In 2016...

>In 2016, the band officially changed their name from "Andrew Jackson Jihad" to AJJ (a moniker that many of their fanbase had been using to refer to them for several years).

>In a statement on the band's website on February 24, 2016, Bonnette wrote "1.) We are not Muslims, and as such, it is disrespectful and irresponsible for us to use the word jihad in our band’s name.

>On June 28, 2016, AJJ announced their 6th studio album, The Bible 2

>We are not Muslims, and as such, it is disrespectful and irresponsible for us to use the word jihad in our band’s name.
>AJJ announced their 6th studio album, The Bible 2

>not Muslims...disrespectful and irresponsible for us to use the word jihad
>6th studio album, The Bible 2

They're terrible. Lyrics are 100% SJW bullshit.

significance, OP?

>irresponsible for us to use the word
>irresponsible to use a word
>a word
fuck off

Blatant hypocrisy.

Not cognitive dissonance. The material conditions for muslims in america are much different compared to christians. It's like trying to grill the kid in class with autism versus grilling the popular jock.

Muslims deserve to be treated like shit.
At least christians don't stone their women.

I'm not seeing it.

This is probably a shitpost but it's also the most accurate thing I've seen posted on this site, good job user

>material conditions
Most Muslims in the United States are wealthy, highly educated immigrants who live in major cities.

Most Christians in the United States are working class white, Hispanic, and black people who live in rural communities.

Most atheists in the United States are white middle class people who live in major cities.

Now let's talk about the material conditions for Christians in the Middle East.

That's because you're a hypocrite, too.

>band changes name from using a pre-Islamic Arabic word so as not to offend Muslims
>next album, announced a few months later, deliberately insults Christians and Christianity, blasphemes against the Christian God, and desecrates the iconographic image of a Christian angel...and that's just what's on the cover

what do you expect when they have a song that is literally about a member's wife's son?

Accusing spree just never seems to slow with this one.
Next thing you know he'll be saying Ringo caused the Beatles to split!

>The Bible, a widely read piece of literature that has applications outside of religion
>Jihad, an exclusively Muslim thing that cannot be appreciated by those outside of the religion
hmmm, funny how that works. At the same time, its retarded, but who cares what they do

>!

Everything until Knife Man is good

>The Bible, a widely read piece of literature that has applications outside of religion
That the early Christians wrote the New Testament of, that the Church canonized, and that Christians consider the sacred word of God.

>Jihad, an exclusively Muslim thing that cannot be appreciated by those outside of the religion
These Christians certainly appreciate jihad for what it is a lot more than you do.

everyone knows andrew jackson JIHAD is a fucking cuck. I'm surprised he didn't change the name sooner

would a man with a name like mine travel there?

I agree with your comparison of muslims to people with mental disorders

Candy Cigarettes and Cap Guns is garbage compared to Knife Man, and the Bible 2 has a few good songs. Can't Maintain is obviously their best album though

Has the thought ever occurred to you that you should treat everyone fairly and behave consistently beneficent toward others without prejudice, treating everyone as individuals, and appreciating them for their personal character rather than what social categories they fall into, or whether or not they hold beliefs with which you agree or disagree?

>AJJ
>is a cuck
>he
You poor, misguided child.

you aren't wrong, you just come of as a fucking pussy

Demanding that self-appointed arbiters of political correctness actually behave with moral consistency does not necessitate that I'm actually myself offended.

that's why i said you aren't wrong. the optics are just bad, hence why everyone is arguing against you despite having made a pretty obvious point.

Part of treating everyone equally is recognizing the struggles that they face from discrimination.To ignore the struggles minorities face is to marginalize them in the most insidious way possible.

>Part of treating everyone equally is recognizing the struggles that they face from discrimination.
firstly, no it isn't. equal treatment is completley independent from one's personal outlook on the treatment of a generalized culture group.
secondly, we've yet to establish that muslims in america face discrimination at all, much less enough discrimination to warrant coddling their sensibilities by not using the word jihad.
lastly, this is all irrelevant to op's point. the band changed their name to avoid offending a religious group, but then proceeded to use the title and cover of their very next album to mock and deride a different religious group's beliefs.
trust me, if anyone is in favor of mocking the religious, it's me, but that doesn't mean i can't see the very obvious double standard being drawn here.

This

Question: Did the thought ever cross your mind that I've faced discrimination as a Christian?

