If God created the universe then who created God? If God doesn't exist then why does the universe exist?

If God created the universe then who created God? If God doesn't exist then why does the universe exist?

Other urls found in this thread:

multivax.com/last_question.html
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sisyphus
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsolved_problems_in_mathematics
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsolved_problems_in_physics
plus.maths.org/content/omega-and-why-maths-has-no-toes
myredditnudes.com/
twitter.com/NSFWRedditVideo

wow really makes you think...

we did

multivax.com/last_question.html

Universe was always there brah

Doesn't explain why it exists in the first place.

Look at what leibniz thought of the binary system. It is no coincidence that every continuous while number is a prime or a compound number aside from 1 itself, which links the infinite to the whole. 1 and 0 are paradoxically the same truth.

The paradox is everywhere most people just can't see it... it's depressing.

Because it was there. Always and before. It's not that hard. It has always existed and always will

>If God doesn't exist then why does the universe exist?
I mean, it clearly exists. Whether God does or doesn't is in question, but not the universe.

>Because it was there.
In other words God... checkmate atheists.

because the universe is god and vice versa

Whole*

Also forgot to mention all primes can be described with binary, and so the infinite divine structure of the primes is described by the paradoxical nature of existence.

In other words we have a reality described by such truths as the continuous and discrete, timeless and animation, nothing and everything. These all are paradoxical dualities that we can neither prove or disprove, but just acknowledge they exist and are shortcomings for pinning our experience to logic.

Our existence is contingent and finite.

Everything has a beginning and an end.

But God is eternal. Eternity, by definition, cannot be contingent or finite, it simply is. God simply is,
and everything that ever was or will be in our measurable timeline is simply present to Him.

Umm not really. The universe has always existed. Always. There is no end or beggining. No creation or destruction. It's just here.

ipsum esse subsistens

simple as

The universe spun into existence so that I could sit here and shitpost. It's all for me. This is my kingdom, you just don't realize it yet because I'm a generous man and I share my throne.

This requires a great deal of faith since this cannot be proven. Stars and galaxies are birthed and die.

We say that God created us in his image. But in reality, we created God in our image.

It doesn't require any great deal of faith because equations tells us that

The question should be, if god created the universe than who created god?
If you conclude that god has always existed than why not skip a step and simply say that the universe always existed

i mean there was always something in some shape or form and that things simply grow out of it. I.e. humans grew out of the planet earth like apples grow from a tree which also grew on earth.

Believing in some man in the sky watching over you is a medieval fairy tale that deludes people into doing very strange things.

I like religion though (islam not included), it provides therapy for the masses, the large part of society is mediocre, avarage.
These people need structure, they aren't very strong willed most of the time and a lot of young adults fly off the rails early in life. Religion offers structure and a new hope for those who would otherwise just quit life.

for universe to be created it must had been inexistent, so how can inexistence exist?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sisyphus
wow really makes you think...

Noone. He is the uncaused cause

Source?

It is faith in mathematics and scientism.
I've not seen the big bang definitively disproven.

>Source?
Equations

The thing responsible for the existence universe has to be something that is not bound by the same rules as typical matter or else we would run into absurdities. You can call that thing God.

>Our existence is contingent and finite.
Ok, observable and true.
>Everything has a beginning and an end.
One could argue that based on the existing observations.
>But God is eternal. Eternity, by definition, cannot be contingent or finite, it simply is. God simply is,
and everything that ever was or will be in our measurable timeline is simply present to Him.
That's where you have to start pulling stuff out of your ass, which leads me to pic related.

Everything has a beginning and an end *within context of itself

This is like a recursive function. The recursion is atomic, but the arbitrary internal process is infinite.

Exactly.

They die and everything but the material is still there.

That's my point. The material that makes up the universe has always been around and always will be. It wasn't created and won't be destroyed. It's always been there and always will be.
Even atheist Big Bang people have the Big Bang but they can't explain where the material for the Big Bang came from same with theist and the material or whatever God came from.

