I like the concept of metal in theory, but I can't really get into it in practice. The melodrama and testosterone-fueled moaning just comes off as cringy and try-hard rather than actually powerful and meaningful. What would you recommend I listen to?
Pic SORTA related - I can stand it but I don't love and am not blown away or anything
bathory
>waaaah I don't like the yucky cringies
grow a pair, fuckface
Metal's not that great. It's not worth it in the end. The only stuff worth listening to in the genre is maybe, just maybe the music that doesn't try to be tryhard manly or w/e like some black or folk or prog or post metal type stuff because at least it's not trying to LARP as something embarrassing. Even then it's only some of those subgenres, too as they are 99% infested with the tryhard LARP syndrome, too.
>Doesn't like "melodrama and testosterone fueled moaning"
>Posts Venom
I don't know what to tell you. Venom was literally three kids from Newcastle trying to be as edgy as possible to scare soccer moms. Cronos has outright said the Satanic image was an act to look cool compared to other bands at the time
youtube.com
>trying to be as edgy as possible to scare soccer moms
No shit. Young musicians being edgy for childish reasons like that isn't just part of metal. Doesn't make it any less cringeworthy. Like, a lot of Sup Forums is like that so it seems fitting, but ultimately IRL it's just childish and embarrassing.
Opera's not that great. It's not worth it in the end. The only stuff worth listening to in the genre is maybe, just maybe the music that doesn't try to be tryhard dramatic or w/e like some modern or contemporary type stuff because at least it's not trying to LARP as something embarrassing. Even then it's only some of those subgenres, too as they are 99% infested with the tryhard LARP syndrome, too.
right, cause on a stage or in music videos is "IRL"
Imagine being this concerned with aesthetics and image. Try listening to this music this time, okay buddy?
Opera isn't trying to be masculine while having dumb fantastical and cringeworthy aspects attached to it that work counter to that goal. Not only that, Opera's a very versatile genre of music that offers far more musically than metal ever can or ever will in terms of how much depth and complexity is there.
But what's the point of listening to a music genre if it doesn't make me feel cool and mature and serious?
How many technical thrash metal songs do you know how to play?
Because its fun
But what I said is clearly aimed at the music though, although it can work for non-musical image and fans as well. Metal's pomp that comes with it's approach to riffs is counter to the masculine persona that it tries to achieve. Genres like hardcore punk or hip hop have certain styles that are focused on making masculine music that do it far better than metal as they kind of sift through the bullshit and get straight to the point.
I think I can still crank out Nosferatu by Coroner, granted it's been seven years since I played the song so I am not entirely sure. Also
>technical thrash
>being comparable to Opera in depth and complexity
>metal at all being comparable to western art music in depth and complexity
>popular music at all being comparable to western art music in depth and complexity
Lmao
>testosterone-fueled moaning just comes off as cringy and try-hard
Listen to something else then you fucking faggot
Here's a secret - a lot of it is meant to be fun.
>Opera isn't trying to be masculine while having dumb fantastical and cringeworthy aspects attached to it that work counter to that goal.
right
cause being manly is all about being ghetto and real
ain't no such thing as fantastical depictions of manliness
>Not only that, Opera's a very versatile genre of music that offers far more musically than metal ever can or ever will in terms of how much depth and complexity is there.
right
cause "versatility" matters more than sick riffs, and random 20-something suburban fuckheads should always value the former above the latter, huh?
grow a pair
It is IRL when taken into the context of daily listening.
but fun is cringies! CRINGIIIIEEES!
right
so nobody should listen to opera on a daily basis because then it counts as IRL
guess you're fucked if you're working on one then,
All you criticized was LARPing (you clearly don't know what LARPing is) which has nothing to do with the music substance.
There's a difference between being manly and fantasizing about being manly. You would know that even what metal's idiocy reduces to fantasy depictions on manliness (Beowulf, Siegfried, etc.) actually have far more mature and interesting connotations beyond that.
>cause "versatility" matters more than sick riffs
Yes because if all you do is "sick riffs" you're one dimensional, thus not really worth spending a lot of time on because due to not being engaging enough and as a result boring as fuck.
>grow a pair
I did, once I stopped listening to LARP music and decided to get my shit together. Like, shit there's a reason you see mostly fatasses and skinny kids at a metal show. It's all show. You yourself are being an internet tough guy who probably hasn't hit the gym except maybe a handful of times to act tough because you can't get the discipline to stay in there and actually better your life as that's not what metal is all about, it's all about things magically fucking happening.