I agree with op but it doesn't bum me out too much. the last good album was knife man and everything after is hit and miss. Still great live and still a fantastic discography so hold on to your warm memories of them

irresponsible is a word but in informal text grammar doesnt matter

anyway andrew jackson jihad suck ass
make early against me look testosterone laden (ironically enough)

AJJ have addressed this multiple times. Being Christians/raised Christian, they think it's insensitive to make use of the word jihad in an incorrect context but they consider it fair to lampoon Christianity seeing as they're doing it from a place of familiarity and understanding.

In the end it's about parodying the stuff you know as opposed to misusing something you don't. Plus they started getting attention after Christmas Island so they most likely wanted to change their name to make themselves more accessible.

None of that changes the fact that this album sucks though. Their discography is great up until Knife Man (which I consider their peak) then slowly begins to decline with Christmas Island.

I'm genuinely interested, what discrimination have you faced as a Christian?

Wow that reasoning is actually a lot more solid than I expected.

AJJ were never particularly good as a band, they were just good at social media and self promotion. Defiance Ohio did that schtick 100x better

Perhaps they are christian/christian educated? That way they would feel more secure in what they're speaking about Christianity. And their statement wouldn't be untrue.

But literally everyone in that band grew up Christian, there's no hypocrisy you dumbfuck

We have to give gay people cake

Maybe they did it specifically to "trigger" dumbass "anti-pc" cunts like yourself and they don't actually have any more respect for Islam than they ever did.

one time an atheist made fun of me on reddit

of course this nuance escapes most of the sad excuses for human beings with hard-ons for hating "SJWs" here

i don't particularly care about the name change, or the politics involved. i just thought the post i was responding to was dumb, and explained why.
stooping to the level of a retarded Sup Forumsack and spouting the "triggered" meme when someone articulates an opinion contrary to your own does you no favors btw.

No matter how many words you use I will still see you as nothing more than an Amazing Atheist subscriber

great argument. i'll be sure to remember that one.

Source?

>muh non-muslim privilege

>muh argument
This is Sup Forums, get off your high horse cuck boi

...

...

>no more shame
>no more fear
>no more dread
No more appeal

well they didn't let me join the Jewish League in college

That doesn't sound right but I don't know enough about AJJ to dispute it.

>AJJ have addressed this multiple times. Being Christians/raised Christian, they think it's insensitive to make use of the word jihad in an incorrect context but they consider it fair to lampoon Christianity seeing as they're doing it from a place of familiarity and understanding.

Once you leave a religion you're no longer a part of it. They're about as Christian as Joseph Stalin was. Remember that he attended seminary. I don't think that makes what he did to the Church fair.

I doubt the Andy and the Jihadists are actually "familiar" with Christianity to any degree greater "that thing my stupid parents made me do on Sunday that I hated" and they sure as FUCK don't "understand" it. I think Christ put it something along the lines of: "Depart from Me. I never knew you."

I'm not from the United States. I was forced to drop out of my university when I privately complained to the editor of the school newspaper about an image of a desecrated Bible being published. The faculty found out I'm Christian and I was forced to drop out. I decided to leave the country altogether when I found out my Bishop had been arrested and tortured by the Communists and fled the country under threat of them doing the same to the entire congregation. I'm starting over from nothing. Leftists in America seem to think they're any different but I don't see it and they have never given me a single reason to think otherwise. There were other things that happened but I've written enough.

You realize that in Islam the penalty for both apostasy and blasphemy isn't a record deal with a major label, right?

It's death. And it's enforced every day.

I wonder if that nuance escaped you.

>I privately complained to the editor of the school newspaper about an image of a desecrated Bible being published.
so yeah, you're a pussy
>The faculty found out I'm Christian and I was forced to drop out. I decided to leave the country altogether when I found out my Bishop had been arrested and tortured by the Communists and fled the country under threat of them doing the same to the entire congregation.
either you're chinese or none of this shit ever happened.
i must have missed the news reports about the rampant communist death gangs killing bishops in the streets. you'd think fox news would be all iver that.

>so yeah, you're a pussy
You're ignorant. And you're a coward who has lived his entire life hiding behind this merciful society that Christianity has built. You're a parasite, like a maggot that burrows into the flesh when you shine a light on it. You know nothing of the world. Because you don't want to know.

I'm fortunate in that I got away from that situation with only losing a few years of education. I knew I might have been arrested and maybe beaten for doing what I did but I did it anyway because I had to.

