With the repealing of net nutrality; "thanks obama" does tor browser and VPN services become more valuable? Pic related...

With the repealing of net nutrality; "thanks obama" does tor browser and VPN services become more valuable? Pic related...its an onion

Other urls found in this thread:

whatisnetneutrality.org/timeline
twitter.com/SFWRedditGifs

imagine you went two years into the past

OH MY GOD ITS COMING TO AN END

Idontgetit.jpg

Of course not.
They will be first to be put on the slow lane.

How about instead of running around shouting we're doodly doodly doomed you just wait until you have a problem and then solve it

If you're reading this I already have the diamonds

>VPN
>Slow lane
explain how that would work

It's not that they'll blacklist websites to throttle, they'll whitelist the ones that pay them and then they'll throttle everything else. This includes Tor. Stop being a fucking retard, you fucking retard.

>mfw i shilled for google and netflix non-stop for months and it didn't pay off
it's like november 8th all over again.. IT WAS HER TURN!

I said VPN, not Tor you illiterate shit.
You can't throttle a VPN. Not effectively at least.

Of course you can. An ISP may not be able to inspect the contents of VPN packets, but they can still easily identify them as VPN packets.

imagine being at computers

I don't know much about VPN but don't you connect to another network and browse through that network? Why wouldn't the ISP be able to throttle that? Also if your VPN is not paying them, and when streamers are hoarding the bandwidth why would they care about any other connection at all?

Net neutrality was put into effect two years ago. Remember those dark times when the internet didn't exist? No? Then you have fallen for the reddit hype

I wish someone put up a copy pasta so that we could shut down this argument every time it showed up.

whatisnetneutrality.org/timeline

What event am I looking for here?

You can look for all the events that lead to net neutrality.

You know when voip services were blocked for competing with internet providers. Or the great times when torrent was blocked, ISP claimed they weren't blocking it and they admitted it later on. Or more recently Netflix streaming speeds before and after deals with Comcast. It's only limited by your patience.

So, the law wasn't there, but the actions of ISPs had already been deemed unfair and action against them were taken. Some of these instances favored the ISPs and some favored the FCC. In the end FCC wanted the actual power to regulate these gray areas and that kinda lead to net neutrality.

Internet wasn't a peaceful and free place two years ago, it isn't now, it will be worse in the future.

>So, the law wasn't there, but the actions of ISPs had already been deemed unfair and action against them were taken. Some of these instances favored the ISPs and some favored the FCC.
So nothing has changed then. Glad we had this talk.

What? The argument is completely accurate. The fact that there were telecom regulations and consumer protection laws before NN is irrelevant because those regulations and laws are still in place. Nothing is different about the legal situation today from where it was in 2015.

I couldn't follow your incoherent reasoning unfortunately. So they tried to regulate the same area where net neutrality supposed to cover. They sometimes achieved their objective, sometimes failed and FCC wanted to put an end to it.

This doesn't mean that things similar to net neutrality was not enforced. They did their best to do it. Net neutrality was supposed to leave no ambiguity.

So how is this "net neutrality wasn't there two years ago"? I mean obviously the name for it wasn't net neutrality, but the idea we discuss as net neutrality today (ISPs should not care what data is being transmitted) was being defended by the FCC.

They tried to enforce things before, they failed sometimes and they managed to do it sometimes. The NN is relevant because the cases that were dismissed in favor of ISPs were the cases where they successfully claimed that this was not a field FCC could regulate. NN and title 2 stuff changes that. So that there would be consistent rulings in the future. But not anymore. They scrapped the idea.

Nothing about NN guaranteed consistent rulings. That's the whole problem with regulating by executive fiat instead of legislation. These things ought to be fought out in courts, not subject to the arbitrary whims of the FCC.

>That's the whole problem with regulating by executive fiat instead of legislation.
I completely agree with this, but do you see these kind of stuff making it through the Congress? No? Then this is the best next thing.

Oh, and I think there is need for this kind of regulation, but that's a different discussion.

This is verifiably false.

