Why could Soviet Union not capture Finland during Winter War...

Why could Soviet Union not capture Finland during Winter War? Such a small and less developed country right against much larger great power. How did they even survive? Were the gains worth it for Russia?

Other urls found in this thread:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberation_of_Finnmark
ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Советско-финская_война_(1939—1940)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_War
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/44th_Rifle_Division_(Soviet_Union)#Ukrainian-Soviet_War
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German–Soviet_Axis_talks
youtube.com/watch?v=NVqxoA52kjI
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

Russia was just Tsundere.

Soviets didn't need Finland. Just a tiny bit of it.

They only wanted the swamp.

Soviet Union even went to Norway, taking Finland would be a walk in the park.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberation_of_Finnmark

Same reason why Italians got repelled by the Hellenes probably.

There must be some good materials on that war I suppose. Remember that in the beginning of war soldiers didn't put any effort in fighting because they had no idea why do commies send them there from their villages.
>Were the gains worth
Ask Stalin. He was a very dumb person if you judge his actions ignoring propaganda (most English materials about USSR are pro-commie propaganda).
>Russia
USSR

It was gorilla warfare and the gorilla always wins.

Some say Stalin is good cause he purged all the jews in the government.
But then again he brought the loyal ones...

Soviets sure had way more guys and equipment than Finns, but Finns had autistic superpowers.

>They only wanted the swamp.
Why would they want that so bad?

As with other bordering baltic nations he thought that he could easily bring Finland to it's fold by asking it for rights to few strategic key islands right next Viborg and Helsinki and stripping us of our only developed line of defense in karelian isthmus where after that Finland would've been just peacefully annexed as another Soviet sr as Finland couldn't have possibly defended itself in any way after that. Of course we can never know as Stalin didn't exactly brag about his ulterior motives but by the time we refused and soviets mobilized and staged Mainila shelling the propaganda was much about how there will be victory parades in Oulu, Tampere and Helsinki in two weeks and the country will be occupied by Stalin's birthday. Iirc they even gave some soldiers pampflets giving directions to the bothnian sea so they wouldn't wander off in the "empty forests of Finland".

Then why did they create Terijoki puppet Government? Soviets wanted to annex Finland just like they did with the Baltics.

Because thats what they probably teach to kids in Russian schools in history class.

>Soviets wanted to annex Finland just like they did with the Baltics.

Not realy.

Yeah, i trust the russian with a proxy and subpar english as much as i would trust the partisan sticking up propaganda posters about Mannerheim being the devil during ww2

Then why did they create Terijoki puppet Government?

Why didn't they annexed it after they got a part of your land? Why didn't they do it when the ww2 was over? They didn't need it. Yes, soviets were evil and they annexed the baltics, but they never wanted Finland.

Because it left Leningrad completely exposed. Finland would allow German troops to capture Leningrad instantly. The Soviets actually asked Finland for half of the swamp only but they refused, so they took the entire swamp by force.

Translate it to english at least:
ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Советско-финская_война_(1939—1940)

>They only wanted the swamp.

>At the beginning of the war, total victory over Finland was expected within a few weeks.
>Meretskov announced publicly that the Finnish campaign would take two weeks at the most. Soviet soldiers had even been warned not to cross the border into Sweden by mistake.
>Joseph Stalin was not pleased with the results of the first month of the Finnish campaign. The Red Army had been humiliated. By the third week of the war, Soviet propaganda was working hard to explain the failures of the Soviet army to the populace: blaming bad terrain and harsh climate, and falsely claiming that the Mannerheim Line was stronger than the Maginot Line, and that the Americans had sent 1,000 of their best pilots to Finland.

Then why did they create Terijoki puppet Government? Give me an answer.

Because Finns are Mongols.

Wtf I love Finland now

Stalin wanted Imperial borders back.

Yes and we refused because it was the only proper defensive structural line we had and would leave us completely defenseless. Also we plead to neutrality and Soviets invaded nonetheless. It wasn't presented as an ultimatum but as an offer, after that the USSR proceeds to fake a borderaccident so they can break our non-aggression pact.

It's completely irrelevant what they wanted, if you defend a dictatorial country invading a neutral democratic one in any way i'd question your motives.

There was no reason to attack, except Russians love to steal and murder.

No idea. But they didn't du nuffin.

This was also Lenin's idea. He thought that by giving us independence the impending revolution would bring us back to the motherland.

It's so simple 1+1 math i fail to see why people still arque about it on the internet since historians around the world don't.

