> The reason AMD has been tight lipped about the entire issue is because they cannot be seen enforcing retailer MSRPs (which would be illegal); they can however (((''suggest''))) the optimal price and then try to enable it using incentives like rebates
>Remember, it is illegal for AMD to force a price point on retailers. Our source believed that the market forces should naturally converge at a universal price point of $599
>Vegas cost structure is going to come down sometime in Q4 2017 when Hynix’s HBM2 memory enters the scene along with custom AIB variants
And so the real truth of it all comes out Gibbo, the lying cunt, just wants more shekels.
Nathaniel Brooks
>580 almost 400 EUR >56 at 399 EUR >64 at 499 EUR Suprise. With prices high from mining it should be expected that you don't get them at msrp.
Jace Ramirez
Oh, also, here's how AMD fix this mess: Sell it themselves, through a website of their own. Seriously, I understand that limits them and they shouldn't ONLY sell it through themselves, but they could easily sort it out through Amazon for examples sake, so they sell it directly from AMD-RTG and set their own prices.
Julian Williams
>WCCF tech
garbage. they were the ones who started the whole AMD fake launch prices bullshit
i spit on wccftech's grave
Angel Brooks
This is exactly what Nvidia did with FE. Founders Edition wasn't a cheap ploy for Nvidia to whore profits, it was a quick and dirty way to put price pressure on AIBs and faggot retailers who aimed to extort consumers. FE was available on Nvidia's website for some time. So, you're right user.. But this would require business people and marketing groups to actually do their job.
> mfw when these morons let this shit fester for weeks until replying showing how worthless human beings are in such roles now-a-days.
Wyatt Turner
I wouldn't pay $400 for vega64, who honestly cares about this shit?
Blake Martin
wccftech was right about pic related since february.
Jace Morgan
>they were the ones who started the whole AMD fake launch prices bullshit
No, that was Gibbo, the owner of OcUK who also started the 70-100MH/s rumour.
Evan Price
That's exactly what I was thinking of outright referencing in my post, but wasn't 100% sure if it was correct or not due to not looking too far into it at the time. If this is the only issue causing the price integrity concerns, and nothing to do with manufacturing costs suddenly jumping, then it would only make sense.
I've just tweeted @ Radeon & AMD, but you know that nothing will come of it. Still, worth a try.
Mason Fisher
But the FE was a 100€ more expensive. The whole FE bullshit was just to cash on the fact that for a month there wouldn't be aftermarket coolers or really any other way to get the card and AMD couldn't do shit about it.
Jace Lee
>No, that was Gibbo You mean 'that was known liar Gibbo', right?
Juan Bailey
>would not even pay 400$ for a card that is as good / better than a 1080 wow what a jew you are
Connor Anderson
And he was claiming to introduce a system to let actual people get their hands on cards too.
>naturally converge at a universal price point of $599 $100 MORE THAN WHAT IT IS WORTH
FFS
Aaron Peterson
Please AMD sell rx56 on steam one per customer
Samuel Hernandez
>most people don't even know what msrp means woooowww
Justin Baker
Go on camelcamelcamel or pcpartpicker or any price site. They stated the MSRP and then they build a custom package (FE) and stated the price of it. There was no bait and switch. Prices were stable for ~3 months.
Price were $50-$80 over MSRP not $100. This is not the case w/ vega.
Furthemore, nvidia offered them on their website w/ zero markup beyond the price they published. It nothing like this shit show vega launch. The markup is north of $200, none are in stock and retailers/aibs are raping the shit out of consumers. Meanwhile Radeon is derping w/ this consistent (but we suggest MSRP and can do nothing about it). Nvidia did something.. They made a custom card and sold it on their fucking website at a price they promised for months which kept aib/retail pricing fixed.
This is factual and can be verified by any price history site. Any commentary to the contrary is horseshit.
images.anandtech.com/doci/10336/GTX1070.jpg $70 above MSRP I paid the founders edition price for the top of the line OC'd AIB. No AIB nor any retailer dared go any amount above the FE price for 3-6 months... because people could simply go to Nvidia's website and buy it for far cheaper.
AMD didn't do this. Their twiddling their thumbs playing pretend dummy while retailers/distributors/aibs rake their customers over coals.
Likely because they have shit for brains marketing/business staff who don't know how to stick it to the market and reign control over their distribution chain.
