Fuck dogs. I want a tamed wolf

Fuck dogs. I want a tamed wolf.
They look way more badass than dogs, they’re smarter than dogs, and because they're smarter than stupid dogs they're easier to train.

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discovermagazine.com/2010/sep/25-modern-humans-smart-why-brain-shrinking.
amp.livescience.com/5672-wolves-beat-dogs-logic-test.html
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>assuming training is only a matter of intelligence

you better raise it from a puppy and establish the hell out of your dominance

they're dumber than domesticated dogs
All domesticated animals are smarter

they are dogs.
if you want a vicious beast get a fucking cat.

this
get a collie faggot

Then go get a wolf, faggot. If you need me, I'll be bonding with my doggo.

this

If you tame it, you would get a stupid dog anyway.

Wring! The brain of a wolf is 20% large than that of domesticated dogs. Passiveness is a juvenile trait and so domestication stunts intelligence. Read page 2 of this article discovermagazine.com/2010/sep/25-modern-humans-smart-why-brain-shrinking.

Bonobos (domesticated chimps) have brains 20% smaller than aggressive undomesticated chimps. Modern (self-domesticated) humans have brains 20% smaller than the brains of humans from 20,000 years ago.

>bonobos (domesticated chimps)
retard

*Wrong.

Nope, barely trainable. They are smarter, which makes them eventually realize they dint have to put up with your human ass. You can assert dominance over a wolf, and thus have some control over it, but if you're away or if it ever gets a chance, it'll take control over itself, i.e. you leave the room or house and it fucks shit up, or it for some reason thinks it's stronger than you it'll attack. They dont have the "I Will get more reward out of behaving than I would acting on my own" mentality that domesticated dogs have. Just breed a German shepherd or husky sith a wolf, basically the same physically but mentally trainable and just as intelligent.

Tl;dr: smart canid does not necessarily mean trainable or desirable as a pet, just breed your own super wolf-dog

They self-domesticated like humans. They selected against aggressiveness and selected for tameness which stunted their mental capacities since tameness is associated with juvenility. They became childlike as did their brains.

no they're wild animals, docile or not
domesticated means raised in captivity for many many generations

This is the only feasible way of raising a wolf, even still it would make a piss poor house pet. At most it would be an outdoor pet and wreak havoc whenever indoors. Wolves are not meant as pets, they're meant as natural hunting machines, which is why they were so useful for primitive humans to keep around.

My dog Titus, a German Shepherd/pitbull mix from the Humane Society

Pretty sure domesticated just means genetically tame. Raising a wild animal in captivity won't make it’s predecessors any less wild. Domesticated in this context refers to the violence and irrationality of an animal. Chimps will rip your face off at the drop of a dime but bonobos won’t. You could keep a bonobo as a pet just like you would a cat or a dog.

Go grab a wolf pup from the wild, bad idea. Raise a wolf pup from generations of wolves raised in captivity bred with other captive wolves, much better success, but that's just domestication without selective breeding.

I want an alpha wolf straight from the wild. I don’t care if I have to declaw it so it won’t kill me.

No. Pitbulls are domesticated. They ultimately used to be wolves but now they are nothing like wolves. That's what domesticated means.

>declawing a dog
thats fucked up

...

the reason we don't have wolves as pets is because they would steal our women in a heartbeat

Yeah, they’re nothing like wolves because they’ve been bred to be genetically different. Captivity didn’t magically change their physiology and phenotype. Selective breeding did. Most dogs weren’t even domesticated via captivity. They just learned “hang near humans get food.”

To say captivity = domestication is dumb.

>easier to train
nice bait

dogs are better wolves are lame because they can't be trained. But they are ok.

Dogs are better tho

Dogs are tamed wolves, you moron.

We can argue about semantics all day long. In the context I use domestication it means genetically passive and juvenile. Stupider, child-like, less aggressive.

Beautiful pup. Love those ears and sweet look in its eyes. I love pit bulls, almost always loving when trained well and not abused, my gf has a pit bitch and she is the best, especcially with kids, shes super defensive against other dogs when shes with a little kid. and German shepherd are imo the best default dog breed. Treat it right (i.e. dont abuse it and treat it to be aggressive) and it will be your greatest friend. I've got a pure bred germ shep and he's a better friend and companion than any human could be. Smarter than most humans, too.

