Is jaime lannister a bad guy or the good guy?

Is jaime lannister a bad guy or the good guy?
i'm a little confused.

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Because he saved king landing but made bran paralysed? :/
Sup Forums your opinion?

There are no good and bad guys. Jaime is a problematic fave.

All of his actions were reasonable under the circumstances. He only wanted to be an honourable knight but was forced to make impossible choices. His father or the king? Let Bran reveal his secrets, killing him his children and verse or push Bran off the tower.

When did he save KL

>cersei not verse

This, Jaime is a pretty tragic figure.

Good guy... bad guy

Our Guy

he's a subversion of the redemption plot. the idea is that he thinks he's trying to redeem himself (and much of the audience have bought into his logic) but he's actually just a reed who bends in the direction of whoever the strongest personality around him is.

>continuing to fuck his sister after she marries the King and fathering his heirs
>reasonable under the circumstances

>would leave his hot sister for brienne, biggest autist in the seven kingdoms

bad guy

chaotic good

backstory

The showrunners have about as much an idea as you.

They were nailing it in S3. And forgot they could make him do stuff from S4 and forward.

Once they got past him explaining how he killed the mad king and how he really feels about the term "Kingslayer" they didn't bother furthering his depth.

Makes me sad. That jacuzzi scene with him and Brienne is some of the most genuine shit the shows ever pulled off.

That is a separate element of forbidden love. It's clear that Cersei is good at manipulating her relatives into sleeping with her and doing what she wants (as we saw with lancel). It seems as though Jamie was seduced quite early on. That's why it is such a huge moment for him later on when he finally chooses to ignore Cersei's plea for help in favour of redeeming his honour. I only said that his actions were reasonable under the circumstances, nothe that he was a saint.

>he really feels about the term "Kingslayer" they didn't bother furthering his depth.

the fact is that the character hasn't done anything to further his "depth" since then either, unless you count threatening to throw a baby out of a catapult and being alienated from Cersei because he found out she was fucking other men.

that's why I think his redemption is a fakeout, or something that's going to be left in a state of partial completion when his character dies.

just because Lancel and Jaime both got manipulated doesn't absolve them of responsibility. and Jaime's burning of the letter from Cersei really is based as much on jealousy over her cucking him as any realization that Cersei is a psycho. added to which, Jaime's "love" for Cersei directly endangered her life for years without him apparently considering it like that.

it's even possible that the subplot of Lancel joining the Faith Militant is an intentional ironic contrast to Jaime, who hasn't made anywhere near as dramatic an attempt to atone or change how he lives.

if I'm right Jaime is probably headed for a scene where someone points all this out to him, perhaps the BwB just before hanging him.

...

everything he does ends up back firing

why did he rape his 'love' next to the body of their dead son?

why? it doesn't even make sense

...

...

You could probably say that about most of the characters
After Storm of swords, the story seems to have stalled. Originally there was supposed to just be a time skip done with a single book. Then he was doing a second trilogy. The problem is that single book expanded into 2 books and he hasn't written anything since. Which is why nothing is really happening.

>raping your sister over her sons corpse
>reasonable under the circumstances

>that
>rape

Lol beta cuck

...

in the books they fuck when Cersei is on her period and get blood all over the altar. they removed that element and upped the rapeyness to maintain the edge.

...

>degenerate
>fucking up lives & families
He's definately a bad guy, but Sup Forumstards probably think he's alpha.

>including the fan fiction of the hack writers

the great autismo speaks again

How does humanity eliminate autism?

Abolish vaccination

he's not a good guy. he's not a bad guy. but he is THE guy.

youtube.com/watch?v=qQuiTa9isS0

>do one good thing in your life
>everyone shits on your for technical reasons

yeah, I bet they'd be singing a different tune about MUH OATH if king's landing was in ruins because the mad king burned it down

I think he made the only decision anyone with an actual conscious could make.

Trippy

I remember when I first started watching the show and I got confused and overwhelmed at the end of Season 1 when Tyrion helped the Lannisters in the war against the Starks.

He is the valonqar, so definitely a good guy.

Why did they have to cut his hair? He looks so much better with long hair. Especially in that flashback of him killing the Mad King. His hair should've been long.

That happened in the book faggot

Why would this confuse you

Good guy fights against other good guys

>Watch Game of thrones with sister
>we're cuddling on the couch
>incest scenes come up
>it gets a bit hot under the blanket

He's in the middle ground all the time.
But if the prophecy is true and he kills Cersei in the end then he's a real one.

Breeds with his sister.
Stabs grown men in the back.
Pushes little boys out of buildings.
Kills his own cousin.
Fucks his sisters beside his dead father.
I could go on but wont.

kek

The one true King!

>That boy had wanted to be Ser Gerold Dayne but somewhere along the way he'd become the Smiling Knight instead

I think there's a lesson about unrealistically high standards in this.

did you get a stiffy, user? an incest stiffy?

There are no good guys or bad guys imo, everyones looking out for themselves and their families.

Except Ramsay who is apparently Jared Leto's Joker in Westeros.


MOM'S

He didnt fuck his sister when his father died.
It was during Joffrey's death.
Uneducated fuck.

>Ramsay who is apparently Jared Leto's Joker in Westeros

You could even be right. [Those guys] aren't noted for their imaginative powers.

no wonder joffrey died if the lord commander of his kingsguard was throwing one in to his sister the queen instead of attending to his duty. it all makes sense now!

