$15 Minimum Wage

Alright Sup Forums, redpill me on minimum wage. Is there any real reason why the minimum wage shouldn't be $15/hr?

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youtube.com/watch?v=7DS0XXFdyfI
poverty.ucdavis.edu/faq/what-are-characteristics-minimum-wage-workers
youtube.com/watch?v=NUtY80fv56M
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It cuts into the profits of companies.
Companies will naturally try to compensate.

This compensation will result in lost jobs, less work hours, or straight up automation.

Also without restrictions on outsourcing jobs to other countries raising the wage will be an incentive for companies to do that as well.

It's way too high for someone without experience and education. It will just lead to loss of jobs because it's cheaper to buy a robot hand to flip burgers.

Maybe instead of setting a floor on wages we should set a ceiling on prices. Bread can't be more than $1.25, milk $2.50 per gallon, rent no more than $750 per month, etc.

Why not just make it $10.10? Why go all the way to $15?

Or why not go all the way to $30 an hour? Or better yet $30,000 an hour?

I don't know jack shit about economics but that's putting up some serious red flags.

For example, if you have 2 people working for 7,50$, then it will become only 1 person, it will not only destroy job opportunities but businesses alike, simply because that 1 person won't do as much as 2 people, therefore the employer has to make cuts on production.

>I don't know jack shit about economics but that's putting up some serious red flags.

It uses exactly the same logic as minimum wages use.

Yes. A lot of fast food locations are owned by sole proprietors who already have slim profit margins because of high overhead.

My family members owned just over a dozen Subways in the 90s-00s in Atlanta and Chattanooga. They needed over $2000 in sales at lunch to break even back then (prime locations, high rent). They had 5 on staff per day. So, at 8 hours and assuming an increase from $7.50 to $15.00, they'd need $300 more in sales per day. That's like 30 more sales, at least. More than likely they would have cut the hours and lowered the lunch staff to compensate.

Because it will ensure that every employer that can will cut as many minimum wage jobs as possible. Multiple fast food companies in the US are already doing that in the states that have boosted the minimum wage. All these useless fucks are going to get by whining is an excuse not to work. Instead of
>wah, if I work I can't make ends meet
It'll become
>wah, I can't get no jerbz

>We need to raise taxes on cigarettes fatty foods sodas and alcohol to reduce consumption!!
>A rise in the minimum wage doesn't cause a decrease in employment

>Libkike logic

No it doesn't. None of those prices are based on workers' wages. Raising the minimum wage has minimum impact on inflation.

Because the minimum wage is like, $7.50 in some places. Minimum wage needs to go up sure, but it doesn't take an economic genius to comprehend that doubling the income for the lowest economic stratum is basically equates hyperinflation for the middle class.

lol


fucking normies

africa would just get all our food

Eh, the South does that shit on cigarettes and alcohol, too. I'd argue we take Sin Taxes far more seriously than the NYC liberals.

why not $50/hr?

Because $15/hr still isn't enough to raise a family of 4 in a nice house with the basic amenities like a big screen tv, an electric car, and surgery for my tranny daughterson.

Why shouldn't it be $96.23/hr user? Why do you hate the workers so much?

>implying anyone needs that much food

>work hard, dangerous manual labor job
>16 dollar doos an hour
>pissant burger flippers who could easily be replaced by a money or a machine
>getting paid nearly what I do
fuck no, they should be paid at all. they don't even have jobs, they do basic ass busy "work" a 5 year old could do.
fuck em if they can't live on their earnings. either they can fuck off and die or get a better job.


aren't minimum wage jobs for like teens anyway? what fucking loser is above 25 years of age and still working at a dead end minimum wage job? fuck those losers

Money is finally becoming outdated.

minimum wage makes ilegal all job offers that are set under an idiotic arbitrary productivity line, if you're under it you're fucked up as there won't be "legal" jobs for you

but that's okay, because keeping young people out of the labour market grant uncompentent boomers with safe seats on their fat asses avoiding competition, as all those youngsters will be unenployed rather than raising their skills and productivity

Minimum wage IS enough to live on if youre not a stupid millenial that cant budget

i guess u need to lower your "other" costs

>No it doesn't.