Any traffic moving through their network of any nature (encrypted, unencrypted, VPN, TOR, bittorrent, HTTP, HTTPS, whatever) can and likely will be throttled. VPNs don't mean your traffic doesn't move through the connection given to you & controlled by your ISP- it means they do not know the contents of it. That's all.

You will pay more to access specific services at full speed. VPNs will be one of these things you can pay more to use- you will pay for a "business package" or "work from home package" that will unthrottle VPNs but will likely impose transfer limits.

ISPs are owned or own major media cartels. They have a direct interest in curbing piracy and other difficult to track behavior. They're well aware that people intend to try and use VPNs and other similar technology to circumvent the upcoming limits or restrictions. It will not work.

I've seen so many people who support the repeal of NN talk about how it doesn't matter anyway because /they/ will be fine, they'll just use a VPN.

You're not smart. It won't work. You're just too stupid to understand that VPNs don't make your traffic totally invisible and immutable to the ISP routing /all/ of your traffic. It just obscures the contents of the messages. There's no reason to suspect they won't throttle unknown messages by default, and only unthrottle what they can clearly verify you've paid for.

We really should be coming up with better ideas for strengthening internet freedom instead of sperging out over band aid solutions like NN.

The internet as it currently exists will never truly be "free" due to its archaic centralized infrastructure, which is an inherent vulnerability to censorship and other forms of meddling.

No one but retards believe your reddit tier doomsday scenarios.

>tfw you live in a country where nobody has even thought about legislating any of this and there's only one ISP in your area, yet literally none of that has happened for the past 20 years

>and only unthrottle what they can clearly verify you've paid for
Yes, because throttling LITERALLY ANY ARBITRARY IP ADDRESS that doesn't go to a manually updated list is going to work out wonderfully. No possible way they're going to be flooded with help requests and complaints 24/7 for the next decade if they do that.

It's also not like somebody would just come up with a VPN routed through one of the 2-3 CDNs that everybody uses to circumvent the whole fucking thing in a matter of hours. There's also zero chance ISPs would simply charge you more for every service equally if they wanted to make more money, with NN rules being in place.

>A lot of people in your region starts streaming on Netflix
>ISP: LOL, why would I connect this guy to whichever IP he's trying to connect to, I'm not obligated to do that even though he pays me for it, because I invested in regulation business more than I invested in infrastructure.

They're not going to throttle network for no reason obviously, that's not good for business. Your funny VPN hobby is just something they can provide on the side while the majority of the customers are watching their streams and turning internet to cable TV.

>LOL, why would I connect this guy to whichever IP he's trying to connect to
Because when they can't update their iPhone or play Minecraft with their friend or connect to their home camera or access the IP Google used for something that someone forgot to add to the magic database or use an ancient form on their school's website, they'll be really fucking angry with the service they're paying for.

Blocking torrents or throttling a single service you're competing with is fairly minor at the end of the day. The reason blocking everything carte blanche won't work is because nobody even fucking KNOWS what kind of unintended side effects it would lead to.

>Because when they can't update their iPhone or play Minecraft with their friend or connect to their home camera or access the IP Google used for something that someone forgot to add to the magic database or use an ancient form on their school's website, they'll be really fucking angry with the service they're paying for.
First of all, I don't think they're going to block popular services unless something similar to Google wallet vs. other payment method or Netflix vs. cable TV kind of thing happens. And as you said these are minor they don't affect me as much. I have no interest in these.

But why would they prioritize your Minecraft server? If someone watches an HD stream, the people who will be angry with the delays in the HD stream are far more numerous than the people who will be angry about Minecraft servers. So you connect them with higher ping, smaller bandwidth. There is no cost for the ISP to provide any service at full speed when there is no demand for the bandwidth that is paid for by a content provider.

So, what you'll get is:
- Reduced priority
- Not being able to connect to direct competitors probably.

What you will do is:
- Get mad
- Fail at finding an alternative
- Realize that most of the streamers are quite happy with this setup
- Realize that ISPs are really happy because for the same infrastructure investment, they get more money and they don't need to invest as much
- Masturbate and go to sleep as internet becomes cable TV

You guys know most vpns use ssl, right? Vpn traffic is no different from most other encrypted traffic. Unless isps use start to use a whitelist, vpns will work fine.

