Wtf Sup Forums why didnt you tell me that this had a futures/promises library that doesn't require standard lib?

Wtf Sup Forums why didnt you tell me that this had a futures/promises library that doesn't require standard lib?

It's only a matter of time before C/C++ is abandonware.

Other urls found in this thread:

benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/compare.php?lang=rust&lang2=gpp
github.com/fuchsia-mirror/magenta-rs
dlang.org/spec/garbage.html
twitter.com/AnonBabble

I personally find Rust to be caring about different goals than I am interested. Make no mistake, I absolutely hate C++ however it doesn't have annoying features like Generic traits and lifetimes.

All I need is a modern C++ that
1. Does not have C preprocessor
2. Has RAII
3. Does not have GC
4. Ditches source level C compatibility
5. Modules and no header files.
6. And of course, lazy iterators, lambdas, pointer arithmatics, CTFE, hygienic macro system etc.

>doesn't want c compatibility for whatever reason so he loses a fuckton if libs
>but wants to have pointer arithmetic

Why, brainlet?

See: source level C compatibility (which C++ is forever burdened with)

>sjw programming language
SHOW YOUR TITS FAGGOT

You mean socks

programming socks*

>faggots
>tits
Are you new to the internet?

OP here, I'm not gay

>It's only a matter of time before C/C++ is abandonware.
oh you delusional retard.
rust is not the default prog language on any platform and is not being pushed by any multibillion dollar company. it has no fucking future.
worst of all, it's run by communists, antifa, SJWs and anti-white jews who literally call for death of whites.

>NO
>STEP THROUGH
>DEBUGGER

Real men don't need debuggers

>sjw programming language
who even cares

I'm sure you can use gdb

lldb

This.

Real manly programmers use print statements to debug the code.

>rust is not the default programming language on any platform
so?
>not being pushed by any multibillion dollar company
Mozilla? Dropbox?
>worst of all, it's run by communists, antifa, SJWs and anti-white jews who literally call for death of whites.
proof?

Samsung and VMWare are using it too FYI

Rust has all of those. Am I missing something?

"c compatibility" and "c source compatibility" are different things dude

Oracle uses it as well

EPIC! Another point for the good guys 8)

Can anyone explain what futures are for, what do they do differently to async/await for example?

Futures and promises have too high of a abstraction cost. Stack/stackless coroutines are way better or Go channels are the way to go.

Seriously, everytime someone suggests Rust can now replace C/C++ is somewhat deluded. It is still high level incomplete and is missing a ton of stuff low level. Seriously, they JUST added unions in the latest release. How long is it going to take until anonymous structs and unions, or something as simple as aligned memory allocation?

The main problem is the language can't be simply implemented like a C compiler. Having 1 implementation will strangle the language eventually.

But Rust's futures abstractions are zero cost!

Why are Rustfags so proud of adding terrible JavaScript memes?

async/await are futures

>that doesn't require standard lib
>standard lib

it's standard, there's no difference because you'll always have to #include

C++ is literally JavaScript

Marketing bullshit. Remember when they said
>Macros are so powerful they build super duper hyper optimized regexes at compile time!
... now it's
>Please stop using the regex macro

Daily reminder of the things written in C/C++:

All OSs desktop and mobile, and the new ones like Fuchsia.
All firmware on billions of embedded devices, from civilian applications to military.
Pretty much most of the scientific research software.
All performance critical software from simulations, CAD, rendering both photorealistic and real time like game engines.
The fucking INTERNET.
All security software, like encryption, firewalls etc.
All drivers.
All the good books that I've read on CS, networking, cybsec, only mention C and Linux, other languages and OSs don't even fucking exist.
Daily reminder that if you removed all the Java,C#,Rust,Go... code out there, not much would happen.
Daily reminder that if you removed all the C/C++ code, we would be back in the middle ages.
Daily reminder that only koders use Java,JS,C# and that they know nothing about CS.
Daily reminder that Rust,Go... are just fucking memes no serious programmer gives a shit about.
Daily reminder Rustfags care more about their crazy political ideologies and Rust is just a way for them to spread their filth.
Daily reminder that C/C++ will outlive you.
Daily reminder that koders like sucking dick.

koders are moving to modern pythonic C++

You literally described Rust.

