If God is all powerful, He cannot be all good. And if He's all good then He cannot be all powerful

>if God is all powerful, He cannot be all good. And if He's all good then He cannot be all powerful

Is Luthor right?

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i say luthor is sort of right in that god cannot be within our universe and among us while simultaneously being all powerful and all good. if he is both all good and all powerful, then he must transcend the universe.

therefore superman is not all good and the human race is at risk from his presence.

literally babbies first philosophy class

If He is all powerful, then He has the capacity to withhold His power when he pleases. A quarterback doesn't throw the ball 70 yards on every play, he limits himself (or voluntarily holds back part of himself and his ability) to do what is necessary. Same applies to God. Also, being all pwerful doesn't mean that He can't be good. This is a false dichotomy.

>implying humans could ever understand god

Literally a mouth piece for Snyder. That thinking is how he percieves Superman which is why the DCEU is the way it is.

Being "good" in the sense Lurthor means it, and being benevolent might not necessarily be the same thing; but then I suppose that might merely be rationalizing our suffering as mortals.

>dude sorry about letting those rebels show up and genocide your people haha it was for your own good I swear haha

Superman never was all powerful. This isn't a fucking dilemma.

What are you talking about?

I, too, did the reading for my PHIL-1050 lecture

Maybe, but it doesn't matter

the idea that "God just voluntarily holds himself back from doing the right thing sometimes so he's still good" is a bullshit argument because when that happens, people die horribly

Who are you to say what the 'right thing' is? I'm sure when you were 6 years old, you would've thought it was the 'right thing' to have bedtime pushed back half an hour so you could finish your lego truck.

>Christianity

Yeah because that's the only religion that exists. I'm not a religious person but I find it annoying how atheists only attack Christianity.

>implying that getting your bedtime pushed back is in any way comparable in severity to people dying and economies suffering
what da fugg

>totally missing the point and not understanding metaphor

I guess it's true, atheism does a correlation to autism.

This is babby's first argument against god, isn't Lex supposed to be a genius? Surely he'd have a less sophomoric position on the possibility of a deity?

It could be said that if God is all powerful, then he is beyond morality, as His senses would be greater than ours. If you consider morality a human concept, then only something with mental capacity similar to that of a human can be regarded as good or bad. So God, so far beyond humanity, simply could not be considered good or bad.

what was your point? that God holds no value to your life and snuffing it is equal in his eyes to forcing a child to go to bed early? that's not a God who is good, that's a cruel chessmaster God who uses his people like pawns and cares nothing for their well-being

This.
Watching so many people be impressed with lowbrow quips puts a smirk on my face. It can't be helped.

They're shit scared to attack Islam even though they double down on everything asthists attack Christians for

muh god lmao
i go to heaven u go to hell

Yes, if God is everywhere and can do anything then he wouldn't allow bad things to happen to good people (Luthor getting abused by his dad).

And if God doesn't allow bad things to happen to good people, he can't be everywhere and do anything because bad things still happen to good people.

Of course, the discussion gets more interesting when you insert what "bad things" are and if they can be "bad" for both sides, what classifies a "good person", who deserves to have "good" things happen to them, if a "bad thing" can actually make a person stronger and better, etc...

That's why people say this is babby's first atheist thought, because it's not really in-depth or interesting.

And that's kinda the point, really, Lex is so self-absorved in his own delusion that he can't think really far. He sees Superman and he immediately see someone like his abusing father, someone with the power to destroy, doesn't matter what good he might do, he can't be all good. And that hatred completely blinded him to do the insane.

The challenge to Superman's God-like status given by Lex is only one facet of the general Superman question that BvS raises, as Superman himself struggles with his abilities and the fact that he can't help everyone, if he's more "bad" than "good" and so on.

I really wish Snyder just had a better script editor so his shit wouldn't come out disjointed and unfocused.

There are lots of counters to this argument but I think the most compelling one is that we simply just don't understand God. How could we, as tiny, flawed, insignficant creatures, possible understand the workings of a being that created the universe. We barely understand Plato and shit, let alone God.

Such foolish, small minded fools. God does not intervene. That's the price of free will.

>can't even refute it or discuss it
How does it feel like to be a chink and at the same time dumb?

The argument is that natural evils such as earthquakes and diseases shouldn't exist if god is both all-loving and all-powerful. He might choose to let humans do evil to one another, but why does he choose to allow babies to die of hunger, or earthquakes to kill thousands?

You could say that, but the god Luthor is talking about is also defined as all-good.

It's obvious that atheists hate film for which they cannot understand due to their austism. I'm sorry but atheism just stagnated into parroting dawkins.

>My Daddy use to hit me. This is Superman's fault for some reason.

DCucks will defend this.