>either you're chinese or none of this shit ever happened.
Vietnamese. Have you heard of Vietnam?

>i must have missed the news reports about the rampant communist death gangs killing bishops in the streets. you'd think fox news would be all iver that.
He wasn't my bishop at the time. He wasn't even a priest, since we had no priest because the Communists took over all the seminaries and schools and the Church couldn't ordain anyone there. He's currently my bishop in my new home. If you want news articles I can link you a few. I know there were some published when the Pope ordained him.

>You're ignorant.
sure stings coming from you.
> And you're a coward who has lived his entire life hiding behind this merciful society that Christianity has built.
the society i live in was literally founded on the principle of secularism, so idk what you mean.
>You're a parasite, like a maggot that burrows into the flesh when you shine a light on it.
man, all this overblown, pretentious pontification is really hurting my feelios dude.
>You know nothing of the world. Because you don't want to know.
yeah, i'm sure you've got it all figured out my man, considering how completley assblasted you are over a band making fun of your book of fairy tales.
>Vietnamese. Have you heard of Vietnam?
eh, i was close enough.

The day will come when you look back on yourself and recognize a con lợn. I hope for your sake that you're able to grow in the meantime instead of becoming an even worse person. I'm done feeding you pearls.

>the society i live in was literally founded on the principle of secularism
Secularism is a Christian idea.

>gook language
disregarded
>Secularism is a Christian idea.
the term was literally invented by an agnostic

I didn't know an agnostic signed the Peace of Westphalia.

>The term "secularism" was first used by the British writer George Jacob Holyoake in 1851.
>Holyoake invented the term "secularism" to describe his views of promoting a social order separate from religion, without actively dismissing or criticizing religious belief. An agnostic himself, Holyoake argued that "Secularism is not an argument against Christianity, it is one independent of it. It does not question the pretensions of Christianity; it advances others. Secularism does not say there is no light or guidance elsewhere, but maintains that there is light and guidance in secular truth, whose conditions and sanctions exist independently, and act forever. Secular knowledge is manifestly that kind of knowledge which is founded in this life, which relates to the conduct of this life, conduces to the welfare of this life, and is capable of being tested by the experience of this life."

also, the peace of westphalia didn't establish secularism. toleration of dissenting religions =/= secularism.

>"Render unto Caesar" is the beginning of a phrase attributed to Jesus in the synoptic gospels, which reads in full, "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's" (Ἀπόδοτε οὖν τὰ Καίσαρος Καίσαρι kαὶ τὰ τοῦ Θεοῦ τῷ Θεῷ).[Matthew 22:21]
>This phrase has become a widely quoted summary of the relationship between Christianity, secular government, and society.
>My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But now (or 'as it is') my kingdom is not from the world (John 18:36)

>also, the peace of westphalia didn't establish secularism. toleration of dissenting religions =/= secularism.
That isn't what the Peace of Westphalia did.

Anyway, here's another quote for you, by CS Lewis:

>“The Tao, which others may call Natural Law or Traditional Morality or the First Principles of Practical Reason or the First Platitudes, is not one among a series of possible systems of value. It is the sole source of all value judgments. If it is rejected, all value is rejected. If any value is retained, it is retained. The effort to refute it and raise a new system of value in its place is self-contradictory. There has never been, and never will be, a radically new judgment of value in the history of the world. What purport to be new systems or…ideologies…all consist of fragments from the Tao itself, arbitrarily wrenched from their context in the whole and then swollen to madness in their isolation, yet still owing to the Tao and to it alone such validity as they posses.”

Parasite.

Con lợn means "pig."

>That isn't what the Peace of Westphalia did.
except it literally is.
what's more, the religious toleration didn't even extend to all portions of europe. the hapsburg's lands still didn't tolerate non-catholics for example.
>here's another quote for you, by CS Lewis
CS Lewis was a retard that wrote children's novels filled with thinly veiled allusions to the children's novel he worshiped.
>Con lợn means "pig."
thanks.

Is that supposed to be offensive?

who cares

>except it literally is.
No, it isn't. You don't know much about history, do you? Toleration of minority religions is ancient. If the Peace of Westphalia had been just that it wouldn't have been remarkable. The Peace of Westphalia handed the authority for determining religious toleration from a religious institution over to princes (secular authorities). Are you beginning to grasp the significance or do you need me to unpack it more for you?

