Are full size ATX form factor motherboards going to die soon?

Are full size ATX form factor motherboards going to die soon?

Everything else in tech is always getting smaller but ATX boards have remained the same for nearly 3 decades.

Is mATX the new king? and is mITX a meme?

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I think the MATX platform will eventually offer all the features and capability that ATX boards have now. Smaller than that? I dunno man.

mITX is a meme but it's a nice meme. Made my dad a mITX htpc and it fits nicely in his TV cabinet.

Even mATX is still pretty big! what features do mATX lack that ATX have? Aside from maybe a dash of space for more cooling?

They might become less common but they ain't going away any time soon.

that's a pretty big consideration if you're gonna use two graphics cards. Sup Forums loves to rail against that but plenty of people do it, and ATX lets you put more space between them. Plus the larger case is easier to work on, and some people will want a larger case anyway, if they're going to stuff a big radiator in it, or fill it with hard drives.

mITX is nice. I think the main problem is that they're tried to solve the space issue by just making it small rather than the industry redesigning the components.

I'm not saying Apple are amazing or anything but they can build a entire (underpowered) computer in a Mac mini that is 'half as powerful' as a mini/mid tower but many times smaller...

Agree user - totally valid reasons but will eGPUs will replace onboard dual/triple etc graphics cards?

You'll see a lot of the >gaming >laptop people using them I bet. But they're kinda pointless for a desktop, and an external GPS can't help but be slower than one in an internal slot.

>Everything else in tech is always getting smaller
processors are bigger, ram is bigger, discrete gpus are bigger

>Is mATX the new king?
no
>and is mITX a meme?
hell no

the micro builds seem good on paper but guess what else doesn't get smaller
fan motors

No, eGPUs will never enter the desktop market because they're objectively a worse solution for a desktop than a regular GPU.

Why do you hate full sized ATX so much? It will disappear when people stop buying it. That's how markets work.

True true - I kinda think egpus will get just as fast as bandwidth continues to grow but yes metal to metal will be quicker for sometime yet I guess. That said, consoles (at release date) are normally graphically better than *most* computer graphically and half the size?

I don't hate ATX - if it's the best delivery model then it's the best delivery model. Just it's hella huge still. Everything else has typically shrunk in tech - even M2 etc is making 2.5 inch drives look obsolete but board sizes seem to remain the same.

The only reason there so small and still have the GPU horse power is because of integration and everything being on one board

Micro ATX is ideal for most people. Multi-GPU setups are increasingly rare and more than two GPUs is pointless at this point. Micro ATX motherboards are cheaper and smaller and provide full functionality for a single GPU PC, except maybe in the power delivery department.

Good point on fan sizes - wthis is just because of the heat that components generate tho? I guess maybe boards are just constrained by the pumped up wattages that cpu manufacturers use and they won't change for a long time because of that

Yeah - no doubt bespoke engineered to very specific criteria to push out the graphics they generated. Maybe because PC industry is so fragmented that it will never shrink down - why would nvidia/shilltel pull the rug from under their own feet

>rather than the industry redesigning the components
The market would be tiny and the prices would be large. The way forward they took was the right one, as much compatibility with existing components as possible. You get flexibility and upgradability while not being terribly expensive due to specialization and small markets. It's not like some pretty tiny ITX cases don't exist anyway, they do that without really sacrificing any desktop performance, which is pretty cool.

Agree user. I still think we'll look back on ATX in all formats in a few years and lol at our massive computer boxes :)

Ironically, microATX seems to be getting passed over in favor of mini-ITX for compact systems, while ATX is still going strong for everything else. There were far fewer interesting mATX boards announced this year than ATX and mini-ITX boards.

Yeah I think there's only really two types of motherboard buyers, the "I want tiny" crowd, and the "I don't want tiny" crowd. Neither of them want mATX. Tinyfags will go ITX and bigfags will stay on ATX.

PC industry really isn't fragmented, its built for interoperability and modularity, and on desktops power draw and size take a back seat to performance which means larger systems to be able to handle the large range of PC parts that are out there

Agree user, it was a great standard to introduce, just now 20+ years ago. To compare, would you go back to a big CRT tv from 20 years ago? I don't have an alternative answer to ATX but CPU boxes have never followed the same shrinkage trajectory as other tech

>Finned mosnet and nb heatsinks on mobos almost dead
>Puke colored mobos gone completely
>PCB quality going down every year, even if '20oz' or '8 layer pcb' marketing bullshit
>Led's that serve no diagnostic purposes
>PS/2 port not working inside the spec (I'm looking at you Asus P67/Z68 boards) or completely missing
>Boards with no PCI connection
>Distance of socket to first expansion slot too small: cpu heatsink and gpu on first pcie slot have trouble fitting
>If using integrated intel_hd_audio, using codec more recent than realtek 889 (which works with oss4, 898 and later doesn't and it also has best analog output quality, if needed); only toslink digital output instead of (or and) coaxial
>Realtek nic's (suprisingly, many am4 mobos have intel nic, which is good)
>uefi, that is objectively worse than bios
>ddr4 memory training causing extremely long post times

>would you go back to a big CRT tv from 20 years ago?
'Go back'? I haven't left, not television or monitor. Big? Size other than visible picture area? How cares? I don't go moving monitors all day long.

