Why were they guarding Lyanna? Why did Ned have to fight and kill his way to see his own sister?

Why were they guarding Lyanna? Why did Ned have to fight and kill his way to see his own sister?

I keep thinking about how all those great warriors died for nothing.

They didn't want Ned to kill the Targaryan kid, but Ned had no intent to anyway.

They were protecting who they believed to be the rightful heir as ordered by their Prince.

Because they promised Rhaegar to protect her and the Child, the baby was his after all and very likely to be killed since it was a Targ

They were guarding her and the baby so robert didnt have them killed, it does seem weird they wouldnt let her brother see them though. They probably fought them because they were pissed they killed all their friends

That card...

Rhaegar Targaryen ran off with Lyanna Stark.
Rhaegar tasked his 3 kingsguard to guard Lyanna and Lyannas baby. The new GoT episode confirms it is his baby.
Arthur Dayne is Rhaegars best friend.
Kingsguard normally guard the king or the heir.
Aerys = dead, Rhaegar = dead, Jon = not dead

wait so is Jon like in line for the throne? Where exactly? Or is he a bastard anyway because he's out of wedlock?

Bastard's still have claims to the throne.

>muh honor

That's it. Or Rhaegar wasn't aware of how much of an honorfag Ned was.

He isn't. If he isn't a bastard he's as good as one because any alleged wedding between Rhaegar and Lyanna was never witnessed or officially recognized, hence there's no way to prove it happened, hence he's effectively a bastard regardless.

Ergo he isn't in line and never will be.

So the redditors could get a badass dual wielding swordfight

I mean it was cool

No they don't you twat, that's what it means to be a bastard. Being a bastard means you have ZERO claim to anything. You are not owed shit. Only if your father legitimizes you as his true son and lets you take the family name will you be allowed to inherit anything.

He is the song of ice and fire. No memeing.
The prince that was promised. Literally "promise me ned"

He will unite stark and targaryen when Daenerys arrives. She is his aunt.

Even if he had heard about it he could scarcely be expected to believe just how committed to honor he is. He's practically inhumanly honorable.

Could Howland Reed show up and reveal Jon's true heritage? No one would believe a frogman from the Neck, but what if he's got a letter or some shit from Ned?

Then why was it such a big deal killing all of Robert Baratheon's bastard children, and the same for Targaryon children?

do we know for sure Reed is even alive?

So there's no chance to legitimize them. As long as they are alive there's a chance they can be legitimized. The bastards aren't really a threat anymore because there's nobody left to make them legitimate. House Baratheon is basically defunct now.

And really, most noble bastards don't get more than a comfy position in their lord father's household guard, if they're very lucky and he's generous. What Ned did for Jon Snow was exceptional and even controversial, he actually raised him in his own household as a son. Some thought this extremely tactless and insulting to his wife, but on the other hand they thought it was uncommonly generous for a nobleman to give so much to somebody he owed nothing to by all the laws of the land.

We don't know for sure but he's definitely alive. He sent off Mira and Jojen and no one fucks with the bog people of the neck. It's been stated in the background that the Iron Born couldn't even find Howland's main castle let alone last long in his territory due to guerilla warfare and brutal attrition maximizing environment.

I'm guessing it's cuz having a false Baratheon and king born of wincest is even worse than putting one of Robert's bastards on the throne. It's also less trouble dealing with 20+ claimants than Robert's two Baratheon brothers

Anyways Cercei was the one that wanted them dead and she's just a craycray bitch that probably didn't want to be reminded of Robert's philandering.

He's the child of House Stark and House Targaryan.

The problem was if Robert found out he could have Cersei and her bastards executed and then marry somebody else, and in the mean time legitimize one of his existing bastard children as an heir.

Jon Cunningham was Rhaegar's best friend.

Nobody knows that. As far as everybody is concerned he's Ned Stark's bastard, and as a bastard he's not owed anything. His targaryen lineage is a secret known to maybe 3 living people (they're different in the show and books), he himself is ignorant of it, so he continues to live as Ned Stark's bastard.

Yeah but if the baby is a fucking stark too then there is no way ned would harm it or allow anyone else to harm it, thus causing a rebellion within a rebellion.

Ned should have nutted up and sided with the targs at that point in order to protect the true heir which had stark blood family before bros. This is a major plothole imo.

Jon was legitimized, as Lyanna was likely wed by Rhaegar, or at least he was all that was left.

He stationed them there to defend his heir, not being able to predict Ned would find him or go on to shelter him.

Thus, Azor Jon Stark Targaryen, king of Valyria and the seven kingdoms, is the true savior of mankind.