It's called the omnipotent being paradox and its been around for a while. Did you honestly think hack Snyder had an original idea?

Except that earthquakes and diseases only exist because the universe has to have certain laws like causality and order.

okay this gets said all the time on this board. what the fuck does "high-level" philosophy even consist of?

Stuff that can't be found on youtube meme playlists.

It's pretty obvious that freewill is the cause for all human made evils. It's hard to really pin things like the War and grnocide when it's the agency of man that causes these things.

As for natural evils, I think both mainstream Christians and atheists agree that things like natural disasters and diiseases can be explained through the laws of the physical world. It's also agreed upon that this physical world allows life and humans to exist.

So, I really don't see why one would shake their fist at God for the existence of diseases if these strains of bacteria go through the same evolutionary process that made humanity.
I also don't see how one can shake their fist at God for hurricanes if the alternative is barren planet with no atmosphere.
You can't have your cake and eat it too

>implying "Good" applies to God univocally
>implying God needs to do stuff to be Good
Luther-er I mean Luthor doesnt know anything about philosophy.

being all good in the universe would mean that you would always eliminate any evil that is within your power to eliminate. the existence of evil depends on the laws of the universe. so if one were all good and all powerful, then he would immediately and forever in the past, present, and future, eliminate all evil in the universe by changing universal laws.

if god were to enter his universe that he created, and he intends to retain both his all-powerfulness and his all-goodness while doing so, then he would effectively, immediately, deconstruct the universe undoing his creation and retconning the universal history creating a whole new alternate universe which would make him no longer the god and creator of this universe.

Whoa....

Really activates my almonds.

How could a human possibly be able to rationally decide what a "God" can and can not be. Who are we humans to put "God" in a frame?

>literally babbies first philosophy class

Because thousands of years later and monotheists still don't have a good answer to it.

>Snyder chose to portray himself as a DYEL sperg

There is no such thing as "good". There's negativity and positivity. Humans would not enjoy happiness if they did not have suffering to contrast it with. Suffering allows humans to grow.

The reason God allows suffering is because in the Garden of Eden Satan challenged God by getting Adam and Eve to eat fruit from the tree of knowlege of Good and Evil. In effect he was saying that humans had the right to govern themselves without God. So instead of just wiping Satan, Adam and Eve out and starting over he allowed humans to rule themselves in order to show the universe that humans obviously can not rule themselves.

There have been multiple theologians throughout Judeo-Christian history that have addressed this argument (examples of these above)

Most Sup Forums users need to take a philosophy class

this

dumb argument, Christ washed away original sin and so now you don't have that excuse

Atheists attach islam all the time. You tend to see them attack christianity the most because that's the religion they grew up with.

And by "examples" I mean examples of counter arguments, not theologians

No. It's like an antique trying to understand whatever beyond quantum physics. Our notions of power and right and wrong, etc. is from creatures that just crawled out of the swamp, relatively speaking.

Maybe this life doesn't matter, fucktard. Ever think of that? Or did mommy hold your hand through preschool?

Of course, but this is high school stuff. The fact that it was presented as some sort of philosophical revelation kinda made be feel bad fro Snyder.

Yeah thats true but the reason why Armeggedon hasn't started yet is because God wants to allow time for as many people as possible to come to an accurate knowlege of him and his son. But the last days are here and it won't be long until the day of judgement is here.

literally start with the greeks

>haha yeah that hurt like a motherfucker, didn't it?
>sorry about that broseph but it was for your own good, mang
>water under the bridge now, haha
>now suck my balls some more and tell me you're thankful for that pain
>and you might get into muh sekrit club. maybe.
>otherwise I throw you in the incinerator forever, haha

Christ is the proof that humanity cannot govern life. God is merciful by allowing fuck ups such as yourself into paradise if you can pull up your pants.

>But the last days are here and it won't be long until the day of judgement is here.
people have been saying that for 2000 straight years. remember when that was supposed to happen in 2012?

looks like someone doesn't understand original sin or Jesus' sacrifice

>Problem of Evil literally covered in my first philosophy class

get this pleb shit /out/

Look at you try.

You're begging the question.

The power of the man is to give meaning to things that don't have any. Just like moralities; twisted emotions mixed with social/environmental history.

The fun idea of God is that it's something that surpass our comprehension, yet we still try to pin it down with the curiosity we got from him.

don't forget to state the question so long as you're offering

>smart people can't be blinded by emotion

Better to be silent and let others think you're stupid than to post and remove all doubt.

that still doesn't explain why a God allows innocents to get tossed into the meat grinder when nothing ever comes of it except pointless suffering

That was some mayan calender nonsense. We don't know the day or the hour but we know the signs. Once the the world's governments turn on religion we will know its soon

>"look at me and my childish view of right and wrong. I'm putting an all powerful and all knowing being to the same standards and complexity as an average joe like me and you. Look at how stupid you look when I severely oversimplify and trivialize the topic."

well you can certainly continue to be willfully obtuse and pretend that not actually arguing is an argument

Haha yea left them alone!