>metal riffing is counter to the masculine persona
whoa
>Genres like hardcore punk or hip hop have certain styles that are focused on making masculine music that do it far better than metal as they kind of sift through the bullshit and get straight to the point.
you mean riffs and lyrics?
oh wait
Oh, you're one of those kinds of snobs.
>mature connotations
what a load of horseshit
they're just badass heroic figures, just like Joey deMayo in his fake abs bulletproof vest
sick riffs are engaging on their own, they don't need extra dimensions to be engaging
grow a pair
>Meaningful
What do you even mean by that? There's plenty of black metal or even nsbm that's "meaningful" and powerful. If you don't like people trying to be masculine then a genre made up of fat sweaty dudes isn't for you
I...what? This doesn't even make any sense. I am so glad I got out of the metal community; you guys are retarded.
Metal's the epitome of musical LARPing because it claims to be about riffs yet tends to not be that diverse when it comes to guitar riffing, takes structures from classical/prog only to water them down making them kinda pointless, and then tries the whole aggressive thing to be tough but still has the more melodramatic stuff from earlier so it can't even do that right. Metal's the epitome of the musical equivalent of LARPing as it's trying to be all these things but does none of them that well.
>I started working out two months ago and am now the Übermensch: the post
>you mean riffs and lyrics?
No. I mean the meat of the music. Hardcore and hip hop don't really do music like metal, they are more straightforward which for the sake of making something more masculine (so qualities like heavy, upbeat) works better than metal's pompousness.
>they're just badass heroic figures, just like Joey deMayo in his fake abs bulletproof vest
>he never actually read the works
Lmao
>sick riffs are engaging on their own, they don't need extra dimensions to be engaging
Nah, they are limited musically to have much to engage with while not straightforward enough to create something truly manly.
of course it doesn't make sense, it's what your bullshit ideas about metal imply about opera
now stop saying shit that isn't true like
>melodrama can't be manly
or
>riffs have to be diverse
or
>metal doesn't do riffs well
or
>watering down prog is pointless
Larpy metal is the best kind
nice to see you try to tie your contradictory bullshit together into a nice little package of "neither nor"
too bad metal is actually both, depending on the band.
Newsflash, fuckhead: pompousness and straightforward riffs aren't mutually exclusive, and power metal is the proof
What styles of metal have you tried listening to? Venom kind of sits in the middle of a number of genres, so its kind of hard to tell what you might actually like based on your opinion of it alone.
But I am not even sure what you were trying to say about Opera? Were you saying we can't listen to it because it has melodrama? Because I made case that Opera works very differently from metal and comparing them is apples to oranges.
Melodrama isn't manly. Nobody calls Dungeons & Dragons manly. Like you can look at some characters in it and think they are manly, but DnD itself isn't manly.
Riffs need to be diverse. Otherwise metal is no different from top 40 tier trash in terms of not being able to communicate much as a form of music because so much of it is the same.
Metal doesn't do riffs well. It purposefully limits itself to use a select set of tropes that are objectively far more limiting than what many other genres have to work with.
This is now a "songs soyboys will never understand" thread:
>[punk is] better than metal as they kind of sift through the bullshit and get straight to the point.
This is exactly why I refused to listen to metal during my teenage years, it was too cheesy to be associated with and lacked punks sincerity and authenticity , except for bands like Napalm Death
Then I got into grindcore (Carcass was the entry point, I bought Symphonies of Sickness unheard based on the cover collage) and Death metal which were so over the top, it wasn't an issue.
Then I started listening to Dio and Judas Priest but only out nostalgia (loved them both in elementary and middle school) and irony.
Then Black Metal because it was such a mix a ridiculousness and the fact that some of these guys really acted out this shit.
By the time I was in my late 20s I was comfortable enough with myself that metal, no matter how ridiculous, fell into the'Fuck You I Like It' category along with anything else i enjoy.
I mean, if Im chatting up a chick and the subject of music comes up im not going to lead off with metal, but I ain't going to deny it either and I will explain to her exactly what I like about it. (So far I've gotten my metal hating gf to actually like blackgaze and folk metal. And the song Flying Whales, she told me she couldn't help but start to love it seeing how into it and how much love and fun Id have every time it played: NOW I CAN SEE THE WHAAAALES
>nice to see you try to tie your contradictory bullshit together into a nice little package of "neither nor"
>too bad metal is actually both, depending on the band.
