet kb
>OSX is a steaming pile of shit with horrendous battery management
>applel's solution is to cram in a massive heavy 95WHr battery to make up for it
>even XXXTREME GAMER cancer like razer blade with 4X the CPU/GPU power and 70WHr battery matches it in battery life in same tasks
>gets BTFO by 55WHr Yoga 2 in battery life in same tasks
>the battery takes up the space where a cooling system would've been in a laptop not designed by the world's thinnest and lightest gay hipsters
>overheats constantly from abysmal crippled cooling system
>throttles to 800mhz due to chronic overheating problems
>retina meme for "pros" have have gloss mirror coating impossible to use with overhead lighting
>blurry as shit retina meme scaling
>shitbook air even worse with glossy 1366x768 TN eye cancer
>systemic battery explosion problems for over a decade

>2016+
9to5mac.com/2016/11/03/2016-macbook-pro-thunderbolt-compatibility-issues
youtube.com/watch?v=NYVjIjBMx6o
>can't use any existing TB3 devices
>can't use USB and wifi at the same time
>ultra shit tier zero travel kb
>keyboard louder than WWII cricket
>memetouch emojibar
>no USB-A
>no escape
>soldered ram
>soldered SSD
>tamper tape on battery screws
>applel falls for their own thin meme and uses 54WH battery
>2 hour battery life

howtogeek.com/198043/how-to-merge-folders-on-mac-os-x-without-losing-all-your-files-seriously
>it's 2017 and moving folders around in finder will STILL cause massive data loss

>macshit is good
Can we finally put an end to this meme?

>are fine with it
First, not objective.
Second, they type less. I mean I can "be fine with" a Fischer-Price keyboard for 30 seconds, I use an Apple keyboard at work that I'm fine with, but we're talking about long periods of typing and at high wpm - and no one does either as much as a stenographer. And stenographers use 3~4mm keyboards, despite your unfounded claim that they only do so because they're not allowed to upgrade.
I don't understand how we went from "this is objectively better" to "being fine with this", is it because you can't provide proof of your claims?

>unless it's literally zero
I did provide evidence: more attenuation means less strain on your joints. This wouldn't hold if it followed your retarded model of one big singularity at zero because 0.5mm has less attenuation than 3mm, and neither is zero.

Still no proof, and I have other stuff to do (I imagine you do too). I hope we can agree the 0.5mm is way less than optimal, whatever that is, both objectively (again, strain) and subjectively. Furthermore, the apple trackpad has exactly zero objective metrics according to which it's the best, that one is entirely subjective. If you can't agree, I'm sorry, you're welcome to show evidence otherwise.

cry harder, poorfag

>zero counterpoints

...

red retard pls go