Try to redeem this character

This is without value doubt the worst Lex ever imo. Can anyone of you guys convince me why I'm wrong?

MARTHA

Nope, the film was obviously too deep to try convincing you anyway

He has hair, is young, not bald, handsome, full mane, and tall

Say hair again.

Make him less "WOOHOOHOOHOO GUIZ I AM SO CRAZY AND SUCH A RANDUMB VILLAIN" and more like the Lex in the DCAU

This. I can only hope they mature the character in future installments.

The only way to redeem this character is if his daddy did something truly horribly to him and it drove him nuts. Dude was insane. No sane person would do the things he did in that movie. Not my Luthor, baby.

Well he's a scheming Jew which is a realistic take on a classic villain

He is like a TDK Joker fanfic written by your average redditor.

Honestly, his portrayal of Luthor was so goddamn terrible that it took me right out of the movie. It was already dumb enough with the terrible, grimdark tone for Superman and the 'Martha' shit but this, this was the final blow.

The entire Doomsday thing just should've been scrapped and left for another movie. They should've just focused on Batman and Superman instead of bringing le ebin millenial Lex Luthor and his horrible CGI monster.

i caught about 10 minutes of this movie and every time he was on screen it was cringekino

whose idea was it to make lex luthor a retarded autistic child

how exactly is he gonna get out of prison now? im not sure "superman was dead so couldn't testify" will work again.

nothing he did was random or crazy, good job being meme'd though


he was only insane at the end once he found out about Darkseid, everything before that was planned.

I went into BvS without knowing anything about capeshit and I thought he was ok. He came across as arrogant and OCD. It would be cool to see him developed more following the events of that film

Jar of piss

>He came across as arrogant and OCD.
This. I don't get the cringe comments.
That was literally his character.

He was acting crazy ALL THE TIME in case Superman was watching.

He went actually crazy after talking with the Kryptonian ship.

He was in completely control for about 95% of the movie, moving everyone around like pawns without them even knowing.


His hate for Superman came from deep down, a mix of jealousy and disbelief torn right out of the comics that I haven't seen translated to screen before (heck, even DCAU Lex cared more about raw power than hating on Superman).


And he won.

wasnt random or crazy, it was part of his plan and a big "Fuck you" to the senator while referencing her conversation from before. Showing her that her attempt to get back at Luthor was all part of his plan.

?
What about that is random? That was set up in an earlier scene.

never did he act crazy before the kryptonian ship, at least not outside of normal super-villain crazy

That's what I mean.

If we think was acting stupid before then, it's because he assumed Superman could always be watching, and he wanted to look harmless.

In his own mind, the plan was to look like he was going to come at Superman in an ineffective way, and to actually come at him effectively; like Batman's plan. But Lex's plan involved deliberately taking poor security measures so Batman would do it instead.

>Puts a gummy bear in a grown mans mouth
>Rambles some vague religious shit
Totally normal

Impossibru for the current DCEU and with that actor. He's too young, looks too much like a muppet, and as others have pointed out, has such outlandishly childish ideas for master plans that he's never going to be as intimidating as Lex Luthor should.

The only possibility is that he's the son of the actual Lex Luthor who shows up later and is not played by Aderall Moot.

His reason for opposing Superman was crazy.
Like Snyder, Luthor thinks Superman is a god. Luthor cannot accept a world in which a gods exist, therefore Superman has to either die or become morally compromised.

It makes sense but not to a person of sound mind.

he put the candy in the guy's mouth as an act of domination, he did it after the guy gave him what he wanted, to show that he controls him. I never said it was normal, but it sure aint crazy.


Also it wasnt vague religious shit at all. He specifically talks about how people name their gods and points out the difference between Superman's name given by the people (Superman) and his chosen name (Clark Joseph Kent) to re-enforce his point of Superman being a false god to those that believe in him.

>His reason for opposing Superman was crazy.


What? No it wasn't. He specifically DOESNT see Superman is a god and is just pissy others do. Just like every other Luthor ever, except Hackman who just cared about real estate. It wasnt that hard to understand.

>has such outlandishly childish ideas for master plans

But he really doesnt, not anymore than any other super villain.

I get that it was set up and it came from what she said earlier, but think about it from the point of anyone else.

This guy took a random figure of speech she probably made up, set a plan to blow up the entire Congress to destroy superman's public image and break him. But he then fills up a jar of his own piss and labels it according to this metaphor to make some kind of point before she blows up. It's Leto-tier zaniness when you consider that it was some random shit she said and probably didn't remember.

Look, maybe you're used to having this argument with people who don't get the movie or people who hate the movie.