>implying its the size of the brain that matters and not the amount of folds in it.

I know more than a few people who keep wolves as pets here in the UK. The only person who wants a wolf as a pet is a person who has never experienced a wolf as a pet.

i assume you feed him a steady diet of babies and neighbourhood cats

>German Shepherd/pitbull mix
that sounds fucking awesome
I bet he's scary as shit if you piss him off

I don’t think you get what I mean. I want a wild wolf. A wolf that looks like a wolf and has all the alpha predator ways of a wolf. I don’t want some piece of shit dog. Dogs are niggers.

captivity and serving some kind of use or extensive selective breeding = domestication
The animals in the zoo aren't domesticated

Well you're using the fucking term wrong

he is just a huge baby himself really. He is afraid of everything basically and loves to curl up in inconvenient spots and pretend he is a lap dog

seereally he is a big pussy but i love him haha

dogs are sexy and lots of variety.

aw hell yeah
that's the best kind of dog

A blue whales brain is hundereds of times the size of any of those animals that you mentioned. Does that mean they some sort of supreme intelligence? A wolfs brain is larger because wolves are larger you ignoramus.

I have a leopard gecko. It is just as aggressive as wild leopard geckos but it's morph has blue and orange on it. No wild leopard geckos look like that, they are all yellow with black spots. My leopard gecko is domesticated.

his ears are really really soft. and he is the sweetest good boy you could ever imagine. he is a bit naughty in that he barks like crazy when he thinks someone is coming home or pulling in the driveway, but otherwise he is a very good boy and acts like a lapdog

^This guy gets it!
>Einstein had a smaller than average brain, but more folds, for an example.

>tamed
>wolf

If you live in the country, hunt for your food, sleep outside, and are willing to assert dominance physically using no tools other than your hands, then go for it. I have a wilderness hut out in the dense woods on my property and I've often considered living in it permanently and living off the land and getting a wolf to help with the hunt. Any other living situation is cruel to the wolf and foolish for yourself.

but user, the sexiest dogs are the ones that look the most like wolves

What word should I use. If a Harvard professor uses the word for that definition than why shouldn’t I, brainlet?

This was
meant for you

I prefer goldens, poodles, and dobermans. They look nothing like wolves.

Certainly looks like a good boy, be sure to ruffle his ears and rub his belly for me. And yep that's a guard dog trait, the thing they love most is barking like mad when they think their beloved owner is in trouble. My shep spends hours a day barking at cows outside my fence because he's convinced they're out to get me

My doggo doesn't know how to use a bed properly

He's a brainlet. I'm smarter than him.

Why? Would it be better if I routinely clipped it’s nails? I really want a wolf.

this. knew a guy with a wolf hybrid. the fucker lived in town too. the wolf would just leap his 6 foot chainlink fence like it was nothing and go kill small neighborhood pets. don't get one unless you live far out int he country, have time to constantly work on training and are still ready for the neighbors to shoot it. they're awesome animals. they're not awesome pets. leave the wolves to the wild.

They look fucking retarded. Especially when their tails are clipped.

Must be gay if you're not attracted to pic related

Yes routinely clip it's nails, dogs don't have retractable claws like cats. They have nails like humans.

docking dogs' tails is fucked up

>no wags of affection or happiness ever
>leaves anus uncovered

Why would anyone do this to their dog?

because they like how it looks
they don't actually care about the dog as a companion, only as an accessory

because it prevents tail injury and lots of future vet bills.

People who don't dock their doberman's tail are autists who do their dog more harm than good.

Tail injuries? Is that a product of breeding like pug faces?

>because it prevents tail injury and lots of future vet bills.
yeah, and if you cut off their legs they'll never break one either
a dog's tail is vital to convey their emotional state to other dogs, and their owner

Intelligence is hunting with a pack.

Wisdom is tricking humans into giving you food for free over hundreds of thousands of years until you become a subservient race of small, beloved jesters that some people value more than human life.

Yes which is why tail docking is necessary for that breed. Ear cropping is to prevent ear infections. These things were developed to prevent future injury and illness to the dogs, to compensate for how they were bred.

People who don't do these things for a doberman are reducing their dog's quality of life.

It's like, if there was a standard surgery that made it so pugs breathed easier, but people refused to do it because they're autistic, then in the long run that pug would have a less decent life. Same with dobermans. Those procedures are done for a reason.