What's gonna be your example of both, huh? Some garbage band like Venom or Hellhammer which itself couldn't be that way without taking influence from punk music as well while still wasting too much time doing dumb metal shit musically?
>and power metal is the proof
Oh you mean the genre that even when it has straightforward riffs will have a vocalist trying to be showy as fuck followed by a wanky ass guitarist trying to be showy as fuck? Or the genre that can also with straightforward riffs try to be some faux symphonic bullshit? Epitome of LARPing, although in a different way from a lot of other metal.
Bunch of idiots from both sides in this thread.
Disliking metal is an unserious position
80s normie trash
That's great, I started off liking the genre, and at one time only really listening to it. When initially going into other genres, I only liked it more. But once I got into other music and started getting a feel for it more, I just found metal to be a waste of time as it doesn't really have much to offer.
okay here's the thing; listen up:
Opera works a lot like metal regarding everything you call "LARPing"
riffs don't need to be diverse
the only thing worth communicating through music is the urge to bang your head
melodrama can be manly
DnD is manly when it's got manly shit in it or manly people playing it
metal does riffs well
the limits of metal are the limits of optimal riffing
incorporate those facts, get fucked, and shut up forever
I like metal but hate the false masculinity and the subculture, fuck you faggots
LARPing: Live action roleplaying. What about music is live action? None of these guys are role playing as anything in the first place.
Fuck you too, asshole
Actually yeah, that's what I mean, because I'm not a whiny faggot who's afraid of cringies
right, cause you're all about that real masculinity, with your beard and your IPAs and your lumberjack flannel
>repeating essentially the same shit without actually being able to say otherwise on anything I said
Lmao, I guess that urge must be to bang your head against a wall or something to get this dumb.
Idk how you haven't figured out that LARPing has been used itt, and is often used as a figure of speech of people pretending to be something they are not. Are you that new?
This doesn't work when there are more metal themed craft beers out there than metal themed of other alcohol. Makes sense since craft beer is highest calorie shit that makes you fat.
There's plenty of metal that's like punk. Ildjarn is more punk than most punk bands
I kinda feel that way about punk - my first musical love.
I still love it, but it hasn't had anything much new to offer for years. I really don't give it a fair chance if its new - if its too boundary pushing (Shape of Punk To Come, say) its not punk to me, or at least the punk i love - and if it just sounds like a 3rd generation rehash I just want to hear the original
It also doesn't help that punk has moved from the original working class liberalism I enforce, to whiny identity politics entitled shit that's more about being offended than offending people (looking at you GLOSS or whatever AJJ is called now)
Their music isn't aggressive though.
Apparently metal riffs aren't diverse just because they have a consistent style and set of techniques. Creating music within a defined style creates more subtle and interesting diversity than lazily shoehorning in other styles.
Wow
wow wow wow wow
wait.
Hold on a sec there, buddy.
Didn't I tell you to get fucked and shut up?
I believe I did, but just in case:
Get fucked and shut up
Lol what?
Most fans across genres are retarded, sane people understand that
>Are you that new?
No. I've fought people about this many times before. That doesn't excuse improperly using a term. By the way, you seem like a cool guy. And by cool guy I mean faggot, it's just a figure of speech.
That's on you for not enjoying the directions the genre chooses to take. A lot of the best stuff today hasn't lost its DIY ethos.
Yeah, but that counts more for styles like baroque music where there's a lot of room for subtle, interesting diversity despite having certain standards of consistency. Metal doesn't have that kind of room composition wise.
Walk on home, boy ;)
So, actually that autistic or just trying to double down for the sake of argument? YOU DECIDE!
>Metal doesn't have that kind of room composition wise.
[citation needed]
just found this album, try it. it's like rock but heavier IMO, less of real metal but still a great album
merlin666.bandcamp.com
Where do you guys go to keep up with new black metal?
>wrongly using a term
>i-it's just a figure of speech!
Metal is literally just simplified sonata form structurally.
>metalfags being so btfo they are arguing semantics
How weak
Low-T confirmed.
>Metal is literally just simplified sonata form structurally.
We're talking about riffs here. Diversity of INDIVIDUAL riffs.
>diversity of individual riffs
There's literally none lmao because most of the time it's gotta be power chords, it's gotta be aggressive, you can't have much dynamics, and everything's gotta stay together on the same beat. There's no real harmonic nor rhythmic variety that you can have here. Even the dissomemes often stick to the power chords/thirds type shit but add a note to it. Pretty boring genre of music.
