How old were you when you realized there was no evidence for a deity?

How old were you when you realized there was no evidence for a deity?

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Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

Yes, it is.

14

Probably like 9. But that's the point of faith, when you're in a situation like .

Liberal education everyone

No it's not. No one has found evidence of big foot, but that doesn't strictly say he isn't real.

I translate faith literally to gullibility. Religion is the one subject that allows conservatives to get emotional and ignore reason.

if a tree falls in the woods but no one is around does it make a sound

checkmate athiest

kek, no it isn't

Consider this:
A mathemetician is setting out to prove some theorem. At this point in time, the thorem has yet to be proven true. Say after a year, he figures out a proof. Now, during the year when there was no proof, was the thorem true or false?

>muh religion is used to control

Nice meme.

>No one has found evidence of big foot
There are evidence of big foot but all are inconclusive

You don't need evidence, everybody knows that God Exists, Romans 1:18-20

I feel warm inside while praying, that good evidence for me

14ish? How ever old I was at my Confirmation (I was Catholic).

10
there is no evidence that a rock with my name on it doesnt orbits the sun. doesnt mean there is one

Since I was conceived. DAY 1 BABY, miss me on that fake shit.

for citing the bible, first prove bible is true please

your very existence.

No how Christians define faith, but a professed Atheist just couldn't understand in their world view.

As compared to what - your non-education?

Yes, yes it is. Absence of the evidence of big foot means that you have no proper means to verify the claim and must reject it. It doesn't mean evidence can't be presented later but it's not something that can be accepted.

Consider this:
A mathemetician is setting out to prove some theorem. At this point in time, the thorem has yet to be proven true. People act as if it's true because they have faith in it. Wars are fought over which version of the theorem is correct. People shitpost on Sup Forums on whether the theorem is correct. Say proof is never found. Now, during the thousands, and likely infinite, years when there was no proof, was the theorem true or false?
Does it matter?

Okay we are both going into this with differing assumptions, so before we can get to that, we have to meet at a common ground, how do you define truth?

wut?

When I was 8 or 9. In church they were talking about how god was infinite and all powerful. Then they were talking about how god was in an eternal battle with the devil. It didn't make sense to me that an all powerful being could be "battling" something that he made. He could end it with a thought, but he doesn't. That's where the cracks in the foundation of my faith formed.

>Religion is the one subject that allows conservatives to get emotional and ignore reason.
So is race.

I get organized religion is trash poo poo garbage, but a general lack of evidence for a proposition is still not a conclusive proof for that proposition being false.

It would be a worse meme if religion wasn't used to control people.

I don't really care how Christians define faith as they believe things without evidence. Maybe they should stop using their 'hearts' and start using their brains.


Until the theorem was proven you would incorrect to accept it.

Not only do I not know that one or multiple deities exist but it seems to go against everything we know in nature.

> I feel warm inside while praying, that good evidence for me

Ah liberal logic.

Then i am gonna say that theres gonna be proof in the future that Jesus(if he ever existed, which i highly doubt) was gay, what now?

Yes, because sound is just the recording of certain wavelengths.

>Until the theorem was proven you would incorrect to accept it.

It's also incorrect to assume it is false.

what about fine tuning?

You can not disprove that an alien named Bob created the universe, doesnt mean its true.

Pretty young, actually. Around 12 or so. But then I realized 15 years later that I was wrong.

Okay Read the verse i gave you, what is your problem with it,

What fine tuning? We arent fine tunned, we have blind spots in vision and we can choke on food because we breath through the same pipe we eat. There are a lot of fails in your gods fine tuning then

It's in a state of 'nothingness.' Unicorns, pixies and Christian deities could all "be true" but without evidence we have nothing but a big zero.

then I'd challenge you to actually prove that. Until you do, we can't conclusively say if Jesus was a homosex or not. Based on the bible, I'd say he wasn't, but that's not exactly evidence.

Before reading it you need to prove the bible is true. You cant use Harry Potter book to prove its truth

That it's not true. I have no reason to think deities are real and claiming we already know is basically throwing a temper tantrum.

>God is a metaphor for that which transcends all levels of intellectual thought. It's as simple as that.

God is within us. God is a human creation that represents our inner potential.

Look into Joseph Campbell, he will change the way you think about spirituality.

First prove that bible is true. By the way, i was referring to his argument that there may be some arguments for it in the future.

I love you, friendo

highly unlikely, but I can't write it off.
more of a state of unknown rather than zero.

>not exactly evidence
can't you read?

It is also incorrect to state that it is true. This makes it unfalsifiable, which essentially makes it a useless proposition.

yes, the point is you have to be agnostic about it.

Have you read it still, before we move on. Ill provide it to you.

Roman 1:18-20
18 The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.

so just to start off, me and you both have a differing world view each with our own assumptions of the world, so we will have to make a common ground before we can reason anything. lets start with how do you define Truth

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

just a argument i saw when i was going though some videos
youtube.com/watch?v=UjGPHF5A6Po

No, you don't. Following that, you don't know anything in life

>edgelord detected

youtube.com/watch?v=01uqLpLkHvY

It is a shit argument, and there are many more like that

okay we have differing world views that would make reasoning difficult, so we have to meet at common grounds, give me your definition of truth.

It's a pretty common argument. Of course, it's also a really bad one.

About 9.

Definitely looped back into it until I hit puberty though, then got right back out.

I know that I have perception. I know I can interact with the world. I know that 100/100 times if I were to drop a pen I would percieve that it falls to the ground.

