/trek/

Who was in the wrong here?

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None. The Maquis were abanonded by a Federation weary of war and left to fend for themselves. Sisko had an obligation to stop the Maquis from potentially precipitating another war and that alone justifies his actions to anyone that isn't some sperged out trek nerd.

The Federation were.

>Oh sorry bro, we gave away your homes to these reptile aliens so they'd stop attacking us
>Don't worry though, you can live in our wonderful Government Housing
>How dare you defend yourselves against them?! They're enriching your culture!

Oh look, another original start for a thread brought to you by DS9 fans

Siskos entire reason for hating Eddington is that him turning traitor was dishonorable like he is a fucking Klingon all of a sudden

The writers for that stupid holo-communicator idea. No wonder they ditched it quickly.

Didn't captain nigger intentionally poison federation planets? Not saying the maquis were good guys (though Eddington was badass) but I'm pretty sure chemical weapons are still banned in the Federation.

DS9 isn't for cucks like the other series, results are what matters not the way you obtain them

Yeah it was exceedingly pointless

I was fine with it, they had the tech to do it so there's no reason they couldn't, though I doubt they'd be bothered since there's no in-universe advantages over a flat screen unless they were doing something insanely niche like watching someone demonstrate something, like how to fix a piece of equipment.

They obviously chose to try it because it makes filming easier and actors can play off each other as they can see each other while talking.

it's because they wanted to rip off Star Wars to make it more appealing to a different audience

>Hey guys, let's add a 30 second holo-conversation to 2 episodes, that'll bring in the entire Star Wars audience when they Jedi-mind-meld that we did that
>t. Brandon Brontosaurus

Oh yeah that makes sense, that is definitely what they were thinking

>also let's add an intergalactic war against an evil empire
>also let's have our main character be a chosen one created by space midichlorians

>The democratically elected human government = Shapeshifting aliens from the other side of the glaxy
>Bacteria = 4D aliens living in a womhole
Holy shit how did I never notice the similarities before, I'm #TeamMerchandise now

>Anakin was literally created by the midichlorians and the will of the force
>Sisko is created by the magic quantum aliens that give super powers and let people shoot beams when they want
>there are jedi aliens and sith evil aliens

yeah, totally different and original and never seen before

also let's ignore how the defiant looks more like a Star Wars ship than a Star Trek one

DS9 is not some action flick

Its about the struggle of Bajor and its people

10 Million Bajorans died in the occupation
You think a show about 20 million dead is comparable to some bad sci-fi movie?
Belittling DS9 is belittling the deaths of 50 million Bajorans

Remember the 100 Million Bajorans

Fucking Spoonheads, I'm glad they had 200 million casualties by the end of the war, that's exactly 1 for every Bajoran turned into a lampshade.

Lmao let's bring it on in the knick of time for a heated debate about betraying uniforms that was ass backwards and then never use it again and all the Star Trek universe

>DS9 thread
>Still no Bashir Faggot

are they dead

Yes, cyberbullying is not a victimless crime

200 Million seems really low

Didnt the Dominion glass like 3 civilian cities in the last day or two of the war

and thats on top of all the military deaths on a galactic scale

I know Weyoun let like 500,000 die for nothing which is why Damar turned on him

800 million died on Cardassia Prime alone in the war's last day. And that's not counting Cardassian casualties in their fleets or on other worlds.

HE BETRAYED HIS UNIFORM

>triggering a nigger so much he apes out and genocides an entire planet

Remind me how blacks were allowed in the Federation again?

Tuvok doesn't count he was a Vulcan.

a lot of people died at Wolf 359 and they were running low on manpower so they put the first random guy in charge of a space station, not even one built by the federation because those were actually valuable

>prioritizes his family
>loves his wife so much he resists moving on and only does so after another black woman begs for his dick and his own son is trying to get them together
>annoyed by the very religion that sees him as a savior figure
>explores dangerous wormhole like any good explorer
>despite having no real Starfleet staff apart from an autistic Irish janitor, autistic on-again-off-again homosexual doctor, and a transgendered and lazy scientist, keeps a dilapidated space station running smoothly while managing the reconstruction of a planet full of religious zealots as he simultaneously attempts to improve relations with their former occupiers
>suffers from temporary mental insanity where he perceives himself to be an oppressed black man in a white-dominated society, but rejects this falsehood and associated sense of victimhood
>punches a demigod in the face
>makes minor mistakes such as chasing a traitorous terrorist across half the quadrant and being complicit in the murder of a foreign dignitary, but has the decency to feel guilt about the latter
Seems like a good guy to me, user.

