So Sup Forumsand, when are you gonna give silesia back to its' rightful owners?

so Sup Forumsand, when are you gonna give silesia back to its' rightful owners?

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silesian_War
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but we are the rightful owner

why did you have to go and shit up beuthen?

it's ugly cuz it's an industrial town
also nobody cares desu

silesia is german, give it back

It's rightful German clay five it back REEEEEEEE

it's polish

part of Germany since the 1200s, it will be back soon enough

>part of Germany since the 1200s
not really
>it will be back soon enough
yeah, right, whatever

google "Ostsiedlung" Stanislaw

so what's your point?

silesians speak a different language, and the poles who moved in treat them poorly and refuse to create the multicultural society germans thrive in

give it back

Yes poland, we need more space for refugees, pls give it back. Silesia at its current is so stale and pale.

>silesians speak a different language
it's a polish dialect pretty much
and it's only half a million ppl that mostly identify as polish anyway

That Silesia was German since the 1200s, it's really not that complicated

it was as german as it was polish

and it was in bohemia then anyway

It was literally a settlement initiative since that piece of land was empty as fuck save for a few Poles in their caves. And Bohemia was a Kingdom in the HRE (and only got Silesia 200 years after Germanization).

and eastern brandenburg, and middle pomernia

>empty as fuck
whatever
>And Bohemia was a Kingdom in the HRE
so not necessarily german
>200 years after
not really

>part of Germany since the 1200s
more like since 18th century lmao

Silesia stayed German culturally look up the few cultural works from that region. Also Bohemia had German as dominant language, German was the only spoken language at Prague university.

Germany didn't exist in 1200 though

which doesn't change the fact that there was also both polish and bohemian speakers in the region
prolly even more than german ones

Germany is the successor of the HRE according to international law, so yes since the 1200s.

>HRE
>international law
plz

now you're just talking out of your ass, also there's no Bohemian language, there's only Czech and German

>Also Bohemia had German as dominant language, German was the only spoken language at Prague university.
After Czech elites were slaughtered and supressed in XVII century as a part of germanization effort.

but the holy roman empire was neither holy nor roman nor an empire.

How can international law recognize the HRE?

>now you're just talking out of your ass
wow
> also there's no Bohemian language
i meant czech obviously

use this next time


No the Catholic church did that in retaliation against the Hussites

International law was established after the defeat of Napoleon so right after the fall of the HRE
While it wasn't Roman obviously, the other attributes can't be judged objectively

>After Czech elites were slaughtered and supressed in XVII century as a part of germanization effort
nice fanfiction

Bohemia was part of the german cultural sphere since about 1000

looks like czech clay to me

Does Germany have a claim on Switzerland, Luxembourg and most of Lombardia, then?

Obviously user, you can't be expected to know such a trivial detail like the language you're describing.

No because they either declared their independence or didn't speak German to begin with.

>so right after the fall of the HRE
so not even close to the times we're talking about

also citation needed about your claim that germany is a legal succesor to hre according to int law

Ok, thanks for the explanation then, Hans.

wtf you're even about i don't know

>Czech (/ˈtʃɛk/; čeština Czech pronunciation: [ˈt͡ʃɛʃcJna]), formerly known as Bohemian[4] (/boʊˈhiːmiən, bə-/;[5] lingua Bohemica in Latin)

>Bohemia was part of the german cultural sphere since about 1000
Doens't mean that thay were all speaking German.


>nice fanfiction
not in the slightest

>The result of the 1620 battle brought two centuries of recatholicization of the Czech lands and the decline of the Czech-speaking aristocracy and elite as well as the Czech language (accompanied with the growing influence of German-speaking elites), a process that was slowed down by the Czech National Revival since the late 18th century. Czech nationalist historians and writers such as Alois Jirásek have referred to the 17th and 18th century in the Czech lands as the Dark Age.

>Forty-seven leaders of the insurrection were put on trial, and twenty-seven of them were executed in Prague's Old Town Square on what came to be called the "Old Town Square execution". Amongst those executed were Kryštof Harant and Jan Jesenius. Today, 27 crosses have been laid into the cobblestones as a tribute to those victims.

