Learning a non-linear written language gives you the ability to perceive time non-linearly

>learning a non-linear written language gives you the ability to perceive time non-linearly

ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME?

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linguistic_relativity
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I agree it was kind if stupid. Fuck I wanted to love this film.

D E T E R M I N I S M

LOVE DUDE IT TRANSCENDS LOGIC

I don't mind the non-linear part, but it should only apply to memories you already have... which it does, as the accompanying short story proves, but it's kinda a key piece of information that they leave out of them movie.

That's fine, but they needed to have shown the daughter die in a car crash or some other scene to show that what she "remembered" is not exactly what ended up happening.

Jesus this movie was crap.

What the fuck is non-linear written language anyhow?

This movie reminded me of Inception. Both are overly complicated shit sacks that normies like because they are unnecessarily convoluted, so it makes them feel smart.

>something something language can rewire your brain
That small piece of dialogue.
I was confused by that leap when I saw the movie too.

Just stick to superhero movies and the big bang theory, you don't need to to pretend to try to understand anything more complicated than that

normies did not see this movie.

Not cool bro, spoiler that shit

I liked it. Yeah it has some flaws, and the time perception thing is way too much of a stretch, but the premise is interesting and the story moving.

Except that Arrival actually has good direction, characters, and an interesting plot and script.

You can criticize both movies for not making sense (which would be right) but if you really think either of them are "complicated" or "convoluted" you need to off yourself, friendo.

Still don't get how learning an alien language can alter how you perceive time. To continue with your capeshit reference, I could understand that it happened to Dr Manhattan after his sci-fi accident, but not the lady in this movie.

so if she has "memories" of the future, couldn't she just change it? like, not have the child? eat pasta instead of a steak for dinner?

>We'll need your help....in 3000 years

no, see also she doesn't 'see' the future or has simply memories of it, she lives the future

example: she's in the present and then the physicist mentions "zero-sum game", then she goes to the future and tells that expression to her daughter

>she lives the future
so you're saying she's living all the moments at the same time, there's no cause and effect anymore?

...

>convoluted
it was plain as a brick compared to Interstellars dimensionwoodoo

How did it work in the short story?

try to learn other languages beside your american english, you'll get the clue what he meant

learn a new language and see if you don't act any differently.

I'm a lot more social while speaking my 2nd language but I'm super formal while speaking my 1st language.

The story wasn't explicit about whether she could actually see the future or if she was just remembering things nonlinearly

sameguy

Obviously I'm not saying that it should explain how she's able to perceive time differently, just saying that learning a new language changes you.

Arrival is Villeneuve's latest yearly-attempt to convince pseudo-cinemphiles that he's an artist. In it, he has a vague non-sensical sci-fi plot about time travel. Where smart films, such as the original Iron Man or Christopher Nolan's Inception, construct a believable world and then weave sci-fi themes around it, Arrival goes full idiocy. We get telepathic aliens that look like hands and can see the future who teach Amy Adams to time travel so that she can save the world so that the world can save the aliens in the future. Sounds stupid? That's because it is. And don't be confused by the trailers, there are no big set-pieces, no explosions or shoot-outs. Just 2 hours of Amy Adams acting confused before she realises that Jeremy Renner is the father of her dead baby from the future. Yeah.
Arrival is an attempt to copy Nolan's contemporary classic, Interstellar, but without the interesting space-travel and without the emotional impact that leaves you in tears. I'd say Villeneuve needs to take a break from filmmaking to figure out his strengths, but BladeRunner 2 is coming soon so we know there's no hope of that happening.

seemed to me like she was still perceiving time linearly at the end, but she could shift back and forth. rewind and fast forward. although i don't know how it would be to perceive time non-linearly, or show it in a linear movie for people who perceive time linearly.

Man, I really wish they would make another movie like Contact, which is primarily concerned about what would happen if aliens actually made contact with us, how people would react and how we would establish communication with them.

I liked the part about learning their language, but the premise was still a bit too direct, with aliens just landing on the planet some day. I would like to see a movie or documentary about the scientific process of establishing a connection with an entirely new race from outer space, but so far the first half of Contact is the closest I've ever gotten.

I'm bilingual, English being my second language. I still think it was quite a leap for the movie to make. I still enjoyed it a lot though, you just gotta roll with it.