>>prioritizes his family

L O L
I guess that's why Jake turned so good

>le punched Q!!

I see, another faggot glorifying mindless violence

Jake did turn out fine.

What were you hoping for, another Wesley?

I didn't say he was a successful father, but he did try. Q wanted to be punched, he's a degenerate masochist, Sisko understood this and was doing it as a friend.

I wish to have rough and passionate hate sex with you while you impale my dirty Cardie pussy with your superior Human babymaker as you berate me for how many cardies you killed in the war. Chief, I'm ovulating. RIGHT. NOW.

uh.... I Kekio is expecting me tonight to scream at me in her shrill voice because I walked in on her and the Bajorian Deputy last night.... sorry.

kek

>muh les mis

I think they were in the right but they lacked moral decency. The whole idea of them being antagonized simply because they Federation hated how they were thrown away in favor of their personal needs is asinine. They were removed because it was a necessary step in De-escelating a situation

>remove maquis
>the Cardassians still start a war against the federation

nice de-escalation, the Cardies cucked everyone

YOU BETRAYED YOUR UNIFORM

A C Q U I R E D

was he the last of the canadians in the 23rd century?

Wasnt Riker a canadian?

Alaskan. So worse, because no maple syrup or hockey.

Alaskan

One of you was baited, one posted the original query

>keeps a dilapidated space station running smoothly

This is something few people give them credit for, but DS9 was in shambles when they came, and within a year they had it (mostly) up to Fed standards.

Not only that, but the damn thing worked like a charm, despite being a decades-old, Cardie-Fed mashup held together with quantum ducktape and O'Brien's pure willpower. All the while serving as a massive trade hub and having 95% of the population be non-Starfleet folks from all walks of life.

Remember the Enterprise, the Starfleet flagship with the finest engineers and equipment the Federation could muster? Remember how it had catastrophic failures CONSTANTLY? The holodeck, a recreational facility, went rogue so many times.

Remember how many mishaps DS9 had with holodeck technology? Roughly zero, despite running permanent simulations (Vic Fontaine). The only times shit went south is when someone would trip over a wire and activate some Cardie kill-the-Bajoran-workers program.

DS9 was a fucking tour-de-force in keeping a station running. Picard was a better diplomat and flute player, but Sisko was orders of magnitude more capable of running Ops.

So you mean DS9 was badly written, makes sense.

Hilarious how the people that complain about Janeway being able to keep the ship in working conditions praise this now.

The federation. The idea of moving people around like that instead of defending them was downright shameful.

Also in Eddington's anti-Federation rant, Sisko was literally unable to come up with any decent counter point and resorted to incoherent yelling .

Nobody complains that Sisko can replenish his torpedoes because he never says that he can't.

Janeway, on the other hand, does say that she cannot replace her torpedoes, so the show is lying to us when she does it anyway.

youtube.com/watch?v=PIGxMENwq1k

>actual competent crew
>"badly written"
If anything TNG was badly written because a ship that broke down as much as the Enterprise would have been scrapped for its (barely-functioning half the time) parts.

In real life, if your car needs to go to the mechanic every few weeks you get a new car.

And the situations aren't remotely comparable, DS9 was a major trade hub with Federation supplies coming in constantly (O'Brien explicitly states they get parts), while Voyager was on its own on the other end of the galaxy with no credible way of re-supplying.

Complaining about Voyager looking spiffy after seven years of hardship is like complaining about the cast of Gilligan's Island somehow surviving all that time alone and no worse for wear - pedantic and superficial, but true.

Complaining about DS9 being a well-run station with no annual "random shit breaks down! drama!" bottle episodes is like complaining there's not enough reality TV out there - aka What the fuck are you doing, nigga?

so DS9 is badly written since they never actually explore how DS9 works and how everything is kept tight but instead it just happens and you fanboys declare it as the ""captain"" being extremely competent instead of convenient writing

thanks for agreeing

>Enterprise broke constantly

nice meme

ugh, DS9 chat

He did. The show's writing treated it as morally acceptable because it was a "fair" trade with the Cardassians. The show says nobody was killed by the poison, but it's such a toss away explanation line that exists just to put Sisko in the clear. It's like burning somebody's house down but acting morally justified because you didn't nail the doors closed when the owners fled.

