Lets seize the means of production, Sup Forums

Lets seize the means of production, Sup Forums

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didnt the rothschild financed marx?

youtu.be/eIMDb2wYNTA

What are you implying, user.

>implying humans aren't good for anything other than dank meme's at this point

fuck off. Sieze yourself a job position.

Implying any btard is actually productive, and produces anything. /b is white. I own a machine shop, and I can't even get whites to show up for their first day of work half the time. Beaners always show up. Canadians, no prob. Negroes are even more responsible than that these days. But young white mem? Nope, they're off going to school for filmmaking. I guess making videos is going to be what we base a national economy on now.

lol

kek check it:

today I learned canadians arent white

No, Engels and then later the International Workingmen's Association helped finance Marx's work.

Anorexic thread?

Rekt

Historically, most Marxists have been employed in industrial positions. The largest and most successful Marxist movements were labor based, such as the 1912 presidential campaign of Eugene V. Debs, which saw his Socialist Party carry 7% of the popular, more than any third party since can brag.
Admittedly, this was over shadowed by the equally Marxist, though far more Imperialistic, Bull Moose Party, which came in second after Wilson's Democrats.

Henry sat in his living room, along with his 2 other friends. John and Henry. It was a very stormy and whispy night outside, so they figured that the spooky atmosphere would fuel the oujia session they were planning to have. They all had their hands on the planchet, waiting for a spirit to contact them, then all of a sudden. With a flash of lighting and the roar of thunder echoed in the background, and almost as if the planchet had a mind of it's own, it ran smoothly across the board, spelling out this fateful word on the oujia board "How could you even think about doing this to me" a shiver ran down their spines, yet they continued on with the game. Deciding to now ask the appropiate question of "are you a bad spirit or a good spirit?" to which the spirit quickly answered "good or bad. I don't care, Just give me some of that scrump!" the boys failed to understand this, yet they pressed on, now very weary of the doll in the corner, staring at them as it sits in it's rocking chair, a breeze causing the chair to move. They quickly studder out "W-What do you want?" And then the planchet zipped and zoomed, Pointing at all of the three boys tight juicy bootyasscrackcheekholes! They screamed in terror as this happened, running into the living room in response, to where they heard this "WHAT DID I TELL YOU ABOUT GOING INTO THE FUCKING LIVING ROOM?!?!?!?!" before an audible "Like, tsk. Owie" before cabbage patch dolls poured from the ceiling like they were cum from a water faucet, inflicting major tickle upon their asses! When the toys were done, there was absolutely no cheek left! Not even a single ass molecule was left to tickle nor lick! Such a thing! Now that you have read this the same spirit will come to violate you're ass to the fullest extent! There will be truely no will away for you now!

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Nice, you know your history. I've now got respect for your opinion.
As a longstanding closet Marxist (family is Hispanic so seeing as they're very familiar with Castro and the sort they'd flay me if I told them I'm a communist) it's appalling to see the image that everyone has constructed of communism because the mindless populace is spoon fed Jew-curated lies over popular media. History is in fact written by the victor, and it's so sad that the closest thing we have to a true communist rebellion against this are the fucking libtard snowflakes in the U.S.

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Nice, now go read a fucking history book about every socialist, communist or marxist country that has ever existed. Millions dead isn't doctoring the facts. Theyre just facts.
Utopia isn't real.

Great to see a de-gusano'd comrade.

Communism has created murderous regimes everywhere that its principles have been implemented.
Marx is trash-tier social revolution for petty, embittered people that are jealous of anyone that has more money than they do.

>it's so sad that the closest thing we have to a true communist rebellion against this are the fucking libtard snowflakes in the U.S.
It's tragic really, though I think not as bad as it appears. Liberals are shit at first, and they're obsession with intersectionality over class analysis makes them hard to educate, but a few have come around. Better yet, they aren't really even in the majority of anything. We have a massive disgruntled working class in this country that hates both the libtards and the cuckservatives, it's a great breeding ground for a Socialist alternative.
Sadly, however, that takes time, and time may be something we have little of.

Then Marx became self employed making pipes and pipedreams.

>2017
>still believes the "COMUNISM KILLD MILLIANZ" bullshit

Sorry, you don't get to pretend like Pic related wasn't your ideology's doing.