>what's more, the religious toleration didn't even extend to all portions of europe...
This point is completely irrelevant to the throughline of our discussion. I'm guessing you just read that in the intro paragraph to the Wikipedia article on the Peace of Westphalia and wanted to show off your newfound expertise. (Slow clap.)

But the Peace of Westphalia wasn't even the origin point secularism, but merely the culmination of centuries of ideas developing in Christian jurisprudence. You've failed to address my point of secularism originating in the teachings of Jesus. I'll consider another failure to do so your concession.

>CS Lewis was a retard that wrote
You're not very intelligent, are you? Actually engage with the substance presented. Stop deflecting. That's the hallmark of a lazy mind. You'll never improve if you refuse to let anything sink in and keep batting knowledge away because you're afraid of it.

It was a reference to pearls before swine. Be as offended as you think is necessary. And it's kind of funny that his "disregarded" reaction demonstrated exactly what that expression means.

That sounds terrible

based

another snivelling left wing parasite btfo

Not discrimination against Christians. It's just that Christians don't blow themselves up or shoot up nightclubs in an autistic fit of rage whenever you make fun of them.

>The Peace of Westphalia handed the authority for determining religious toleration from a religious institution over to princes (secular authorities).
even if this is the case (and i didn't find anything in my admittedly short search), that still is not secularism. the governments of 19th century europe were still very much christian, and christianity was still very much the state religion. at best you could say it was a step towards secularism.
> I'm guessing you just read that in the intro paragraph to the Wikipedia article on the Peace of Westphalia and wanted to show off your newfound expertise.
yes, i did. mostly because i'm not about to go find a primary source about the peace of westphalia in order to win a fucking argument on Sup Forums.
>You've failed to address my point of secularism originating in the teachings of Jesus.
i had no issue with that part of your post, so i didn't respond. i do, however, take issue with you suggesting that jesus somehow pioneered secularism when the term wasn't invented until the 19th century.
>You're not very intelligent, are you?
idk man
>Actually engage with the substance presented.
give me something of substance to engage with then. as far as i can tell you just dropped a quote from a famously shit apologist in my lap with little or no context as to how it relates to the discussion at hand.
>You'll never improve if you refuse to let anything sink in and keep batting knowledge away because you're afraid of it.
ok pal.
*snort*

Concession accepted.

This is their only good album.
Fight me.

good, now care to address everything else? or are you just going to declare victory because i granted you one of your premises?

where i come from they do

What if the autistic kid is a spastic asshole to everybody and the jock is kinda cool and friendly sometimes?

>In the 1982 second edition, the track "Qu'ran"—which features samples of Qur'anic recital—was removed at the request of the Islamic Council of Great Britain. In its place "Very, Very Hungry" (the B-side of "The Jezebel Spirit" 12" EP)[29] was substituted. The first edition of the CD (1986) included both tracks, with "Very, Very Hungry" as a bonus track. Later editions (1990 and later) followed the revised LP track order without "Qu'ran."

>[...] in an interview for Pitchfork about the 2006 reissue, Byrne said: "Way back when the record first came out, in 1981, it might have been '82, we got a request from an Islamic organization in London, and they said, 'We consider this blasphemy that you put grooves to the chanting of the Holy Book.' And we thought, 'Okay, in deference to somebody's religion, we'll take it off.' You could probably argue for and against monkeying with something like that. But I think we were certainly feeling very cautious about this whole thing. We made a big effort to try and clear all the voices, and make sure everybody was okay with everything. Because we thought, 'We're going to get accused of all kinds of things, and so we want to cover our asses as best we can.' So I think in that sense we reacted maybe with more caution than we had to. But that's the way it was.[28]"

>folk punk is full of pussies
gee whoda thunk it

who cares with AJJ does?
they're basically irrelevant now because they suck so bad.

>at best you could say it was a step towards secularism.
You've recognized that things in the present are connected to things in the past. That is a pretty big leap. Now, I don't want to push you, but do you think that maybe ideas as expressed in both history and the present might exist on some sort of nebulous continuum rather than as clearcut Platonic ideals that suddenly spring forth fully formed from nothing? Does that get you thinking about maybe how far back some of these threads might go?

>secularism when the term wasn't invented until the 19th century.
Now, this might come as a shock to you, so make sure you're sitting and aren't chewing any food. Ready? Things are sometimes older than the names for them are. I know, right?

>little or no context as to how it relates to the discussion at hand
Pfft. Figure it out, Forrest.