What always let me down the most was how Worf had a moment of hesitation to carry out the order, but in the end bitched out and did it- and then it was never brought up again. A moment like that should have soured Worf against Sisko for quite a while. Worf should have taken that move seriously.

>It's like burning somebody's house down
The house should still be intact in your analogy, since the planet is still habitable.

to add to this obviously a moving spaceship is going to be under a constant different structural stress compared to a stationary base and require more maintenance

but I don't blame DS9 fans for not knowing this, the only ship they ever saw was the Defiant and its plot armor

>true facts that are even lampshaded by the characters
>"meme"
How much of a butthurt fanboy can you be?

Are you seriously asking why they didn't spend time detailing the re-supply patterns of a major space station? What the fuck am I even reading, this isn't Hearts of Iron, Star Trek NEVER micromanaged shit like that. The whole point of technobabble is "I don't have to explain shit".

And again, even by your anti-logic, it's trivial. Dozens of episodes state there are regularly scheduled trade routes passing through DS9, including Federation ships. They give them the supplies they need. Hell, I'm pretty sure they explicitly state this at least once (O'Brien saying they need to wait for new parts, or that he put in a request for new equipment). Which you would know if you actually watched the show.

How the Enterprise, which is constantly on the move, not always in Federation space, and certainly not next to a planet with (canonically) industrial-grade replicators never runs out of anything is an actual question, though.

>Alaskan

so...Canadian

It's like giving someone else's house to syrian refugees and then act as if you did nothing wrong because the house is still there and the people got away (maybe) before being raped or murdered

Not by humans. From the refugee's point of view he basically burned their house down. The show acts like he's not in wrong because graciously decided to not murder them as well.

>DS9 isn't for cucks
>literally has a story arc revolving around kiras mother being a comfort girl and her father being a cuck

Capped for future threads to shit on DS9.

DS9 makes sense in at least they can get replacement parts and supplies from the Federation


Voyager somehow remains pristine with a steady supply of torpedoes, biogel packs and new hull plating which comes from ???

>the refugee's point of view
You mean the same people that burned down the Cardassians' house?

Well, the analogy doesn't work, because the Cardassians' house is still standing too, and they get to go live in it.

And they're probably grateful that Sisko didn't arrest them after they burned down the Cardassians' house (which didn't burn down).

Nice dubs, not nice post desu.

But you must not have seen DS9 because literally hundreds of Starfleet, Klingon, Dominion, Romulan, Cardassian, Breen, etc. ships show up. Fuck, I've seen people complain a few threads ago that there were TOO many ships in DS9, since Wolf-359 was supposed to be this huge loss with only 40.


Not to mention that saying the Defiant had plot armor (when it lasted for less than three seasons and was used sparingly) is downright silly compared to all the times the Enterprise survived stuff it shouldn't have due to plot fiat.

DS9 is far from perfect but at least don't make up blatantly untrue criticism.

>lol the enterprise broke every episode!!!
>this is considered fact or meme

the only times stuff like that happened was when the ship was under extreme stress and doing something incredible

>b-b-ut the holodeck

if you actually watched the show instead of skipping the first two seasons or the entire show to go watch le based sisko meme you would have know that holodeck was REALLY NEW technology and almost experimental

Voyager scouted planets to acquire resources, even the ones that couldn't be replicated and traded with different races. Nothing absurd about keeping the ship working and in good state. They could replicate pretty much everything except some materials they could easily find

>Voyager somehow remains pristine with a steady supply of torpedoes, biogel packs and new hull plating which comes from ???

This is the nth time this as come up, but goddamn VOY makes me angry. The premise was fucking excellent and having a mashup crew of Feds and Maquis was a great idea.

If the show had committed to seasonal arcs and continuity, shit would have been cash. Watching the first season of Battlestar Galactica shows this. That show recycled concepts from VOY that the network turned down.

But Janeway says that they can't make more torpedoes. So how do they make more torpedoes?

I guess the Voyager writers have a low opinion of the audience, and they thought that we wouldn't notice.