I understand BvS. I like BvS.

And I'm telling you. Go watch the rooftop scene with Superman and Luthor again, because the stuff Luthor says about "God can't be all-powerful and all-good" demonstrates what I'm trying to explain to you.

Luthor thinks the world is so bleak and fucked up that the only god he can accept must be as bleak and fucked up as his own world vision.

(In a sense, Luthor's madness could be seen as a projection of Zack Snyder's own limited worldview, because Snyder seems similarly incapable of representing the iconic Superman that is all-powerful and all-good.)

it was the last thing she said to him before the hearing and it probably wasnt actually piss just there to mock her. And again, it wasnt random, it was trying to show that her act of rebellion against Lex (the whole senate hearing) was all part of his plan. What she called revenge (peach tea) was actually helping her enemy (piss). It was classic Luthor mocking, right up there with that issue where he offers that waitress money to sleep with her and leaves before she answers, just to destroy her.

That's my assessment, too. The info-dump he got from the ship unhinged him a bit.

It will be interesting to see how he acts once he's had more time to process it all.

> Luthor says about "God can't be all-powerful and all-good" demonstrates what I'm trying to explain to you.


No, that is literally him explaining why Superman, or anyone, CANT be a god. Because he doesnt believe Superman is as good or powerful as part of the world is claiming.

You misunderstood.

also. you retard, Snyder DOES end up portraying him as all good AND all powerful in the end by showing that his death was just temporary.

>I understand BvS
>proceeds to not understand BvS

Eisenberg should have gotten an Oscar for his Lex Luthor performance.

fuck the haters

I genuinely thought he was really good as lex

I genuinely don't understand how people don't understand this.

His performance was good. he was supposed to be a silicon valley prodigy type character.

same
he is so good in that scene.

That's true, it's clever if you have all of the details like that, but when I saw it in theaters, I remember just thinking "man, he actually peed in that jar just to spite her".

I'll say one thing, BvS really is a movie that demands you pay attention to everything.

I didn't love the character but his acting was fantastic.

>it's a "trying to explain something with levels and symbolism to a pleb" thread

He doesn't even believe he's a god. He was fucking with him, too. Just like Senator Finch, and to exactly the same end - for Clark to know precisely how he'd been fucked when it was too late for him to do anything about it.

Goddam right.

You are not alone.

You're a delight.

> that is literally him explaining why Superman, or anyone, CANT be a god

Let me put it to you this way.

Say you show me a picture of a winged and feathered creature with a wide beak for a mouth and webbed feet.

You then ask me, "What does this picture show? What is it?"

I examine the picture and then look at you square in the eye and say, "It's not a duck."

You can tell me it's a duck all you want, but I'm going to insist otherwise, because, hey, it turns out for some reason I refuse, no matter what, to accept that ducks exist. In fact, it bothers me that you keep trying to convince me that ducks are real.

I then proceed to start ripping the feathers and bills off all the ducks I can find to prove that there's no such thing as a duck.

Would you say I'm crazy?

By trying to contradict the goodness and/or greatness of Superman, Luthor is trying to rip the feathers of a duck and call it not-a-duck. That's what a crazy person unable to accept reality as it is would do.

And when Zack has Superman die in heroic sacrifice at the end he demonstrates that the heroic ideal is ultimately a self-negating principle. Only a miracle can overcome this negation and make the spirit of the hero live again.

well put

You'd think Sup Forums would be tapdancing that a jew is Christ's nemesis.

superman birthright
little changes to the backstory aside, nothing he says or does is out of character


i think the only thing that really is outside the scope of lex's behavior in the comics is the domestic terror attack, and even that might be something with comic book inspiration

Didn't he have a breakdown while giving his speech at the fundraiser or whatever? Did that happen before or after he went in to the ship?

He didn't win. His goal was to kill Superman. Supes ain't dead

the speech was before the ship, and more about him identifying with prometheus and feeling unappreciated, i'm sure there's more to do with everything else going on in that scene and that he's the one 'bringing everything together' but i haven't pieced it yet

Same, his acting it's always mediocre but he just went the extra mile for this, even Kevin Spacey did it better.

Scene-wise, it's after, but it happens earlier chronologically. It's a backwards reveal, sort of like the underlying psychology behind why Bruce is branding the criminals he views as irredeemable. They take place side-by-side as well.

>replace with Michael Cera
>lex is now hilarious and enjoyable
This actually applies to any movie with Jesse whatever. Zombie land could be an easy 9/10 with that swap

You guys are all fucking all retarded. Even the people who like Lex and BvS got his motivation mixed up. Let me spell it out for you.