>true heir
Except he was still a bastard. A royal bastard, but a bastard all the same. Since nobody could prove Lyanna and Rhaegar were married.

Bran could

Find out next season when our whacky Sam the Fat Cuck finds some documents in the Library of Knowledge that changes the whole world..... in 1 book

how, projecting his mind on a screen?

>Lyanna was likely wed by Rhaegar,
Unless you can produce witnesses, exceptionally credible witnesses, to prove this, he'll remain a bastard even if they were married in 7 different religions blessed by the physical incarnation of R'hllor himself.

>guys they were married, I saw it when I traveled to the past in my dreams
>also I'm a three eyed crow, kakawww!
Yes, Bran is a very credible person who they will absolutely believe.

Bastard or not, he is King in the North, he controls everything north of the Neck. Danny controls the south already. She will marry Jon to have two forces. Mark my words.

wait it's rhaegar's child? does that mean daenerys is jon snow's aunt?

If the writer wills it, people will not question it.

This is the same mythos where a woman burns half a city down and goes from hated by literally everyone to the unquestioned queen.

Yeah but that has fuck all to do with how legitimate his claim is and everything to do with him as a person and the army he commands. They're going with him because he's "stark enough" for the North right now.

In the books Dany is still hated by pretty much everybody. Or at least the number of people who hate her far outnumbers those who respect her. Even half the people who respect her are likely just faking it out of fear or greed.

Doesn't matter if he's a bastard. Ned should have sided with his blood against robert. The guards should have told ned what was going on and may have actually swayed him with diplomacy.

>protect your ROYAL NEPHEW and swear your allegiance to your sister the queen.

I feel like they should have fucking TRIED at least.

>le fat man finds secret records in a giant hall filled with thousands upon thounds of manuscripts, records, and notes each filled with at least 1000 pages.
>no card catalog, no metadata google searches

Aw seven hells damn it Dabid!

I always thought Lyanna would be lying on the ground alone, not in a bed surrounded by handmaidens.

yup

He didn't know that Lyanna was pregnant until after the battle.
And as far as the Kingsguard was concerned, Ned was a commander in the rebel army and a major enemy. Ned and Robert had gone too far to turn back and were overthrowing the Targaryen rule. Kingsguard would have wanted the heir to the Targaryens to stay in the hands of the throne.

user, this is not a plothole at all. Ned fights rebellion because the rebs believed Lyanna was abducted, including Ned's father who rode to Kings Landing to demand her return and then Ned's older brother who died on the orders of the Mad King in a brutal way trying to prevent his Father dying in a shit way as well. Ned loves his sister and family and he loved Robert. This was the one smart thing he did that compromised honor. Why fight against a man you put on the throne to defend a child born from your family when he also comes from the family whose patriarch tried to wipe out you and the rest of your kin? Why kill the child when your dying sister that you love asks you to take care of him? This was a real grey zone for Ned because he is either a kin slayer by turning in Jon or he is a traitor because he would defy Robert Baratheon a chance to kill a Targaryen thats an even huger deal than Viserys and Daenerys. This is the perfect middle road where he cannot win by doing what is expected of him so he adapts to retain his honor, keep his kin alive and keep Robert on the throne after he helped put him there. Everyone wins at his expense.The only thing I can think of thats close to a plothole is why Ned let Jon join the nights watch. Sure Starks have manned the wall since day 1, but sending him off to live with bastards, thieves, rapists isn't taking care of him.Then again, why bring his daughters with him to a city where a faction of the side he joined in the civil war looted and destroyed much of the city? Hes not good on decisions but as far as his honor takes him, lying proved to be the right and honorable thing to do and somehow, against all Stark odds, turned out to be a smart decision as well.

>Unless you can produce witnesses, exceptionally credible witnesses

Bran and/or Howland Reed
The former would be key in convincing Sansa (Given that he's heading south and the episode made it clear that there's going to be a whole subplot of Littlefinger steering Sansa against Jon)
Howland may have physical proof and has been hiding in the Neck for decades

Wait so Jon s ow is really the Targaryans kid?

Always thought Ned was jons actual dad

ironic or not stop shitposting

Pretty sure Howland Reed only knows Jon is Rhaegars child, not if Rhaegar married Lyanna or not.

Howland Reed knows and has proof

Howland Reed has proof of it. Screenshot this faggot

If there was any sort of evidence, it would probaby have been at the tower with Lyanna. And Ned - being so high profile - probably wouldn't keep it. It would be pretty safe in Howland's Moving Castle, though.
Or buried in Lyanna's crypt or something who knows
I don't even know how their marriage works, if there'd be a certificate or rings or whatever

why did jon's hand burn in season 1 if he is a targ

The blood of the dragon hadn't been awakened yet

They were there to keep her from leaving. Lyanna was clearly raped still. She just clearly saw Jon as her own son and wanted to save him.

