You cannot learn how to draw.
You have to be born as an artist.
Try to prove me wrong
>protip: you can't
>Hard mode: No anecdotal evidence
For example:
>I remember when I started drawing
>you just have to sit down everday and draw this worked for me
Extra challenge for artists: If you can prove me wrong, I might consider commissioning you and pay double the price for a fully colored one. If you should not be able to I get free full commission.
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Practice does work tho, I was pretty shit at it back in high school and used to just draw shit while I was tripping, (pic related) it was mainly just patterns at first, but I couldn't for the life of me look at something and draw it to any resemblance, so then I bought anatomy books and started practicing over and over again trying to actually resemble a hand or a real anatomical person and after a year or so I could draw an anatomically scaled person, now I'm getting better with landscapes
Have to have more than basic survival skills that's for sure but if you don't practice you won't achieve.
Source: psychology
U proved op is correct
>anecdotal evidence
Read it again.
That's one of his shit drawings.
How? If anyone practices they can draw, the only part that's a "gift" is being able to have a style that others value
It's like singing
Case closed.
>I think you can become a baseball player.
>Source: The Bible
Correct, here's where I'm at now
>hur durr practice worked for me
>anecdotal evidence
>yfw when you compare the two and see that the supposed shit one is better
Only if your into "trippy shit"
I'm really good at it and it took me 2 years of hard practice
Back in high school when I was just doing faces and patterns I couldn't even grasp doing something like this, I couldn't capture the real world at all just shit I made up
Art is subjective tbh. I mean obviously some people just have talent. I can see your point but its just a blanket statement, it is a trade you can learn.
>anecdotal evidence
>it is a trade you can learn.
No evidence provided to back up said statement.
Nature prepromed me
You're suffering from inaccurate descriptions here OP. You can absolutely learn and practice drawing. The act of dragging a pen over paper is physical and as such depends on your manual dexterity and experience, both of which improve with use.
What you may have meant is that you can't learn artistic talent - which is what you express USING your ability to draw.
This can actually be verified - there are plenty of people that do very well copying designs, drawing what they see or what they remember, but that do really badly imagining stuff or creating abstract art.
Go ask /ic/ about Kyle.
I hereby have genes to play baseball
It's both nature and nurture
>You can absolutely learn and practice drawing
I would really like some evidence with that.
>This can actually be verified
>doesn't post something that would verify it.
Can I have a quick rundown?
>You cannot learn how to draw.
>You have to be born as an artist.
>>hur durr practice worked for me
>>anecdotal evidence
OP said *no one* can learn to draw. user learned to draw. Therefore, OP's premise is invalid. lrn2logic
>presenting anecdotal evidence
>oh it worked for me, just trust me
>user learned to draw.
>user was born with artistic skill, just refined his skills over time
It's pretty simple to find the answer OP. Its called "Is there a school for that?"
We'll use "Drawing" and "Looking Good" as example.
>Is there a school for looking good ?
No, okay, so you're good looking at birth, or you're simply not.
>Is there an Art School, where you learn how to draw and perfect that art?
Yes? Ok then, you have to learn to draw, it doesn't come pre-packaged with a baby when it's born.
Is that logical enough for you, OP?
>Art School
It is an institution for people to refine their artistic skill they have been equipped with at birth.
>anecdotal evidence
It would be a valid criticism if OP's statement wasn't absolute, and user's refutation wasn't personal experience.
>>user was born with artistic skill, just refined his skills over time
Babby's first logic troll.
You have to be born with an interest but anyone can get better at it.
>no evidence provided
>no argument
where's your evidence you have to be born with it?
you just need to reach the 10000 hours of practice threshold.
Don't need evidence, I'm speaking from experience. The topic itself isn't worth really providing evidence for, unless someone has a real interest in testing but how do you do that anyway?
Gladwell's 10k hours thing has been refuted as bullshit many times.
That's bullshit OP. In my country we have mandatory drawing exams for all wannabe architecture students and of course you need to attend some classes first if you want to pass it. I've seen people from different backgrounds and with different initial skill level taught at drawing schools like that and eventually everybody can learn how to draw if they don't loose patience first and actually work.
It's maybe 10% talent, 90% practice and actual work. Talent only helps in the very beginning too.
Source: myself (passed the exam at uni).
The burden of proof lies on you my friend.
But okay compare drawings from kindergarten kids. Even though all of them seem rather simplistic you can definitely make out a significant difference in skill. This children will improve over time while other kids will always lack such skill. Despite the fact that they equally spend the same time drawing.
Op, you seem to be talking so much about arguments, but, am I the only one that thinks it's weird that you do not have any? You have a statement, surely, but there is nothing backing it up. The burden of proof is with you.
>>no evidence provided
Don't require one. You refute MY statement. Isn't this your first logic troll?
You know what that means.
>myself (passed the exam at uni).
>anecdotal evidence
Thank you for your contribution.
what ever, its always proven true in my life.
one day 10 years ago I wanted to whistle, but couldn't even get my lips right to produce sound. tried once a day to make sound, eventually became able to do it. Now i can whistle yankee fucking doodle like nothing.
You're retarded
Well, humanity's abilities with art have increased throughout history by way of figuring out new techniques. You need to learn techniques in order to develop an ability with art. Anyone can be taught these techniques but not everyone is going to be in the upper echelon of artists. Literally everything works this way.