>Millions dead isn't doctoring the facts. Theyre just facts.
Amen to that, comrade. Communism will liberate us from the grim ideology of death that now haunts us.

Yeah but Capitalism doesn't claim to usher in a utopia, idiot. Communism has and does, and all it has ever brought is totalitarian regimes and murder their own people, which is entirely different. No one is saying that any path is going to result in perfect peace or that it will stop deaths that don't need to happen. But Communism leads to these things directly.

Funny because thousands of Americunts *will* die under Trump's puppet regime. Why? Because "affordable healthcare is communism and communism kills people."

>Yeah but Capitalism doesn't claim to usher in a utopia, idiot. Communism has and does
Marxism does not define Communism. I don't think anyone here is going to claim that all problems in the social and household economies just magically go away, but they won't be compounded so much by external pressures and people will be handling them.
>totalitarian
Nigger do you even know what this word means, or are you just pastabating from muh Koch brothers?
>murder their own people, which is entirely different
Actually, it isn't. Capitalism does the same, it just does so with deniability.
>No one is saying that any path is going to result in perfect peace or that it will stop deaths that don't need to happen. But Communism leads to these things directly.
You don't get to wash your hands just because YOU do it INdirectly.

>Yeah but Capitalism doesn't claim to usher in a utopia
Nor does communism. Instead communism insists that capitalism will slowly become communism and we'll continue to approach utopia. People think about the big revolutions of communist regimes, but those are reactions to the ideas, not what the ideas describe.

Yes, crapitalism works just fine. We're all temporarily embarrassed millionaires, so let's keep feeding the fat cats.

>Marx is trash-tier social revolution for petty, embittered people that are jealous of anyone that has more money than they do.
How tf are you going to criticize Marx when you don't even know what his book says? It's not an ideology of "vengeance" (though many get hung up on that potential aspect of the ideology), instead it is is an ideology that seeks to find and address the problems in our current economic system through the process of Dialectical Materialism. Ultimately, we believe that the underlying problem of capitalism is that ownership is treated as a fiat of the state instead of a natural product of labor, simply put this means we want the workers to own the means of production.

>Yeah but Capitalism doesn't claim to usher in a utopia
Neither does Communism. We merely claim to advance the dialectic.

But... That wasn't real communism

Brief introduction to the basics of Dialectical Materialism.

Brief introduction to "real communism"

I don't get to wash my hands because I do it indirectly? This is basically saying "Yeah you're right. But your system does the same thing."
And then you say Capitalism murders its own people ALSO. Lol. Garbage.

>Overthrow the bourgeoisie
DO IT FAGGOT

Then why did virtually the same thing happen to every country that adopted it? Might be that shitty principles lead to shitty results?

I don't delude myself into thinking that I can become a millionaire. I'm only of average intelligence and humble origins. The best I can do is work hard for what I earn. But I also know what Communism has done to other societies. And I would rather live in an imperfect system that gives me the ability to make something of myself than risk it on a CLEARLY FAILED project. Bury your bullshit philosophy already. It didn't work.

Human nature finest example of cattle behaviour.

People will still die, same went with feminist. Rape and murder will be constant in humanity, no matter how you teach they are both bad.

The quality of life in countries that have fully or partially adopted Communist principles has historically with few exceptions drastically increased. You're functionally asking why countries that started out far lower on the human development index didn't magically jump lockstep with the US once they decided to try something that wasn't Capitalism. Communism is a practical philosophy and economic system, but it isn't utopian.

>Yeah you're right. But your system does the same thing
By raising the point, you're implying that muh capitailsm is superior because it only murders people INDIRECTLY. You've simply chosen not to accept those deaths as a consequence of your system, as if your choice somehow relieves your system of moral responsibility. Yet they are a consequence of your system.
Are you going to accept responsibility for that which you're arguing, or are you just a neoliberal that needs to star in a gore thread?

You realize when the "people" own the means of production what it really means is the government owns it. Capitalism is where it actually belongs to people. Some people just arent as useful as others.

What shitty results? Russia became a piss-poor, plutocrat-controlled shithole AFTER the fall of Communism.