He was bad, then he became good and now he's becoming bad again.

life isn't that black&white op
things is complicated yo

GONNA

Nah, Jaime was a cunt. He's done some good stuff as well, but that doesn't excuse pushing a kid from a tower or instigating a whole succession crisis just because he couldn't stop fucking his sister, the queen. Seriously, the war is squarely on his and Cercei's heads.

of course, in a situation like that you can't control the dick
>her ass presses slightly against my soft cock
>incest scene comes up
>dick starts getting hard
>before the scene is over I get a raging boner
>presses hard against my shorts
>she doesn't move at first but then slowly rubs her ass against my boner
>call her a pervert while rubbing more against her, she just giggles and says "you too"
>keep watching the show while rubbing boner against her
>about to cum as the episode ends
>she gets up gives me a kiss on the cheek and leaves me there with my blue balls

>He was bad, then he became good and now he's becoming bad again.
>things is complicated yo

This is an amazingly accurate reproduction of what must have been David Benioff and Dan Weiss's brainstorming session on the subject.

Haven't you heard of a character arc?

>Starts off bad and selfish but becomes good and noble
That's how writing works my boy.

Was kinda weird though how he fuggs his sister in the room of their deaded son

Do you find sleeping nude in an oxygen tent gives you sexual powers, user?

Nobody that fucks their own sibling is a good guy.

absolutely

If two people love each other even if they are siblings, there is nothing wrong with it.

:^)

If he was executed for killing the Mad King or something he'd have been a good guy forever. But then shit happened.

>Everybody hates Jaime because he killed a king that everybody hated.
>Sneks kill their leader, get power
>Ramsay kills Roose, gets power
>Greyjoy kills his brother and king, becomes king.

What happened?

I hate when that happens.

Jaime in the books no longer cares about Cersei since like book 3. He realised she is a bitch and just moved on. They keep it in the show just for controversy.

DABID

Jaime was the King's personal bodyguard.

Why does Homer have no dick?

He still cares but he 100% recognizes she's a crazy cunt and only truly tries to cut their connection at the end of his last POV when he burns the letter pleading for his help

I'm just pissed DnD haven't done his arc right. He's supposed to be well into redemption mode by the time he's sent off to riverlands. But no he's still pinning for cersei. No one cares enough that a crown princess and her husband to be have just been offed either, at least not to the proper scale.

But this is just another royal/court death of the dozens over the last few years, so I might be reasonable that even the court couldn't give a shit anymore.

book: guy who loves and fucks his sister but starts redeeming himself by questioning his actions.

show: guy who loves and fucks his sister but starts redeeming himself but screw that, let's keep fucking sis lannistarrrrs foreveerrrr

This is the only right answer.

Not defending DnD but Myrcella is strangely almost completely unmentioned in the books outside of Dorne POVs

Everything just gets worse in the show

show Jaime is barely a character
Book Jaime was kinda an arrogant twat - the only really bad thing he did was pushing Bran out the window. Other "bad" shit was just duty to his house and kingdom. Stabbing the king was being in a shitty situation.

He's a cunt, but he's not a monster. He'll sacrifice himself and others for family, but he's still a noble and plays lethal games of political chess. It's just that those games frequently spill over into the lives of people who had no idea they were even playing.

He's a cocky, arrogant prick from an arrogant, cunning and brutal house, but he's also a loving, emotional man with some integrity. I fucking hate the cunt, but I can't stop loving him.

He just does what he wants, what he thinks is necessary or what he's ordered to do, except he can't really do shit since he lost his only talent, the hand, so people started to think of him as a good guy since S3.

>During the early days told everyone that Jaime was my favourite character and that he gets loads of development
>In season 3 people start to agree with me, even despite that fucking retarded kinslaying scene
>Then in season 4 he rapes cersei for no reason and they completely play down her manipulative personality and the fact that he breaks up with her
>Jaime in the show is just the same sisterfucking degenerate he's always been

Is full plate to expensive for the Kings in GoT? No way a king's personal guard of Knights would wear that shit.

Jaime and Cercei are the two sides of the coin the gods flip when a Targaryen is born. And that being said is pretty self explanatory.

I don't think cersei knows she's lost an ear yet. I think she was more or less a plot device given she's non-POV and what, 12 or 13? Her role is more hostage/ward anyway.

The Mountain got all the plate because the Lannister mines ran out of gold.

>implying it was rape

yeah but even in inner monologues and thoughts she comes up like twice after she's sent to Dorne in the second book

It wasn't rape, it was a moment of liberation from cerceis manipulation. Him having her for the first time under his terms. She then uses what he said as they fucked again against him for another manipulation. She was most likely waiting an entire lifetime for him to take her like that.
But sorry he didn't sign a consent form or whatever you pink haired speds are doing these days.

HOLY SHIT so much from season 1 I don't remember

they're targs tho so its okay

That means that Joffery and Tommen were rightful rulers of Westros after all

mad king wanted to burn entire kings landing but jaime killed him

because it makes cersei look bad. if they showed how crazy and retarded cersei was they'd be called misogynists

Fuck no, Jaime didn't hammer the shit out of Rhaegar's ruby encrusted sissy ass.

He saved a few extra lives pushing bran from the tower. When you do compare them. And the incest is interwoven in their blood by magic, a genetic trait to preserve the blood of the dragon lords, so you cant really blame him for that.

Armour on left is fucking sweet.

The Lannisters are slowly moving from "bad' territory to "good" territory.
The Starks are slowly moving from "good" territory to "bad" territory.
They'll reach something in the middle by the time Dany arrives and burns them all.

It means they have a better claim then say the baratheons who had a shit excuse for a claim anyway.
Though truthfully it should go to Jon / Aemon considering the targaryens were nearly wiped out in blood sacrifices at the tradgedy of summer hall to reintroduce a dragon lord back into the ruling bloodline. aka rhaegar.
The red comet came around before used in the rituals for birthing rhaegar. Red comet is used for targ magic.
So Jon has the best claim being son of a dragonlord, though if Aerys could choose and probably dreamed about was plucking the twins from Tywin and having them take the throne.

Not even her?