only really tolerable for me in his prime, though. his diction got extremely shitty from the late 50s and on, and it was never that great anyway.
Chase Collins
lads, can one learn anything from Music Theory online courses?
Jayden Hill
My favourite Winterreise
Angel Morgan
What are the most awesome collections of classical music? I really miss when what.cd was around, you could just go download whatever collection you wanted when there was the freeleech.
I have NPR top 50, deutsche grammophon: the originals - legendary recordings (volumes 1 & 2), deutsche grammophon collectors edition 111 year anniversary (55 CD), of course the Sup Forums classical thread downloads, the glenn gould original jacket collection.
Then of course I download everything I could download myself, and a bunch of collages from what.cd which will never be seen again.
Jack Evans
youtube.com/watch?v=iCNl7FJg8ds Just watched this. Performances and some background story on Thomas Quasthoff. It is long, though.
Jayden Foster
anything that sounds like Bloodborne ost?
Charles Young
flicking through the soundtrack on youtube, it sounds like a general pastiche of Mahler, Bruckner, Strauss and early Schoenberg. You might enjoy Wagner too.
Bentley Jackson
Is there actually a giant leap in complexity between the works of Mozart and Wagner or have I only been listening to classical for a few weeks?
Lucas Allen
>when you download a boxset of 9 CDs and they all are without id3 tag
David Ross
I tag all my music myself anyway, so it never bothers me
Nolan Powell
Post Scriabin
Nathan Lee
>1. Martinu Opinion discarded. Fuck off poly.
Aiden Wood
What are the most awesome collections of classical music? I really miss when what.cd was around, you could just go download whatever collection you wanted when there was the freeleech.
I have NPR top 50, deutsche grammophon: the originals - legendary recordings (volumes 1 & 2), deutsche grammophon collectors edition 111 year anniversary (55 CD), of course the Sup Forums classical thread downloads, the glenn gould original jacket collection.
Then of course I download everything I could download myself, and a bunch of collages from what.cd which will never be seen again.
Christopher Roberts
Wagner benefits from Berlioz and others' advancements in orchestration (writing music specific to individual instruments for thematic or timbral effect) as well as half a century of development in tonal language.
That being said I'm glad there's no Mozart with full Romantic chromaticism
Christian Ross
rutracker has a number of collections, but collections can be quite prescriptive; it's often more fun to build up using smaller, more tailored recordings instead of just getting a big box set
>Is there actually a giant leap in complexity between the works of Mozart and Wagner Yes.
Liam Torres
Is he right? I'm just a pleb
Dylan Miller
1. Stravinsky I don't care about the rest
Jacob Gomez
I'd say so, I never got much out of that recording either.
Kleiber isn't bad, but he's been anointed as God by people who never heard Furtwangler.
Lucas Kelly
he's right about it not being a very great recording, but he's wrong in regards to the reasons.
Kleiber is probably the most overrated conductor ever ... on the basis of his studio recordings.
his live recordings make a better case for his reputation. but, unfortunately, amongst the live recordings that he have, there's kind of a limited repertoire.
Nathaniel Hall
I'd say his Beethoven 5 and Brahms 4 are certainly up there with the best, even if I prefer Toscanini and Furtwangler respectively.
Kleiber isn't anywhere near the worst conductor to be promoted. His New Year's Concerts are quite good.
Nathan Baker
my god I hate 20th century the only thing I hate more is the 19th century
Bentley Reyes
Bach Mozart Haydn
romantics need not apply
Asher Long
both his Beethoven 5 and Brahms 4 are much better in their respective live recordings imo, especially the BPO Brahms 4 which is probably the only recording which really matches Furt in intensity.
his Brahms 4 studio recording is, for me, probably his most disappointing recording.
the biggest reason why most of his studio recordings are disappointments is because of how garbage the sound quality is. typical DG overmiking and shitty spotlighting -- listen to any live recording of Kleiber and you have a much, much better idea of what his balances and dynamics were like, and they sometimes sound worlds away from his studio versions.
>Kleiber isn't anywhere near the worst conductor to be promoted i don't think so either, but his reputation in certain circles borders on the obscene.
Nolan Perez
Mein Gott Baroque-kun, what a pleb you are.
Gavin Johnson
>his reputation in certain circles borders on the obscene Which circles? Even here, it's mostly overly patriotic Austrians that fawn over him. Carlos Kleiber is a good conductor. I don't think his reputation exceeds his ability.
