There is no reason for most people to get ATX computers. MicroATX, or even MiniITX have everything you need...

There is no reason for most people to get ATX computers. MicroATX, or even MiniITX have everything you need. The only difference between the sizes is number of drive slots and PCIe slots, and there are certainly people who need those slots, but those should be the niche, not the default, and the industry should stop treating it like the default.

Other urls found in this thread:

asus.com/Motherboards/Z170I-PRO-GAMING/specifications/
asus.com/Motherboards/ROG-Strix-Z270I-Gaming/specifications/
asus.com/Motherboards/PRIME-B350M-A/gallery/
youtu.be/OaKsJFQoChw?t=438
twitter.com/SFWRedditImages

>liked, subscribed, upvoted, thumbed up, bookmarked, reblogged
the majority of people don't need desktop hardware anymore

yeah the lack of microatx (or smaller) X370 boards is a bit of a piss-off

i personally plan on eventually using SLI so i'm stuck going with an ATX board

>Pico-ITX
YOOOOOOOOOO

Consoles and smartphones do everything you need. There is literally NO reason to own a Personal Computer in the year 2017. People buy these ugly ass boxes in the year twenty seventeen? I am literally shaking my damn head! Get with the times, family!

Even within the small niche of people who build their own computers, the vast majority of them aren't going to have a fucking NAS in them.

>3 DIMM slots
JUST

There are two kinds of people left. There are the ones that appreciate the extra slots and ports. and the ones so stupid they think a bigger box = a more powerful machine.

>MicroATX, or even MiniITX have everything you need
I learned that when I built my first system years ago. I just had to get an ATX board+case for some reason. I never even needed those extra PCI slots.

The extra space is good for airflow and giant ass heatsinks

>3 Slots VIA chipset
Shieeeeeeeeet, my P4V8X-X just died a month ago, this strike really close

This is what I've been saying for years. Looking at half empty motherboards in riced cases is just retarded as fuck. Most people never buy more than a graphics card, but they STILL buy an ATX case and motherboard for it.

Bullshit! More space just means more opportunity for turbulence and hot pockets to form, and if for whatever reason you'd decide you need a 165mm tall heatsink, you could just buy a larger ITX case, same deal if you decide 2 drive slots aren't enough. There is zero reason to buy an ATX case and motherboard if you are only planning to populate one PCI-E slot.

>Consoles and smartphones do everything you need
but not everything I want.

>There is literally NO reason to own a Personal Computer in the year 2017
I assume laptops fall under that category as well, PCs are all in one solution for entertainment and productivity, there are power users that require special software which can only be used on a PC running linux or windows.
For instance CAD, PCB design, programming. Even for more basic tasks like spreadsheets and documents good fucking luck handling input efficiently with a fucking capacitive touchscreen.
With a single monitor or more you have a far larger workspace.

Consoles and smartphones are not x86 with a physical keyboard, you can only use android. Until other OSes start supporting ARM.
Don't get me wrong, I like the idea of an ultramobile platform that can do a wide range of tasks like a swiss army knife. Ubuntu phone had a nice idea going with docking a smarhpone turning it into a workstation for basic tasks on a mouse+keyboard, smartphones have far more than enough processing power for basic tasks these days the problem is with the OS and input limitations.

I hope UMPCs kick off, got a gpd win recently and fucking love it.

>Consoles
>not x86
ignore that

>UMPCs
Don't they have heat problems or is it just a meme?

What's wrong with people getting atx though?

agree,

although ATX boards look sweet if you have a windowed case, an itx board is more practical but has limitations on memory slots and overclocking potential.

Nothing, but it shouldn't be catered to the most at the expense of others, like they are today.

Managed fine without fan on when playing light games or browsing/watching video.
With heavier games like last remenant it sat around 76 degrees celcius on the CPU with the fan off and teh plastic case got lukewarm but not hot enough to annoy me.