Haha yes, well true. :)

Sage
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>would you go back to a big CRT tv from 20 years ago?
If it offers better picture quality (motion quality; black levels) than my edgelight bleeding, sample and hold blurring LCD TV with blue heavy color spectre (thanks to blue leds covered with white coating), then yes.

>Yeah I think there's only really two types of motherboard buyers, the "I want tiny" crowd, and the "I don't want tiny" crowd. Neither of them want mATX. Tinyfags will go ITX and bigfags will stay on ATX.
Eh. If you look at /pcbg/, most people seem to get mATX cases and motherboards. mITX has too many compromises(and limited motherboard selection at the moment, if you're looking to get Ryzen) while there's little reason to get ATX over mATX.

Interesting user - I think there are some great small matx cases out there that fit the goldilocks scenario now. Inwin 301, raijentek, maybe even the define mini c if not still quite large. Love the mITX size but too noisy and cramped. Tho that's another thing - why so many cables. Why not just build one header off the motherboard with a single controller for fans, sata etc...

>would you go back to a big CRT tv from 20 years ago
Not to one from 20 years ago, but if I could get a 3840x2160, 27" actual visible diagonal CRT monitor I sure as fuck would, the colors, contrast, blacks and lack of motion blur would be amazing. CRTs were huge and bulky but have legitimate advantages. It's a device I place on my desk and it stays there, the size isn't really any sort of primary concern, it's not meant to be portable and I don't use it in such a manner. Same goes for ATX mobos and cases, they aren't really that large to pose any significant problem for their intended use case, so I don't see any particular need to make them smaller, except for niche uses such as ITX HTPCs and NUCs which already have their niche.

Yeah I miss my old CRT too, amaxing picture quality. I suppose people said before us too as well with this gorgeous old TVs that were build with chestnut wood etc

Itx has better performance over atx and matx. Look up oc3d's review on the z270i, if the it has all the features you need then go for it. Cheaper, performs better and cools easier since there is less going on.

Yeah AMD need to get more ITX boards out soon. Ryzens shaping up great and needs to appeal to everyone, even if to just make Shilltel get off their a$$es and start making competitive products again

>Love the mITX size but too noisy
Depends entirely on the components used. There's no reason you can't build a Mini-ITX system to be just as quiet as a full ATX.

>why so many cables. Why not just build one header off the motherboard with a single controller for fans, sata etc
Because they didn't start with a blank slate; new cables and interfaces were added and upgraded as needed. What we have now is 3+ decades of evolutionary development.

Starting over would allow for some amazing optimization, but as time goes on you'd get the same feature creep and you'd eventually need to do it again. It'll happen eventually, it just won't be for a while yet.

Yeah I suppose that's my point user. 30 years of refinement rather than the industry recognising 'hey let's do something different'. Even if mobos came with a teeny inbuilt controller that you could plug everything into - rather than routing 5-10 cables to the mono directly. But yes, I suppose everything just takes time...

i usually find itx boards are at best similar price, usually more than mATX, why is that?

>There's no reason you can't build a Mini-ITX system to be just as quiet as a full ATX
IF you use low power parts sure you can but using full TDP parts is abit harder. Having to use an AIO and the graphics card running hotter will make it louder than a normal sized system

>i usually find itx boards are at best similar price, usually more than mATX, why is that?
Cramming all the components into a smaller space takes more engineering man-hours.

ITX should have 2 full pcie x16 slots, that way it would be very easy to build compute clusters with a single slot pro gpu and a infiniband card.

There are a plenty of ITX cases that will fit the biggest heatsinks on the market, so that's not really a concern. Likewise, you can get cases with more than enough room and airflow for oversized GPUs. Keeping compatibility with all that stuff (and full size ATX power supplies) that makes most mainstream ITX cases so large.

mATX is cheaper because they make it smaller by removing shit (you probably wouldn't use anyway) from ATX boards. ITX is so small that they need to actually make an effort to design a custom, small, high-density board which has all useful features while still being small enough. They're probably less popular too.

It wouldn't be ITX then. Like, the size of an ITX board isn't physically large enough for another slot. What you want is Mini DTX, which is basically what you're describing (ITX dimensions enlarged enough for a second slot).

I've got a 4690k and Tri-X R9 290 in a Phanteks EVOLV ITX with a PH-TC14PE for the cooler. It's silent unless the GPU is under serious load.

so saying itx is cheaper is wrong

Volume is a big reason. ATX boards sell in much greater number than either microATX or mini-ITX; consequently, the initial development and tooling costs can be spread over many more units, bringing the per-unit cost down.

Quite a big itx case? Good for cooling because of extra size?

>uefi, that is objectively worse than bios
Please explain.