At least the other guy admitted he didn't know jack shit about economics.

>None of those prices are based on workers' wages.

So? Minimum wages aren't based on their production.

It uses exactly the same logic. People have living expenses that are higher than their take-home pay. So you can either raise wages or drop prices. Either way, you're distorting market value.

>Raising the minimum wage has minimum impact on inflation.

[citation needed]

Yes this would just drive inflation. What we value as $15/hr would soon become the new $8.00/hr becuase there would be no actual increase to GDP.

You'd see an increase in living for two months but your basically printing money at that point.

>Seattle

Maybe they should try living somewhere with a lower cost of living. Or maybe not have children they can't support. Aren't the liberals always going on about abortion is good because the child wouldn't be going into a good supportive environment?

Automation is a stupid argument. Why wouldn't companies invest in automation if it saves them money in the long run?

I think the minimum wage should be raised. Double it seems a little extreme. But if those 15$/h is to be implemented in stpes over 7 or 8 years, then i see no harm in it.

The USA does not exist in a bubble.

>raise min wage
>all other job positions will require raises as well, to incentives employees not to switch to easier job positions.
>cost of goods and services go up.
>inflation.

Increasing minimum wage is good for people in debt, or people who have no savings. Because it will directly lead to inflation.

Raising the minimum wage is bad for people who have money saved up, because now the money they have will be worth less due to inflation.

The effects of min wage increases have no other impact other then this. There is no way to set a minimum wage to "a living wage" because as soon as you do it, it causes inflation, and the minimum wage will no longer be a living wage.

All you are doing is taking people's savings away from them.

Liberals will just over regulate or over tax it to the point where it's impractical.

There'd be nothing wrong with that, if the economy was localized. No company will be able to compete in the global market if they had to pay 15 dollers an hour to every worker. Either the price of services would rise or even more shit would get outsourced.

It would only save them money in the long run if the minimum is raised such that the cost of an employee > cost of maintenance.

at 7.50$ this isn't the case yet.

im sure as machines get cheaper automation will happen regardless.

Let me tell you about this one country that thought that controlling prices was a good idea

They are too stupid to understand that automation will hit no matter what the min wage is. It's cheaper to replace a worker for a machine even if the worker is winning 1 dollar a hour

It's disproportionate to the current rate of inflation. It will make companies ramp up their costs to pay for the new wages, while a dollar will buy less than it did before.

Honestly cali and NY and Seattle can have it because it just means more jobs in the south.

All your companies are fleeing here to avoid the socialist polices of California and New York.

youtube.com/watch?v=7DS0XXFdyfI

Inflation.

Let me tell you about this one country where they thought controlling prices was a good idea

Couldn't you argue that since people are getting payed more that they will then spend more, giving the economy a boost.

What makes a supply side perspective any more valid than a demand side. Prices might go up initially to cover the cost of increased wages, but in theory this would be short lived since people would be buying more. With more goods and services being sold companies could cover the cost of increased wages with the sudden increase in consumer base.

What is the flaw in my thinking here?

In texas minimum wage is enough to survive in comfort if you keep your legs closed. But of course that's just too much to ask and not everywhere has low taxes.

Who said anything about controlling prices?

nothing wrong with it desu at least for now.

im #Tweeting4Twenty actually.

>ceiling
inflation gg

Price floors create surpluses. Price ceilings create shortages. Do with that what you will.

If you're correct than inflation occurs

>wages rise
>people have more money
>companies can now charge more to increase profits
>people can't afford as much anymore
>people demand more money
>wages rise
>people have more money

>thats right. Just work hard so you can survive. But don't even think about having kids. Nonono, kids are for Mexicans to have at the expense of you tax dollars.

