We toyed with the idea of giving [Zemo] his mask and sword in the final act of the movie...

>We toyed with the idea of giving [Zemo] his mask and sword in the final act of the movie, but we quickly realized that it would have made no sense within the context of the story structure. Those items have great importance to this character. They aren't just a costume and a weapon, they are his heritage, legacy. Had we made him suit up in the movie yes, fans would have understood what was happening but casual audiences would have been lost because we didn't explore [Zemo's] royal descendance .
>This is why we left the door wide open for his return. We have only begun to scratch the surface with this character. We have big plans for him

But he was the weakest part of the movie. His plans hinged on every other character being a retard.

Snyder woulda given him both and not given a fuck

You mean his plan hinged on the emotions of the characters that he spent every day of the previous two years plotting to manipulate?

concept art for zemo

I hate that capeshit doesn't commit and tries to show celebrity faces as much as possible.

>>This is why we left the door wide open for his return. We have only begun to scratch the surface with this character. We have big plans for him
I actually like this idea.
The actor was decent and casual watchers have no idea who he is anyway, whether he has a mask&cape or not. So they might as well expand the character

they said they wanted to do the reveal like on Seven, did you get the feeling at all?

Well you cant refute what he's saying about Zemo's character and costume. If people disagree then they simply dont know anything about Zemo and want a flashy costume for no reason. I am even a Captain America fan and agree it would make no sense in the current context of the movies because he wasn't in WWII at all even as set up.

Not really. His plans specifically focused on iron man being an imotional twat, which he was, even going so far as to be an emotional twat on stage in front of thousands of people.

The film has tons of coincidences, but only a couple plot holes. Zemo was always planing on getting the info to iron man so he would cause a scizm in the group, just so happened that they all meet in the same area he found the tape in, so they could conviently have a cool fight then and there when Iron Man was fresh with rage, rather than sending it to him in some e-mail or something. And even then he did plant shit to lead the avengers in general there, just go happened because conviently only capt bucky and stark show up.

Both of those things aren't really plot holes or characters being dumb (excpet maybe that line about going alone Falcon gives) they're just a little too convient to seem realistic when you think about it.

The mask should have been part of the Sokvia riot police uniform or something, or something sovia secret service would wear during torture...

your writing is horrendous

Oh, please. If Cap had just tried to explain shit at the airport there would have been no fight.

And how the fuck did Zemo even know there was a security recording of Bucky murdering Tony's parents from a camera out in the middle of nowhere? Why would Hydra even keep that? It happened 25 years ago and is absolutely useless to them. And how did Zemo know Wanda would fail to save some niggers, which would result in some accords bullshit, so Zemo could bomb the UN? And how did he know his bomb wouldn't kill some of the weaker Avengers who were there?

Zemo's plan relied on even more coincidences than Joker and Silva's plans combined.

no

10/10 rebuttal. Still liked the movie though.

Yeah, I thought it was okay, it just needed a better villain.

>tfw Thunderbolts confirmed

>Oh, please. If Cap had just tried to explain shit at the airport there would have been no fight.
Cap did try to explain it in the airport... Stark didn't believe him since he thought he was just trying to save his "old war buddy"

>And how did Zemo know Wanda would fail to save some niggers, which would result in some accords bullshit, so Zemo could bomb the UN? And how did he know his bomb wouldn't kill some of the weaker Avengers who were there?
Maybe Zemo just took advantage of the opportunity and not every microdetail of the plot was a specific step in his plan...?

Baron?

What's up with Zemo's mask, why does he wear it?

who else would be on an MCU Thunderbolts team? they kill off all their villains

Ross, Abomination, Justin Hammer.

>muh royal heritage

Zemo specifically calls the hotel he stayed at and ordered room service so that they would find the corpse and Tony would realize what was going on and go to help Cap and Bucky, them being alone and in an isolated area was the best place for it to happen so Tony had no time to cool down or anyone else to stop him

The bomb with Crossbones had nothing to do with the accords

>muh glued to my face

Spider-Man Homecoming : Beetle
Captain Marvel: Moonstone
Ant-Man & Wasp: Fixer/Goliath
Songbird is the lead character and is introduced in the Thunderbolts movie.

>Ross as ringleader
>Zemo as squad leader
>Abomination as muscle
>Elektra as assassin
>Frank Castle as sniper
>Justin Hammer as the tech guy with his own suit
>Nuke from Jessica Jones as hand to hand specialist
>Absorbing Man from AoS as guy-only-there-for-his-useful-power

they're put together to take down the real Mandarin and save Trevor Slattery

ends with Frank going AWOL and blowing them all the fuck out like the last run

Marvel Television characters are out limits.