>lifetimes are features
Features? Really? How are they features?
Every language has lifetimes. It's just that in Rust you sometimes has to show what your lifetimes are.
They are help for the compiler to show the flow of your program. Maybe some day writing them will not be necessary, but as of now you sometimes need to help the compiler to infer the lifetimes, if the compiler can't do it on it's own.

You mean, all that shit around me is full of exploitable holes everywhere and people are still adding more holes every day?
>Stop this planet! I wanna get out!

[citation needed ]
We've been through this before, a language can't be insecure, you can write insecure code in any language.

thank you for stating the truth. sadly Sup Forums has become pajeet central as of late...

>[citation needed ]
auto [citation, needed] faggot

See the throbbing CoC

even if modern C++ were to resemble python (which I'd argue it doesn't), that's not a problem because it still comes with the advantages of a compiled language like static typing, extreme speed, and good diagnostics.

>software written before Rust became a usable language is not written in rust
Wow.

>static typing

you can fucking write an IDE that autocompletes auto before compilation for you, it doesn't even have to know what the fuck it's doing with auto

same with all the includes and other crap

>Daily reminder that if you removed all the Java,C#,Rust,Go... code out there, not much would happen.
you would fucking starve if you removed all the java code out there you ignorant fuck

Yeah, GDB works just fine.

And all of this would be way less buggy if it were written in a langage without null pointers.

exactly, null pointers are the primary source of bugs and vulnerabilities
idiot

Am I doing a huge mistake learning c and c++ now?

probably

I would like to use Rust for embedded systems, but the lack of compile time features and higher memory use is a pretty big blocker. For comparison see the mem column here:
benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/compare.php?lang=rust&lang2=gpp

>>Please stop using the regex macro
Why, does it slow the compilation time too much, is it buggy or does using it make the code unreadable?

>For comparison see the mem column here
that kode is ""optimized"" for speed you fucking idiot

don't take that shit seriously

That's a good point. It would also be interesting to see binary sizes on a -O2 + freestanding environment.

Rust doesn't have CTFE. And I said "doesn't have annoying features like mandatory traits in generics and lifetimes." (equivalent)

Still waiting for that citation fuccboi.

Exactly, and it's going to stay that way.

>you would fucking starve if you removed all the java code out there you ignorant fuck
Prove it.

Nothing, absolutely nothing will replace C and C++. Deal with it, faggot.

there is still room for a language that's productive AND low level

Software that is already written in a certain language will very likely stay written in that language.
I don't see your point.

>We've been through this before, a language can't be insecure, you can write insecure code in any language.
But some languages make it much easier. "Insecure language" does not necessarily mean every program written in it is insecure, it's a question of how easy it is to make security bugs (and how many language-specific ones there are).

will sepples ever recover?

This.

Also needs all the nitpicky shit cleaned up (obtuse syntax and half the STL).

There is no NEED for new language, there already are too many and nobody's going to rewrite the huge code base of already written and well tested code in C to a new language "just because" and without any business with doing that.

>There is no NEED for new language
there is a need, python is too slow and C++ has shit syntax and missing features

only
>bank
>finance
>heathcare
nice cherrypicking, faggot

People that wrote all that code until now don't have this problem. Maybe you're just a bad programmer?

>why have cars when everyone is happy riding horses
>maybe you're just a bad horse rider

You ran out of arguments about programming languages and now you're talking about some horse shit? In Python you can call C code that can use OpenMP for efficient parallelization. C++ has good syntax, when you write reasonable code, it's just not idiot proof. I'm really curious what are those missing features, go on and enlighten me and don't tell me it's gc. Do you even write computer programs? If so, what kind of programs? Have you written anything for HPC cluster? I don't think so.

>Real manly programmers use print statements to debug the code.
Wait I do this, is it bad?

> C++ has good syntax
wrong it's ridiculously clumsy

idiot proof or not, it does not help you to get shit done

>I'm really curious what are those missing features, go on and enlighten me and don't tell me it's gc.
if you don't know you're not a C++ programmer

hint: Boost

If you're looking to eventually be employed yes. If you're just doing it for learning purposes then no.

Tell this to all the people that got amazing shit done with C++ including Carmack and the guys behind Unreal Engine, people who write CFD code for wind simulations of wings in airplanes in Boeing and many, many other people. You don't know shit.

Why the fuck do you need a library inside a language? Just fucking include it you cretin.
I know C++ and other languages too.

