Dont you think its possible that Littlefingers army came to winterfell as soon as they could...

Dont you think its possible that Littlefingers army came to winterfell as soon as they could, they were just a little late?

>Dont you think its possible that Littlefingers army came to winterfell as soon as they could, they were just a little late?

>implying the plan wasn't to let Boltons and Starks kill each other and weaken both of them.

apparently they were having a big orgy at moat cailin

If Littlefingers army had been there at the beginning of the fight, do you think they would have won fair and square?

They were following the timetable on his flight plan

No, Ramsay would have just retreated back inside the walls of Winterfell and prepped for a siege.

more like LF deliberately held off for the last second because he wants Jon dead

Definetly

>implying Jon would let Ramsay know about LF's army.

then wun wun would just open the gates and ramsay would be BTFO even harder

more like littlefinger is going to supply Jon with an army and make Jon his puppet so he can rise to power and become Jon's hand.

It was part of his plan

>more like littlefinger is going to supply Jon with an army and make Jon his puppet so he can rise to power and become Jon's hand.

Littlefinger is going to demand to marry Salsa

This puzzled me.

CIA's plan requires very precise timing - he shows up with his army AFTER Jon has got wrecked, but BEFORE Ramsay retreats back into Winterfell which would result in a long and costly seige. Also, he only knew to start marching North whenever he got Salsa's letter, so his timeline for movement is extremely tight.

I know Sup Forums loves the guy, but once again his plan worked on sheer luck, not political genius.

Probably, but that doesn't mean he can't do what I said.

>more like littlefinger is going to supply Jon with an army and make Jon his puppet so he can rise to power and become Jon's hand.

not Caosh enough

>Probably, but that doesn't mean he can't do what I said.

Jon would have absolutely no interest in the Iron Throne, so littlefinger would never get to be his hand. Jon is probably going to try to focus efforts on stopping the White Walkers

Jon dying only helps his plans, Jon stands in the way of Sansa inheriting Winterfell. there was no need for him to rush, even if he turned up after the battle at that would mean is that Ramsay's forces would be depleted and exhausted

>checking those quad trips

>I was trying to win the throne to save the kingdom, when I should have been trying to save the kingdom to win the throne.

Jon will be persuaded into becoming King after he finds his lineage, Tormund and Davos were hinting at it last episode.

If Jon becomes King he'll have a banner to unite westeros under and spread the word of the walkers.

Implying that wasn't Sansa's plan

I think it was Salsa's idea to wait.

>Jon stands in the way of Sansa inheriting Winterfell

?

John is a bastard, bastards have no rights when it comes to inheritance unless legitimised .

Good thing Jon is getting legitimized next episode.

Actually they were just a little early

Who can do that?

The northerners support him and he has Starks blood that's all that matt

A self proclaimed queen in the north

Rhaegar's will, or sansa if she becomes queen.

A big guy is never late,nor is he early he arrives precisely when he means to.

And probably hiding behind winterfells walls with winter on the way. It's not a great plan if that happens.

I hope she dies to be honest

Sansa had already sent him a letter in the previous episode, he was probably already on his way up north when Jon was asking her "When are we gonna have a bigger army?".

Sansa and Littlefinger were waiting for Jon Snow to die so Sansa could take Winterfell uncontested.

When Jon got trapped beneath the bodies Sansa and Littlefinger thought he fell in battle so they sent the Knights of the Vale in.

omg why didn't jhon listen to sansa and just wait what agisgusting cis white male with his mansplaining. ugh i mean it was so obvious why should sansa even have to explain herself?

I don't get why they'd do that though, they could spearhead Jon just like the anti-baratheon coalition spearheaded Bobby B.

Anyone noticed how many times they've used the "convenient entrance" card this season?

>Oh no, the night's watch are going to storm the building and kill the ones protecting Jon's body. But wait!

>Oh no we're surrounded by catapult boats raiding the city, we are so fucked! But wait!

>Oh no, we're against all odds in this battle, getting slaughtered one by one in this panic. Surely there's no hope for us now. But wait!

...

It was more frequent this season, but has happened many, many times throughout the run of the show. It's fucking tired. GRRM does it too, of course.

It's more Sansa than Littlefinger. Sansa is pissed that the people respect him more than her, and she wants to be Lord of Winterfell. It's also why she told Jon to just forget about Rickon when Ramsey revealed that he had him.

Littlefinger probably didn't know that was her intention, but he will next episode when he asks her to marry him and she says only if he kills Jon off like he did with Joffery.

kek

That's a pretty common trope in all of medieval and fantasy fiction. It heightens the drama and most of the time works pretty well. Sure it's dumb once you step back and analyse it, but it hasn't really bothered me so far in this show.

Nah, Sansa kept him on board the whole time. He knew she was gonna call him in at the right time.

Wtf didn't she guilt Jon into going to save rickon to begin with.
>Muh family

Littlefinger's conversation next episode is leaked

>Littlefinger: You know what I want...
>Sansa: You can not have me, no man can have me
>Littlefinger: My armies are large and vast where as yours is but 100 people one word from me and your home and bastard brother will be burnt to the ground
>Sansa: Sweet Robin would never allow it
>Littlefanger: Ay he is sweet not very bright, I will just tell him it was the umbers in their anger and he will give me the norf
>Littlefunger sees Sweet Robin
>Sansa: I know

Really? They've done it five times in big battles in this show alone. Blackwater, the fight at the wall, the fight in mereen and both fights at winterfell concluded with surprise cavalry charging in.