Anyway I think they are sexy hot 10/10 supermodels, and they look good no matter what, but best to dock and crop with anesthesia when they are young.

dobermans suffer from tail whipping because their tail muscles are strong for their type of tail, so they end up breaking it over their life many times. Ear cropping stops infections over their life too.

man breeding got out of hand
>let's breed abominations for whatever reason and bring them into the world to suffer

If you really want a wolf (which I guarantee unless you have already raised wolves, you won't), then make sure the laws are in your favor (in most states it's okay to shoot a wolf on site, regardless of it's status as a pet or not), buy acreage, multiple acres of forest where it can hunt and patrol it's "territory" (remember wolves roam many miles and consider it their territory), save as much money as possible for food, fencing, and fortification of your property (not just an 8 or 10 or 12 foot fence, but electric fencing spanning the whole property along the top and bottom of a high [and I mean high] fence, as well as fortification to prevent digging out) not only to keep it in but other animals out, devote tons of time to train it and show that you are the dominant animal and that it can get it's social needs met through you, the owner, and provide a mate or frequent breeding for it so it doesn't get "dog lonely". After all that, it will still be the most difficult thing you've ever done, and still highly likely to end up attacking and killing you. Much easier would be to breed a husky to a wolf sanctuary wolf, then breed the resulting offspring to a wolf yet again, so that it'll be 3/4 wolf while still retaining the trainabilty of most huskies and the physical attributes of a wolf.

and some people basically marry them as partners and feed them the same human grade meat that literally only 5% of the world population has ever tasted before, because most of the world is 3rd world poor.

They're guard and protection dogs dude, those procedures were also done to make them more effective in that role, but they have very real medical reasons.

And they are sexy.

I meant pugs and British bulldogs

I have the best dogs ever. German Shepherd, bull terrier, English bulldog. Chased a nigger down our alley the other day. I thought he was bringing them back. He yelled “ I’m running away from them “

As common in a wolf's nature, if you get male, he WILL challenge you for the spot of alpha male. It's just what they do. Just be prepared to fight for you life one day with it.

do you have a source I can look at to show those increased rates?
because I can't find evidence supporting either of those claims

Can I also do this with a mountain lion?

Not really. Just from expert breeders. That's why those procedures are done.

And if you know anything about dogs you know why floppy eared dogs get more infections than straight eared dogs. Which is the reason for ear cropping. Dobermans are more prone than most other breeds, and also since they are protection dogs it was done so a burglar would have a harder time grabbing them by the ears.

Ear cropping and tail docking greatly improve a dog's quality of life if done correctly with anesthesia. Ignore the retards who want to get them banned. They only hurt animals by feeling holier than thou.

Humans disprove that point

Alpha wolves don't exist in the wild.
Fantasy btfo

Yeah, except wolves are by nature are a much more social animal, a wolf gets companionship from you as much as you do from it, a mountain lion is not social at all. They breed, but that's about as much social interaction you'll get from them. So in a mountain lions mind there's no reason to stick around or not attack a human unless the food source is better and easier to access then what it would have in the wild. Same as a bear, and most carnivores. Obviously it's possible to raise in captivity, but whether or not it's a Good life for the animal or a worthy pet is debatable.

every source I've read has said that ear cropping only marginally decreases the chance of infection
doesn't really seem like a worthwhile venture to chop off a big chunk of both ears, along with the pain which the recovery from the procedure brings

I've also yet to find any source showing that a doberman has any higher odds of tail injury, let alone significant enough to condone mutilation
I've seen a few state that it reduces injuries in the workplace, so fair enough there, I suppose, however if the dog is going to be interacting outside of a work situation, docking the tail only reduces the quality of life for the dog, as they've lost one of their main tools for social interaction

This. If anything the alpha mentality is a dog trait, not wolves. In the wild it's more of a partnership or family, and If one dog tries to assume all the resources and control, that's when the "challenging for dominance" occurs. With weak wolves, old wolves, or genetically inferior wolves, they will get attacked purely out of a genetic, evolutionary need to prune the pack of weaker animals. If an old wolf submits dominance to a young wolf, that's that, the young wolf won't rip apart the old one just because it's the "alpha" male.