>Rape and murder will be constant in humanity
Right, but they went DOWN after feminist theories were implemented. Society progresses into superior iterations as economic systems advance. It's dialectical materialism.

see

>How deep does your doublethink go?
>"Public ownership is when the bourgeoisie claim property through the will of the state, private ownership is when the workers claim property through their labor. Only not that."
>Whoa, that's deep.

>You realize when the "people" own the means of production what it really means is the government owns it
The government is not some creepy leviathan. You just prefer to cower in fear of it because you have an unresolved Oedipal complex or something.
When you have real democracy, not this liberal republicanism shit, as a group the people can nope anything their government turns out. That's almost as good as actually being incorporated into the government.

You only need to talk to people for a bit to see their utopian leanings. They think Communism is the pinnacle of human achievement. "If only you give it a chance." I didn't say I expected countries that started out badly to be fixed overnight. Again, I'm not a utopian. But I also wouldn't hold out high hopes as you seem to do when historically adopting Communism has not just "stumbled" at its inception as you imply, but has led to oppressive regimes controlling everything.
And the reason for that outcome is actually obvious.
Cuba. China. Soviet Union, Vietnam, too. These are MAJOR examples that you refer to as a "few exceptions."
And I don't begrudge you your opinion, but that just seems like such a bullshit excuse. "Look ignore the most horrific thing that happened in the 20th Century."

>We're all temporarily embarrassed millionaires
>all
>millionaires
Capitalism isn't intended to make each and every citizen rich. But it guarantees that the resources are exploited efficiently. This off course doesn't imply those resources will be shared justly.

Has communism ever worked? Once?
Oh okay so shit thread and also the the harbinger for literally millions of its constituents dying by starvation, execution, or a colorful multitude of other horrible life ending circumstances.
Can't believe anyone ever tried to snuff out such a great ideology.

the ideology itself isnt to blame, just like most religions, the problem is incompetent leaders that doesnt know what they are doing, and leaders that just doesnt care about human lives.

also a comunist society is a dynamic one, so claiming that utopia isnt real, is irrelevant to the point you are trying to prove.

Look dude, if you're going to argue about direct versus indirect deaths within a huge system, then you're kind of grasping at straws. Why?
In any system, there's going to be deaths from flaws in the system. So if there were inadvertent deaths within the Soviet Communist system one could almost laugh it off. But if you don't see a difference between a few people not getting adequate aid under Capitalism versus Communist leaders purposefully sending Kulaks out to die in the Siberian winter then I don't know what to tell you.

no, The living standards were shit. ever since the Soviet Union, the people were all regarded as equal but were all dirt poor, had all the same shit quality stuff. were starving and under totalitarian rule (To maintain every aspect of the USSR's preferred communist theory) and only the government officials had a decent life. Communism has fundemental flaws and is an incomplete as a theory.

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>Cuba. China. Soviet Union, Vietnam, too.
They all seem to have been bettered for their adoption of Capitalism. Compare Cuba to any other free-market loving Caribbean nation. Compare Maoist China to the abortive Republic of China. Compare the USSR to Czarist Russia, or even modern Russia. As for Vietnam, can you name another group of illiterate rice farmers that pushed back invasions from TWO nuclear superpowers? The only "exceptions" I can think of are Cambodia and North Korea, though the latter suffers less because of their ideology and more because of the necessities of being at war with a country 4,000 times their size since their inception.

The government isn't some creepy leviathan. That's not what he was saying. The government is dangerous, however. The fact that you even made that sexual is projection, faggot. Maybe your love for your Mommy Communism is a manifestation of an Oedipal complex.

we are referring to when the soviet union was alive.

Let's kill all the commie scum fucks

You need a free market in order to control production of goods. Didnt work so well in the USSR when goverment officials were setting prices for 24m items. Always results in shortages.

The free market is the only fair system. There has to be incentives and competition in order for progress to happen.

All the shit you take for granted. Tvs, smart phones, your fucking ps4 and all video games are all a direct result of free market capitalism.

You say that Communism, a theory, is incorrect because Russia, a country that was never as fully developed as the United States, was not as developed as the United States?
The Soviet Union had flaws, yes, but it was vastly superior to what they had before or what they have now. Hell, just ask the Russians! They love Lenin and Stalin.