...

They were there from the start. It was Sansa's plan to wait. She knew Rickon was going to die. She also knew if Ramsay got even a hint that another army was coming, he would have changed his plans. So the plan was to wait until Ramsay thought he had won, then strike when the army was overconfident. She had no way of knowing that Jon's army would be encircled, she just knew that at some point it would be clear that Jon had lost.

The whole arc of Sansa's character has been about her becoming less naive and learning how to play the game from those around her. She learned that knowledge is power from Tyrion, to always keep your biggest trump card a secret (from Littlefinger) and to let people think they are going to win before you strike (from Ramsay).

Do you even watch the show?

Man you really overestimate the writers.

Trust me it isn't going to be nearly as deep as that. It's going to be "Hey Jon I went back to Littlefinger in the last minute to plead for his army".

You might be right.... but this is definitely the way her character has been portrayed since season 1. It would be nice if they actually had an appropriate pay off for her character.

Yes. Show-littlejon is a fair weather friend of the Boltons. If Jon had Littlefinger's army, Show Littlejon would have backed him, as would the Glovers. The only ones who would stick with the Boltons are the Karstarks

Then why was she still telling Jon to wait on the night before the battle? What if he had agreed to wait one more day. LF would have shown up the following day and Sansa would have some splainin to do.

Wun Wun only got the gate open because Ramsay's dudes weren't defending it. If all those archers didn't die earlier in the fight but instead had been defending the gate, there's no way it would fall.

>the way her character has been portrayed since season 1

No way. Sansa does whatever the plot needs her to do, which is usually whatever LF tells her. She is the least consistent of any main character.

Give it to me straight Sup Forums: Is Harrenhal back on the table?

Why didn't Wun Wun have a sword or a club?

I mean that other giant had a giant bow.

To be fair it happens even more often than that in regular skirmishes, not just the large battles. The most recent one I remember is when Theon and Sansa escape Ramsay and get saved by Brianne out of sudden. Shit happens all the time, but you don't really notice it when watching it. There's probably a ton more examples but I can't remember it all at this point.

I meant that they were building towards this..... Not that she has been some master gameplayer all along.

Speculation. If the Starks knew they had a siege on hand they could use many methods to improve Wun Wun's odds of reaching the gate. Wooden armor, a feint attack - virtually anything would still be more effective than a battle in which almost all of them die. It's present-ism to say otherwise.

I shuppose.

Marrying Ramsay was the final straw for me. Sansa was a retard before, but waltzing into your enemies' castle with no back up and no plan takes the cake. Nobody marries into their enemies to get revenge. it's not feudal politics, it's not even common sense.
If she needed to be raped to understand that this was a bad idea, there is no possible way of organically turning the character into a master schemer.

And using her behavior at winterfell as an example of how she has developed is crazy. because none of that made sense either.

I'm afraid so. It's actually too big a castle 4 u.

I don't disagree.....

From the earlier seasons you can see it was the intention (probably in the books as well, but I haven't read them). They went astray with her (and several other characters) in season 4 and 5, but it looks like they're trying to rein in the characters now.

Robb legitimised him

I'm dubious about the "Sansa wanted Jon and Rickon dead" theory because withholding the information about LF coming soon supports it, but telling Jon not to attack anyway doesn't.

Plus, I don't want to see her turn into a total bitch. She's clearly not that in the books.

You're forgetting that Jon's a bastard, and he had also taken the vows of the Night's Watch. Even if his vows were nullified by him dying and coming back, the only way he can be lord of Winterfell is to be legitimized by Sansa. Not only that, but it's unlikely that everyone in the North would want him in charge because he deserted the Night's Watch. Sansa would also gain nothing and lose everything if she married Littlefinger, because then it would be him as lord of Winterfell.

What was his political reason for bringing the army of the Vale to help Jon? Jon and Sansa are defying the Iron Throne, Ramsay (presumably) is a Warden of The North under King Tommen. Littlefinger is officially a loyalist, that brought the Vale into the fold of Iron Throne.

So, does it mean that Littlefinger is in open rebellion now? How does he hope to hold the Vale and Riverlands then, as before this battle his authority over them came from the king? What is his master plan here, if we omit Sansa's pussy?

I think since all the vale knights sat out the whole war of the five kings, he pretty much has a fresh army(apart from the few knights that died in the bolton fight), and all the other southern houses are ravaged since the previous wars. Plus Edmure Tully's army and Dorne are already against the Lannisters. So it's the Tyrells(who hate the Lannisters), the Lannisters and whatever remains of the Baratheons(?) against the rest, excluding minor houses which exist on both sides.

Might not be such a bad gamble after all.

>Littlefinger tells that Tully kid he ought to help Sansa
>Littlefinger tells Sansa he's soliciting help from the Vale
>wow isn't it "convenient" that the army Littlefinger had promised for the entire season was finally delivered?

If we didn't see any of the Littlefinger scenes you'd be right. Similarly with Dany returning to Mereen, we literally saw her with the Dothrakis and then she flew off BEFORE the masters returned to Mereen, so we knew that she'd make it back.

No she didn't. She did the opposite. She specifically said not to do what Ramsey wants and she specifically said it was 100% impossible to get Rickon back, since he is the heir to Winterfell and the only one whose existence challenges Ramsey's ownership of Winterfell.

When did that happen? When Stannis came to the Nightswatch he offered to legitimize Jon because Jon was (and is) still a bastard.