For general tasks it idles around 55degrees Celsius and the plastic enclosure remains cool. So far the unit only gets lukewarm for me when playing demanding games without the fan on. For heavy loads you will definitely need to turn the fan on.

Haven't tested much with the fan since the battery lasts around 3 hours, get to squeeze more without it. Don't expect it to play AAA titles on lowest settings smoothly it is better suited for emulation up to PS1, indies, and older games like mount and blade warband.

>limitations on memory slots and overclocking potential
Sure, because a 2x16GB dual kit isn't enough for any home user, right? And the lack of overclocking potential is just pure bullshit, everything that has to do with overclocking electronically occupies the same amount of space on any motherboard, so the components relevant for overclocking are the same as well.

you do know some iTX boards have a 16gb limitation right? compared to the 32gb cap on an ATX/mATX board.

(for anyone that is autistic enough to go for that much RAM)

I have plenty of room I buy whatever is cheapest within my parameters. if its an atx, fine. If it's a matx in an atx case, that's fine too. I would like an itx build someday though.

I accidentally got a microATX instead of full sized for my last upgrade, still worked with a mid sized tower and is barely sufficient for my needs.
I am running out of USB ports, had to buy a PCIE USB controller though it is not a waste since I can route my front USB ports to use the expansion controller making life easier when hotpluging devices to a VM and not have to worry about the motherboard's USB memory mapping on future upgrades.

Who gives a fuck about antiquated hardware? We are comparing form factor to form factor, not aging compact shit, to shiny new big shit. You can buy mITX boards with 32GB support since 2015.

Notice the placement of the PCIe slots in your OP.
Notice anything?
I'll wait...


The x16 slot blocks usage of the x1 slot with the use of 95% of video cards.
You are a literal retard. The vast majority of Micro-ATX MoBos are like that, also. Having the x1 slot placed between the x16 slot and the edge of the motherboard.

>I didn't need this thing for my life, so that means nobody needs it.

4x8GB is still a lot cheaper than 2x16 though, as are full ATX cases and motherboards much of the time.

Here's another one OP.

Micro ATX and smaller sizes force the manufacturer to place the audio chips and module next to the x16 slot; the LARGEST emitter of EMI in your case.

Can't argue with that. It's not for poorfags. But from a utility standpoint, ATX has nothing over mITX, as long as you only want to use one PCI-E socket.

So what? Everyone and their grandmother buys audiophool speakers with DACs for their PC.

ANOTHER ONE. In case I haven't properly communicated, one point at a time, that Sup Forums doesn't belong on this board.

Find more than 6 boards smaller than ATX that have more than a 4+1 VRM. OR a VRM with an attached heatsink. Some people like powerful CPUs.

...

>not wanting enough storage space to have 2TB worth of torrents

There is literally no disadvantage to having a ATX motherboard and anything less should be kept to niche micro builds or network service machines.

>implying Sup Forums aren't the ones advocating for hueg industrial strength riced out cases

ASUS Z170I Pro Gaming (I have this one)
Asus ROG STRIX Z270i GAMING
Asus MAXIMUS VIII IMPACT
Gigabyte GA-Z270N-Gaming 5
ASRock Fatal1ty Z170 Gaming-ITX/ac
ASRock Fatal1ty Z270 Gaming-ITX/ac
ASRock Z270M-ITX/ac

... and these are the ones with more than 4+1 VRM phases AND a heatsink on them. There are two others with more than 4+1 but no heatsink.

Again, your argument is irrelevant. No matter the form factor, the VRM occupies the same fucking space on the motherboard above/left of the CPU socket, so there is no reason why they'd have less.

>He thinks those are PCI-E slots on the top

oh you, user

>autism
>implying I ever said ATX should go extinct
All I'm saying is that despite microATX shedding most of the cruft that your average builder wouldn't need while still keeping everything that's relevant and therefore being a much more space efficient layout, OEMs seem to mostly ignore it and give all their R&D money to full ATX instead. The end result is that if you want to buy any case worth their salt the only options have 3 5.25" bays and 6 3.5" bays, when 99% of builders would have maybe 2 HDDs maximum, sacrificing efficiency and aesthetics.