>C++ has good syntax, when you write reasonable code, it's just not idiot proof
Declarator syntax fucking sucks, god help you if you want to declare a function pointer. Using & and && for references sucks too. There are at least 5 different ways to initialize an object and they can all behave differently. Template syntax is ludicrously heavyweight and templates in general are bound by a ton of bizarre restrictions. Good luck putting any constraints on your template parameters too, because the only way to do that currently is to do some horrific hack like
typedef typename std::enable_if::type constraint;

C++ does not have clean syntax. Not in the slightest.

people dug canals and built pyramids with their bare hands, don't mean he don't need mechanization you fucking moron

you're not even a programmer, just some number crunching code monkey that doesn't understand efficiency and dev speed

>there already are too many

Nah. Most of them are terrible and have terrible implementations that can never be optimized to a reasonable degree. Many of them also have huge problems with parallelism that can never be solved without breaking backwards compatibility.

There's still lots of room for modern languages with good implementations.

Just declare function pointers like you'd do it in C and you're ok and besides that don't use features just for the sake of using them, if you can do the same thing easier, do it. Nobody's forcing you to use templates like this.

I understand all that and even more and the proof of this is that you're not talking about fucking pyramids. Go watch ancient aliens and leave programming to programmers you piece of brainlet shit.

I disagree.

>Why the fuck do you need a library inside a language?
lol what moron

just fuck off you retard

c++ ded

Not everything has to be inside a standard library of a language, for this reason you can use external libraries like Boost. Now you fuck off, I'm done with this thread full of idiots like you.

c++ is more popular in modern tech fields

high tech and gaming are almost exclusively c++

> I disagree

Well you're very obviously wrong. Every major technology company is investing in new languages for very good reason.

>It's only a matter of time before C/C++ is abandonware.
The BSDs would like a word with you.

with every post you prove that you're a moron

imho you don't even use c++ beyond college level shit

it's still true that if you worry about employability you should learn java and not forget it

If you're talking shit on c++ than there's no fucking way you're not a retarded code monkey

lol nice try but the biggest critics are c++ gurus who wrote best selling books on c++

If you're not talking shit about C++, there's no way you have any experience with it and any other language.
You could easily have all the shit that you have now with much cleaner syntax if you simply designed the language coherently rather than building shit upon shit over decades.
D would be that if it didn't go full retard with its GC dependency.

C++11 has future and promises as part of the spec.

what's your point?

There are maybe 10 people in the entire world that fully understand C++ and how all the features interact. You're not one of them.

do people actually use those?

>D would be that if it didn't go full retard with its GC dependency.
GC dependency? you can turn it off

>1. Does not have C preprocessor
>5. Modules and no header files.
Why?

It's endemic in the language. You can't use half of the standard library without leaking memory for the GC. Array slices? Mandatory GC.
You can't "just" turn it off. Too much of the language depends on it.

They do no good.

>and the new ones like Fuchsia.
github.com/fuchsia-mirror/magenta-rs

Speeds up compilation time and removes possible dependency on the order of includes.

D developers argue that garbage collection improves performance: dlang.org/spec/garbage.html

I seriously doubt that unless you're using shared_ptr everywhere like a dipshit.

PR stunt. Typescript is the only language Google ever approved besides C/C++, Java, Python. Homegrown languages like Go and Dart excluded.

That was just something some of the Fuchsia developers did in their free time. Rust isn't an approved language at Google.

This is entirely dependent on how much garbage you're generating and how much money you're willing to spend on memory.

I've seen places in finance that use Java but in order to get acceptable performance they have to have systems with ridiculous amounts of memory so that they can ensure garbage collection doesn't happen during trading hours.

>Garbage collection isn't a problem if you never have to collect garbage

That's the idea yes. In most benchmark contexts where this is being spouted by Java developers it's quite a bit dumber because they use that to claim that Java is faster. Then they ignore the fact that's it's trivial to allocate a huge memory pool in C or C++ as well and that C and C++ blow Java out of the water again once that is done.

That's the problem with GC. Any performance gain you think you gain from the removal of determinstic destruction is simply deferred until later. You can't sustain the performance.

Yup. Java also has other huge problems like lacking value types and having no way to control how objects are laid out in memory. Overall, it's just shit if you really care about performance and efficiently using memory.