Post examples of when the Enterprise would end up just breaking down for no reason instead of running into a gravity well or a area of subspace that fucked up their shit

they found new technology all the time, they obviously found a way to make new torpedoes

also did they ever tell how many torpedoes they actually had?

>industrial-grade replicators never runs out of anything is an actual question, though.
So you're saying you've never seen any TNG episodes? I can recall several where the Enterprise is docked for maintenance and restocking supplies

>also did they ever tell how many torpedoes they actually had?

They were constantly talking about being down to 'x' number of torpedoes in combat.

Post examples of moving the goalposts.

I'll start:

I watched all of season 1, m9. Encounter at Farpoint shows it as reasonably new, but not necessarily experimental. If they put it on a ship with hundreds of civilians it must not have been that bleeding edge.

Still, that's not a counter-point. Saying there was a reason for not working correctly is agreeing with my point (it didn't work correctly).

The Defiant's cloak was also cutting edge and broke down several times, this isn't abnormal for new tech.

I don't have to, since I never said it broke down for no reason. If you send an all-terrain vehicle into difficult terrain and it faces problems constantly, then it's not a very good all-terrain vehicle. The Enteprise was supposedly built for exploration, yet whenever it ran across something new the ship would shit itself and Geordi would have to McGuyver them out of it.

They dropped the limited torpedoes after season one, same with the biogel circuitry

was too hard for the writers to deal with so they just dropped it


I dont know how they expected Trekkies not to be autistic about it really

>they found new technology all the time, they obviously found a way to make new torpedoes
They told the audience that it cannot be done. If the situation changes, they should tell the audience. Otherwise, Voyager is guilty of bad writing.

>also did they ever tell how many torpedoes they actually had?
Watch the video in .

>Biogel

What ever was the point of that anyway? In-universe or out? The pilot made such a huge deal about it that I expected it to be a major factor in the show, but it really lead nowhere ever.

Do you have zero reading comprehension? I wrote "never". Meaning, it's never been shown they face supply difficulties, even though they reasonably should at least once in a while given they're often not in Federation or otherwise friendly space.

This isn't the same as saying how come they don't always face supply challenges, which is what you seem to think I was saying.

Even if I had missed those, that wouldn't mean I hadn't seen any TNG episodes. You seem to have a problem with proper use of qualifiers.

>Voyager is guilty of bad writing.
This is almost universally acknowledged by ST fans isn't it?

>They dropped the limited torpedoes after season one, same with the biogel circuitry
False. Bio-neural gel packs were still being referenced even in season 7, such as in the episode Shattered.

If they want to change the premise, why not tell the audience that they've discovered a new way to make torpedoes? Changing the premise without explanation is bad writing.

You would be upset if season 2 opened with them suddenly back in the Alpha Quadrant, and no explanation was given, wouldn't you?

>claim the enterprise broke constantly
>b-but I can't name examples!

The only recurring problem was the holodeck and it usually wasn't even the fault of the technology on its own. Claiming that the Enterprise broke constantly is not true, I really don't understand why you people have to try this hard with all these lies.

There are some weirdos out there.

Also, some individual episodes have good writing, but the biggest problem is lack of any sort of consistency. Janeway's bipolar thinking is always brought up, but that's just one example. The show shifts tone and character traits and it is disorienting as hell, even in the good episodes.

There is a poster in this thread RIGHT NOW insisting that people shouldn't criticize Voyager for having infinite supplies.

I didn't select the entire line you wrote because I just don't give a fuck.
They shouldn't face supply problems because it's a literal non-issue. They're always stocked and staffed, which as I was pointing out, is shown several times throughout the show so why would they need to add filler about them running low on supplies?

>claim the enterprise broke down a lot
>okay, but name examples where it happened in this specific manner (that you never even mentioned)
>what do you mean, I'm moving the goalposts?
This is why arguing over the internet is pointless.

>show clearly states that they hunt for resources all the time
>they even have episodes that start with a shortage of something and end up with them finding the stuff
>they use rations multiple times
>etc.

B-B-ADLY WRITTEN! THEY NEVER EXPLAIN ANYTHING! MUH TORPEDOS! WHY ARE THEY STILL USING DYLITHIUM INSTEAD OF A WOODEN SHIP WITH SOLAR WIND? DID THEY NEVER STUDY BAJORAN HISTORY? MUH TORPEDOES!!!