>mfw you lost and we won

>not understanding the difference between appropriating a culture youre not part of and a culture youre part of

Hey, aren't you dindu nuffin?

cultural appropriation doesn't exist.
If it did, why are black people studying? Modern education didn't come from Africa or is imbued into their culture, it's appropriation.

>do you think that maybe ideas as expressed in both history and the present might exist on some sort of nebulous continuum
yes. if it's not too much trouble, i'd like it if we could get to the point. if you are suggesting that secularism is a christian idea because it was influenced by christians and parts of the bible, then we could use that definition to include basically every thought to come out of the western world for nearly the last two thousand years.
>Things are sometimes older than the names for them are.
great.
>Pfft. Figure it out, Forrest.
yeah, i'm not exactly chomping at the bit to dedicate time deciphering the philosophic ramblings of an idiot without even knowing how it relates to the discussion at hand.
>i won an internet argument by saying i won
how will i ever recover :'(

AJJ aren't Christians. The members are on record as saying that they are apostate. Christianity isn't a race. You aren't born Christian. It doesn't stick with you for life. Christianity is a belief system. Once you stop believing in it, you're no longer a part of that community. It no longer belongs to you.

The current dominant Western culture is significantly anti-Christian and at best indifferent to Christianity. This album is one example. Christianity refers to a variety of subcultures that AJJ are no more a part of than they are part of the Black Israelites, or Deists, or Freemasons. Given their reasoning for changing their name, they're hypocrites.

I meant control of the White House

good luck with surviving for 8 years

Daily reminder Jeff Mangum doesn't own a hotel that serves neutral milk.

Daily reminder none of The Smiths' are called Smith.

Daily reminder The Front Bottoms is an all-male band.

Daily reminder all members of Teen Suicide are alive.

Daily reminder The Antlers are human beings, not antlers.

Daily reminder Modest Mouse are human beings, not a humble rodents.

Daily reminder Radiohead's members all have actual skulls, and not radios for heads.

Daily reminder The Cure isn't involved in any medical field and, as such, provides no cure for any illness.

Daily reminder The Shins do not utilize their shins in playing any of their instruments, nor are purely shins themselves.

When will these problematic bands stop using insincere names?

>if you are suggesting that secularism is a christian idea because it was influenced by christians and parts of the bible, then we could use that definition to include basically every thought to come out of the western world for nearly the last two thousand years.
You're starting to understand that Lewis quote now, aren't you?

>great.
So you recognize how absurd the following posts are in retrospect?
>yeah, i'm not exactly chomping at the bit to dedicate time deciphering the philosophic ramblings of an idiot without even knowing how it relates to the discussion at hand.
I'll give you a clue. Go back and read the Holyoake quote you posted. Then read the Lewis quote I posted. Then reread each. Print them out on construction paper of different colours and hold them side by side. This is called juxtaposition, a technique that will help you notice similarities and differences. Draw up a pair of lists comparing and contrasting the two quotes. Label each sentence with a cute sticker to help you concentrate. See if you can spot any connections.

This

>i won an internet argument by saying i won

I believe the other user was talking about the election, not our argument.

underrated post

>I meant control of the White House
well in that case, i won too, considering i voted trump lmao.
>good luck with surviving for 8 years
i'll be fine
i guess i'll ask again, considering you didn't actually give me a straight answer (although i'm 99.9% certain i already know the answer).
are you saying that because christian thinking influenced secularism, secularism is then a christian idea? because if so, you're fucking retarded.

The only post IIT that matters.

please link articles I'm not the guy u were arguing with and am interested in learning about your point of view

>i voted trump too lol!

I'm saying exactly what Lewis said, which goes quite a bit further than what you're 99.9% certain of.

I'm saying that you've swallowed the ideological equivalent of a parasite. While purporting to be a novel worldview created ex nihilo, your belief system instead derives whatever truth it holds entirely from the system of thought outside of itself that it claims to do away with, a value system that includes Christianity among other bodies of wisdom, and indeed all knowledge. No, I'm not saying that your worldview is influenced by Christianity and hence Christian. Quite the opposite. I'm saying it is a deformed, hobbled, and literally retarded mockery of traditional values that is too incompetent to be an actual inversion let alone an invention, a kind of lusus naturae that would die in nature, and should be killed out of mercy. The last thing I would call what lurks in your heart is "Christian."

>>The current dominant Western culture is significantly anti-Christian and at best indifferent to Christianity. This album is one example.
Except the entire western world is entirely based on christian values