>But if you don't see a difference between a few people not getting adequate aid under Capitalism versus Communist leaders purposefully sending Kulaks out to die in the Siberian winter then I don't know what to tell you.
I don't, actually. In both cases those deaths were nothing more than a policy choice. Your frozen Kulaks example carries exactly the same moral gravity as a refusal to provide housing to the homeless and unemployed because muh markets would be sad.

At least there's a manifesto

sounds gay m8
>im in

>The government is dangerous, however
My point is that the government is not an Other, and Bastiat is a whiny little manlet. When you ARE the government, and not a subject of it, the power relationship is far different and more favorable.
The Oedipus complex has ramifications that stretch far beyond sexuality, Tipper.

>Has communism ever worked? Once?
Yeah. Rojava.
Or Yugoslavia.
Or Catalonia.
Or if you want to get edgy, the USSR, China, and Cuba.
Hell, or even the US. A LOT of social programs came from the pens of Socialist union men like Debs.

Nah, let's stick to liberals.

>Your frozen Kulaks example carries exactly the same moral gravity as a refusal to provide housing to the homeless

I don't think someone being sent to their death against their will is comparable to someone who can't work a minimum wage job to buy their own food but instead rely entirely on handouts for their own existence.

Solzhenitsyn was a crazy guy and a big pussy. Sergei Korolev was imprisoned too but didn't came out like he survived Auschwitz and shit.

>the USSR, China, and Cuba.

Why do you think so many people fled Cuba and the USSR as soon as they had the opportunity to do so?

Do you think Communism was pleasant to live under?

this is rather zesty
>getsmyzingerzippin.png

>I don't think someone being sent to their death against their will is comparable to someone who can't work a minimum wage job to buy their own food but instead rely entirely on handouts for their own existence.
Naturally you wouldn't, because you're unwilling to step outside the Calvinist frame of muh individual earnings. Good goy.

Lol. You're neglecting the FORCED movement of city dwellers out into the country to work on farms against their will.
Compare the USSR to Czarist Russia? Do you know how many people died in Russian work camps? Or how those that weren't in the camps lived in fear everyday of being randomly sent to one? It's shameful to ignore that. I'm not trying to be harsh, but it's true. Don't pretend that it was a cakewalk.

>Maoist China vs ROC
While China might economically be stronger, taiwanese people fare better on average, and have an actual democracy, now.

>USSR vs Czarist Russia
Czarist Russia was just about to undergo an industrial transition, but needed agricultural reforms that nicolas 2 started, but couldnt finish because of the revolution. And even then, Lenin realized he'd better finish what the czar started. And then came Stalin who thought otherwise, and made it so that, while russia became an industrial and military power, that power could never sustain itself, being built in shoddy foundations (like all things communist, by the way).
>Vietnam
The french and the american forces realized they couldnt do shit against a country that unanimously wanted to turn communist, unless they made a fucking genocide. That's what Nixon tried to do by the way, before realizing it was just not worth the hassle. Nothing to do with communism.

Yeah and supposedly the North Koreans love their glorious leaders too. That doesn't make them NOT shitty.

If you've ever been around homeless people you would know that most of them are drug addicts who don't deserve "free housing."

I don't think you understand what goes into building housing for people, and how fast someone who can't stay in a drug rehab program for 2 weeks will absolutely ruin your "free housing" for the homeless and cost thousands of dollars to make that tiny living space he inhabited even livable again.

Why do the homeless and the unemployed "deserve" housing? What are they contributing? What have they ever contributed?

>fled
Most were expelled. Landlords don't do well when the power shifts to the people they spent their lives oppressing.

Most of you have never picked up a hammer nor a sickle in your life.

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I mean after "Communism" was established in the USSR and Cuba, and when people finally could escape it (See: Florida)

the no true scotsman fallacy does not justify the consequences of having a communist government and just dismissing it as a "perversion of REAL communism". The ideology is an incomplete ideology with many ambiguities and fundemental flaws, also since realistically it requires totalitarian control to maintain every aspect of communism in a society.

>and leaders that just doesnt care about human lives.

If you give someone ultimate power over others, why would they care about human lives? Just by putting them on that pedestal the whole country knows that this person is more important than the rest, inherently.

