Why can't we have nice animation?
Because it's expensive.
Because animation in America is made strictly for the lowest common denominator, and they don't give a shit about quality.
Unlike in glorious japan.
Why can't we outsource animation to Japan anymore? Nowadays it's outsourced to South Korea.
is that transformers?
because most budgets for animations goes to VAs here in the west.
Jesus what was the buget for the transformers weekend
isn't VAs' Budget bigger in Japan?
>transformers
The original 80's movie. You know, the good one. Before that Bayformers shit happened.
what we need is more in-house animation, like superjail. Koreans are fucking trash
it's criminal to be this patriotic anymore.
Because animation is expensive and the fact fine arts which is very important to be good in animation is being fazed out for modern art. I thing the latter is a bigger factor.
The animation is awful.
Because the process is insanely resource-intensive.
To have consistent high-quality animation like some parts of that video you need people slaving away for weeks.
This costs a ton of money you cannot justify through greater sales for the most part.
Unless you can somehow move more dosh for being better animated, you can't justify more budget to the suits.
So right now we have a very tight balancing of model complexity vs fluidity, weighted heavily towards fluidity and movement as opposed to the 80s where you had an animé-like situation with detailed models that would hardly move.
Like in all those scifi shows where you had completely still ships that hovered around very affordably.
It's finished oh shit
God I love this beautiful piece
It sucks we don't get shit like this anymore
Fuck I want an Ace Combat-esque R-type now
>HP Lovecraft
You fucking what nigger? HR Giger the name youre looking for as that is clearly inspired by the xenomorph.
But that wouldn't have lent itself to the "back to non-Euklidian space" line.
It would require a reference to any of the Alien movies, probably Aliens and probably a Hudson line. Mostly this is just my bitching about my own autism getting triggered. Everything is "Lovercraftian" and its pissing me off like how everything is zombies now. Otherwise it was a really solid short.
I thought it was pretty awesome. So many things were happening on screen at once. Can you tell me what you thought was bad about it?
The animation is not smooth the character movements don't have believable weight.
I have to agree the dialogue was shit, though.
Hey, this is by the guy who did the Anime Doctor Who isn't it?
Glad to see he's doing more animation!
Seems like this thread is the perfect place to post the Thundercats intro.
youtube.com
was that animated in Japan?
Too bad 90% of the animation budget went into the intro.
Yeah, it's a solo animation work by Masayuki. You can see the style of effects and posing that was popularized by Yoshinori Kanada in the 70s and 80s.
i don't get how can DC make its straight to DVD Animated Featured Films with pretty decent animation ( i guess is japanese animation?) and we can't have decent animated series ...
His studio has never produced anything, he doesn't speak for the entire industry, and there were and still are a lot of people making "serious" and "mature" anime, so his complaints were and are groundless.
And even if you personally don't like harem and moe shows and whatnot (which are not aimed at the lowest common denominator but at niche audiences), that doesn't mean they aren't good productions.
The cost of a single lead voice actor on The Simpsons is two or three times more than the total episode budget of the average anime. According to that Shirobako salary chart that sometimes get posted, an A-list voice actor in Japan makes in an entire year what a lead actor in The Simpsons makes in two episodes.
>You know, the good one.
It's laughable that tranformers fans think this. The only thing going for it that it looks pretty and thats it.
The point was japan has it's fair share of shit made just for money.
this scene is better than any scene from Michael Bay's Transformer
inb4 80s nostalgia
The animation isn't that good, especially the character animation. It has a lot of drawings and the quality of the drawings are pretty high, but the animation has a lot of room for improvement. And didn't he rotoscope 3D animation for this? At least he's done that before.
It's just nice to see animation that isn't SleepyCabin wacky-face yelling-all-the-time bullshit.
I don't presume to know the motivations of anime creators, and I don't assume that something was made just for money just because I don't personally like it or because it's not high brow enough.
And even if something is made just for money by people who would rather be working on something else, it can still be a basically competent and professional production.
The animation was great, but the dialogue was atrocious. Should've had no dialogue.
Did someone say Mighty Orbots?
>Otaking
So japan has never made anything bad?
Where was anything like that said or implied?
It's fucking great, you dumb nigger.
>Memorable villains
>80s metal music and based Vince Dicola
>Great action sequences
>Dat sense of epic adventure
>Prime going out like a boss
Great fucking movie. Fuck you.
But you presume to know the motivations of american cartoon creators.
I didn't even say anything about them.
it's obvious japan go with waifu pandering and fan service since that keep the paycheck coming, but they con go full commercial and do some decent animation, the topic here is "why can't western establish a viable model to produce decent animated series?"
Was this by the same guy who did that awesome Tie Fighter video?
yes
>Killed characters left and right to make way for new toys
>Forgettable characters
>The entire trash planet
>WEIRD AL SONG
>Orson Welles simply just didn't give a fuck
For as much you people like to shit on Bay's Transformers they still far more watchable and entertaining than that cartoon movie.
I get what you saying but the humans really bring down the bay films for me.