>Itx has better performance over atx and matx
you mean that single asus board has a menial edge over its matx/atx counterparts? Form factor doesn't guarantee better performance, that comes down to component quality and reliability.

Does mini dtx fit inside ATX family cases? Does anyone use dtx form factor?

I was more referencing the really tiny cases, rather than the itx cases that are pretty much shrunk down mtax cases

It's definitely large for ITX. It's only a little smaller than the mATX version. Temps are similar to the mid tower case I originally had all this shit in except again under heavy load.

>Does anyone use dtx form factor?
No.

Mini DTX follows ATX standard the same way as ATX/mATX/mini-ITX, so yes it's compatible with cases designed for those. It will even fit in many mini-ITX cases, despite being a bit larger, as long as the case has two slots (which most do if they're designed to support video cards).

Unfortunately, it was basically a stillborn form factor after being introduced some years ago by AMD. Very few DTX boards were produced, and those that were almost all ended up in prebuilts.

Then maybe say what you mean instead of making broad, incorrect generalizations.

>Are full size ATX form factor motherboards going to die soon?

No.

Pic related.

>Compares the board to numerous others
>Itx gets higher memory speeds that only a $300 atx board could achieve
Alright. You're completely right. Just ignore the video why would you.

...

Related question? Could I cram an extended ATX mobo into a normal ATX case? I'm willing to do some modding but I don't want a bit of motherboard sticking out?

...

he's dumb and i'm guessing he hasn't used a board that shipped with UEFI yet given his referencing P67/Z68. the BIOS to UEFI "updates" for those boards were atrocious and removed plenty of features for no good reason. default UEFI doesn't do that.

hugely diminishing returns with high frequency ram paired with kabylake, ryzen can't even utilize much past 3600mhz

Asus, gigabyte, and msi. Thanks for proving my point boiyo.

...

Like I said though, the itx performs better and generally I found it to be cheaper compared to similar counterparts. If it has everything you need, why would you go for an atx instead? You like much empty realestate?

Entirely depends on the case. Some will fit, others won't. Some you might need to mod it (like removing drive cages) to fit. You'd have to measure the specific case to figure it out.

>muh noise
why do you retards keep your case so close to your ears
i've put delta fans in a pc before and the noise didn't both me because the computer was not on my desk or close to my ears.

are you daft? it's literally a difference in score of 200 in 3dmark. No productive tasks will benefit from itx. Gaming doesn't benefit from itx.
PCI-E slots. Even if all you're doing is gaming then something like this will perform very similarly for $60 less than the strix.
newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813132935

Bitch did I say your daily tasks will show improvements? All I said is that they perform better and higher memory clocks than similar counterparts and I wasn't wrong. Fucking read you shit nugget.

>I need muh pci slots for audio cards and sli
Fag

you weren't wrong but the difference in performance is so minuscule that it doesn't really matter all things considered. This is all in response to your blanket statement in . Motherboards are a platform, they're simply different sized PCBs with different features. If that strix works for you then that's fine, but to claim a form factor has more performance than another is entirely misguided.

My argument was if the itx has everything you need it performs better and it's generally cheaper so why not just get that? I see so many builds with atx and they never use more than what an itx provides. Generally there is less on an itx to break than a atx, I've seen random shit burn out on atx that's never even used and worked fine with out it.

>My argument was if the itx has everything you need it performs better and it's generally cheaper so why not just get that?
For starters generally it ISN'T cheaper.

No, enthusiast hardware will always require more space and will always exist.

Kek no, those things aren't even for consumer class normies

You're right. I think this is driven by case manufacturers supporting mitx cases over smaller sleek cases accommodating matx boards. I've looked in to a mitx build and there are a lot of feature and expansion compromises to be made with those builds not to mention the constructions on hardware.

Here is an example of a smaller ATX or M-ATX case currently in development that interests me greatly.

you're misunderstanding, reliability doesn't come down to how small or large a unit is. Quality of the components (capacitors, vrms, etc) is all down to the manufacturer. All key components have simply been crammed into a smaller area. Claiming that a smaller form factor of a board will result in a lower probability of failure is flat out inaccurate. The niche for itx has also lent it a considerable price premium over matx/atx, this is true for both LGA1151 and AM4.

Tell me more about this NCASE. I want two in MATX form.

some ITX boards support bifurcation

>are ATX boards going to die soon
No.
>is mATX the 'new king'
That's one way to put it.

I personally would not buy an ATX board in this day and age. MicroATX is perfect for me, and once nice cases set up for PCIe extension cables become more common, I'd even seriously consider MiniITX.

They are working on prototypes. Check out their site and sign up for alerts.

I have a m itx water cooled pc and it's comfy

>literally only one mATX AM4 socket motherboard that has the X370 chipset and a M.2 interface

I guess I'll just go ATX.

The Ncases are great. If they did one in mATX I'd buy one in a heartbeat. I'm currently looking at raijintek Thetis. It's a compact ATX case that supports a mATX board. Tempered glass side.