>An estimated five-sixths of the Bohemian nobility went into exile soon after the Battle of White Mountain, and their properties were confiscated.[7]

Well not directly of course since there didn't exist any German nation state after the fall of the HRE. But the German speaking states retained the rights to all territory after the Vienna congress and were later integrated into the German Empire which in turn kept the lineage of it's member states. So legally Silesia never stopped being German.

this

we are victims of germanic pervert catholicism

but silesia should be czech clay

sorbians still waiting for end of occupation

Who at this point ISN'T laying claim to this piece of dirt?

rude

Then link to the HRE is still missing so the 1200s claim remains invalid.

>So legally Silesia never stopped being German.
It happened in 1990.

>Well not directly of course since there didn't exist any German nation state after the fall of the HRE
not really, there was prussia, which would only help your claim, but then
>But the German speaking states retained the rights to all territory after the Vienna congress and were later integrated into the German Empire which in turn kept the lineage of it's member states.
austria didn't.
and until prussian conquest of silesia it was the "legal" owner of silesia
>So legally Silesia never stopped being German.
until ww2
which pretty much is the case

>execution of a few dozen insurgents
>slaughtering of czech elites

pick one

>Doens't mean that thay were all speaking German.

A rather high percentage (35-40%), even more in the upper class. And this didn't start in the 17th century, but about 1000 years ago.

Why did you ignore my post that said that the Papacy killed them

Why should I be arsed to dig up a source to this, when you didn't bother sourcing any of your claims either? Also it's just common sense that if the single state that rules the territory remains and willingly partakes in a national union that said region's lineage stays intact.

>prussia
wasn't a nation state
>austria
German speaking country, was even part of the German federation at the time of Silesia's loss
>until (after) ww2
So I won the argument since that was the point I was trying to make since the beginning.

Germans are Celticized Poles.

Give back Germania, you filthy niggers.

>pick one
I did not not say all of czech elite was killed and I've also mentioned supression and you can't appply to someonw who is dead so stop cherrypicking.

>A rather high percentage (35-40%),
What century? And that's still a minoirty.

>but about 1000 years ago.
And in XVII Czech elites retained a strong identity and opposed Germanic dictate.

Considering this as a fair measurement

Lower Silesia was:
>Austrian for 216 years
>German for 263 years
>Czech for 305 years (extra points for makeing city in the first place)
>Polish for 400 years (extra points for dominant languge in region up to first half of XVII century)

what? first german settlers were invited in 14.century

>was even part of the German federation at the time of Silesia's loss
but not german empire

Because you don't know what you're talking about

There was never a distinction between Austria and Germany till the founding of the German Empire 1871

>Polish for 400 years
where do you get this from I only count roughly 250 years (in a very disjointed fashion that is)

Actually it's a Czech clay to Silesia. The problem is only in polish ppl who live there, but every problem has a solution. GIVE IT BACK POLYAKS!

Maybe if you give back Galicia

>single state
HRE was neither

Oh so we only count institutions now? By that logic you only had Silesia for 27 years.

Galicia is a shithole now

Yeah I do. They were butthurt about the Hussite and had them killed off by their Austrian underlings

>There was never a distinction between Austria and Germany till the founding of the German Empire 1871
ofc there was
especially after 30 yrs war

>now
gee, I wonder why.

With enough EU money Lwow could be Wroclaw tier in a decade.

What did you say about Galicia, you fucking Untermensch?

Do you have some kind of reading impediment? Since the HRE was a collection of states, I obviously mean Austria and later Prussia which founded and joined the Empire

you said
>and were later integrated into the German Empire which in turn kept the lineage of it's member states
but austria wasn't a member of german empire

>EU money
It's a meme. It goes to private pockets, then goes back to Germany with a profit.

They found a perfect milking cow in Polish state. Just like during WW2.
Easy there, Celt faggot.

Tsk, tsk, we're arguing now with an autistc manchildren fabricatng claim to gain casus belli. Alone we'll be defeated by them, one by one. Why don't we form an union or something with capital city in the disputed land? We could even bring Slovaks together, the more the merrier.

I didn't realize Germany only consisted of the protestant parts thanks for teaching me about my history user. Austria was even invited to join into a unified Germany in 1848 which was only stopped by the rejection of the crown by the Prussian successor of the throne.

The difference between Galicia and the rest of Poland is striking though, it must help at some point

>thanks for teaching me about my history
Everyone knows Germans bend history and rewrite it to fit their agendas.

You did that to us for centuries.

But Prussia which annexed Silesia while Austria was a member of the German Fed. was.

So you're not responding to my argument and now reveal your motivation: Polish butthurt.