There is plenty of diversity to effectively communicate. That's what music is about after all, not how much diversity or variety there is. You are also ignoring riff diversity beyond their strictly music properties. Diversity of what each riff communicates even if they are similar in structure and technique.
>you can't judge diversity of music strictly by their musical properties
What?
>Diversity of what each riff communicates even if they are similar in structure and technique.
That's all surface noise, and ultimately as uncreative as it gets (or maybe a step up after top 40 trash often using very similar chord progressions.)
Why can't you grasp the idea that there is more to music that the theory behind it?
ITT
You do understand that theory is being used to talk about aspects of the music we can hear, right? Like I am trying to explain why it all sounds the same using formal but more unanimously used terms.
The piece you are missing is the effect music has on the listener. Why a piece of music affects someone a certain way can't be described through theory alone.
Sure, but then we are entering realms of subjectivity that have no real room in terms of discussion because it makes the very act of discussion pointless.
Exactly. People like metal because it communicates and appeals to their sensibilities. You can't argue against this with theory.
Sure, but that's not exclusive to metal, either though but all music that exists, period.
I didn't think I tried to say otherwise.
Then don't enter into discussions about music with others if you just want to go with "it's all subjective in the end."
Don't try disprove subjectivity with music theory. "It's subjective in the end" is the logical conclusion to every argument about whether a genre is good or not.
I didn't. I don't see how the concept of discussing how one feels based on looking at the actual aspects of something is somehow foreign to you. But I guess this is where you gotta go with your argument since everything else didn't work for you when you actually tried to discuss the music.
But part of why metal is great is because it's goofy and cringey.
Your argument is that metal is bad because it doesn't meet certain musical requirements without taking into account the subjectivity of how music affects the listener. I'm sorry I didn't want to endlessly argue with you about music theory when it doesn't mean anything to the initial subject.
OP here. I regret starting this thread. I'm just gonna stick with NWA. Cya
No music isn't cringy and tryhard, musicians are parading themselves out there for attention, and think they're so important that they have a right to inflict their music on the world despite the sea of music already out there.
Holy shit you are such a faggot
you posted a thread on Sup Forums, the fuck were you expecting?
i recommend you listen to something else.
metal IS cringy try-hard stuff.
oh, yeah, and then there's Motörhead of course.
People who hate on metal are clueless about music
metal is awesome - if you are a teenager.
be honest OP, did you actually want recs or did you want to just shit on metal
...
How insecure are my my dude
the metal will never die
Get angry at something for once instead of being a weak, sterile pussy
Difficult to play =/= complex or deep
I can write a super fast tempo piece that's nearly impossible to play but which only has two notes or a piece which only has three notes that are spaced very far apart in an instruments register and played at speed.
None of that is musically complex, but point is you can something very hard to play with very little depth or complexity.
You can shred across a blues progression like a God but even if what you're playing is super hard to recreate, that doesn't necessarily make it complex.
It's worth noting that a lack of complexity or depth doesn't make something good or bad any more than the complexities in Seigfried make it good. It's all a bit meaningless unless the piece is written/played with emotional conviction.
im angry at you cunt
FUCK OFF
FUCK OFF CUNT, FUCK YOU
...
>implying opera isn't used in metal
>implying there isnt an entire subgenre of metal dedicated to this
But then discussion becomes pointless, if you truly believe what you're saying you wouldn't started at all. It's not arguing about theory, I just used terms that entail music theory to describe the music. I don't see how this so hard for you guys to understand, stop looking at theory as this esoteric thing that instantly makes music better or worse; it's just describing what you can hear. If it's that hard for you to describe why you do/don't like something, perhaps you're too fucking stupid to discuss it.
NWA does go far harder than most metal even if story wise their stuff is a bit exaggerated.
If you stop believing in what the metal genre brings conceptually then yeah you stop becoming insecure.
>implying having some operatic bits is anywhere close to actual opera
Only metal fans will make posts like this on this site. There's definitely idiocy and autism from other genre fans, but metal really takes the cake.
You maybe lack of testosterone, man.
classicfm.com
holy shit I see you in almost every thread on metal on Sup Forums with the exact same arguments, can you not get it through your dumb head that people listen to metal for the riffs and it's intensity
Please show me a genre that has riffs as intense and hard-hitting as death metal
youtube.com