First off Lex hates being a person with little to no power. When he was a child he was beaten and was helpless. He couldn't be fucking saved because he had less power than his father and since God didn't help him he hated God, or the idea of God.

In comes Superman and now people are praising him and all the while Lex is once again a man with now power. He's nothing compared to Superman. This is where this line comes into play.

>The bittersweet pain among men is having knowledge with no power because... because that is paradoxical

So what does he do, he creates Doomsday to kill Superman. But that's not all because people look up to Superman. He has to prove this line that he says....

>Do you know the oldest lie in America, Senator? It's that power can be innocent.

..... and the reason he has to prove it is because if he kills Superman then and there some are going to view Superman as a good guy who just got killed. Lex doesn't want that. So what does he do? He forces Superman to make the decision of killing Batman. Lex heavily implies this mentality.

>They need to see the fraud you are, with their eyes.

There now stop bitching. Could it have been done better? Yes.

the social network was the only film he's been in that truly fit him, as it's the only time where his own personality and the character's personality actually matched (a smug self righteous semi-autistic asshole)

Jesse is a one note shitty actor and a complete miscast from the start
>But thats what they we're going for, a sperg
Fuck off. Thats a lie straight from Snyder himself so he could justify catering to Jesse since he originally said no to playing Jimmy Olsen.

With all due respect, you are incorrect.

He doesn't think Superman is a god. He thinks of him as yet another means to an end, and that end is more power and prestige for Lex.

>implying it has anything to do with his motivation

You're a fucking idiot if you don't think that this sperg wasn't miscast.

Imagine if a more seasoned actor like Kevin Spacey or Bryan Cranston had literally the same lines as him. This would be regarded as a masterpiece (ok that's an exaggeration but you get the point)

You're getting warmer.

kevin spacey had some similar lines in returns, but to a different end goal

I dont give a fuck what JesseLex's motivation was supposed to be, it was fucking pretentious shit and basically changed on the fly. Do you know what a simpler, stronger message would have been? Superman hinders humanities progress. Comic Lex had a problem with Clark because he was the ultimate safety net, something humanity became too reliant on. Moreover, Lex hated Clark because ALL of his accomplishments in business, science, and charity were completely overshadowed by a flying brick. God metaphors, daddy issues, and being a sperg, didnt really work

I feel bad for Eisenberg though, they could have had anyone play lex and if he acted like this id hate him, it's not Jesse's fault

is this seriously the only big movie to reference us like that?


that's hilarious tho, sharing little "leaked" footage of metas

>Moreover, Lex hated Clark because ALL of his accomplishments in business, science, and charity were completely overshadowed by a flying brick

that's in the movie, the stuff you're singling out is stuff that feeds into how he sees superman, which is ultimately exactly what you describe

It's fine. It's Jesse being Jesse and Jesse a cute.

he becomes the Joker after he shoot Jocuck.

Which is completely overshadowed by all the other shit that didnt need to be there user. By the time he began monologing about Martha being a witch I was about sick of his rambling and wanted Clark to just kill him already

As best I've ever been able to tell.

The reason I post it, though, is it's the only overt clue we get to what Lex was actually looking toward for an end goal.

I love this movie so much. It's the only cape movie I can ever remember seeing where the villain reveals almost nothing, and still has a monologue. It's all bullshit. Every last word of it.

So you don't want a new take on the character?

Pretty much most comments on this thread are about his motivation. But if you wanna talk about miscast, just replace Jesse with that guy from Smallville and you get about 50 more rotten tomatoes percentage points.

>By the time he began monologing about Martha being a witch I was about sick of his rambling


My God, I read posts like this and get amazed all over again at what they managed to do. It didn't just work on Clark, it worked on portions of the audience, too.

new=/=good user. Im all for trying new things with characters, but not if it becomes unfocused, stupid, and overall laughable thanks to the miscast actor trying to convey it

I just find it hilarious that even after all this time, about a year since BvS was shown, people can't still get the plot of the fucking movie. Just shows that any film that makes the audience think and analyze gets panned hard and bashed.

stick to your generic popcorn numale flicks please.

Underrated

What is darkseid

>Jar of his own piss


How do you know it's his? He's probably not that stupid. He probably used Mercy's.

Jesse Eisenberg's performance would have been perfect had he been playing the Joker. As such, it was just okay.

Or maybe it shows how awful of a storyteller Snyder is and how shitty Terrio writes and how poorly edited it is. But no, let's go with the it's too smart 4u argument since it's obviously the capeshit director with more intelligence.

