X11 vs Wayland

X11 vs Wayland. Go.
>Which do you use and why?
>Is Wayland really going to replace X11?
>How does Wayland perform compared to X11?
>When will Wayland be mature enough to actually use?
I still use X11 myself. Whenever I've tried Wayland it's seemed like a buggy piece of shit. The biggest reason I'm still on X11 though is because everything like Redshift, screenshots, screen recording, etc. all work fine.

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blog.martin-graesslin.com/blog/2018/01/kwinx11-is-feature-frozen/
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waylund is bettah

becaus

x11 because it werkz

X, no video card support in wayland for my card
Maybe in 50 years
Garbage
Maybe in 50 years

We have arrived at a point where the age and complexity of x11 has started to show .

While wayland isn't fully there yet I'll put my money on it as it is a more modern and efficient solution for the future..

Isn't Wayland just another Red Hat project, backed by the Illuminati, intended to take over Linux more and more? Just like Gnome, GTK, SystemD, and now PipeWire (replacement for PulseAudio).

So I see you're running Wayland... You know, I'm actually on X11 myself, I know this protocol is supposed to be better, but, you know what they say, old habits, they die hard.

X11 because nvidia is shit.

Whenever I see discussions about wayland vs X11 on here, I'm continually baffled how much misinformation and FUD there usually is.

(You)

Xorg works
Wayland Does not
What FUD is there to be spread?

>client server architecture for a program meant to run on your computer only
This is also why Hurd is a pile of dogshit.

Care to explain user?

Wayland works perfectly, so long as you're not using nvidia hardware.

You are aware that X11 is also a client-server architecture, right?

I was criticizing X11.

>Wayland Does not
It just werks for me.
Although I'm not some stupid cuck that bought a nvidia GPU.

Both X11 and Wayland are client-server. It actually works pretty well for this kind of stuff.

>Wayland works perfectly, unless you're using the major video card brand.

Seems kinda counter-intuitive. Can you explain?

I don't know how much you know about program design, so I can't really be bothered explaining why it makes sense.

blog.martin-graesslin.com/blog/2018/01/kwinx11-is-feature-frozen/

Fuck I'm running KDE with nvidia proprietary, what should I do now? Shitvidia doesn't want to fully support Wayland!

>Write wayland compositor
>Explicitly not support Nvidia's bullshit
>Tell people to buy AMD if they complain
>mfw
True story.

I'm not going to add a lot of extra complexity to support the effectively proprietary EGLStreams garbage.
They gave up after basically everybody told them to go fuck themselves, and are apparently trying to make something else which will make everyone happy, but we'll have to see if they can succeed.

Wayland is still broken with a lot of software regardless of which graphics you use. Want to use vino for VNC? Tough shit, they even hid the button; log out and switch to Xorg.

Wayland works on nouveau for some reason the retards of the novidia prop driver doesn't want to support it

I would be using Wayland for better HiDPI scaling, but kwin_wayland still didn't quite work the way I wanted last I checked. Specifically regarding virtual desktops and touchpad gestures, and a few other rough edges that would be mostly tolerable but annoying.

kwin_x11 still mostly works how I want.

but wayland works fine on intel, what are you on about?

KDE 5.12 will be the last KDE to get feature updates on X11 though

>Which do you use and why?
X because it just works
>Is Wayland really going to replace X11?
probably
>How does Wayland perform compared to X11?
dunno
>When will Wayland be mature enough to actually use?
when it's ready

Wayland. I finally switched to Sway a couple of months ago. There's a few quirks but it's really nice overall.

SirCmpwn is that you?

>>Explicitly not support Nvidia's bullshit
I think you have it the other around, friend

>SirCmpwn is that you?
No, but I worked on wlroots. My contributions as of late have been pretty pathetic, though.

We could support the Nvidia proprietary driver by supporting EGLStreams, but we chose not to.
But yes, THEY should be the ones supporting the already established and wide-spread API (GBM).

Either nvidia supports it or their hardware will perform badly soon. Upstream is focusing on Wayland, both major DEs support it by default and X11 will become deprecated.

I literally switched to AMD recently just so I can mess with Wayland without jumping through hoops. It was a good decision.

What about Mir guys? What are your thoughts on that?

Dead

Literally dead.

How to make X11 less power-hungry?

Mir is a literal who at this point.

Wayland is better but X currently has more compatibility. If you game on Linux, Wayland is a must.

tell me about wayland, will I save Shekel on electricity? Or it is gas-room?

When Wayland actually becomes usable I'll use it considering it will be backwards compatible with X11 anyway.

Yeah I saw Martin's post about that.

I'm looking forward to kwin_wayland getting those last few things sorted out. The scaling and multi-monitor improvements are pretty exciting.

No good window managers or DE's use wayland, your options are Gnome and more Gnome

Sway. It's an i3 clone for wayland. Doesn't get better than that.

KDE can use Wei-land
KDE is kosher, so no problem

KDE is equally shit.

That's a pretty shitty bar if that's the best wayland has to offer then

What's wrong with i3?

More baked in features than DWM but with none of the customization, all the bloat of Awesome. It's the Gnome of tiling WMs.

>so autistic that you consider i3 too bloated
Back to suckless with you.