He's wrong. The snappy take on Schubert's 3rd in that recording is great. Not "Schubertian" my ass. The 3rd is a Pastoral-like symphony. Playful and full of whimsical motifs. Haverstock can suck it.
Blake Robinson
>Which circles? i must've read a dozen polls from big magazines and websites by now that have him as the #1 conductor.
>I don't think his reputation exceeds his ability. neither do i
Juan Brooks
The 8th is a dull affair though. I'm not sure who's best in it, but it sure ain't Kleiber.
Michael King
I only skimmed the review (actually, I just read two lines in the middle paragraph and took note of the two star rating). Didn't notice the review is mostly about the 8th. Definitely not the best interpretation of that symphony. Carlos went for the same snappy, high variance interpretation as with the 3rd, but the 8th isn't a good fit for such a take. It's more solemn, with slower, more deliberate developments I like Krips and the Wiener for Schubert's 8th far above the Kleiber combo.
But 2 stars for the whole album? No way. 3 - 3.5 more like. And really, what the heck is "schubertian" supposed to mean?
Jackson Gutierrez
Actually, "solemn" is the wrong description. It's more "serious", more "elegant", less "pretty".
Ethan Brooks
>And really, what the heck is "schubertian" supposed to mean?
Sadboy
Daniel Stewart
>what the heck is "schubertian" supposed to mean? it means, "whatever i think schubert is supposed to be like"
Levi Campbell
Böhm and Monteux are also great for Schubert's 8th. (I'm really partial to the Wiener Philharmoniker.)
Let me expound on that a little: it depends on what level you want to understand music theory, from which perspective and to what ends. In general, various online courses work well enough as an introduction into the topic. For things like staff notation they're as good a source as any.
For example, one of my favourite books on music theory is Guerino Mazzola's "The Topos of Music" since it combines two of my favourite subjects (music and category theory) but it's a very abstract take on music that wouldn't be of much use to most (aspiring) musicians. I also enjoyed reading books written by composers about their own subject, like Messiaen's "Technique de mon langage musical". Some of the old classics are still the best for their subject, like Fux's "Gradus ad Parnassum" for counterpoint. Haydn, Mozart, and Beethoven studied from it.
So, why do you want to study music theory?
Nicholas Ross
I never knew there was a live Kleiber Brahms 4. Thanks a lot!
>both his Beethoven 5 and Brahms 4 are much better in their respective live recording isn't that true of almost any performance? most studio recordings are too overworked to the point of being stale. the best way to listen to music is live anyway. don't cheap out anons.
Joseph Gutierrez
>the best way to listen to music is live anyway by the way, what concerts/recitals is /classical/ going to next month?
Cooper Wright
In the age of Reiner, Kna, Ormandy, Kondrashin, Solti, Barbirolli, Toscanini, Furtwangler, Klemperer, etc...just throwing out random names, the list is enormous, that was a fucking golden time.
Now? Who is there? I ain't hauling my ass out to see Dudamel. Even the ones I like are well past their prime.
Andrew Walker
No, he isn't.
Jordan Hernandez
Why?
Christopher Cox
>not having a subscription to your local small city (and somewhat shitty) philharmonic just to support the culture faggot, if you're one of those assholes crying about how classical music is dying I'm going to pop open a vein from rage
Hunter Gutierrez
Perhaps I'm at odds with everyone but I hate the overly Romanticized approach of Classicism that slows everything down in pursuit of the solemn. Having performed the 8th I'm with Kleiber in its pace.
Matthew Brooks
People blame things like the retarded plebs and rap obsessed public for the decline in classical but maybe it is classical fans worshiping the golden days that is killing it.
Isaiah Roberts
I played in my local small city (and somewhat shitty) symphony for years until the conductor died.
Classical music isn't dying, it's being strangled by retarded 'musicologists' pushing their theoretical tripe.
Well that's too bad, the whole point of recording is setting examples for future generations to follow and learn from.
Are you going to blame Homer for your furry sex novels not selling well?
Landon Allen
Classical music isn't dying at all, stop the meme ing.
Yeah it's no longer the people's only option, so unnecessary chaff will be done away with. That doesn't mean the form is dead or dying.