I still haven't seen a modern cartoon top this
I mean christ, look at this, how has there been nothing like this on TV for so long despite all the advances in technology?
They work way too hard for something that wasn't going to receive a lot of praise.
- Finally realist stake in my Intergalactic war
- Some of them
- Was great.
- Weird Al is a talented and I've always liked that song.
- Even dialing it in Welles is great.
>For as much you people like to shit on Bay's Transformers they still far more watchable and entertaining than that cartoon movie.
Something is wrong with you.
>Why can't we outsource animation to Japan anymore? Nowadays it's outsourced to South Korea.
And France outsources it to North Korea, where they pay the animators in rice and there is a "director" making sure none of the workers gets any funny capitalist ideas.
Regardless, South Korea animates more foreign projects because their salaries are lower than Japan's.
WE outsorsed to Japan with Korra and was SHIT. Korea on the other side did way better.
"Waifu pandering" doesn't exist, and "fanservice" is a misnomer when talking about anime.
Establishing something functionally equivalent to the anime industry would be extremely difficult or impossible. The anime industry is enabled by many different factors and has taken many decades to build. It may be something that can only exist in Japan. I don't know where Americans should even start, especially now that they've annihilated their domestic animation capabilities.
>how has there been nothing like this on TV for so long despite all the advances in technology?
why spend money on animation when you can just get the rights to an anime for next to nothing?
It's not a matter of tech, it's a matter of investing in outsourcing.
>Orson Welles simply just didn't give a fuck
Which worked perfectly.
Same reaction here. Calling Lovecraft instead of Giger? He's a fucking casual, no wonder he dies on first boss.
Because there is nothing functionally equivalent outside of the anime industry, waifu pandering is unique to anime because Japan/Korea has such a huge population of social outcast NEETs that such a marketing can be wildly successful where anywhere else it would struggle.
Waifu pandering doesn't exist, and I wasn't talking about anything like that. The anime industry started about four decades before late night anime, and there's a lot of anime besides moe and harem shows.
Also, the otaku audience for late night anime is small. Disc sales for most shows are measured in the thousands.
>Waifu pandering doesn't exist
>goes on to mention moe and harem shows
I'm not saying ALL anime is waifu pandering, just that it exists and there is a big industry for it.
It does not exist. Pandering in anime has never been proven to exist in general, and waifu just means a character that you personally are very fond of.
lol, are you that Sup Forumsutist from the previous thread?
I don't visit Sup Forums much, so no. What does this have to do with what I said?
Actually, Korra was outsourced to Korea. Some Japanese animation is outsourced to Korea too. Soon, all the "decent" stuff will be.
So how do we get americans to animate their own shit again?
I think there's only been a few anime projects that have been outsourced entirely or mostly to foreign countries (like some daytime kids' show nobody has ever heard of). Anime production remains domestic to the extent that even a lot of in-betweening is done there (maybe even most in-betweening?).
How does any harem anime not qualify as that? They're literally a genre of shows about a self-insert protagonist getting all the girls. It's not even the only genre that's built entirely on waifu pandering and fan-service. I'm not much of an expert of anime but even I have heard of numerous shows that are built around entirely on "cute" moe-blobs getting in lewd situations.
How do you know the author of a harem manga, light novel or game was pandering? How do you know he didn't make it because he was interested in it? If you concede that there are people who enjoy harem stories, then what makes you think there aren't people who enjoy harem stories and also make them?
>self-insert
Also not a real thing. Westerners are obsessed with self-insertion and project it onto the Japanese.
>It's not even the only genre that's built entirely on waifu pandering and fan-service
Again: waifu pandering does not exist. There is no such thing.
>moeblobs
These don't exist either.
How do you know that not a single one ISN'T pandering? You statement is absolutionist and doesn't have much weight based purely on statistics. Out of the sheer magnitude of them, there's bound to be a handful that are nothing put marketing.
>moeblobs don't exist
Pic fucking related. A lot of anime styles are rife with sameface. Again, not to say all or even most of anime is like that, just that it exists.
Prove that it doesn't exist instead of saying that it doesn't.
If you think someone is pandering, it's up to you to prove it or at least provide compelling arguments.
>Pic fucking related.
Moeblobs don't exist.
>A lot of anime styles are rife with sameface.
Sameface is a meme and has nothing in particular to do with moe.
Burden of proof is on you.
Jesus christ those things aren't human.
>"I'm cute?"
No, you're not. You're a fucking monstrosity.
>"TMS did the best animation of the series for this episode. The second part had maybe six retakes on the whole show, which is incredible," said producer Bruce Timm. "The first time we saw it in the editing room, we couldn't believe how beautiful it was. It has all those transformation effects that only TMS could do. It was after these two episodes that we decided that any two-parters we did would have to be done at the same studio." Timm had a theory why TMS did such a good job, which he felt resulted from Warner Bros' demand that they redo the opening sequence for the series.
