Was Karl Marx wrong? Or could his communist ideas work in society? Explain it to me Sup Forums

Was Karl Marx wrong? Or could his communist ideas work in society? Explain it to me Sup Forums

Yes he was wrong, value doesn't come from labor unless there is consumer demand. If that were true then a sweatshop worker in communist China would be wealthier than a liberal Hollywood actor. Communism cannot work under any condition because it goes against nature and tries to force equality rather than let it happen.

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the devil tells no lies???

Yes, he was wrong. Because communism never works and we have plenty of examples.
>inb4 it's never been done right

they could, and do
but only on very small scales
organizationally most families are marxist (not leninist, stalinist, or maoist) communes with a benign ruling oligarchy
the reason communism breaks down as the scale grows is because it requires voluntary involvement AND all involved to see each other as equals AND need to be willing work in the best interest of the group, even when that is contrary to the interest of the individual

very much this

Plus in communism the focus is on common wealth. In theory this sounds good. But human nature is note like that:

1. people want to exclusively own stuff,so they simply steal stuff. Been there, seen that (east eufag here). It's not like they steal big wealths, rather "my salary is low, the property of the company is of everybody's, so it won't hurt if I take this smallish item home"

2. even if for some miracolous reason they don't steal, the common property is not respected. You know, "it's not mine, why spare it" or "who cares, if it breaks the company will buy new"

3. people are not motivated to do better - either work more in quantity or work in better quality, because the outcome is just an unnoticable drop in the big sea of common wealth and will have zero effect on your own life - you won't get more salary, you won't get promoted, there's no carrier path, etc., you just work because you have to, and you work at where you are told to work at. I don't say without communism everyone is 100% motivated with their work, but I say there will be a top few % who are and who are willing to improve - in communism this is about 0%

It works, it's just not as fast as capitalism.

works ok in vietnam, actually. China is not doing to badly either. Not saying it is a good system or anything, but we do have examples of functional "communist" states in the world today.
>inb4 those aren't really communist regimes

It's interesting how people attempt to disprove socialism and communism in capitalism terms.

"Consumer driven"

It doesn't work in those places. Vietnam abandoned communism after its war with China and the USSR. Vietnam turned against China and sided with the US in the 80's. China is still deeply communist, the people there are still under state surveillance, there are still state executions, and the country is still in a bad situation. Remember China is over 1 billion in population, only a fraction of the country is doing good, only the coastal areas are successful. There are still continental Chinese, 800 million of which are still in 3rd world conditions and starving.

Read Animal Farm

The numbers don't lie.

The real deal is about deciding the wages, not who owns what. The private property still exists, it's the means of production that matters. It's the difference between a consumed property and a lucrative property. The capitalists rent their tools (the factory) to the workers and keep their goods. That's why it's fucked up because owners decide the price of the items and how much they give to the workers. That's the point where you have to read economists and nothing is as simple as some say (well, the capitalists, nowadays...)

It requires a radical structural shift in everyday living, beyond what you bourgeois faggots can imagine.

Under state surveillance
Executions
Starving people (food stamps)

Sounds a lot like murica

According to Democrats, socialist countries have never spent enough money on communist policies to be successful.

So is Karl Marx a dumbass then?

>socialist
>communist

Which one do you mean, user?

I personally believe communism is the perfect form of government for a small group filled with equally loyal members, like a zombie apocalypse base or an astronaut team

food stamps is different from people starving

in china there are thousands dying from hunger, slave workers that would rather kill themselves than continue his lives

Communist ideas are the ONLY ones that will work.

Yeah I’m pretty sure murica has that too, they’re called fast food workers.

Marx agrees that value doesn't come from labor unless there is demand. For an object to have value socially necessary labor must be expended.

And so much of the demand nowadays is for useless things, the kind of stuff that sits in your house and gathers dust while never being useful for anything.

This is bad trolling desu.

Just so!

Conspicuous consumption and demand manufactured by advertising.
Marx and Engels wrote in an era when productivity was much lower due to less advanced technology

>implying middle aged fast food workers don’t wish for death daily.

I enjoy the luxury of modern technology but mainly live my life as a minimalist, if I don’t need it I don’t buy it.

except that works only in your head.

We had communism over here for like 50 years. That's at least 2 full generations. Was not enough for people to give up their idea of owning things. If you asked them, they didn't say ownership didn't matter.

One of the biggest mistake of commies is that they believe their theory can simply ignore the fundamentals of how the human brain has worked for a few thousand years...