Maybe it'd help technically challenged people if the examples on the picture weren't from 2017-10.

-gaming; console popularity took a hit this generation
-vr w/ room scale
-having a workstation


30% bump in sales over the past year according to microcenter

OP's image is outdated; pic related is the state of mATX motherboards today. I dare you to find something important that won't fit on this.

pretty good,
mATX is defintely the best form factor.

If you're willing to go down to microATX, you're willing to go down to miniITX. mITX has far more support from OEMs too.

Nothing missing here either.

If I install a graphics card where the hell do I put my 10gbit LAN card?

>an mITX board only has one expansion slot, thus it's not for people who want to use more than one
well, no shit sherlock!

so you understand most people, I see.

Post says nothing is missing, yet something is clearly missing.

It's not the expansion slots at debate here you fucking moron, the argument is that PCI-E slots aside, smaller boards are not as well equipped as larger ones. They are!

to a degree, i agree. when it comes to atx vs micro-atx i do believe micro-atx serves the overwhelming majority. i would have gladly bought a micro-atx board for my ryzen if decent micro-atx boards actually existed like they do for intel. if asus released a ryzen x370 gene i would have snagged it fast. in this day and age the differences between micro and full atx boils down to slightly less pci-express lanes and now nvme slots. everything else from ram slots, vrm setups, and sata ports are identical. plethora of m-atx cases that are small but roomy enough that don't sacrifice in cable management, hard drive / ssd space, and cooling. not to big nor to small.

atx still has its purpose for those who want multi-gpu setups and / or two or more nvme slots.
>hurr m-atx can use dual cards!
well obviously but i mean more for dual with a dedicated sound card or other pci-express 1 slot card, and tri / quad video.

but itx and less? that's just meme level for autismos. don't get me wrong, i've seen some beastly itx builds but they're WAY to cramped and limited for my taste. with how small they are and limited space, i can't even see joe the gaymer who can barely plug his cpu into the socket trying to conquer a itx build. they can barely manage cooling and some how manage to overheat their parts with full size atx cases.

>no m.2 slots on mini itx

What's the point of your form factor

>smaller boards are not as well equipped as larger ones. They are!
>they are
no, they're not. it doesn't even have a nvme slot.
>hurrr you can just remove the wifi card!
well now, i guess i have to choose between wifi or nvme ssd. doesn't sound well equipped to me. at least with micro-atx i can have everything and still have a small build.
>hurr use lan!
hurrr use m-atx.

This mITX board has one:
asus.com/Motherboards/Z170I-PRO-GAMING/specifications/

This one has TWO:
asus.com/Motherboards/ROG-Strix-Z270I-Gaming/specifications/

should I get a NUC or build a micro/miniATX rig?

also:
>I don't know shit about the form factor I'm criticizing, the post

Call me when micro/mini can have 8-10 sata ports, support 4 RAM sticks, onboard sound to the level of a pci-e sound card (with all the usual features, 7.1 etc), provide 6-10 USB ports (need 4 minimum with kb/m, USB stick + phone charging), at least one 16x pci for graphics card (not a bit fan of dual). For most people a micro or mini will do, but for what ever reason I haven't come across a mobo with 8+ sata, no onboard graphics, 7.1 and 2 RAM. After a certain people manufacturers go ham and try to load higher end mobos with as much shit as possible.

Although onboard graphics have come in handy a few times.

Either way I'd still need a full size tower, for drives and cooling.

Irrelevant. We're talking about people who unnecessarily buy large boards, not about people who consciously buy the bigger one, because they need more expansion slots.

I want to convert my ATX to a mITX, but the costs would be somewhere around $300 I don't have. Specialized hardware man.

I got this one
asus.com/Motherboards/PRIME-B350M-A/gallery/

Only seems to have the standard 6 sata ports.