>I did not not say all of czech elite was killed and I've also mentioned supression and you can't appply to someonw who is dead so stop cherrypicking.
The term slaughter doesn't apply to an execution of insurgents at all

>What century?

19th

>And that's still a minoirty

And part of the HRE/German confederation. I guess the minority-Polish areas of Poland/PLC weren't really Polish then either, hm?

The integration of Bohemia into the German sphere started back then, and the outmost edges of the country around Cheb were settled early on.

>HRE was a collection of states
>I obviously mean Austria and later Prussia
See I wrote it down again for the special needs section of Sup Forums

the shitposting is strong today

>ctrl-f bohemia
>13 results

Based Sup Forums

>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silesian_War

>1742
>german fed

Okay you're right with that, all those Prusso-Austrian wars can get confusing.

>The term slaughter doesn't apply to an execution of insurgents at all
My initial point still stands as they were being killed or opressed.

>19th
lol, so looks like German never was a dominant language in Bohemia

>And part of the HRE/German confederation.
Not that willingly considering revolts in XV and XVII centuries and a Czech National Revival.

Are you seriously? There is cannot be a war within the EU. Democracy don't war with each other. The only way it can happen because of some stupid right-wing populists in head of the Polish government.

start taking care of your fucking buildings pawel

Barely. I used terms from Europa Universalis game, you know. :^)

But I still remember the case of Texas which was purely Mexican colony first, only later flooded by American settlers, who justified their confllict with Mexican govt and successfully seceded. I don't know, what kind of dreams our western neighbours cherish secretly. Trade confllict? Legal battaillle in Strassbourg? There are plenty of legal solutions, if there is political will to exert pressure.

>lol, so looks like German never was a dominant language in Bohemia

Well, at the time when Silesia was still part of the kingdom of Bohemia, German was presumably the biggest of the three language. And this is not only about the total percentage of speakers; Germans was more widely used amont the elites, in writing, etc while Czech was only dominant among peasants of Inner Bohemia.

>Not that willingly considering revolts in XV and XVII centuries and a Czech National Revival.

The revolt of 1618 wasn't a national Czech independence movement, but more of a struggle for emancipation of both German and Czech Protestants; the Bohemian rebels elected a German as a king.

The Czech revival movement wasn't necessarily in favor of splitting off of the HRE/German confederation.

>No distnction
>What is 30 years war
>What are Austro-Prussian wars
>What is reformation

71 years since 1945
281 years in polish kingdom and in polish duchies.
48 years in Piast's kingdom

400 years. Go back to school

>Well, at the time when Silesia was still part of the kingdom of Bohemia, German was presumably the biggest of the three language.

Timeframes and sources. If it's after 1620 then you have no case here.

>The revolt of 1618 wasn't a national Czech independence movement, but more of a struggle for emancipation of both German and Czech Protestants; the Bohemian rebels elected a German as a king.
>The Czech revival movement wasn't necessarily in favor of splitting off of the HRE/German confederation.
Their motives are irrelavant for my point, because my intention here was to illustrate that Czechs remained a distinct group even after 1000 years of attempted germanization.

>Timeframes and sources.
Common sense, there is no detailed demographic data from that time. Germans were one third in Bohemia proper, if you add the Germans in Silesia and in the Bohemian territory west of the Oder it would likely make them at least a plurality.

>Their motives are irrelavant for my point

Well, we we're talking about Bohemia's affiliation to the HRE, I didn't deny Czechs being their own ethnic group, I argued for Bohemia being part of the HRE

>if you add
Common sense dictates that we should have some estimates that we could add together otherwise we're engaging in fanfiction.

>I argued for Bohemia being part of the HRE
I've never denied that. I've argued that they weren't all German nor they were properly germanized and that the dominant role of German language came after the defeat in the Battle of White Mountain (but according to your numbers it wasn't even as dominant as I would've expected).

Żiżka did nothing wrong.

The duchy of Silesia was a Duchy in the Holy Roman Empire, just Bohemia used to be a kingdom in the same empire

I think the world needs a new Holy Roman Empire. Probably without an emperor

Also, this is Silesia in 17th century
If Żiżka wasn't heretic I would name my son after him (if I will have any). Man, this man was based.

>Germany
>1200s
Am I being rused?

..Czechia?

To be honest, it's better to keep it with Poland right now.
We need to sort out our own problems before demand old territories.