Idk. They just sent 10 million soldiers for lulz.

You have a choice.
1. Go steal and murder in Finland otherwise your entire family gets stolen and murdered by commissar Goldstein/sent to gulag
2. Do nothing.

Shoot comissar Kovalev.

The way for write peace in case of refusal it by the Finnish government.
It was rape but not murder

And get executed right away? In any russians place i would've just stuck with it.

By the circumstances i wouldn't go and blame soldiers for the decisions of their masters. Especially since the soviet internal purges were hard at work by 39. Any normal soldier was probably scared to death to do against the bidding of the commisar.

it was gonna be rapemurder but muh granddaddies fought back. still one of them lost his homestead :(

Red army was always shit, even during our civil war. They just used soldiers as cannon fodder.

>t. Islamic Japan
Rare.

nah red army of 44-45 was one of the greatest fighting forces in human history

If by greatest you mean largest then yes

nah Patton himself said Soviet infantry is good. Read his letters.

i mean greatest, operation bagration, august storm etc. are amongst the gretest feats in military history and it had everything to do with soviet deep battle doctrine, tactics, leadership, equipment all the way down to the battle hardened individual soldiers.

Translate it to english at least:
ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Советско-финская_война_(1939—1940)

>t. Islamic Japan

Ayy lmao. Russian low IQ logic.

Russians were the ones who attacked without a reason. They were the ones who didn't want peace.

These are all theories, much like most Stalin quotes on the internet like "one death is a tragedy, one million is a statistic", "Ideas are more powerful than guns. We don't allow our enemies to have guns, why should we allow them to have ideas?" or "it doesn't need to turn, it will drive straight to Berlin".

>The Soviet Union ostensibly sought to claim parts of Finnish territory, demanding—amongst other concessions—that Finland cede substantial border territories in exchange for land elsewhere, claiming security reasons, primarily the protection of Leningrad, which was only 32 km (20 mi) from the Finnish border,[28][29][30] at the end of a narrow finger of coastline about 15 km (9.3 mi) long by 5 km (3.1 mi) wide; most of the Finnish border was more than 50 km (31 mi) from Leningrad.[31][32] Finland refused and the USSR invaded the country. Many sources conclude that the Soviet Union had intended to conquer all of Finland, and use the establishment of the puppet Finnish Communist government and the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact's secret protocols as proof of this,[33][34][35][36][37][38] while other sources argue against the idea of a full Soviet conquest.[39][40][41]
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_War

Soviet Union's massive losses was because of Stalin's stupid idea to kill all experienced offices and send Ukrainians, Kazakhs and troops from the Caucasus to one of the coldest places on earth because he didn't trust local troops and thought they probably would't want to shoot their Finn neighbors.

>Patton himself
Yeah, try seeing history before 1943.

wish we too didn't give up
we should've made some meme alliance

you granddaddies trained it

I mean it got better. Like really.

Rokossovski was probably the best general of the war. Of course it was a sodding mess before the late 43'

see

>be USSR
>kill every general and hight patent officer or send them to the gulag because revolution
>promote a bunch of Jews that never hold a gun, and did not have knowledge of Finland.
>they send Russians to simple march over the country
>huge loses

Lol. The troops were set up in Russia.

Stalin killed only few percent of his officers and same troops had just won Poland.

Of course the Russian security reasons must be understood. The mighty Finnish army was going to steam roll into Moscow any second now. The massive engines of our Renault 17 FLEET were roaring and they say you could hear it even in SPb. Russians were literally shitting their pants.

also modern Norway-Russian border it clean humalition of Finland
all this - result of great mistake: winter war

>Tells him about the red army before 1943
>He tells me how great it was in 44-45

Ironically, the same Ukrainian division that refused to attack Kharkiv during the revolution was also the one that got shredded by Finns in the Winter War. Ukrainians got fucked their entire lives.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/44th_Rifle_Division_(Soviet_Union)#Ukrainian-Soviet_War

But this explains Stalin's fears of using local troops, apparently this happened a few times.

>The mighty Finnish army was going to steam roll into Moscow any second now.
would've been ebin desu

nah Patton word > your word.

Please, be so kind as to remind me why was the read army so shit prior to 1944?

Btw, it's funny how Stalin feared that Finland would be a offshoot platform for a German invasion in the impending barbarossa and thus conducted winter war but by that moved they just made sure there will be the exact scenario Stalin feared.

Patton is a faggot who later said "we thought the wrong enemy". Go suck him off if you like him so much.