Stop being poor, and buy bigger hard disks. Then you won't need more than four. Yours is an issue of money, not motherboard design.

Would agree, somewhat. But I don't purchase new drives every time they are full. I have 3 2TB drives, 2 4TB, 1 5TB and a small SSD. I only consolidate into new larger drives when a 2TB is full. I can't just go out on a 6 monthly basis and buy 4 new top of the range drives, easily $1k or more (8TB REDs are $455 ea here at the cheapest shop I know).

The point of a smaller motherboard would be to be able to get it in a smaller case. I don't think small cases can take ten drives so you might as well stay with the ATX ones.

Do you need several terabytes of data all the time? Can't you get a network share and keep the desktop PC as you like?

the Costy form MITX vs ATX vs cases not all ITX cases look nice most of them are objectively ugly and square and dGPU limited.

Other than that motherboad size has its uses.

that said. I have ATX because I liked the tmotherboad and plan on expanding that in the future. IE . PCI-E SSD
not all PCI-E 8x are just for gpu and one sould not forget that PCI-E SSD is a thing.

for the average user I guess ITX should be the norm but nobody cars about anyof that when looks equals sold product.
ATX sell because they are expandable
ITX and others just don't have it and that don't have the self life of more ram over time.

So in fact its a moot point.
and your a Idealog that just wants other people to do as you say.

>I don't purchase new drives every time they are full
I do, although they don't get full too fast. I started with two 1TB hard disks, then moved onto 3TB disks. Now that I have four of them, I am using them in RAID through USB 3.1 in an external enclosure, and my ITX PC is fitted with a 10 terabyte SATA hard drive, a 500GB SATA SSD, and an M.2 SSD for the OS.

It's really not that much money. A 3TB drive costs only about $100, and I bought four of them during the course of four years. The 10TB hard drive was quite expensive though, but it won't be full for another two years, unless I decide to go 4K.

I have two machines currently, the HTPC and this one. HTPC has the largest set of drives of about 16TB atm. I just can't afford a proper server set up, the HTPC is for communal use as well.

Do I need it all the time? No, but having the drives spin up when I want to watch something is better than digging out a stack of drives and plugging them into a dock.

I organized my drives by content, so some are accessed daily, others maybe a few times a week when I want to watch something from months or years ago (I have a habit of eventually moving completed seasons or media to the HTPC eventually).

Its Costy form MITX vs ATX vs becases not all ITX cases look nice most of them but esculate in price given there is higher price per mm(2)
plus the cases for ITX are objectively ugly and square and dGPU limited.

Other than that motherboads are for indivuals that have different needs.

That said. I have ATX because I liked the motherboad and plan on expanding that in the future. IE . PCI-E SSD
not all PCI-E 8x are just for gpu's and one should not forget that PCI-E SSD is a thing.

For the average user.
I guess ITX should be the norm but nobody cares about any of that.
When looks equals a sold product.
ATX sells because they are expandable
ITX and others just don't have it and that don't have the self life of more ram over time. (not includeing MATX because they are just the same thing basically)

So in fact its a moot point.
You are an Idealog that just wants other people to do as you say.

Yea size tends to be the issue. Going through the collection and updating old TV rips to BD is crazy. From 350mb xvid to 2.2gb (or more) per episode so you're keeping the same amount of time/episodes but increasing the storage requirements by almost 6.

You buy what you have a need for. I bought a nice mATX and got a small case so my computer wasn't a big hollow shell. If you want ATX go for it.

Finally got into the ITX build meme and I'm currently happy with it, looking back at my old ATX build you can see the huge amount of empty space that is wasted.

(although aesthetically it looks better since the heatsink doesn't cover the whole motherboard like in an ITX build)

I don't update to a higher resolution with all my TV series, only to a more effective encoding. So I've gone from 350MB divx episodes to 172MB x265 with some of my old series. I've found that with most series from the 90s the higher resolution and bitrate actually leads to worse visual quality, because the film grain will get a lot more crisp, so the blurry lower resolution image is an advantage.