My opinion is it's always been there and always will be. God or no god.

The big bang is fully predicted and explained by the equations

>why does the universe exist?

The nature of the universe is to exist. That's like asking "Why does a thing that exists exist?". A thing that exists can't not exist

>If God created the universe then who created God?
The universe is god experiencing its self, hard to explain other than it comes from that which is nameless or formless and is the real user
>If God doesn't exist then why does the universe exist?
Something must always exist otherwise you wouldn't even be able to ask that.

Quantum Theory says Time isn't relative... We don't know shit.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsolved_problems_in_mathematics
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsolved_problems_in_physics

>Our existence is contingent and finite.
>Everything has a beginning and an end.
Philosophers are still operating on such a basic framework?

Very well. It all comes down to opinions based on faith.

Elaborate

cuz the only explanation is that God always existed, he is infinite omnipresent and all that stuff.

the universe is just a limited empty space that is expanding(its imagined to be spherical)
even when all stars and galaxies die, the universe will be still here.

>Quantum Theory says Time isn't relative
Nope, the relativity of time is in fact the reason quantum entanglement doesn't imply retrocasualty. Please, read more before spouting nonsense.

We created God.
The universe created us.
The multiverse created our universe.
The omniverse created the multiverse in which our universe is.
And so on.
We - our universe - are not even 0.00000000001% the size of an electron when put in that perspective.
And now imagine all the possibilities of civilisations rising and falling with intelligence superior to ours, on planets superior to our own.
And they fall.
Yet we, inferiors, are standing tall in a harsh environment with harsh history.

That's beautiful. To survive.

I think... I think I need a sip of vodka...

>equations
Like I said quantum theory and general relativity go together like water and oil.

you just described the universe but also personificated it to feel a connection to it

>If you conclude that god has always existed than why not skip a step and simply say that the universe always existed
This depends on your definition of universe. Still, attributing these kind of "powers" to the universe itself is called pantheism.

Well said.

Theism does not require personal deities.

Not really.

Both sides believe in creation of the universe either God or Big Bang

Both sides cannot answer where the material for both came from

Because they can't. Meaning the universe has always been here.

There was no creation of the universe. It simply has always existed

The multiverse is a bunch of self fulfilling stories and imaginations come to life. In one universe someone imagines a universe created by a god. that universe comes into being. In that same universe with god, someone imagines a universe coming into being without a god and that first universe come into being. Both universes creating the other, and many more

well, for some people god's universe.
Something like universe with conscious

>math is hard for me and makes my head hurt

stop

Not true. He's stating the obvious paradox of the idea of a God. Therefore god has no logical pinning to JUST our reality and experience. He would have infinite many experiences up to the whole of himself as 1 thus also completing his destruction as nothing.

it does cater to the need for personal connection. plus religion is very egocentric, for example thoughts like "god made the universe for humans" etc

makes people with shit lives feel like they somehow matter

all theism is based on personification, the difference in some personifications is that it completely removes any direct similarities with human but its still a person

(((Asimov)))

"If you think you understand quantum mechanics, you don't understand quantum mechanics" Richard Feynman

You can't create something that already is.

the universe is inside God, and it was created by him

No one. He is the uncreated, the unmoved mover. Jesus man, read Aquinas.

True, but that's not necessary.

This is false. Theism only means there exists at least one weird supernatural being.

and what property does this "being" has?

But there is evidence that the universe expanded from a singularity and is continuing to expand, while we don't know how it came to be in the first place that doesn't really work with the idea that the universe has always existed.

Yes you can, but in doing so, you have admitted there was nothing first, which is just another category of everything. This is a form of relativistic information and a paradox is an infinite information generator.

b-but muh M-theory

Where did the singularity come from?

All that energy?

The universe in one form or another has always existed.

Where in Romeo and Juliet is Shakespeare mentioned?

A creator is not bound to or by their creation.