Why would they connect you to whichever IP you are trying to connect to while paid HD streaming people are waiting to be connected? There is no reason for ISP to directly target VPNs, but there's no reason to give them priority. So the effect is the same, you'll get throttled either way. It doesn't matter if it's encrypted or whatever.

>Why would they connect you to whichever IP you are trying to connect to while paid HD streaming people are waiting to be connected?
Because I paid for it.

But they have the right to provide the content provider that paid more than you with higher speeds! THAT'S LIKE THE CORE OF NN THING!

waiting until a problem manifests itself is literally one of the dumbest things you can do.

Thats fine. As long as I get the bandwidth that I pay for, what's the problem?

It's dumb but it's not one of the dumbest.
Dumbest is african philosophy: Wait until a problem manifests itself, and then don't fix it. Just live with it.

>uneducated faggot realizes that nn wasn't all about liberals and that he will end up facing consequences too
I love seeing stupid fucking retards like you get your just desserts.

I'm not American m8. Also:

That's the whole point! There's no longer a meaning for the "bandwidth you pay for", it's all "up to 1 Zigabit per second".

Imagine a 3 user scenario, 2 of them are watching Netflix and you are playing Minecraft. Assume Netflix pays the ISP and Minecraft doesn't. 2 people will get their bandwidth to watch whatever they want at full speed and you'll be given whatever bandwidth left. They don't have the obligation to provide Minecraft server connection the same speeds they are providing Netflix connections.

It's never "you'll be guaranteed this much bandwidth" in ISP contracts. It's always "up to this speed", now that speed also depends on which website you connect to.

Your whole scenario relies on Netflix traffic accounting for like 80-90% of an ISP's maximum available bandwidth. Also the change with NN rules is basically just the difference between "ugh too many people are on and my internet is slow" and "ugh too many people are on and my internet is slow to websites except Netflix".

I don't get it. Netflix can pay the isp extra for added bandwidth but I can't? Why not? Surely there is incentive for the isp to offer as much bandwidth as people demand.

I think you should read more about net neutrality, I'm bored.

>le educate yourself argument
Yeah, I'm done too.

>living in a country with virtually zero regulation
>"hanging coax cables on trees to connect a house" tier no regulation
>nothing like leddit "muh world is collapsing" horrors happen
It's almost as reddit is a shill platform which Netflix knows how to manipulate.

>oh the end of net neutrality is going to slow down our favorite services
>lets use this tor network that slows down everything even more

Get off Sup Forums

he's not wrong

But you virtually can't you fucking retard, half of the businesses in the US use VPN in one way or the other and you can't differentiate what's what. Unless you're gonna whitelist them on a case by case basis they aren't gonna shoot themselves in the foot just to stop Billy 4chinz to torrent his animu via VPN. If anything this will increase the adoption of VPN and increase privacy.

You don't even need to ID the packets. They're going to addresses that aren't part of the services you ordered off the upsell menu.

Yeah and the FTC will bust them or people will leave causing a or nightmare. Retard.

user, ISPs offer different kinds of deals to enterprises, the only thing determining whether they want to throttle billy 4chinz VPN animu torrents is the free market, and the we will see the results soon enough
also
>VPN
>route your traffic through yet another 3rd party
>somehow be more secure and private

>what is encryption

Premature optimization is the dumbest thing you can do.

Gonna post this in every Pai shilling thread

Don't misquote Knuth. It's not premature if you already know it's going to be a performance bottleneck.

This is missing Comcast jewry, such as throttling Netflix and blocking P2P traffic.

But you don't already know. The problem is imaginary.

>d-d-don't worry, silly goy
>big business is going to take good care of you
Fuck off, shill.

Your ISP sees all the packets going to and from the VPN provider, sure they don't know the contents but they don't need to for the purposes of throttling

>VPNs "obscure" traffic
You're fucking stupid and have no idea what a VPN is or how it works. Get off Sup Forums retard.

>its archaic centralized infrastructure
What could you do to help?

Go be retarded somewhere else please Frogposter.