To start with, it doesn't make any sense. The money that business owners collect does not vanish into some black hole, it is also spent, usually on expanding the business. Raising the minimum wage will, however, unemploy people as businesses close to the line collapse or fire employees. UCB just fired thousands of employees after whining for years for a $15/h minimum wage. Those thousands of employees are now on fucking welfare, each eating up public funds.

Let me see $10 an hour for a human vs a robot hand that cost pennies a day of maintenance. I wonder what's cheaper? If companies wanted it they do so with ease. So what's the real reason?

Inflation literally does not affect you and the majority of the people in here. Inflation only fucks up the rich and their fortunes.

:^)

Just make it fucking 11.50 and be done with it.
Company Jews are happy and so are the trash goyim.

This but it can't be wages can't be raised so high where the profit motive is gone.

Minimum wage jobs were never meant to raise a family on, or to even live on. They are supposed to be starter jobs for teenagers. When we flooded the market with foreign workers to under cut American wages, the teenagers stopped getting jobs and their skill sets were never developed.

Basically, Trump's wall will solve all of these problems. You can't expect companies to pay you more when a Mexican family is willing to work for $2 a day.

Think of it like this, you are a bread company, for simplicity say your cost is $1.25 per loaf to make. Say something happens, wheat costs more, your cost is now $1.30, your'e now losing 5 cents per loaf sold, eventually you will go out of business or deal in the black market if you can't charge more. You can't peg prices when they always fluctuate.

The rent example is absolutely retarded. You're going to charge 750 bucks a month for a rat infested dump and the same amount a condo overlooking the ocean in a popular city?

You're literally describing communism, go back to your Bernie rally.

All it does is cause inflation. It's very simple. If you are in debt, or broke, it's good for you.

If you have money saved up, it's bad for you.

In a way, it punishes people for saving money, and rewards people for being in debt.

When you are losing money as a business you will go broke sooner or later. Why even run the business in the first place then?

If you force companies to pay certain sums of money without any consideration about their profitability you will just bankrupt a lot of companies. Let the market determine the wages.

Some companies may compensate for the external wage rules by stealing money from the more productive employees to pay for the lower level employees. That is if they can't get rid of them. By making all employees more equal you are disincentivising productivity.

Shut the fuck up, scum. Don't have kids if you're working on minimum fucking wage. Barely anyone in the country makes that wage, it's all college kids at Starbucks and 40 year old highschool drop outs.

Shouldn't you be off redefining unemployment as luxury or something you cocksucker? Please do me a favor, slit your own throat you jealous fuck, I'm so suck of you kikes and your debunked antiquated religion shitting on proper conversation. You're like creationists, except you kill more people.

>The money that business owners collect does not vanish into some black hole, it is also spent, usually on expanding the business.

I thought the panama papers leak would have taught us anything. Apparently i am wrong.

But with your way of thinking, the money workers get is virtually always spent on the local economy

>inflation only fucks up the rich and their fortunes
what

>Let me tell you about this one country where they thought controlling prices was a good idea

But apparently controlling prices on labor is OK

>inflation gg

But user, what happens when inflation raises the cost of goods higher than what the new minimum wage can afford? Gosh, it's almost like government involvement in the market leads to inefficiencies.

Again, this is the exact same logic used to defend minimum wages.

The minimum wage is not intended to support a family. Over half of all people who earn the minimum wage are under 25 years old. Hiking the minimum wage reduces the number of these jobs available as automation becomes the better option at higher labor costs, hurting both the under 25 crowd trying to get their first job and anyone with a low wage job in general.

The entire reason the Democratic Party wants to hike the minimum wage is because public sector (i.e. government employee) union contracts are based on the minimum wage. If the minimum wage goes up, every civil servant in a union sees a large pay raise. The primary constituents of the Democratic Party are the super wealthy, lifelong welfare recipients, and public sector employees. Everything else is identity groups. A minimum wage hike helps one of those and doesn't touch the other two. The people it hurts are not Democrat constituents.