>smart films, such as the original Iron Man
HAHAHAHAHAHA
stopped reading there

fuck off
Villeneuve is at least not Refn (pretty pics with no substance), and he is around, maybe above Nolan's level (none of Nolan's flicks gave the tension what eg. Incendies did)

Nolan is a hundred times the filmmaker that Villeneuve is
Where Interstellar brought to literal tears and left me marveling at its cinematography, Arrival left me scratching my head wondering why a film about time travel made no sense

The short story's premise was basically
>what if Sapir Worf, but taken to an extreme

It's interesting, because the arrow of time isn't really a solved problem. To a single particle like an electron, there's not really a meaningful distinction between the past and the future. Time only has an obvious direction when you get a complicated collection of matter together, and even then only in the same way "down" is an obvious direction when you have a large mass to reference.

>DUDE WORDS MAKE YOU REMEBER STUFF WHAT IF ALIEN WORDS MADE YOU KNOW STUFF THAT HADNT HAPPENED YET LMAO

the point is that learning new languages changes the way your mind works. it's a science fiction movie not a documentary. things happen that can't really happen but it's about giving a message to the audience.

capefaggots are just mad the aliens didn't hand over a time machine or the plans for one. i bet the idea of a language virus really chapped your asses too in Pontypool.

>its a lets rip the good half of our plot from a Vonnegut novel movie

fug i hate these, music was goat though

i agree on that the space-travel act is a huge plus on interstellar's count, though, but it was also convulated too much, and had lot of shity clichés. And the time travel thing (5D-bookshelf ) makes even less sense there, than here. Villy made it much simpler.

>looks like typical alien drama movie
>trailer reveals nothing about the non linear time plot
>turboplebs on Sup Forums go to see it
>get bamboozled with the twist
>get mad because their genius intellect and superior kino critiquing minds were fooled into thinking the daughter shit happened before the aliens
>come on Sup Forums to shitpost about how it's so shallow and how they're too smart for it

kinda yes

which Vonnegut?

I like the idea that because the first broadcast from earth was hitler claiming absolute superiority over everything, all alien life has written earth off completely as a concentration of pond scum with delusions of grandeur.

It made no sense! I was empathising the entire way through thinking Amy Adams' characyer had depth cause her daughter died only to find out that she hadn't and apparently this counts as art? It's dishonest filmmaking and stupid. A good filmmaker like Nolan or Tarantino knows how to pull off a real twist without just saying fuck you to the audience

>learn moon
>whenever you go piss dick is covered by mosaic

Exactly what this gug said, except this time unironically.

This, Contact is one of the best. I wish they'd found a way to include the bit about pi from the book, but I can imagine it's hard to get across on film.

Honestly I don't give a fuck, it was a good movie which is more than I can say for 90 percent of movies I saw last year

slaughterhouse five

aliens that perceive the 4th dimension of time teaching a human how to do the same

similar to how watchman is just sirens of titan with superhero bullshit thrown on top; just enough to make it seem original, but if you strip it back all the good stuff is vonnegut

>Nolan's contemporary classic, Interstellar

film was holding my attention until the ending, where the bullshit just piles on too heavy and I stop giving a shit about the pseudoscience

basically the same as Interstellar

I really love how much chinese dick hollywood is sucking these days.

appreciate it

something like an oil painting

>good characters
character. singular. amy adams. the rest is plot device.

OP, you're a pleb. It was a great film. Best sci-fi film in recent memory.

The Arrival makes Interstellar look like Lost in Space.

Good filmakers don't care so much about twists.

One of the Heptapods mentions that time doesn't exist, it is just a human construct. We are wired to perceive reality in a linear way, while the Heptapods brain is wired to perceive reality in a non-linear way and they created their language based on this perception. Actually, their language is similar to ours in the sense that the circle is a 2D representation of a three dimensional object (their spherical, non-linear perception of reality), much like how a word is a 2D representation of an idea (a human way to perceive ideas).

>their spherical, non-linear perception of reality
Are you fucking dumb? Time is clearly cubic.

One of the things that pissed me off about this movie is that it raises a grandiose atmosphere, as if we were dealing with something profound, when in the end it is a much simpler and linear thing.

This movie is the latest pleb filter, if you like Arrival you need to see more good movies plain and simple.

>time doesn't exist, it is just a human construct.
Except it does, and it isn't.

In universe doesn't exists. The Heptapods said it.

There should have been proper closure explaining WHY learning the language results in a different perception of time. Instead the left the audience with the statement "i does lol now like it".

is there a difference

It feels like it does, but nothing in the laws of nature says it does.