It's objectively bloated, and you can't go in and customize it to any serious extent. It's a install-and-use WM, if you don't like some particular annoying thing it does you're going to have to root around in 30 different .c files to change it.
If I was fine with that I'd just use Awesome, at least that shit looks good out of the box.

>try Wayland
Wife: What the fuck is wrong with the TV?
>uninstall Wayland

Wayland works fine for me. Although I'm not too happy with Gnome so I might switch WMs. If the WM I like runs on Xorg then I'll just use Xorg. No big deal.

you fucking idiots

xquartz is where its at

...

What customization does i3 lack?

GNOME uses Wayland by default
KDE is now developing for Wayland instead of X11
Then there is xfce which I prefer but it's a half-dead project that's still trying to port over to GTK3
Wayland is the future, if only Nvidia gave a shit

Huh? I thought gaming was better with X11? Why Wayland?

The space station?

Didn't it crash into australia?

banned for offensive language

lower latency, higher refresh rate, no tearing

Anything past keybinds and the statusbar, like every other baked WM. Which, again, is fine, but it's not okay for a large number of users, and is a huge problem with Wayland. Your options are basically Gnome, KDE, and apparently an i3 clone.

n-nani

I still don't understand. Name something you specifically lack.

Or intel hardware.

This

Frequent hard system freezes are a feature, not a bug!

Wayland just werks on intel though.

Hasn't happened once on my machine.

Works fine for me.

Every Linux WM/DE is shit.

Sure, if you never turn the computer on.

We aren't using sextoys, we are using PCs.

So I've got my Nvidia GPU cordoned off for my W10 VM and am using Intel for Linux. What sort of issues are you running into?

Switch between normal master-left stack-right, 3-column pair, master-top stack-bottom, floating (with saved positions), all done on the fly with single key-combinations without having to set each container block to the desired layout behavior.
On top of that, any kind of customization that *can* be realistically done has to be done through i3 scripting, instead of the well-known quantity of C.

If you like it, great, but it's too hard-baked for my tastes. Again if I was fine with that I'd just use Awesome instead.

>unironically a straight face on the transvestite developers when they designed a display protocol with no support for non integer scaling

Wayland goes straight in the fucking bin

lol just use half an integer like wtf this is ez

can't you have all that with compton?
I have Wayland running natively on my AMD 260x but I just use X because although Weston is nice, I prefer the WM I have on X.
Also there seems to be more programs supported by X. I only got mpv and the terminal working in Wayland.

Compton is pretty slow actually. Anything that's qt5 or gtk3 should be handled by wayland. Most things are probably still in xwayland though.

What CIA nigger warped faggots into this narrow way of thinking

Shouldn't that be handled by the compositor?

probably

Shh, you'll upset the X dudes.

I found the zoom function to be weird since the detail didn't improve as everything got bigger
I haven't noticed any slowness using the opengl backend for compton, but then again I have a fairy modern PC.

fairly*

X11 because fuck ASIC, Whoops wrong thread

no i don't think so

>Wayland Does not
>t. novidya

>Wayland is still broken
Nice FUD.
>lack of features =/= broken

Could you check xwayland in weston? The flicker of the window border when the cursor hovers over the maximize and close buttons, and the right click pop up menu - showing up offset and auto clicking itself.

it was a wayland fork
>literary

no, you won't have tearing tho, that's about it. i think it's xorg maintainers who got fed up with dealing with it, took what they wanted/needed from x and made wayland, for simpler maintaining n shit

weston (is usable)
patch it to switch windows with super-space instead of super-tab

you can't try wayland tho
and you can't uninstall it either too

>it's our fault you bought a stupid display

No it should not

>Wayland is shit on new monitors
>x11 from the 70s is great with new monitors
Wayland was a mistake, at least give me Mir instead

>Wayland is shit on new monitors
???
>x11 from the 70s is great with new monitors
¿¿¿
>Wayland was a mistake, at least give me abandoned fork of mistake instead

>Whose main design focus was scalability

I watch alex jones

>Switch between normal master-left stack-right, 3-column pair, master-top stack-bottom
Nigga what

Master-left Stack-right
Default mode. Master window is on the left, stack windows on the right.
3 column pair. Windows are tiled in order into columns, with the rightmost column being a deck-style stack.
Master top stack bottom is the same as default mode, but the master window is up "top" and the stack windows are arranged side-by-side along the bottom of the screen.

Can someone explain to me the whole "xwayland" thing? What does a program have to do to get Wayland support? If I write a program now, will it run on Wayland? Why won't some programs run on Wayland? Why is "xwayland" needed? If I switch to Wayland now, is everything just going to be running through "xwayland"?

xwayland is for gtk2 like stuff
if you write something with gtk3 (or qt5?) it should work without xwayland in wayland

dwm is autistic

>Switching tiling layouts to suit your current task is autistic
???

I prefer X.
X started out with a sensible structure and a ton of tools grew out of it.
I have no idea how these tools can be made with Wayland and I fear they will never exist as Wayland aims to fragment everything.
Wayland doesn't yet offer anything I am interested in.
Are window managers supposed to create their own version of every tool that starts with an x?

X because wayland can’t into screen rotation if you don’t use bloated gnome

My mouse buttons stopped working with Wayland and there is no way to configure libinput so I guess it's fucked? Even if it did work, I hear input latency is even worse than x11, as well as 3d performance. Input latency is the only reason I dual boot windows.