Well for a start the Holodeck was a experimental piece of technology and when it fucked up it was due to Data doing something retarded like trying to create an intelligence on the same level as him or aliens fucking around with the Holodeck
It's a exploration ship that regularly deal with things nobody in Starfleet had ever dealt with before such as the Borg and Q. DS9 was a space station on a trading route whose main problem was Cardassian dickery and acquiring enough photon torpedos and phaser banks to stop an entire fleet in their tracks.

Yes. I'm fully on board with you. This was my original point to the other user who was claiming that DS9 needed to go into detail about how they got their stuff.

All I was trying to point out is that it's far more intuitive (thousands of merchants pass through weekly, they sell wares) than how a moving ship like Enterprise gets their stuff sometimes (like when they spend several weeks in the Neutral Zone or something, where there's no nearby starbase).

Spending time on either is pointless filler.

I think it was just to give the doctor more stuff to do since he was stuck in the med bay for so long

so biogel packs gave him an excuse to work on stuff?

>why would they need to add filler about them running low on supplies?
Third party here, but I would love to see an episode about the ship completely running out of some supply.

An episode.

Just one.

Any series, but preferably Voyager.

Just one episode where they're completely out of torpedoes, or completely out of shuttles, or completely out of replicator rations, or something else along those lines.

It doesn't need to be a regular thing, but I was a little bothered that nobody ever ran out of anything.

Sisko was wrong for killing that planet. WTF, man?

except the guy clearly means it broke down a lot on its own forgetting that the Enterprise was exploring and facing NEW things that the ship couldn't be prepared for so obviously there were going to be problems

if the ISS is hit by asteroids and breaks it doesn't mean the ISS is badly designed but it was because of external events.

The Enterprise exploder the galaxy and faced new things that put the ship in new scenarios it wasn't designed for, obviously it had consequences. DS9 was a station made to stand still and do nothing and worked fine, big deal.

Apologies user

I'm not dead.

t. Planet

Wait? Did the Doctor constantly work on them? I never picked up him doing much with biogel packs.

>show clearly states that they cannot do something
>they do it anyway
>no explanation is given
You can type in ALL CAPS all you want, but that won't stop the rest of us from seeing something wrong with this.

I'm the poster you were replying to, that's not what I meant.

I don't think I implied that, but if I did that's not what I believe. The Enterprise was a fine ship on its own, I was just saying that it had difficulty when encountering new situations.

>stand still
And yet they managed to make it move across a solar system in the pilot. Pretty impressive feat considering half the systems weren't operational.

it also defeats an entire fleet of cardassian warships without almost no working weapons in the pilot

but I guess that's not "convenient" bad writing like in VOY but amazing and deep meaningful writing

I think it came up a few times when they got infected with viruses or something

desu few DS9 fans argue that anything in the first season is deep or amazing, aside from Duet. It doesn't really find its footing until season three, when they introduce the tensions with the Dominion, the Romulan scheming, and the Defiant.

>it also defeats an entire fleet of cardassian warships without almost no working weapons in the pilot
No, it doesn't.

In the pilot, only 3 Cardassian ships show up and they defeat DS9.

Kira is about to surrender until the Prophets give back Sisko and Dukat.

Your problems with the series stem from you skimming Wiki articles and not remembering what happened in episodes that you watched years ago.

the biogel packs were the doctor's brain, that's why he was almost human anyway, I think they bring it up that his brain is really no different than theirs

>>I don't know what 'intergalactic' means
So, you're just like 99.9% of sci-fi TV and movie writers, then. The only sci-fi show I can think of with an actual intergalactic war was Stargate SG-1 and, briefly, SG Atlantis.

3 ships are a fleet

Voyager is absolute fucking garbage, but oddly I find it to be the comfiest show


TNG just aged so badly with aestetics, and the film quality is so bad in HD

In the HD version on Netflix you can see how fucking cheap the sets and costumes are, and everything is that hideous beige color on the Enterprise D . TNG is just hard to watch, somehow it aged worse than TOS did in that regard

At least Voyager still looks nice aside from the CGI stuff

You're still describing events that didn't happen. They defeated DS9, not the other way around.

the biogel packs were the entire ships circuity

it was supposed to be faster computing because it simulated a brain

However that makes no sense in a universe where they have Data who is thousands of times faster and used isolinear circuits or whatever the fuck it was