>Worst
he's literally the best you tasteless fuck

>Which is completely overshadowed by all the other shit that didnt need to be there user. By the time he began monologing about Martha being a witch I was about sick of his rambling and wanted Clark to just kill him already
lol nice, an admission that superman on screen is a better man than any of us

and yeah sometimes i wonder about the extent to which snyder wants to go meta

snyder has said multiple times that his goal with lex is in a guy who "you can never quite pin down"

a lot of the 'problems' people express with the movie seem to be almost induced on the audience

no its definitely the latter in this scenario

I totally get where you're coming from, but what I was getting at is that the smokescreen didn't just work on Clark, it worked on us, too,

You don't call a man a god then call him a flying demon and his mother a witch in the very next breath unless you're fucking with them,

That monologue was granny's peach tea for Clark - something that he's not supposed to catch on to until it's too late for him to do anything about it.

Think back to what Lex said to Senator Finch right before the bombing. Then think about what had to be going through her head there in that final moment when she knew she was fucked and the guy who did it just got through telling her how he was going to do it.

let's take into context what Snyder's tasks are, He is given a task to create a film :

1) an origin movie for Justice League
a) this will include scenes and character development for Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman
b) have the 3 team up to serve as a basis for Justice League - obviously this has to be a super villain since how can any human stand against 3 superheroes?
c) have that super villain be engineered by a human to serve its origin and for connecting with the human personas of Superman and Batman

2. have a continuity to Superman's actions after the Man of Steel - this includes the political aspects of having an uncontrollable god exist in the presence of humans and its spiritual implications as well

3. Introduce Batman and relate him to Superman

4. Be distinctly different from Marvel movies - tackle the serious side of having heroes among us


Given this ginormous task, it’s amazing how Snyder was able to make it all work in his film. To cover all this points would take about 4 - 4 1/2 hours and I feel that if given the freedom Snyder would have done it so. A task of this magnitude would have failed Kubrick but Snyder has done it, although we admit this is not his best work but I would have loved to see what he could have done in a 6 hour epic Director's cut of Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice™.

I'm excited to see more of Snyder's work. I'm not trolling I really do. Even his adaptation of The Fountainhead, but I really wish I could see it in Snyder's intended form. Not getting cut down to what the studio wants. A 6 hour Fountainhead and Justice League and see it in Snyder's vision would be amazing to see.

i'mi think what you're saying makes sense even without considering characterization, as the stuff you're pointing out gets invoked by different people at different points in the movie, it would make sense for lex to do the same thing, with his personal considerations included
since we're on the same page,

"they have to see the fraud you are
"the blood, on your hands
does the cut look similar to the whole in superman's chest?

i swear to god the way dialogue and visual details are cross referenced and compared and juxtapositioned feels like a fucking rabbithole

I hadn't noticed that, but I noticed this from Suicide Squad.

So you agree that Luthor doesnt think Superman is a god? Okay then.

Neh , everyone "get it" Eissenlex actually spell it out for you, critics "get it" or why its your excuse for winning so many razzies? The paid critics one? the its2deep?
What happens its that all the themes are too heavy for a comic book movie, it look chessy, thats why Snyder don't want the characters to talk in costumes, and he is right.

To Lex, Batman, and the rest of the universe he did. Don't use out of universe knowledge for in-universe arguments.

The Joker already knows what's up.

guys, the library scene is really obvious. We know that Luthor, since the beginning of the movie, knows the secret identities of Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman. Both Superman and WW are there. Him fucking up the speech is Lex being so fucking mad at Superman and the idea of these gods that he fucks up his own speech, he has to suppress his anger at Superman and change his speech so it doesnt come off as overly hateful.


Its literally just that he hates Superman so much he can't give a proper speech because he is standing right there.

Please just read this.

And tell me you think you're even in the same conversation.

>Comic Lex had a problem with Clark because he was the ultimate safety net, something humanity became too reliant on

Nope, confirmed not reading comics.

Darkseid is the big bad of the DC universe. Originally the "New god" of fascism and complete order, he has since become just a kind of god of evil, or as DC calls it "anti-life."

haven't seen ss so can't comment
file name there indicates you caught on to something no one else has yet, pretty trippy mayne

This project could have been taken by anyone else and it would have been just as bad or maybe even better. It's really not amazing what he did. Anyone can come up with ideas. It's takes an utter genius to actually execute it properly. And as we've seen, BvS was far from a perfect execution.

This is actually a good post... regarding the whole name.

Thanks man.


Its weird, with the JL trailer Sup Forums has become a shithole and Sup Forums has become a bastion of conversation.