Not wanting classic Thunderbolts

Considering the Marvel marketing, I can't see they using a team other than the originals

>cancelled mobile game artwork leaked: Songbird, Zemo, Fixer
>LEGO Avengers pack: original team + Jolt
>cartoon: original team
>comics: original team minus Songbird that got bumped to a field leader on an Avengers title and Zemo

THIS

Civil War is that rare example of NOT having plot holes, just coincidences and conveniences. It's a good example of poor writing, but not because the story doesn't make sense, just because it's lazy.

That would be a fair criticism if it was all one movie written by one writer, but it's cobbling together so many different elements from different writers and directors it's actually more impressive than lazy.

is there a reason for that?

> MCU uses classic line-ups for their teams
> Marvel starts pushing the classic Thunderbolts line-up with their classic origin story fucking everywhere out of nowhere
> MCU!Thunderbolts speculation is somehow nearly always Zemo + random as shit team

Also the Thunderbolts run involving Punisher and Elektra was awful and did nothing worthwhile whatsoever for either character. In fact they were both written painfully out of character during that run. I sincerely don't understand why anyone would want to inflict that on them.

Just because a lot of people are involved doesn't mean the story is good. Many shitty movies have been written by multiple people.

It stems from the Marvel Studios/Entertainment separation, Feige is still at odds with Perlmutter. Not even Daredevil will be used on Infinity War.

I dont see a reason Norman Osbourne isnt in thunderbolts considering marvel said they will use spiderman villains in other movies

The whole movie was shit. It was a Captain America movie were I rooted for the other team and hoped Cap would get fucked up.

Felt more emotion when Iron man saw the tape than the 2 movies hyping up Cap finding Bucky and trying to rescue him.

I'm literally going to bust a nut if they do the original Thunderbolts team. Its basically the perfect transition from Infinity War.

What is Thunderbols?
Marvel's Suicide Squad?

how can the be at odds, they both love money

It all makes sense though from a logical and character point of view, the criticism is "well that's unlikely" but that's only valid against this one movie if it wasn't carrying on a story from other movies made by different teams 8 years ago that had no idea they'd do this plotline.

It does a better job at villain motivation and plan than movies that only have to worry about their own story.

So a good movie with varied viewpoints then, again better than most genre movies that can't even get one viewpoint right.

Yeah, exact same concept.

But Feige loves it more.

It would've been perfect if he worse a purple ski-mask/balaclava when he was in the snow in Siberia, and it would've made perfect sense

It's a group of supervillains that acted as superheroes in a plan to take over the world when the major heroes got killed by Onslaught. Some of them actually liked the hero lifestyle and rebelled against Zemo when he put the final phase of the plan in action.

How did he know who had the book with Bucky's mind control stuff?
How did he know that Bucky had been mind controlled and the existance of that book?
I guess nowadays we can read almost anything that may have been confidential 30 years ago on wikipedia tho, and there was probably a lot of conspiracy around it...

...

Post 2007 Thunderbolts are basically a Suicide Squad knock-off, yes.

Classic Thunderbolts from 1997 were their own thing.

In the aftermath of the Onslaught event, the Masters of Evil decided to fill the hole left by the "deaths" of the Fantastic Four and Avengers by disguising themselves as a new team of heroes called the Thunderbolts.

This was part of a plan to take over the world.

As they continue to do good and heroic deeds pretty much everyone save for Zemo decides that they like this entire being a hero thing. They are later on joined by Jolt who was rescued by the Thunderbolts from a lab and who is unaware of the scam. She serves as the team's moral compass.

When Zemo launches the final stage of their taking over the world plan, the other Thunderbolts betray him because they'd rather be heroes than villains.

From then on they try to redeem themselves and become heroes for real, sometimes with more sometimes with less success.

They are later rejoined by Zemo who got a lot of character development and starts to discover that maybe this entire redemption thing isn't such a bad idea after all.

I'm guessing they will replace Atlas. They might hybridize Songbird/Jolt. Moonstone, Zemo and Beetle are definitely going to be in the film though. Techno was my favorite character from the original so here's hoping.

I thought alot of that information kinda fell under the shit Black Widow released at the end of TWS.

Atlas will be the easiest to set up. The HYDRA dude escaped on the end of Ant-Man with a sample of the Cross Particles.

Good. Phase 4 when?

When they get FF back and can use Doom, Galactus and cosmic shit

Abner a shit. A shit.

They probably planned it that way, yes.

>Plan hinges on bucky
>Get a shoot to kill placed on him and just hope he doesn't die

Nope. He had a Bucky mask ready to use to bomb the UN and frame Bucky.