I once checked where those troops were set up and most were Russian origin. Russians love to steal from their neighbours. Their biggest annual holiday celebrates attacking their neighbours.

It was highly unprepared and lacked cohesion before it got it's act back together by some major reforms in their doctrine.

Winter War was just levelup of Red Army
Bloody play of cat with mouse

The translation:
9,000 whites vs 100,000 reds
Whites had won that battle.

He's right though

You mean conquer

Hitler offered an alliance but Russians wanted 40 million pointless deaths and loved Communism.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German–Soviet_Axis_talks

Patton was a literal Nazi.

...

...

>Hitler offered the alliance
We know the Hitler's word worth, we had Non Agression Pact. Also
>guy who came into power by anti communist doctrine
>allying with USSR

winners are not judged

It was a minor conflict in the scale of red army and only made some changes to the leading roster. The most changes in tactics and equipment happened during barbarossa. And red army still faced the same exact logistigal problems in Continuation war but in a lesser scale as the whole conflict devolved to uneventful trench warfare where tanks and blitz tactics in to trenched woods and cities didn't work till they started the mass offensives in the spring of 44'

lmao pidor s dvacha podorvalsaya. Maмкy твoю eбaл и пaпкy твoeгo нa бытылкy caдил вo имя Aллaхa.

Ayyy lmao @ Russian """education""".

This was when you already had a pact with Nazis. Hitler just wanted to continue with it. Russians wanted war.

Yeah, if only they would find a way how to do it without killing Russians.

Not an argument.

He would've taken the alliance any day of the week. He was terrified of the industrialized Russia as was his predecessor Willhelm II

youtube.com/watch?v=NVqxoA52kjI

Пидop c двaчa? Этo ты o ceбe, мaнь? Иди жидaм пoклoниcь.

>since historians around the world don't.
Well about that, russian "history" books are a little different from rest of the world.

But yes, USSR was not Nazi. And it hurt it's own citizens unlike Nazis. Fery few foreigners suffered from Soviets.

You also mention USSR which doesn't exist. You should understand ost people here don't relate to it as their country. Younger generations see Soviet regime as an enemy.

Even if you Baltics tried to stand your ground you would have been defeated more easily because you lack natural barriers towards Russia. Also your countries are not much larger than the area Finland ceded to Soviet Union after Winter war so losing even small area would mean losing half your country.

>n-no they didnt want to annex
Why are russians so easy to make asshurt?

Ух ты, гдe мoжнo пoчитaть пpo этoгo гepoя? Пoчeмy я o нeм нe знaю? Бля.

Ehh, most of the data historians took of PoW's and casualties and documents were taken from soviet data. nonetheless it's always made clear that the figures are from, Soviet data*

i dont feel like reposting so here

Stupid retard

Probably a local commie. there is a literal commie supporter here. Also one fag from Sosach ITT. You've been trolled.

:DD
Tell me again who are Soviets? Literally foreign people suffering from Moscovite bullshit.

>Russians wanted war.
No, Russians didn't. Stalin did.

Just imagine if Japan hadn't attacked pearl harbor and the US remained neutral like the populace wanted. Br*tain would be a bombed out hellhole of an island, Ireland would reclaim the north, France and Germany would be the pinnacles of Civilization while R*ssia would be red with the blood of dead slavs rather than the banners of Communism

I agree Patton was a very wise man

Neither probably wanted war, well both had ulterior motives for later, Hitler with Lebensraum and Soviets with European communism stretching to the atlantic.

The politics of that period and those two nations were bound to clash and i guess a formal alliance would've just made the peace a bit less uneasy.

Nobody cares about winter war here.

Ha вики, нo тaм мaлo. Boт eщё oб oднoм мOлoдцe.

True

>Tell me again who are Soviets?
Citizens of USSR.
>suffering from Moscovite
Not sure what do you mean. People in all cities were glad to support commies for profits. Especially ethnic minorities and poorest Russians who were mostly criminals or mosrt worthless of peasants. They got what they deserved as well as the rest who didn't fight enough for their freedom.

it mean Germany have no land

>without killing Russians.
But killing russians is the whole point you dumb subhuman.

It's quotes like that one that make his """car accident""" seem a little too coincidental

I've been to Russia like 5 times and always when i mention i'm from Finland i get the same, Oh you finnish! Winter war! Respect! It's all good fun and giggles unless you discuss it with spergs on this site, especially someone with russian flag.