Gabriel Moore
1080/1070 launch didn't have scalpers and miners grabbing every single part in stock with moments. There were some stock shortages that was sorted within a few months but not a huge demand so it wasn't that bad.
Also founders edition was never a custom card, it was the reference design with a built in early adopter tax with it's increased rrp.
Ayden Young
You're retarded (which should go without saying for a frogposter really). There was no mining bubble when Pascal was released. Demand was a lot lower. The 1060 and 1070 are currently facing stock shortages and massive overpricing too. Any half-decent model of the latter is currently selling for $500. Based Nvidia, right? By your own logic it's even more fucking embarrassing not to have stock sorted and allow price inflation more than a year after launch than to sell out at launch.
Miners were always going to strip the stock and raise the price as soon as it was available, like they have every single other card that's good for mining. Stop being a fucking retard, retard.
Connor Taylor
>FE was available on Nvidia's website for some time.
They still are... I bought a couple of 1070s last month. Most of the time everything except the $1,200 Titan Xp is sold out, but if you keep your eye on it you can score the cards at non-inflated prices (limited to two cards per order).
Anthony Gray
do you avatarfag or something, cause i saw this image in an amd thread
Camden Cox
Yes, he does. At least it's useful for knowing that the post was made by a complete retard.
Juan Ross
If retailers are selling your product over MSRP, why wouldn't you sell them for more money in the first place? You're essentially just letting them make free money, instead of making the free money yourself.
Aaron Sanders
>AMD starts selling RX 580s for a sane price with a steady supply >Some market scalping douchebag who stocked up on 100 of them shoots up a Bestbuy with an AR-15
Eli Reyes
All i see is wait wait wait wait all fucking wait, what the fuck AMD when can I fucking properly buy your cards at standard price everything is fucking wait
Jacob Collins
i just want to build a new computer when will stock be replenished and cryptocurrency outlawed
Jaxson Peterson
>why wouldn't you sell them for more money in the first place? because margins for AMD do not change, AMD gains NOTHING at all from this except moving less volume which hurts them the most profitable for amd would be selling everything at MSRP but with the mining craze included for maximum volume
Gabriel Turner
what are you poor?
Ryan Hughes
You can't buy Nvidia cards at standard price either.
And why should retailers sell them at normal price to begin with? They can get away with $1-200 upsell on everything. Only a retard would sell the cards at MSRP now.
Cameron Howard
vega 64 and 1080 are 10% difference inpprice here 1080 is ~$800-850 for aib 64 is $850 but our prices are fucked from the beginning, actually seeing how vega performs without AA i'm somewhat tempted, difference is negligible in local currency except being reference
Xavier Howard
why are geese such shitheads
Evan Turner
also on AA topic, did anyone test without AA? I'd like to see how NCU performs without the throughput choke for science.
Easton Jackson
Performs exactly like how every card performs with no AA It gains FPS but it still stays exactly in the same performance bracket
Landon Hughes
MSAA hurts vega more because it's choked, so the question is how fancy NCU performs without a choke compared to nvidia which has pretty good triangles throughput
Dominic Stewart
The big joke is that HBM wasn't even needed. AMD's cards were not memory bottlenecked in the slightest.
Carter Robinson
Gibbo caught in a lie
I wana to punch that scumbag.
Joshua Reyes
HBM is a prep work for MCM because it needs to be wide, very wide pushing fabs to produce more hbm is a good thing, it will be cheaper in the long run
James Ward
It stays in the exact same performance bracket Gains some FPS but doesn't pull ahead of any cards
vega is ahead to being with, why is everyone saying vega is slower? it has problems with price sure, but it's not slower, the fuck? it may not be 30% faster than 1080 but it's 3% faster, consistently, in dx12 and pretty much equal fps to fps in less favorable games like rotr
Carter Turner
Because it had 14 months of extra development.
So rather than saying it's a piece of shit, it's easier to quantify as "slower".
Justin Perry
again, how is this relevant if I want to buy GPU right now? I'd get the point if nvidia was going tor release volta next month or even this year, but they won't
Kayden Roberts
it's relevant *right now* because the 1080 does not currently have any supply issues. You can get one on-demand pretty much. A Vega 64, being new hardware and highly attractive to both gamers, miners and professional workloads, and ontop of that suffering supply issues, is going to be difficult to get at the advertised price point.
Colton Evans
56 is slower than 1070 on average and the other is below the 1080 on average as well
That's not any bias, that's purely what every benchmark points to
>is our full intention of where we would suggest the product be priced. Not just for launch, but ongoing. >ongoing So MSRP was never raised or changed. Gibbo is just a lying cunt that fucked AMD over PRwise.