Maybe, highly unlikely though. Congress is owned by republicans and they won't let that happen. Maybe in state govt they will though.

I've always held jobs that paid fairly low, $10-18 an hour. At one point in my life I was making $30900 a year managing a store for a corporation and if you do the math that comes down to about $10.60 an hour. Working my ass off for barely more than 10 bucks an hour.

I understand people wanting to make more money but the $15 an hour requirement would just fuck everything up. You can get by on $10 an hour or less if you know how to budget your money and don't live in a place where the cost of living rapes you. The people I see pushing for the wage increases are typically liberal retards that don't understand economics and want muh free shit.

7.50 an hour hahahahahaha wtf. Little kids earn more then that over here

1: Most businesses are not multinational corporations with complex tax shelters.
2: The unemployed people don't spend anything. Next question.

High school students don't need to make more than thr current minimum.

If you're a parent and working a no-skill minimum wage job you're a literal piece of garbage.

Gee why shouldn't the minimum wage be $30 an hour?

>But user, what happens when inflation raises the cost of goods higher than what the new minimum wage can afford? Gosh, it's almost like government involvement in the market leads to inefficiencies.
im explaining why price ceilings are bad faggot.

Agree. A doubling of min wage is brute. Bt if the 15 is increased by steps in 8-10 years, then great.

>Shut the fuck up, scum. Don't have kids if you're working on minimum fucking wage.

>See goyim, Don't have kids. Let the niggers and mexicans do that for you. Meanwhile focus on making more money so you can pay welfare to them. See how great it is to live in america!

> Barely anyone in the country makes that wage, it's all college kids at Starbucks and 40 year old highschool drop outs.

poverty.ucdavis.edu/faq/what-are-characteristics-minimum-wage-workers

half of min wage workers are over 25

are you fucking 12?
>wages go up
>prices go up

>im explaining why price ceilings are bad faggot.

And I'm explaining why wage floors are bad, please, try to keep up.

In what way does inflation affect you? (Unless you have savings)

How about people in college? How are they supposed to survive?

>1: Most businesses are not multinational corporations with complex tax shelters.

But may do And multinacionals are stronger then ever

>(Unless you have savings)

Are you seriously suggesting that only rich people have savings

>But may do And multinacionals are stronger then ever

Shit, people are making money. We better take it

wage floors are there so that the kikes dont start scamming people horribly

poor fags cant negotiate for shit so we basically have to do it for them.

I've heard that franchises have to set higher minimum wages sooner compared to say a mom n pop restaurant. Is that true?

>how does inflation affect you other than the one way for it to affect you

Get a loan and pay it back with the skilled labor from the job they get. Don't go to college for something that doesn't have job prospects.

You were talking about upper limits. That's dumb as shit.

If you put upper limits on prices you will of course make them affordable for everyone.
Guess what happens if in say, canada or mexico said products are uncontrolled ergo mor expensive? People will sell them there.

Same happened to venezuela. They said that milk couldn't be above 1$ (invented numbers for argument's sake). In colombia, same milk was 2$. So all the damn milk went to colombia, and their supermarkets ended up empty.

That is for upper limits, as for lower limits like a minimum wage, more or less same principles apply. If the minimum wage is higher than in other countries, companies will outsorce the labor(that's why all your shit is made in fucking china). If it's lower than other countries, you will get more jobs and inversion, but if you don't have some sort of welfare the workers will eat shit (like in china).

The idea is to find a middle point in which the wage is liveable but still competitive enough. And that's exactly what you already have.

>living in Seattle

There doing that in my state commiefornia. Each year goes up a dollar.