My thread is asking people to disapprove my statment. The burden of proof lies on them.
draw discord/ eBAh6gE
Thank you for playing.
Isn't it hilarious how people can admit that someone has a talent for math, or for music, and some people can't deal with numbers, or are tone deaf, but when it comes to drawing it's "LE ANYONE CAN LE DO IT LELELE". Fucking retards.
Why go to school
You're a born truck driver, no need to learn
The sun is actually a negroid screaming so hard it emmits light. Prove me wrong
>Hard mode: No anecdotal evidence
kek
>Being so dishonest you can't even find words to go around the argument.
>It (art school) is an institution for people to refine their artistic skill
>Refine
Is another word for "learn better" or "improve"
You said Learning but used another word for it.
Checkmate faggot OP, you can't simply slide through the English language and redefine shit as you please.
Tone deaf people can learn music and people who are bad at math just take more time to develop those skills.
I see, you're just shitposting. Have a good day.
>false equivalance
SInce there is actual photographs and scientific documents providing evidence.
>more time
Human life is finite. Do you want someone to spend 80 years getting to a level someone gets to in 2 months?
>not realizing what you're good at solely relies on your experience with it
You can use yourself as evidence as long as the correct method was applied to draw the outcome.
Learn better or improve but not learning in itself.
You can learn to refine skills but you cannot learn the skill itself.
Yeah, that's why there are 5 year old prodigies who can paint perfectly photorealistic paintings, or write symphonies in their heads or do ridiculous mathematical operations, because of experience.
Why did you post this?
>gives up because no evidence
Everyone can draw - it's about expectations vs result.
Prove me wrong now.
>no evidence
oh boi...
ITT: OP is a bad, frustrated artist, and too lazy to practice and improve.
>no argument
anecdotal evidence
Go draw a dot
If I would draw a dot, I still haven't learned how to draw.
>still no argument
Won't refute my argument.
Most recent project in illustrator
that is not true at all,
you have people who are gifted and learn quite easily the hand eye coordination , and you have others like me who learned by doing it over and over and got better each year.
you are so stupid and self defeating you are just angry you can't draw, and are to lazy to put the effort into learning correctly because " IF IT IS NOT EASY , then fuck it , and then bash everyone else who disagrees with you or shows you some of their work.
you are just like women who expect special treatment because they are women ,and then are pissed at hot women for being hot and don't bother to do anything to improve anything about themselves.
tldr go die in a fire..
You haven't made a single argument. You made an assumption about me.
Actually Imma agree with you on this. Always sucked at drawing but had friends who were so good at it even as little kids. I draw when I'm bored and stuff but it's just not good. It really does seem to be something you are born with, good point
Evidence? Every artist ever is evidence for that. What, you think none of their products have in any way influenced by the fact that most artists spend much of their waking time creating art?
Hilarious.
Drawing is finding patterns and repeating them, that's how you learn. If your iq is 0 and you have no fucking idea on how patterns work and interact with eachother, no wonder you don't know how to draw
>You made an assumption about me.
Prove me wrong.
One more
This, OP post your best work of art
And not a single shred of evidence was provided.
So sad my friend. I didn't bash anyone, I called them out when they haven't provided actual evidence and resorted to the "it worked for me so it should for you".
>you have to be autistic to be an artist
are you seriously just trying to make excuses why you suck as an artist? just practice more faggot
>This, OP post your best work of art
Sorry, I didn't take a photo after I jizzed on your mom's face.
inb4 andecdotal evidence
thats not drawing tho
Art classes help people learn how to draw
OP is a fag sage
Did you just assume my parents gender?
>illustrator working with shapes and not actually drawing yourself
Looks nice tho.
You can 100% learn to draw. You need to get the mindset right, I agree, but that's developed rather than innate. It's not just being mechanically good at putting pen to paper, it's about understanding how to transfer what you're seeing into movements of the pen.
A good example of how this can be developed is through drawing excersizes. Try to draw something without taking your pen off the paper, or as in as few lines as possible. You'll start to get better at recognizing what is important to the drawing and what is unnecessary detail if you do this enough. It's all about having a good eye for it I think.
My gf used to draw at a near deviantart quality. Two weeks ago she bought a drawing tablet, and now she does great. Even better than she does on paper, I'd say.
There is some level of natural talent on paper but with drawing tablets that benefit is pretty much nil.
>Did you just assume my parents gender?
Sorry, your birth mother.
Unless they've perfected gestating fetuses in pigs.
you are just as stupid as OP then ,
you bother to take any classes that teach technique ? or even just basic skill level stuff proportion , shadow , perspective stuff like that ?
if not then your opinion is therefore skewed and not valid
First of all, I am not an artist. Do you think that if I were one that I would say something like this? The general consensus of artists believe that everybody can draw.
youtube.com
youtube.com
superamiuniverse tumblr com
(just scroll down a bit)
And second why should I practice something you can't learn?
True, and I appreciate it. The actual drawing I used to do was in high school, before I became focused on digital art.
evidence for what ??...that is an opinion of you as a person m based of what you have said in this thread and how you like use logical fallacy arguments , that are in fact just you side stepping any proof for the statements you are making
>refine their skills
ftfy
>First of all, I am not an artist.
If you're gonna troll in the big time, you better be able to remember thread history.
Or maybe you think trolling is an innate talent.