>Noted Timm, "I think when we shipped them 'Clayface,' they said to themselves: They think they know everything, but we'll show them how do do this show. We'll change Batman's colors. We'll do special color key treatments on the villains when they're walking over the green vat. We'll blow them away.' If that's their revenge, thank you for proving us wrong. I was so happy with that episode." "The sequence where Daggett and Germs are walking over that green vat, those characters look like they're three-dimensional. They look like they're rotoscoped. When Daggett slowly turns toward the camera, the shadows really wrap around his face. It's as if they're real! They did all those colors themselves. We couldn't even ask for those colors if we wanted to. They aren't even in our palette. They had to specially mix those colors." Shirley Walker, supervising music composer for the series, found the task of scoring this episode quite a challenge. "It was demanding story-wise," said Walker. "There was so much going on. I was so proud of it that I submitted it for Emmy consideration, and that's the one that I got a nomination for.""
TMS was beyond god tier.
>Sameface is a meme
You mean when multiple characters share the exact same facial structure is a meme? This shit isn't even exclusive to anime you mongoloid.
"Moe doesn't exist"
"Self-inserts aren't a thing"
"Waifu pandering isn't a thing"
"Most animes don't take place in high school"
"Americans make these terms up to insult glorious nippon"
>inb4 "for these arbitrary reasons I don't consider them pandering because the creators never say it is"
The lip synching is so awkward.
Also,
>modern camera angles
>in a 2D side scroller
It's rare for anime characters to have sameface, that's why it's a meme.
>Moe doesn't exist
Of course it exists, and I never said it doesn't.
>Self-inserts aren't a thing
Westerners are obsessed with self-insertion and project that onto the Japanese.
>Waifu pandering isn't a thing
Waifu doesn't mean what you think it means, and the existence of pandering in general has never been proven.
>Most animes don't take place in high school
When did we even talk about this?
>Americans make these terms up to insult glorious nippon
Where did I say this?
>Autumn 2014.png
What is this supposed to prove?
If you think someone is pandering, it's up to you to prove it.
Those are edits.
>It's rare for anime characters to have sameface, that's why it's a meme.
Google anime and sameface. You'll find all the examples you could want.
>Of course it exists, and I never said it doesn't.
I said:
>It's rare
I did not say:
>It never happens
Where did I say in either of those posts that moe does not exist?
>it's rare
>google search shows numerous examples
>a lot of mainstream shows are guilty of it
It's not THAT rare. That's like saying side-mouth is rare.
The only recent case of sameface I can think of is Love Live Sunshine. Some of the characters look way too similar to the original cast.
>Ai Tenchi Muyo
Who the fuck are those girls??
Anyway, most of these actually aren't moe, though I will certainly not deny that a good number are, or at least have aspects (visual or otherwise) in them. Aikatsu is cute, but it's not moe, for example. Meanwhile, Fate/stay night isn't cute, but it certainly has moe all over it, being based on a VN.
You're delusional, but it's true that Japanese animation generally has more serious productions made out of a wish to create good art. That's just by virtue of having so much more to it.
I'm subscribed to his blog because I'm interested in cultural aspects despite not living there, but Peter Payne's views on Japanese animation are very narrow and steeped in moe culture.
How am I delusional?
Anime and cartoons are both in decline, anime is becoming otakushit because anything else doesn't profit and cartoons are cheaply animated and are forever doomed to be comedy.
This is a truth that both sides aren't willing to admit.
>inb4 your an amerifag/japshit
I'm from Brazil.
Yeah, Paul "OtaKing" Johnson. He also recently did a TIE Fighter short that's really gorgeous.
There are many "non-otaku" shows made every season. You just don't watch them.
I think you're delusional to think that pandering doesn't exist when there are a lot of major industry leaders complaining about how most animators nowadays are fans, and it's getting more shallow because of that. Miyazaki retired because he couldn't stand it.
We get some
youtube.com
There were times when I legit thought some of the Thunderbirds were physical models like the sets. They weren't.
Because a year or so spent on one 100 minute or so feature will always turn out better results than a year spent producing 26 or more episodes of a TV show.
Hell, we HAD a DC animated show with that top-tier quality animation. It was called Young Justice. Say what you want about it, it was a very pretty show, and it was also a financial failure because it didn't move any product for a number of reasons. So now WB is understandably gun-shy about that sort of thing.
They are a minority, for every non otaku show nowadays there are 10 more animes about high schools with cute girls.
The majority of things are non-otaku, really. They're considered an ever-present periphery demographic, however, and most adaptations of things that aren't being written for otaku have that in mind. Shonen Jump- or Hana to Yume-based series are definitely not being designed with mainly otaku in mind, for example. Although I'm not familiar with light novel culture, it would seem that series like Haruhi Suzumiya and Toradora got mainstream popularity, though they both fit nicely into otaku norms, as well. The only other examples I know from the "big 3" LN publishers also fit otaku, and like I said, I'm not familiar with how popular they were in general, though I'd assume things like Spice & Wolf are probably just being written as good stories.
The vast majority of VN and their adaptations are for otaku, however.