Benjamin Young
Even for something like Schubert's 8th or 9th symphonies? Or Beethoven? (Not talking so much about the slowing down of the tempo, but about "drawing outside the lines" with rubato and extra instruments in the orchestra.)
Are you a HIPster?
Jace Price
>anyone who doesn't share my shitty opinions is the same person!! That's really pathetic you know that? The problem with classical concertos is that they're too repetitive and they lack flare; almost formulaic. The problem with romantic concertos is that they're too long and droll. The good parts are seconds long and wedged between long boring orchestral segments that does nothing but link one theme to another.
Daniel Johnson
I'm fairly particular with my HIP. On and off. When it comes to the large orchestral works I agree more. When it comes to Chamber works I'm almost completely opposed.
Dylan Gonzalez
HIP Schubert is best
Robert Roberts
>The problem with classical concertos is that they're too repetitive This coming from the guy who reveres Vivaldi is comedy gold.
Dominic Morris
t. Stravinskyboo
Michael Reyes
>droll
Ayden Jenkins
Are you memeing is that legit good? I don't want to get memed.
Grayson Ramirez
HIPsterism is nothing but a fogey meme.
Ethan Sanders
I like it, shut up with memes.
Jack Allen
I think it's fine for Baroque but for classical composers it's dubious, sometimes works but mostly they don't.
Andrew Young
Stravinsky is the opposite of repetitive, Baroque-kun.
Angel Williams
>doesn't know that I was referring to what Stravinsky said about Vivaldi (which is wrong, by the way) >hates HIP even when applied to proper eras that need it >he's a retard Checks out.
Wyatt Ward
HIP in instruments for Classicism is nigh unforgivable I will say.
Jaxon Myers
Wow, HIPsterism is old enough to be wrong generationism now I guess.
Carson Walker
I have yet to be convinced by any academic 'reconstruction' of a classical piece, how the hell would they friggin' discern the physical movements and rhythms of people who died 200 years ago?!
The whole thing is just a retarded exercise in larping. Might as well tell us how what positions Napoleon nailed Josephine in. I'm not against scholarship, but any attempt at dictating what is the 'right way' to play anything can go fuck off.
Angel Clark
>Vivaldi >not repetitive
Sebastian Perez
Immerseel is one of the better HIPsters.
that Schubert is interpreted pretty well, but your mileage may vary on the instruments. in particular i didn't like the sound of the brass too much -- it's the same issue that i had with his Beethoven cycle, it's a bit too hollow for me.
Daniel King
It was never about the 'right way' it was simply researching the time the score was made rather than just relying on the score. But it got the old guard of conductors and listeners butthurt as they felt chastised for being wrong and they apparently still haven't got over that butthurt.
Jonathan Gutierrez
Also >HIP >ever needed Define "need" you faggot.
Ethan Barnes
The retarded limp-dicked flaccid post-Wagnerian Romantic interpretation and the big-band orchestration of chamber baroque works sucks ass.
Jason Peterson
Not him and I agree that Vivaldi isn't great, but he made some good points. Baroque-shit has some similar repetitive trends, like those trills at the end of bars, and the playing a few notes and then playing the same pattern but starting from a lower note. But I still find it superior to the periods after.
>The good parts are seconds long and wedged between long boring orchestral segments This is the main issue I have with music from the classical and romantic periods. Also too many instruments playing similar notes.
Ian Perry
> it got the old guard of conductors and listeners butthurt as they felt chastised for being wrong No, it annoys me because it sounds like shit. To hell with period instruments and technology hating luddites who fetishise about >muh winds with no keys >muh brasses with no valves >muh violin bows that loosen up when pressed on the string etc etc etc
Jaxson Peterson
Post some good HIP
Dominic Price
You're stuck in a rut where the only thing you really grok is melody and can't parse musical development. Sorry to break it to you, but you don't really "get" Baroque music either.
Stick to popular songs.
Joseph Martinez
I've considered that maybe I'm just a classical newfag whose tastes will mature later. So maybe in a few years I'll join you in posting >MUH COUNTERPOINT and such.
Caleb Perry
It's an ancient Calcium meme but Il Giardino redeems Vivaldi
Ryan Allen
you can be HIP and not utilize period instruments
Carson Cook
>Il Giardino The Onofri-Antonini combo is good, but I find their interpretation of Vivaldi's cello concertos with Coin lacking.