This sort of acknowledgement is not without precedent.

"For if you have been able to comprehend what you would say, it is not God; if you have been able to comprehend it, you have comprehended something else instead of God. If you have been able to comprehend Him as you think, by so thinking you have deceived yourself. This then is not God, if you have comprehended it; but if it be God, you have not comprehended it. How therefore would you speak of that which you can not comprehend?"

-- St. Augustine, Sermon 2 on the New Testament

how about a sip of bleach

God(The self) decided to play a game/dream an adventure,
but there is nothing outside of god, and nothing that god does not know,
so in order to play his game, he played it with himself (this becomes the game of yin/yang, good/evil, positive/negative, matter/energy, material/immaterial, faith/reason all dualism and language), and in order to get really into the game/dream he made himself forget that he was god so that he could be anxious or fearful about if he would win his games

there is nothing else but god(The self) and you are his game/dream

None, really, but that would be an innocuous being. The common trend is for people to think of it as being able to cause phenomena which cannot be explained using a materialistic framework.

>Where did the singularity come from?
>All that energy?
I don't know, I don't see how this means the universe has always existed. If that is the case the universe would be in a static state, but it expanded from a singularity about 14 billion years ago. If the universe had existed for infinite time this doesn't make any sense.

>innocuous being
those are qualities of a person, its still a personification

>Something must always exist otherwise you wouldn't even be able to ask that.
>tfw Kek is real
PRAISE KEK

In other words- God.

Checkmate, fedoras.

> the universe has always existed. If that is the case the universe would be in a static state
neither yes or no

>but it expanded from a singularity about 14 billion years ago
This sentence is an image in your mind, when you think of it, you think of it now

when you think of the past, you think of it now
when you think of the future, you think of it it now

the only moment that exists is the now, and it is eternal and has always existed

>In other words- God.

Which one? Why even a personified god, why not something monistic like Taoism?

This guy gets it

Define always

That's not the definition of the Christian God though, you've just called the universe God.

Spot on

This is the general idea of what I believe to be true.

>people in this thread unironically believe the universe wasn't created
>it was "just there"

>he believes his magical daddy wasn't created
>it was "just there"

I'll just leave this here

plus.maths.org/content/omega-and-why-maths-has-no-toes

How come?

A being is by definition a person

What is there to lose in believing in God? No afterlife when you would have had the same result as an Athiest.

This is same fag. Phone changed ip.

Oh, it is an atheist thread and a thread of religious people opinionating themselves, I have this funky idea where we disregard anything said about spirituality in a world of very untrustworthy and lying people and we say the following: Save me Satan.

And from now on, we fight for Satan to the end.

Trust me in this one, the gang of atheist parachristian muslimhindu group who dindu nuffins will come claim your soul for the actual devil

Do it; Save me Satan.

If your belief results in you worshiping God all day only for it to turn out there's no God you might feel you've wasted your only life.

Agnostics don't deny possibility but can still constrain those possibilities with empirical evidence based on other truths.

Nothing saw it's reflection and gave birth to 10,000 things.

It's an impossibility for nothing to exist. If only for a fraction of a instant. The instant there was not, there was. Before time left, before cause and effect. It was Eternal because nothing never was.

I don't chose to believe or not. If I could believe it and be sincere I'd go for it.

For all I know, every single person, animal, plant down to every single microorganism are really all part of the universe but it's observing itself so in a sense we technically are all a sientity experiencing itself billions of time through everyone and everything kinda like how every single living cell is part of a body

DUDE

>It's an impossibility for nothing to exist.
But the universe is full of nothing, the vast majority of what we see is empty space.

*Are all a single entity

WEED

...

I'm with you, OP. GOD in the biblical sense doesn't exist. However the immeasurable course of cause and effect, calculated down to the smallest integer. Nothing is by chance if the future can be calculated. So if by instinct alone, or objectively. The Universe is alive.
(cont.)

...