Someone's buttmad

the truth : the real facts about something : the things that are true

Its irrelevant for me.

I just know one thing, jews and muslims are more dangerous than Christians.

And eastern religions are bat shit insane.

Um, so what's you point?

Not at all, the entire thing should be ignored until more information is available. Religion, however, assumes that there is and makes predictions and actions on this assumption. Which is wrong, as this prediction is based on nothing.
It isn't like a regular prediction, like where a goalkeeper has too guess where the free kick is gonna go. There are set parameters there. He has to aim for the goal, so you have set parameters with the variable being WHERE in the goal he's aiming for. The religious prediction, however, is nothing but a variable. It's like trying to guess the exact number of people on a street from another country.

Would you agree to the definition that which corresponds to reality?

How do you guys differ between scientology, christianity, islam and every single religion that has ever existed? How do i know Christianity is true?

We were discussing the case of a proposition which has yet to be proved. There are loads of propositions which have been proved true. In the case of a proposition which has not yet been proven nor disproven, one musn't assume it is true or false.

I guess, yeah, never really thought about that. Not ones personal reality, but the ultimate reality

>mfw I was raised without religion so don't have all these weird hang ups about god always watching me, being guilty about my own thoughts, letting down my parents, ect that every other human on earth seems to have

Thats not how the world works, pal
If you claim something, you need evidence for it and im yet to see the evidence for god. I can claim a lot of absurd things that cant be disproven, doesnt mean they are true

How old were you when you realized that the creation of the universe doesn't make any sense without it?

Could you also address this?

How do you know that?

we are discussing the existence of evidence of a general deity, not one specified by a religion. A lot of claims religions make are baseless, I will agree with you there.

If you believe in a God, you ought to be a deist such that you aren't constrained by religious dogma.

Yes, everyone has their own reality that could be copetely warped to the true reality, like you could have a mental illness were you look at flowers and think their blue, but in reality they are red. So in your world view, i assume atheism/agnosticism, can you be ultimately sure that your not a crazy person looking at the flowers in the wrong reality?

9-10ish

15 when I realized the importance of having one.

>creation of the universe
>creation
How do you know it was created?
>inb4 big bang

+1

Campbell did a fantastic job of rehabilitating religion for our modern age, amplifying all the spiritual benefits while removing all the baggage that made the religion struggle with rationalism and naturalism.

I ssomewhat did here

You weren't wrong. You just gave up on yourself and let yourself become complacent as your life turned to shit.

Well flowers are much different from what we are talking about. I can hold a bottle of coke in my hand and ask people what it is, if 99.999% answer coke, that means its true. I believe my sense because they are proven to be reliable.

>we are discussing the existence of evidence of a general deity
There is no evidence either way, which makes all discussion near useless as any characteristic you can think of cannot be distanced properly from imagination.

Faith is essential for any religion, and any ideology
Pls go

On one side:
>Blah Jesus blah Jesus blah
>Okay that's cool, look, I'm gonna go-
>BLAH BLAH BLAH JESUS JESUS JESUS BLAH BLAH BLAH
>I heard you, man, I'm Christian now, you ca-
>JESUSJESUSJESUSJESUSJESUSJESUSJESUSJESUS

On the other side:
>Dawkins said that penguins buffalo hullabaloo
>Okay that's cool, look, I'm gonna go-
>GOD ISN'T REAL SHITLORD ARGLE BARGLE MY ANUS GARGLED
>I heard you, man, I'm atheist now, you ca-
>NOGODNOGODNOGODNOGODNOGODNOGODNOGODNOGODNOGODNOGOD

Two groups that aren't much different in terms of behavior. All they need is a slap to the mouth if they don't listen.

Doesn't need to be. The existence of a deity is not falsifiable. Evidence is for scientific pursuits. It's actually far more ridiculous to assert that aliens are real than to believe in a deity because aliens would be part of the natural "world" thus are falsifiable.

Also, we could be, but untill you present some evidence that we are, it just stays on that

literally saw this grid while tripping

But your senses can deceive you, is there any way you can ultimately know with certainty that your senses are working properly, and that you are not the crazy person having a scitzo moment?

the scientific method must confuse you greatly

Do you seriously believe that the universe was created because energy was concentrated in a spherical shape (where did it come from?) and for whatever reason while in equilibrium decided to go allahu ackbar takbir and just out of sheer luck or randomness it gave birth to the macrocosm (galaxies), which in turn out of sheer luck had the ideal condition to generate life that didn't exist prior to that and he same life forms evolved to complexity just because nature played the roulette and won

Does this sound like a reasonable theory?

Note that I don't advocate for Christianity here, I'm just saying that creation out of randomness and inexplainable starting point sound worse than a deity with immense power to do so

Also, have you ever witnessed anything on a micro-scale that could give credit to the Big Bang?

I agree they can be wrong, but prove me that i am a scitzo.

But can you trust evidence if you cannot be completely certain of being able to evaluate the evidence in your world view?

pretty much yeah

What i believe doesnt matter, we are discussing existance of god.

Just because we currently dont know 100% what happened doesnt mean god dun didit.

7

If you were scitzo, how could i prove it to you?

Ok genius, if it wasn't created deity and wasn't big banged how did it came to be?

13

Also, i am not ashamed to admit i dont know how the universe started.

"I don't know and you probably don't either therefore IT HAD TO" is this supposed to be your point?

WE JUST DON'T KNOW
humans have such limited knowledge accept that.

Maybe it always existed.
By presenting evidence