>pennies a day

Nigga you can't count or something? Automation can be cheaper than labor but it has its own costs. Equipment is Hella expensive upfront. Upkeep and maintenance has its own costs. The idea here is that when payroll pressure exceeds the automation payoff, you'll see it. And there gunning for $15, not 10.

>wage floors are there so that the kikes dont start scamming people horribly
>poor fags cant negotiate for shit so we basically have to do it for them.

Whoa there, buddy. So you're saying that we have to stop the dirty, filthy Jews from underpaying us poor workers, but we shouldn't do anything about those slimy, greedy kosher bastards from overcharging us on essential goods and services? Whose side are you on, anyway? You got some Jew gold hanging around your neck?

There are many countries where people make less than a dollar an hour. The countries are very poor and people are struggling. We should help them by raising the minimum wage to $15/hr. That way they can support themselves and their families and not be in poverty or live in shacks near open sewers.

>but we shouldn't do anything about those slimy, greedy kosher bastards from overcharging us on essential goods and services?
I already explained why price ceilings are a bad solution for this.

But I agree we have to do something.

Because I make $100/hr and I don't want you plebs to catch up.

>Are you seriously suggesting that only rich people have savings

Meaningfull savings are not very common today. people are living paycheck to paycheck.

>plundering our economy, closing local bussiness, exploiting loopholes, receiving tax breaks and gov subsides, and in the end hide their money.ยด

In english now

jesus christ you have to be baiting or have an iq of 70. Everyone saves money and inflation hurts the poor the most because saving is the most useful for low income individuals, because those are the people that have frequent expenditures (bills to pay), and need to keep the money that they have in line in order to be able to live. inflation decreases the amount of buying power that poor person's savings has, and makes his life even harder, plunging him or her farther into debt you fucking mongoloid

>1 Post By This ID

>Redpill me on X

Gee, really makes you fucking think eh?

Do your fucking job mods.

So why can't we find a "middle point" on prices? Why can't we make them expensive enough to make smuggling them across borders uneconomical, but cheap enough so that anyone working any wage can afford them?

Is it because both price ceilings and wage floors are "dumb as shit"?

And commiefornia is already destroyed? Have the bussiness all went away?

>double the minimum wage
>print literal tons of money
>middle class disappears

A loan only covers so much and cost of living is ridiculous and rising. Wages though have stood the same. So again I ask, what are college students supposed to do?

I just happened to be watching this while having this thread open.

Doesn't have much to do with minimum wage but its still good

youtube.com/watch?v=NUtY80fv56M

Whatever the minimum wage is set to, it should be upheld not by banning employers from paying less, but instead by a universal minimum wage job offer.

Any workers that are displaced by a raised minimum wage would then just go to work in a guaranteed minimum wage job until they can transition into the private sector again. This is infinitely better than letting people's skills and employability decay as they sit in the unemployment queue.

The only question then is what should these basic, guaranteed jobs do? Depends on your political views. I would personally use them to facilitate something like the Green New Deal concept (see Bernie Sanders, Jill Stein) but whatever it is, it would be better than nothing.

Minimum wage as it currently exists is not acceptable because there is still unemployment and therefore the "real" minimum wage is still zero.

The minimum wage serves an excellent purpose as far as protection for workers, but the key is in the name...MINIMAL. The minimum wage was never conceived as a 'living' wage. If it were that's what we'd call it. Interfering with the market is sometimes necessary but it's not something done lightly. Some jobs being done are simply not worth the 'living' wage that so many liberals now want. These jobs require minimal education, training, experience, or credentials of any kind and are meant to be done by young people and those working part time. People aren't meant to do these jobs past the age of 24 or so.

>Raising the minimum wage will, however, unemploy people as businesses close to the line collapse or fire employees.
I just have trouble believing this would lead to mass termination. I get that businesses would be strained, but they could simply raise prices to alleviate some of the strain. I think only a minimal number of people would be left unemployed as a result. That business you cited, how many minimum wage workers are still working for that company? Probably thousands.