This is dumb because it's like saying corgis can't communicate with other dogs. They use their entire bodies to communicate. A tail doesn't tell as much as facial interaction.

Facial interaction is a human designed trait in dogs. Wolves use virtually no facial expressions to convey emotion or actions. Vocal interaction is much the same, though they do use it as warnings, either to the pack in general or to an individual animal or pack member. The fact that it is obvious that neither of these forms of communication are used by dogs or wolves frequently enough to warrant communication show that if there is any communication done by dogs or wolves (which, by the way dog and wolf packs or societies work, show communication does happen) it is done in the minute differences and variations in wags of the tail.

Okay you clearly don't understand dogs. Dogs use facial interactions too.

they can still communicate of course, but not as well
much like how a person with no arms can still speak, but not gesticulate, certain nuances may be lost without the added social cues from the tail and ears
you are essentially making your dog worse at communicating, to reduce risks that have a low chance of occurring in the first place

So much mythology and BS on both sides. Wolves don't have generations of selective pressures to understand and relate to human communication. As such they may respond to condtitioning training, but they don't "get" human actions and noises like dogs do. They are wild animals first, with higher fight-flight response and prey drives and they are not ever "pets". You don't understand them and their communication if you think you can have a tame wolf. It would end poorly for everyone.

Can dogs learn facial expressions from chimps?

Dogs, yes, but not for communication with other dogs. You can read a dogs face because it is bred to convey a certain emotion or need through facial expressions. Wolves, no. A dog does not use facial expression to convey the majority of it's communication between other dogs. Obviously there are some facial and physiological things that occur when a dog or wolf has a certain emotion, such as the flattening of ears, relaxing of eyes, movement of lips or jaws, but the vast majority of communication between dogs or wolves occurs from general body language and tail movement.

I don't believe tail docking restricts dog communication, for the record, I believe the majority of dog communication comes from the use of the whole body, not just the tail. I don't know enough about Doberman or other "tail dock" or "ear dock" breeds to state one way or the other is correct, I simply acknowledge that to assume a dog or wolf communicates entirely or mostly with facial expressions is wrong.

I agree. Every dog i see reminds me of a wolf just more retarded and inbred. The process of making purebreeds disgusts me like if you were forced to fuck your sister for 10 times until a child of yours has the desired trait and then you have to fuck that child too and after that your children with the same traits are now forced to fuck each other too. It's so disgusting and im not going to buy a dog just because it was inbredically engineered to look appealing to my instincts

>The process of making purebreeds disgusts me like if you were forced to fuck your sister for 10 times until a child of yours has the desired trait and then you have to fuck that child too and after that your children with the same traits are now forced to fuck each other too
I have the weirdest boner right now

I agree completely, we don't understand wolves and their wild behaviors at all. I wish I could site the sources I remember this shit from but I can't, it's been a long time since I read it. They dont respond to any "human" traits that we we wish to train on them, but that doesn't mean that humans and wolves don't share a similar need for social interactions. That's why they were relatively easy to domesticate in the first place compared to other carnivores. They fit a function, met and required social needs, and thus they were perfect for early humans to use and eventually domesticate. Like you said, there will never be a "tame" wolf, or a wolf pet, it will always have and use it's wolf nature first and foremost.

Welcome to Sup Forums

If the size of the brain matters then pic-related should be able to do advanced calculus

Well, maybe early on they were inbred to some extent, but by general nature anything that it's inbred for too much Will die out. At least as early as the 1800 or 1700 they kept track of the inbreeding in these dog races. Just because it is selective breeding does not mean inbreeding. That's like saying just because Europe is predominantly white Every one is inbred. (Not to say inbreeding didn't occur in Europe, everyone fucked their sister or cousin before 17-1600)

...

Dude, his brain isn’t big. That lil’ fella has hydrocephalus—water on the brain. I agree that there’s more to intelligence than brain size. Some brains are built more efficient than others. Some brains have larger frontal-lobes and less of brain-parts that aren’t associated with intelligence. Dolphins have larger brains but that doesn’t make them smarter than humans.

In regards to domesticated dogs vs undomesticated wolves there’s plenty of proof that wolves are smarter besides brain size though:
amp.livescience.com/5672-wolves-beat-dogs-logic-test.html

Dogs are smarter and better at sex than wolves.

Show proof.

I would but I just got unbanned for doing the same thing.