It ruined the film for me. All my normie friends were citing sources where apparently the director of the film consulted some head scientists and that made it okay
THAT'S NOT HOW LANGUAGE WORKS.

you can't remember something that never happens

Actually the short story explicitly makes clear that the flash-forwards are in the future you huge fucking retard. Not sure how you can somehow miss this. It's in the fucking tense for fuck's sake
"you will bla bla bla".
Just KYS buddy.

That's what I was enjoying about this movie before the whole lmao time shit. I really like the whole how do we deal with first contact scenario when we aren't sure of their intentions at all but they aren't overtly hostile.

The explanation was presented in the film as it was because it's a real thing. There are entire areas of philosophy/neuro-science/linguistics on the way that the brain is affected by language
The film simply theorised that, if time is an allusion, theoretically the right language could affect your brain in such a way as to see through this illusion. It's an interesting concept. And despite the memers who write it off, there's actually no way of saying that it's objectively impossible since we have nothing close to the concept with which to measure it against - not that whether or not it's realistic really matters

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linguistic_relativity
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wernicke's_area

9/10 was about to type angry reply before realizing it was a troll post.

And of course people have to bomb the aliens every fucking time.

Look up the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis and linguistic determinism. It will give you almost everything you need.

>reality is cliched

movie could have been renamed "Woman Breathing". It was so goddamn distracting.

On another note this movie was bland as hell. They had so little content and yet dragged it out into such a long movie. It constantly felt as though they were trying to figure out where to go with it. Awful

It's like any science FICTION movie … if you try to dive too deep into the science or explaining shit, it just falls apart. They should have just left the whole perceiving time thing open and ambiguous instead of Amy Adam's character 'splaining things to us near the end.

This is the biggest fault with this movie. That, and if you are going to have flash-forwards, at least make the character look older. She looked the same, which was confusing. I realize they were trying to confuse the audience till the end, but don't do it in a way that makes me suspend disbelief after the fact.

But time isn't linear unless there is no gravity.

>It feels like it does, but nothing in the laws of nature says it does.
The entire concept of physics as we know it literally depends on time, retard.

The entire movie is literally based on that one theory that learning another language changes the way your brain works.
Villeneuve probably read it somewhere and thought it was such a cool idea that it deserved a movie, and it honestly is.

unfortunately you don't have to dive too deep with this one...

I want a movie where aliens spend years trying to communicate with us and then just say fuck it and leave.

As Nolan showed us, gravity and love are the only things that can transcend the fifth dimension, ie time

So while gravity might not be determined by time, that doesn't necessarily mean that time is determined by gravity

it's called real life user
look at the pyramids - you want to tell me some sub-human africans built those structural behemoths?

Time is the fourth dimension bro. Aside from that, there exists at most 7 (but probably 6) extra dimensions and they are all spacial.

>that doesn't necessarily mean that time is determined by gravity

General relativity states gravity curves spacetime. So the only way for time to be linear, is if there is no gravity.

The whole reason they explained it is why this movie was in a theater and not a direct to video art house film like say Primer or Pi.

I mean it was bad enough that they only had one splosion and no sex stuff, imagine if the main character couldn't spell out the film at the end for your average american movie goer.

well they actually depend on movement if you want to go that far with it

Define movement without using time.

You're next in line for a Nobel prize.

shit bro, i concede
time is non-linear. this is messing with my head

WE

yes

>people think science has even a minimal grasp on how the universe works when we were all riding fucking horses and barely had clean drinking water just a little over a hundred years ago
Science is in such an infancy it's fucking laughable to believe we know fucking anything.
This is hairless monkeys pawing at the ground staring at the stars.

It doesn't. Classical mechanics involves time as a fundamental variable, but the laws that govern particle interactions work just the same forwards as backwards. When you get right down to it, there's no difference between the future and the past besides entropy.

Do we know how bikes stay upright yet?
I remember they thought they understood it a few years back and then constructed a bike that shouldn't be able to stay upright under that model, and it still worked

You don't know that.

Back to your tank, Joe.

That's my point.

>I understand how gravity works therefore I can fly now

wrong, in the book you exercise free will by not changing the future because you let it happen.

The phonecall is just her seeing the future and letting it happen, same for her daughter

Dude that guy was in A Good Man with Steven Seagal

Show some respect

>besides entropy
so you're saying time DOES exist.
Think I'm adding besides to my list of "don't read anything before this word" list.
Current list:
But
Although
Except
Reddit

i want bookfags to leave