Christopher Ramirez
Not to mention he lied about this to make himself look good yet gouging prices higher at the same time.
Noah Wood
>what every benchmark points to says the words, but never posts the numbers
fuck, wrong post sorry, it's meant for the one before...
Ethan Martin
>Quick note on primative shaders from my end: I had a chat with AMD PR a bit ago to clear up the earlier confusion. Primative shaders are definitely, absolutely, 100% not enabled in any current public drivers. >The manual developer API is not ready, and the automatic feature to have the driver invoke them on its own is not enabled. Oh wow. Thanks Ryan.
Joshua Gutierrez
sorry got tangled in local prices, I guess it makes sense to get 1080 everywhere else if it wasn't end of the cycle for nvidia
Adam Gray
but why?...
Colton Sanchez
Ha КУ 64 yжe зaвeзли?
Jaxon Cooper
Looks like development for gaymen drivers was started silly late. Heck they finally fixed the power management in th recent update.
Gavin Perez
>666 >lying Hello, satan.
Nicholas Gutierrez
nope, only FE
Andrew Gray
Fucking hell that sucks. Sapphire Vega56 or at least 64 when. I want to get one before dorra skyrockets, courtesy of пыня.
Eli Gutierrez
amd sells 1 vega 64 for 500$ amd sells 2 vega 64 for 1000$ amd sells 3 vega 64 for 3000$
I just solved all the miner issues, amd also can enforce msrp, and if partnered with someone like amazon could sell through amazon, possibly get a prime deal too.
John Bell
same boat, radeon is best choice in case ruble drops again and nobody would be able to upgrade without selling kidneys, at least I'll have some peace of mind with it
Josiah Morgan
Jesus.
Kevin Diaz
>amd also can enforce msrp that's against the law, user, if they could we wouldn't have this mess to begin with
Ayden Clark
I clearly said on average buddy, improve your reading comprehension Because you can cherry pick a few outliers means nothing
Charles Wilson
I average 90fps at 1440p with a 1070 hairworks off (which I assume is how this was benched)
Angel Murphy
by selling the cards themselves they can't enforce msrp?
Gavin Torres
Selling cards themselves is such a pain in the ass.
Zachary Butler
I don't think this is enforceable unless they sell them themselves they are not responsible for what vendors retailer's and end users do with them.
Long term will tell but if yields don't go up we can kiss Vega goodbye until a respin
Ryder Wilson
The yields for Vega are more than okay, the node is mature. It's just Vega10 is fighting for fab capacity with Zeppelin.
Colton Smith
Based nvidia, doing the work nobody wants to do, keeping those damn scalpers in check
Ethan Nguyen
they don't have infrastructure for that, just think how much work it is to sell worldwide directly they just offload cards to channel vendors which distribute them further, it's giant companies that do just that - distribute
Juan Brown
Yes, by pricing them $100 higher for shitty shitblower with shitty PCB.
Logan Bell
yeah, and still you couldn't buy pascal for a month because shortages, god it's been less than two weeks for vega, calm down
Oliver Foster
remove crysis3, and wow. it's suddenly much faster on average
Zachary Roberts
I bought a 1070 about a week after aftermarket came around, and a 1060 FE first day for my other pc
Asher Martinez
Dirt 4 runs 60fps on medium settings on my fucking igpu laptop Just throwing that out there
Gabriel Nguyen
yea, amd cares what users do with their cards, see, when you take a 50+ million dollar loss because every single coin miner floods the market with your card and partners are telling you to fuck off with that shit they cant sell anything because the market is flooded, and you gain nothing in the market the cards were for (gaming) and the market that bought your cards just again, dicked you over so fucking hard you lose 50+ million dollars, they care.
get the cards in gamers hands, and they may be a recurring customer, especially with how amd drivers have been recently compared to nvidia, and all nvidia's bullshit they don't let you touch. get the cards in the hands of miners again and you are looking at vega hitting 200-300$ the moment the market crashes due to stupidly large influx of cards. sell the cards at an extreme markup to miners and you may recoup costs when the crash happens.