Typical example for that is Babylon 5.

Smaller motherboards and by extension smaller cases don't have support for enough radiators.

So get fucked poorfag ;)

I would if Micro ATX actually had some good looking motherboards. They all might as well have green pcbs

> you don't use things
> wants to take it away from those who do

I like ATX motherboards with 8 SATA ports and a lot of PCIe slots. I always move my desktop's motherboard/CPU/RAM to my home server when I upgrade my desktop. You need SATA ports to have a RAID6 array and you need a lot of network cards to use your server as a router/switch.

My desktop also needs a lot of SATA ports and it's nice to have enough PCIe slots there too.

what case is that?

Fractal Design Nano S

I do like ITX as a form factor, but it does have it's limitations. I know i'm not going to buy one without built in wifi again.

I think this time around i'll prioritise quietness over smallness however.

Thanks.

Oh, I've been looking at that case. The gap between the PSU and GPU was concerning me. Though i see you've solved it by using an SFX power supply.

That's a moot point, those who do fine with mATX can go buy pre-built garbage system which probably have mATX motherboards in them.

Real men who build their own systems need big ATX motherboards unless they are manlets who think that's too big to handle.

The smaller the board the shorter it's life span. Larger boards have more surface area to relieve heat stress as compared to the smaller boards. No amount of case cooling will change this. Ive gotten more Micro-ATX's that were burnt out than I've ever seen with ATX boards.

youtu.be/OaKsJFQoChw?t=438

You were saying?

yeah I had to go with SFX, my other PSU was choking one of the intake fans

>I am a real man therefore I need a bigger board
>being this retarded

ATX builds/cases are a pain when you don't have that much desktop space available.

Just get a hub.

yeah that is what I am doing now, only got a PCIE one to make passing devices through easier due to QEMU's 4 device restriction by USB ID.

ATX notation:
>Standard>Micro>Mini>Nano>Pico
not
>Standard>Milli>Micro>Nano>Pico
If you are going to use metric prefixes at the very least use them in the right order damn.

Is "mini" an SI prefix?

Nope, and it tickles my mettwurst when all the rest are.

So they are in the right order.

That mATX mobo has an AGP slot and PCI slots (along with the PCI-e 1x).

mATX has three slots usually.If more than two are PCI-e then you have nothing to complain about.

Perhaps, but E-Atx is still the better purchase because of the amount of upgradability one can do to a motherboard of that size.

Real men don't fiddle with computers that can house ten HDDs for hentai

I love how mATX is finally becoming popular with case makers this year, they're finally catering to something I want
Its like bezelless phones too, 2017 is just my year.

nice bar fridge you have there, i like the conversion into a tower, is it a fisher and paykal or a Kelvinator? i can't tell

MicroATX master race, checking in.

I have a standard ATX because I have something like 9 drives in my computer, and needed the space for the SATA connectors, plus the PCIE connectors for an extra sata controller. And a backup USB pci card because the usb3 controller on the motherboard sometimes shits itself.

Also I use the bottom PCIE8 slot for the videocard because that way I can fit more HDDs in the case (it's pcie 3.0 so the speed is still fine).

However I would love to move all my drives into a NAS in another room, and change my main computer into a small mATX box. Possibly even mini-itx, depending on whether I can find a motherboard that is sufficiently powered for a work + game PC. And make it a horizontal case, so it puts less strain on the components.

>Consoles and smartphones do everything you need.

consoles and smartphones can't run photoshop, mate.

>The extra space is good for airflow and giant ass heatsinks

They are actually bad for the airflow due to lower pressure. There's a reason why servers manage to get good cooling with tiny ass heatsinks - they force a lot of air fast through a small space, which is more efficient (they also run 4000rpm 50db fans but thats beside the point).

Wait...my computer will make Hot Pockets if it has enough empty space? Why wouldn't I want that.

ur soo funneh!
air pockets, moron

You must be fun at parties