I am so confused by this flashback thingy.

So that baby is Jon. Who is that mother? Neds sister? what? more sister fucking, or is Ned not Jons father.


I'm confused.

not all targ's have this ability? Viscereys burned like fuck despite being a targ

thank you for this response. This is what I was thinking and I'm glad somebody replied thoughtfully to our retarded friend, OP

Probably because he is only half Targaryen
Dany is pure Targ (Albeit slightly diluted with Arryn blood and Martell blood from the last couple hundred years)
His claim still comes before hers, though

Rhaegar Targaryen. You know, Kelly C's brother that was killed by Robert during the rebellion.

Fucking showfags, no wonder they are dumbing down the show with every passing season.

Confirms Ned is not Jon's father.

At the same time confirms he's the son of his sister and Raegar.

Something people have literally theorized about for 20 fucking years.

*Arryn, Dayne, Martell, and Blackwood blood. Forgot a couple
Viserys II also married someone outside the family but she was still of Valyrian descent so still not straying far

Maybe they shouldn't have had her hang out in a big tower guarded by a bunch of the most recognizable motherfuckers in the seven kingdoms...

They aren't fireproof in the books, and further magic awakening.


Also Ned could have avoided this whole issue if he declared himself King of Westeors.

Keep in mind that the Tully's would have followed the Starks regardless, and that Arryn liked Ned more than Robert, Dorne would have sided with Ned if he intended to make Jon king, so even if Robert would have a problem (no he wouldn't have, hell he might have even resented Ned a little for not becoming king and leaving it to him) he couldn't have done shit.

Wait who are the 3 who would know?

Benjen, Howland Reed, ???

I mean granted if you reread the flashbacks it is said "they" found Ned holding Lyanna so Howland had someone else with him.

It was only Ned and Howland in the books.

LYANNA WAS RAPED AND KIDNAPPED YOU GUCKING IDIOTS. Do you honestly think Rhaegar didn't know exactly what would happen when he rode off with a member of a powerful family that is in a super alliance with four other powerful families? He knew what he got himself into, he purposely made it so Lyanna couldn't communicate with them and was hidden enough so she would give birth. Eventually she caught on if it wasn't s kidnapping from the beginning so he kept his best friends there to prevent her from leaving or contacting anyone. You all underestimate how much of a delusional piece of shit Rhaegar was.

What about aegon and his sis

Ned taking the throne would be even worse. Robert is a Baratheon, descendant of Aegon the conquerer's bastard brother- giving him blood of the Dragon and a very loose claim to the throne. Ned had no such blood ties, he pledged himself to King Robert and would never have betrayed him- no matter his odds of victory or defeat. Character and Logic dictate that Ned would never take the throne from Robert or Aerys because he has no right to the iron throne at all, he would lose support and the respect of the lords of westeros because they wouldnt find the story of him avenging and protecting his family as believable as a power-hungry Northerner who seized an opportunity for power. House Tully would be more likely to side with Ned and maybe House Arryn while Jon Arryn was still alive, best case scenario. Lannisters would side with Robert, as Tywin wanted cersei to become Queen one way or another and Ned isn't a bachelor at this point like Robert was. Dorne would NOT side with Ned since the Martells blamed Lyanna for Elia Martell's rape and death for seducing her husband, Prince Rhaegar. They would most likely just secede with the Reach. The Reach would probably join eventually if Ned found his Targaryen nephew and then seat him, but then the succession would change to be Starks taking over instead of Targaryen. SO the question is which makes more sense, Ned denying the Throne to himself and upholding his honor by staying loyal to his closest friend, ally and brother from the battlefield, or is he a power hungry man who would take the throne from Robert? The latter is unlikely going to give his nephew the throne before his own son so if anything, the Reach would fight independently to put Jon Snow on the throne and maybe get help from Dorne but Dorne is and forever will be salty over Elia so good luck with that.

>This is a major plothole imo.
Do you even know what a plothole is?

Why couldnt they talk their problems

fucking hell

Calm down autist

>Do you even know what a plothole is?

People not knowing what an actual plot hole is triggers me.

Argon is learning how to fuck biches, take names, and get rich as fuck with Jon Connington and The Golden Company.

Rhaella got murked by Armory Lorch while The Mountain was riding Ellia Martell to an early grave.

CONNINGTON

BECAUSE JON ISBA DAYNE TOO.

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE