How does one distinguish a good noise (or power electronics, for that matter) album from a bad one ? What exactly makes a noise album "bad" ?
Is the focus set on structure, novelty, variety, etc. ? What exactly is the focus of evaluation when considering such works ?
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if it fucking sounds good ?
what's so hard to understand
What makes it good?
same a normal music, is it engaging? boring? repetitive? too much so? interesting sounds? cool progression? sound good? no good?
it's not hard user
>is it engaging?
How is it engaging?
>boring?
How is it not boring?
>repetitive?
What does it matter if it is/is not?
>interesting sounds?
What makes it interesting?
>cool progression?
What makes it cool?
If it's not hard, why can't you answer these questions?
pretty sure it just comes down to taste, like all music
Why
But there must be some objective qualities to it. I'm trying to get into these genres so I'm going to point out a basic example: As far as I'm concerned, most people would say that Flare Gun is Merzbow's best record. What makes Flare Gun a better album than Venereology ? Obviously, noise music has a different set of rules when comparing it to popular music or classical.
who are you, ralph wiggum?
Here's the secret: There is no such thing as "good" or "bad" music, only what you enjoy and don't. It is a purely subjective thing.
There isn't a way, it's all bad.
This is why I was able to release two albums of absolute shit on purpose and get the /noise/ generals to listen to them.
Fire up spotify, and listen to this album.
Merzbow - Hybrid Noisebloom
I would consider this an incredible noise album, with all the aesthetics of such, but also remaining just accessible enough for people to form an opinion on it if you're outside the noise scene.
Well accessible is the wrong word, but listen to it and it might offer some insight.
Don't get memed into listening to this shit.
Amlux is best Merzbow album.
How do you pronounce Merzbow? I say Murz-boe, but I've heard it as Murz-b(ow as in, "Ow, my toe")
I've always said "Murz-B-Oh" like "Oh, it's you!"
I had a guest lecturer in college once and he said merts bo
>
>>>is it engaging?
>>How is it engaging?
>It's not boring?
>>>boring?
>>How is it not boring?
>It's not engaging?
>>>repetitive?
>>What does it matter if it is/is not?
>It makes it engaging/boring?
>>>interesting sounds?
>>What makes it interesting?
>It's not repetitive?
>>>cool progression?
>>What makes it cool?
>It sounds good?
67716587
>
>>>is it engaging?
>>How is it engaging?
>It's not boring?
>>>boring?
>>How is it not boring?
>It's not engaging?
>>>repetitive?
>>What does it matter if it is/is not?
>It makes it engaging/boring?
>>>interesting sounds?
>>What makes it interesting?
>It's not repetitive?
>>>cool progression?
>>What makes it cool?
>It sounds good?
>>is it engaging?
>How is it engaging?
It's not boring?
>>boring?
>How is it not boring?
It's engaging?
>>repetitive?
>What does it matter if it is/is not?
It makes it engaging/boring?
>>interesting sounds?
>What makes it interesting?
It's not repetitive?
>>cool progression?
>What makes it cool?
It sounds good?
What are you saying here?
Honestly, I just glazed over the wall of nonsense green text and moved to another thread.
Is it supposed to mean anything?
Is he trying to emulate Merzbow in some fashion?
Is THIS art?
Maybe it is part of his vegan, straight-edge, noise project.
So you have nothing to say. Why say anything at all?
someone isn't down with the fresh out of the box merzbow memes.
n-no man i was listing things you judge it by...
what the fuck is going on in this thread
OP wants to earnestly have an in depth discussion of music
>it's all opinion
>people like different stuff
>you like what you like
What is even the point of this board?
To discuss things you enjoy, didn't enjoy and help others find stuff they might enjoy.
jk it's to feel better about myself by shitting on other's while I masturbate to my "deep, intellectual taste"
Eno > Merzbow.
You can not prove me wrong.
To try and cluster Brian Eno's music as compatible to anything as an entire discography is your own ignorant downfall, user.
Let alone comparing any of it to Merzbow.
You haven't listened to more than one album by one or both artists in order to have said this.
I'll go further than that.
Any Eno track > any Merzbow track.
Try posting two tracks where the merzbow one is better. You can't.
I don't understand your point.
You seem to just be aggressively stating one is better than the other, without consideration for how they are not comparable in the first place.
In any way...
However, I posted this album if you need some slight Merzbow insight or clarification:
hey, kid, are you some kind of retard or something?
Yeah, I knew you couldn't do it.
Any Eno track >any merzbow track.
This
youtube.com
Is better than anything Merzbow has ever done.
I love hearing cool stuff though so please prove me wrong and post something.
>Merzbow - Hybrid Noisebloom
>search on youtube.
>listen to 2 seconds
>yep it's shit.
If you've heard one merzmeme record you've heard them all.
i think you're wasting your time in the wrong thread.
You're probably right.
But there is an objective side to music, to most people it's not as strong, but it is there.
I understand the appeal of this kind of music. I'd say people listen to it for three major reasons: anti-music, breaking the boundaries of musicality; a form of extreme expression or just plain old novelty. I just don't understand the basis upon which the GOAT noise albums are chosen. I'm positive that such albums exist, so there must be some kind of criteria to it.
Personally, I'd say this track is better.
open.spotify.com
And the combined track blows everything either artist has done out of the water.
youtube.com
But I don't think I'm talking to a person who really belongs in this thread.
from what I know the appeal of noise is just as a far harsher and abrasive form of ambient
It doesn't user. It's still following the same rules. It's just obfuscated by the noise.
You didn't answer my question. Try again?
Just listened to the first track.
Honest question, how can anyone listen to this without laughing or going insane? I know it's not my thing, but I can't wrap my head around how some people can appreciate this as actual music.
people need to be more specific with their discussion. I never see anyone using time codes to refer to certain moments in songs like oh that harmony at 2:07, that riff at 0:35 etc. there should be threads about posting your favorite moment in a specific album and then discussing it
see
>And the combined track blows everything either artist has done out of the water.
>youtube.com
I listened to that video and it was shit.
Still, taste is subjective etc.
To be fair, it seems to me like kind of an impenetrable question, you can't do much but glide on the surface until you establish whether "good" and "bad" are subjective or objective terms, which is going to be pretty convoluted conversation.
However, by his use of the phrase "distinguish a good noise album from a bad one", we understand that OP considers the aesthetic value of music to be objective (intrinsic to the music itself, independent of the listener's preference), but he seemingly also considers the criteria to be genre-specific, which brings us to the next point:
Are genres subjective or objective?
Rather than something intrinsic to music, it seems to me that genres are abstract constructions.
...
>Are genres subjective or objective?
well now I think you're splitting hairs. that's a very interesting question that could have its own thread dedicated to it.
I gave Opie some things I usually think about when considering whether a noise album is good or not but then he had a stroke and started insisting I answer rhetorical questions I made myself
but not the solo merzbow track? shame.
I just think that noise as a genre doesn't follow the rules of popular music, jazz or classical (popular music meaning everything from rock, to dream pop, to hip-hop, to metal, etc.; they are all forms of popular music in one way or another).
For example, when judging a death/black metal album, the focus of evaluation is set on composition and structure. When judging a classic rock record, people might consider the "catchiness" of the songs, the emotional power it has. In hip-hop it's the production, the lyricism and it's performance, etc. So what I'm trying to find out is which elements do people consider when evaluating noise. Textures are an obvious element, but I want to know what else is there.
OP here.
These two are my only posts, the user arguing wasn't me.
harmonics
oh, cheers
Just so you know - there is an insufferably autistic, militant anti-noise faggot who thrives off of threads like these, and forces his nonsensical rhetoric into any conversation that he can.
is this thread of the year
the three questions you can apply to any art
>what is it trying to do?
>does it succeed?
>was it worth doing?
holy fuck this would be perfect and i agree
it's too subjective a topic to really have a list of "doo's" and "don'ts" about it
for example
I like harsh noise
but can't stand drone or field recording type stuff
but within harsh noise it doens't just have to be the classic "distorted static" sound like that of hanatarash, I also like the acoustic harsh noise stuff.
Why I enjoy it is more discussable, it makes me feel different from regular music somehow, like it's lifting me away out of my chair, it's really weird but also really great feel.
Hm, I guess that makes a lot of sense, but I'm more interested in the more traditionally musical aspects of evaluation, not so much in the purpose of the music as a piece of art. I would genuinely like to know how people who are knowledgeable about different genres evaluate noise.
I'm referring more specifically to the more abrasive forms of noise (the distorted static). I find it impossible to say one album is better than the other, but I don't like all of it. Similar to other music, some stuff I like - some stuff I don't, but since I'm not well versed in this genre, it's hard to determine what are the exact elements that make something good.
envelopephilter.bandcamp.com
Far more accessible than their first album.
If you like it, then it's good.
well the real question there is does it all sound the same to you?
like can you differentiate the albums you like and the ones you dont sonically? or is it purely the feeling you get from them?
I think it's a bit harder than that, if we assume that not everyone has "good taste in music".
I'm going back to my earlier point. I want to find the musical elements upon which the greatest noise/harsh noise/power electronics albums are judged and chosen as such. I say this because even if genres are just words we use to categorize stuff, every music genre has an almost unanimously chosen pantheon of albums which are considered objectively good, not only as pieces of music within the genre itself, but within music as an art in general.
>noise music
>literally tv static as "music"
I'll never understand. It's exclusively physical/digital releases right? So no concerts? I can't imagine being in a large group listenign to static.
i have a weird taste in noise
i like it textured and rhythmic, but not in a musical sort of way, more of a sound sort of way. Also i think free improv on string and wind instruments is much more entertaining than a harsh noise wall
Well, I haven't listened to enough to differentiate it, that's for sure. Most records I have listened to sound like improvised static and the only parts I can remember are the one that have some rhythm to them. I'd say it's more of a feeling.
The entire fucking genre of noise is based on the exploration of sound itself, stop trying to invent constructions that obscure the actual sound of the music. In noise, that's all that matters, it's pure sound art.
And objectively good albums don't exist. Learn to get your own taste, if so many people agree for it to be the best it may actually be shit (ie the Beatles, Bob Dylan, Joy Division)
but it's pretty
Actually it's just the opposite. Noise makes much more sense live than on record.
it's more complex than just tv static, boi
I'm really struggling to believe noise music is anything more than an out of control meme
What's you favourite noise song/album? I just want to hear one song where I can think "Oh I get it now, this is ok" instead of having to turn it off because it's just pain.
You just get used to it, learn the internal logic.
tbqh I can't even listen to clean pop rock anymore, stuff like Beefheart and the Shaggs make more sense to my ears than the Beatles
No, I understand that perfectly. I don't want to guide myself by the general opinion, I'm just interested in discovering the objective element (not the absolute objective value of an album, since it's only partly objective) upon which most people would consider a harsh noise album good.
There is no objective element to ANY art.
I'll back this up.
>If you've heard one merzmeme record you've heard them all.
As someone who's listened to 80% of his discography, I can safely say this isn't true.
Different music appealing to different people. Kind of how some people like metal and some people don't, or country, and so on. Honestly I hated Merzbow when I first listened but once I changed my mindset on it I can say Noisebloom is one of my favorite Merzalbums.
>the subjective meme
>As someone who's listened to 80% of his discography, I can safely say this isn't true.
what is your opinion of this? meme? art? decent?
My favourite album is Merzbow - 1930, but that might be a bit much. I remember that his song Tadpole was quite accessible, but I don't remember if it was noise song, so check that song out and see
I listen to noise for the sweet-ass textures, and its dominating feeling, the feeling of being pummeled by the music. So think of it like that, maybe
the killer textures
this, I find the feeling of being topped by a noise album stimulating
...
yh, I get that
legit as fuck
only really unforgivable track is "Summertime" like damn that shit fucking sucks arse
thoughts on link related?
harmonicforest.bandcamp.com
decent
wrong album
woops
nvm then
>noise listeners are such cucks they liked to be dominated by their music as well as their black whores
>that font rendering
the quality of noise, like any other music, is subjective. what people get out of it is just more varied than most genres. If you like death grips, specifically the more aggressive tracks, it might be worth checking out whitehouse's bird seed album. for me, the appeal for that album is similar to what i look for in some dg tracks, but much more intense and unfiltered.
I can't say much about artists like merzbow, as i don't particularly care about his stuff, but a lot of people like different textures?
Also, i should mention that i used to play in a noise duo where my friend made noises on pedals and i improvised on drums. for us, it was much more about the act of doing it rather than the result of it. i did enjoy the sounds we were making, but for that project it was all about raw expression. i'm not saying this is what other artists do, btu i'm mentioning it to say that the things people try to accomplish with noise can be anything. there's a decent doc about noise on youtube called "people who do noise" if you're actually interested.
I don't know, I think bands like The Gerogerigegege or Boredoms are much more interesting and successful than straight up white noise experiments. It's more than playing around with pure sound, but playing around with found sounds as well as fucking with and deconstructing genres and perverting them. which is why I think something like Yellow Trash Bazooka by The Gerogerigegege is much better than anything Merzbow released
soundcloud.com
>harsh noise
>He doesn't think taste is subjective.
>>noise listeners are such cucks they liked to be dominated by their music as well as their black whores
BDSM and even cuckoldry are very common on Noise acts.
what makes anything good?
>noise
If you're getting into meme music at least listen to some good shit like vapourwave or future funk
this isn't noise, its just gay weeb music
That's the point, if you're litening to meme music at least listen to good meme music
it has nothing to do with noise it's just average j or k-pop
You're not getting it mate.
Noise is meme music. Vapourwave/Future Funk is meme music. Only one of these are actually nice to listen to, so if you're getting into meme music, listen to Vamourwave/Future Funk not Noise.
no it's just gay weeb music, what if you were in a car with a girl and it came on by accident that would suck so hard