And this too.

That and there's nothing really that the Avengers ever kept secret. Tony flat-out came out as ironman so the manipulation part came easy if you just looked up his fucking wikipedia page. Also the whole world knew Winter Soldier's connection to Cap at this point it's in every news coverage. The avengers having no secret identity just made it easy for people like Zemo to fuck them over with the right planning.

Maybe. It just seems like alot of characters competing for screentime and Atlas/Fixer aren't particularly essential to the group dynamic.

But that'll never happen. Incidentally, can they use Namor or not?

If Steve had just went with Tony and explained things when everyone had cooled down Tony would have believed him. I mean, he came to the same conclusion only hours later on his own.

>implying Captain America couldn't protect his BFF

He almost didn't. On that note, why were German cops trying to murder Bucky in Romania? How the fuck does that make sense?

I'd say Fixer is pretty essential (especially in later stories) though I can see what you mean.

Though if they pull a Zemo with the other five and introduce them + their relevant backstories in the upcoming phase 3 or early phase 4 movies before they do a Thunderbolts film, the screentime might not be such a problem.

Especially since Civil War has shown that it's possible to do a fairly crowded film that nevertheless gives everyone involved good character and relationship development - and a Thunderbolts film would probably be less crowded actually than CW.

>comic book movie
user, I don't even try to pretend any of this makes sense.

Antman & The Wasp is definitely going to have build-up for phase 4, but where else would they have time for it?

I'd say Moonstone for one could be introduced relatively easy in Captain Marvel.

Mach in Spider-Man and Fixer in Black Panther could also work (though Fixer could also be introduced in Spider-Man), Atlas in Antman...

Only one I am completely clueless about is Songbird.

That crossbones guy sure did have a lot of loyalty- for a hired gun I mean

Well not everyone needs to be introduced separately.

He was a big guy.

That is certainly true. Fixer and Mach could be introduced together...or maybe Mach and Songbird.

This was shite. I felt nothing for this character's motivations.

That's because your family was never killed.

>We have big plans for him
FUCK YES

>We have only begun to scratch the surface with this character. We have big plans for him
Fuck this makes me hype. Zemo was such a great villain.

>Beetle and Mimi are added in Antman and Wasp to have a couple of supervillains

Who is this cutie patootie?

the fuck is Kamen rider Garren doing in murican cartoon

qtest supervillain

>dat ass
>dat innuendo
At least I think it's innuendo. They're going to rape her, right?

Sadly not.

But I could ateast try and sympathize with him. I saw that they tried to do that at the end, but I felt nothing.

He was a terrible villain.

>Yeah, exact same concept.
If the same concept is villains doing heroics, well, yes. But while Suicide Squad are still villains and only do heroics because they're forced by the suits to do so, Thunderbolts were pretending to do heroics by themselves and eventually liked the whole deal of doing good.

>I'm dead inside, therefore the movie is bad!
Okay.

>Romania
It was Austria. And they wanted to murder Bucky because for some reason the suits wanted to kill Bucky, that's primarily what made Steve defect, the fact that higherups wanted to kill Bucky instead of giving him a fair trial.

Once Bucky was captured Cap was almost on board of the accords...till stupid Tony told him that they had Wanda imprisioned.

So who is that gimp? You know, for research purposes.

Poundcakes

Sclaret Johnason looked so fucking hot in this movie. I masterbated hardstyle when I came home!!!

How did Zemo know about the video?
He knew that Bucky did it because he scoured the shield leak after his family died, and he was looking for evidence to show to tony to break the team apart
He may not have known there was a vide but he knew there was something. That's why he interrogated that hydra guy and then Bucky, just trying to get info on where he can find solid evidence.
Not the strongest of plans, but that's what the plan was

He also didn't know the accords would happen, but he fully toon advantage of them

And if his bomb killed some of the avengers, then all the better.
Bucky being framed for killing avengers would split the team right in half

The Least the director could have done was to at least make me hate the guy but I couldn't do that either. I at least hated Luthor in bvs

reminds me of boris or whatever from x-men. im sitting there thinking "whys the dude being so fucky nasty man?"

Songbird/Mimi can be added in the movie cold open like Batroc/Crossbones

Ike is apparently a humongous douchebag and the biggest Jew ever.

Ike used to go to Marvel offices and audit the number of paperclips

I think Namor is with Fox with the X-Men/mutants

>Based Russos
Have you thanked them yet today Sup Forums?

Look cool as fuck tbvh

>We have only begun to scratch the surface with this character. We have big plans for him
And yet you literally destroyed any chance of based Crossbones ever returning. He was cool as fuck, what the hell?