Why would that person care about anyone else?

fucking faggot. Sup Forums is a capitalist board

Farmers who had done nothing wrong sent against their will into Siberia.
People rounded up in the middle of the night and sent to work camps because their neighbors wanted their apartments and so they made up some lies about them.
Workers routinely sent out to work in below freezing temperatures where they often died, or came back nearly dead.

You don't honestly believe that carries the same moral weight as a society that votes on policy do you?

In fact, because the Kulaks refused to work for society, and were deprived of its privileges by exile, the moral gravity is about the same.

How about we talk about the others user mentioned, you twat

You did ask for one country, and he gave you more than what you asked.

And yeah, communism was as pleasant, for most people, as the american way of life is today; or even more.

EACH and every human advancement has been co-inlined with the overall social development and mental capacity of the brain. As a collective we must be well fed and stored, but that is not enough, exploration in existence is what our social ability is for.

Why this is not totally comprehended by everyone is the fact that the majority of human exploration in existence is wasted time. Computational knowledge has been the use for the Left brain and knowledge in comparison in the Right. The reality is with the increase in our holdings between societies the forms of media/art(whicher you prefer) we developed from ink to paper, to painting to holding data in more and more advanced forms. As of right now our technology and how we hold and share data has shot WAY into advancement over what the Great Ape brain can handle. .

Human stupidity will always outshine the honor and respect of our smarts, The universe is mostly dark, the glimmers of light are what we live in.

Historically Sup Forums has been an anarchist board. Anarchists are inherently anticapitalist, as Capitalism requires a strong state to maintain a writ of private property.

dude, some homeless people went hungry despite there being thousands of free meal programs provided to anyone who doesn't violently attack the soup kitchen volunteers.

Obviously these vagrants who can't muster up enough politeness or quell their violent tendencies for 5 minutes are comparable to forced death camps, I can't believe how the homeless get treated in places like San Francisco and San Diego and all those other California homeless camps. It's like a modern day Auschwitz!

>communism was as pleasant, for most people, as the american way of life is today

Then why are Russia, Cuba, and China shitholes to live in today?

It's insane that you defend the government. It's not an Other. And yet a class of people that have amassed more wealth than you are an Other? They're just fucking people dude.
And also, you are not the government in a Communist society. History clearly shows that.

>muh north korea
North Korea is governed by a dictatorial nutjob. No matter if he pretends he's marxist or not, he's still a nut job, and even he is but a puppet to the military who reigns supreme in the country. Nothing communist here; just a nutjob.

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>Then why are Russia, Cuba, and China shitholes to live in today?
The collapse of the Eastern block? The censorship of Maoism? And Cuba is doing fine.

Marx wasn't even (((his))) real name. Karl Mordechai is his ACTUAL name

>C.N.T.
seems to be missing a U.

>When you are government... the power relationship is... more favorable

He's imagining he's a part of some great Communist government and he won't be working in the fields or on a manufacturing line, like all great young Communist politicians out of college like Bernie Sanders.

Once "I'M" the government, I won't do all those mean things like death camps and starvations like the other communist governments, I'm actually nice!

Capitalism is for beta cucks. Real alphas skull-fuck their bosses and seize the means of production.

Lel, go lick a boot classcuck statist.

>And yeah, communism was as pleasant, for most people, as the american way of life is today; or even more.

Said no one who actually lived in a Soviet country ever. You should meet some immigrants from the USSR and ask them, instead of just writing what you assume must be true.

The Kulaks were basically slaves until they got their own farms. Little pieces of land. And SOME, not all, were actually really good at it, and produced a lot. Then they were told that they were parasites and to give up all that they had produced, when they had been slaves not long before.
What the fuck would you do? I wouldn't say comply. They had worked hard and nobody had helped them but maybe the people that lived with them.
They got sent to Siberia and died for that. Fucking bullshit that you would say it's the same.

>The collapse of the Eastern block

Why did it collapse? Did it have anything to do with their system of government?

>And Cuba is doing fine

Why were countless Cubans fleeing on rafts to a free country? Why would they want to come to a terrible Capitalist country if they've been fine?

>muh bootlicker memes