>nice Tower of Babel
>nice boat you got there

Still begging the question.

>some prick's right to get off by killing people is more important than your right to keep breathing, therefore I'm going to allow it to happen
t-thanks

You're an idiot. It's perfectly clear what I'm saying. Maybe not to a moron like yourself but I can't be blamed for your mom's poor choices.

See it sucks but its for the best and the good thing is that it won't last forever just look at the news. Food shortages more rampant, earthquakes becoming more numerous and destructive, war and pestilence it all there

What's keeping you from doing something to stop this? Seems a human failure, not God's fault.

>See it sucks but its for the best

>tower of babel
God told man to fill the earth not all live together in one city
>boat
Not sure what you mean by this one.

If we were happy all the time we wouldn't be really happy. That's call a status quo.

>implying God "gets off" to death and that suffering in the world isn't a result of living in a universe that is maintained by the simple laws of cause and effect

You sure got me, user

God knew that Eve was gonna bite the apple.

>implying that human-on-human atrocities like war and genocide are simple cause and effect natural laws
wew

God gave us freewill. He allows suffering but does not cause it. Satan rules this world not God for now

so God isn't all powerful because Satan has usurped his control over the world?

While I don't believe in some big, all powerful guy who controls everything, I do believe that you get what you give, and thats theres some sort of balance or 'thing' rolling in the background that we haven't figured out just yet.
Its probably just confirmation bias, or due to my overly positive attitude, but i've always been very, very lucky in life.
Not like 'winning the lotto' lucky, but little things, like machines double vending all the time, getting free furniture and stuff from people, getting the fuck out of situations before stuff goes wrong, that sorta thing.

Whatever it is, life is good, amigos, and I wish the same for you the rest of this year!

The premis is free will and free will allows this to happen

and how is God going to explain that logic to the victims of these atrocities who never got justice
>yeah, that was supposed to be a lesson to the wealthy 1st world countries to take a more active role in monitoring human rights abuses in sub-Saharan Africa. they didn't take it to heart, sorry about that.

Are you assuming that God predestined that Eve would eat the fruit? If so than that would mean that God didn't create us with freewill. Even though God can see the future doesn't mean that he predetermines our fate. Just because a strongman can shatter glass by picking it up doesn't mean he will crack any cup he picks up. He can choose when to or when not to predict the future.

Should God stop the bullet?

>blaming the failures of man on the failures of God
Looks like you found the perfect scapegoat and humanity didn do nuffin

Satan rules the world because God allows it not because he was overthrown.

People are too cynical on Sup Forums to believe ''The love you give is the love you receive''. It's the best premise for happiness.

Predestination is the biggest theological cancer Christianity has ever encountered

Yes
All of these things can be explained through cause and effect

Wars are the effect of long histories and political decisions and the same can go for genocides.

why would God allow the literal devil to control the world if he's all-good and has humanity's best interests at heart?

>I do believe that you get what you give, and thats theres some sort of balance or 'thing' rolling in the background that we haven't figured out just yet.

I used to believe in this and most decent people do but the longer I live and the more I encounter massive cuntbags and borderline psychopaths who are hugely successful because they have no qualms about fucking people over. The whole altruism thing worked well when we were hunter gatherers and living in small villages but in modern society its fucked or be fucked.

what upsets me is the ignorance to the fact that the barbarian raiders who sacked Western Rome were the initial cause of the dark ages, and it was their continued threat that kept the manorial system of governance in place, and from such a power vacuum Christianity was allowed to exert their teachings as supreme law
but don't expect intelligent writing from Family Guy

Here's some thoughts on the problem of evil

peterkreeft.com/topics/evil.htm

See

The premis that Satan rules the world often means that humans in general are tempted to sin, often times commit sins, and these sins shaping the world around us. Since Satan is the father of sin and the representation of rebellion against God, all sin is an extension to his power.

Parlor tricks and practical jokes.

My understanding of god is he got bored and said hey fuckers have fun. The bible has a lot of shit where people don't give a fuck if people die throw some deference to god and do what you can. If you survive your suffering good on you shit gets bad carry your faith. Yes the point is free will the problem as far as I am concerned it the concept of heaven. Heaven is how you carry yourself on this earth and looking to history immoral actions cause in some great counter genocides. The bible is important because it tells you how to live properly in the kingdom of heaven .

>Even though God can see the future doesn't mean he predetermines our fate
then by that logic Time is therefore something out of gods control