If I was amd, I would contract aibs to supply coolers for the gpus,
base card with blower - 500$ base card alone - 450-500$ cooler made by sapphire + 50-70$ possibly even cooler made by noctua or arctic then cooler pre assembled +20-40$
There you go, good cooler on top of a warranty, and aibs wouldn't have room to bitch about you putting a good cooler on it (they do this to amd and intel where they threaten to fuck off making anything for their cpus if they make too good a stock cooler, amd has a good stock cooler only because of its necessity with bulldozer, but still couldn't put the wrath in a non partner computer because of their 'partners' threats)
with this amd would set msrp, not get dicked by retailers, get a bigger cut of the sales, and have a better warranty process (potentially) because they have the base cards there, and just stick different coolers on it in house.
Would be a nightmare to set up initially but would pay dividends in the long run.
Eli Rodriguez
Imagine if AMD was selling $499+100 Vega's from day one?
David Mitchell
>having $100 more expensive as an option is bad >having $100 more expensive forced on you is good #teemred amirite
Anthony Flores
partner with a distributer and feed cost of using them to customers through shipping and handling. the shipping would be slightly higher than normal, but not back breakingly higher, at least not air cooled vega 64 costing 700-800$ currently for stock more.
Lincoln Hernandez
remove amds stupidly good top 2 and 2 stupidly bad bottom (one of which is well known to be fucking shit on both cards) and you get a better average picture.
Blake Diaz
I'm glad I've had a $380 dual-fan 1070 to enjoy since July of last year
Blake Garcia
>well known to be shit on both cards But one of them is practically 1/5 shittier
Joshua Nguyen
Will there ever be a iChill x4 Vega? I'd buy that for 1000+ dollars.
Brayden Flores
>But one of them is practically 1/5 shittier No, its a literal crapshoot if the game will magically work on one computer or not, 2 computers with the exact same specs get wildly different results in that game along with random crashes because its barely functional, shit is beyond fucking broken. But because its a desperation genre (massive world battle royal) and literally no other game is close to done or even better then this pile, everyone who desperately wants it play it, and right now thats 500,000 people right now and 700,000 people in the last 24 hours.
broken from the get go games should not be on a benchmark period.
Dirt at least has an excuse of the game is finished, plays well on both cards but amd handles global illumination better,
Joshua Nguyen
I saw this article, the 1070 beats it like 3/4 tests, they just pick a single resolution where it pulls ahead and hypes the fuck out of that, while casting "yeah the 1070 pulls ahead by 4 frames but that's margin of error they're equal!" Go look at the review, it's actually embarrassing how they spin it
Matthew Green
asus looks not bad this time around, 2.5 slot coolers are my dream, i'd take even 3 slot with anti bend stick if it means it will be quieter
Brody Gray
>1080p gets wrecked by 1070 >4K gets wrecked by 1070 >"our final thoughts about this game bench is that vega pulls ahead by nearly 5% in 1440p, a solid win for vega" The review is fucking cringe but at least there's data, and it's nice to see that there is a trend of vega pulling ahead of a 1070 at higher resolutions But I mean That's literally what the Fury X was hyped over, this just has a little more substance to the claim
Carter Perez
>single resolution
I'm sorry but I have only one,single 1440p monitor, so I care only about that resolution
James Sullivan
You literally sound like them >4K is unrealistic for the majority of PC gamers, and nobody buying vega is aiming for 1080p, so let's just focus on 1440p, where vega pulls ahead on average, and not on averages across all resolutions
Charles Perez
Why this pcb so long? Isn't vega's pcb small?
Luke Evans
And 5% ahead is 1/20th of the value 1/20th of $400 is $20 And a 1070 can be found for $380 Therefore they're not competing with each other Buy both
Jonathan Kelly
what? why the fuck would I care about 1080p/4k if I don't use the resolution? for "lul 1070 is better" argument? I see you are not in the market to buy a GPU. I got 390 exactly because it was better in 1440p than 970 by same margins btw, and probably will get vega 56 because it's better in 1440p(no there was no need for new gpu last year now there is).
Liam Taylor
You get Nano if you want smOll card.
Jace Clark
I'm not trying to sell you a GPU I'm saying their review spin is fucking transparent and retarded and that you're defending it I also only own 1440p monitors, it's still a shitty spin of a review
Angel Jenkins
nah, vega pcb is normal size, it's pretty good PCB if nothing else there is nano vega coming alter, who knows when
Brody Watson
I have to be honest, I didn't even listen to what reviewer said just skimmed through graphs.
Ayden Long
I've also had no need for a GPU since last year Because I bought a 1070 for $380 in july Waitfags get cucked on prices by miners or poor yields
