Red Skull is brainwashing Captain America

Can you all stop posting about Cap now?

It's just another story arc that'll be over by the end of the year with no consequences

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comicbookresources.com/article/captain-america-steve-rogers-reveals-caps-shocking-spoiler
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaslighting
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_Faustus_(comics)
twitter.com/SFWRedditGifs

Then why do they show Steve's mother getting the Hydra recruitment poster when Steve was a kid? And that inner monologue Cap has about it being the right path?

Honest questions, because I did assume initial that he was being brainwashed but they also seem to imply it's legit.

It's a form of brainwashing, Steve thinks those things happened

The recruitment scenes are false memories. The woman in red has been inserted in by Red Skull using his Professor Xavier brain. She was not there originally. Please pay attention to what you're reading instead of being a complete dumbass.

comicbookresources.com/article/captain-america-steve-rogers-reveals-caps-shocking-spoiler

"For context, this is a Steve Rogers that was just returned to his youth by a Cosmic Cube -- a reality warping device that has, at times, been used for nefarious purposes. While this is definitely Steve Rogers, as Spencer says, it's still possible that this is a different Steve Rogers than we've seen before."


I'm assuming it's a case of the cosmic cube messing things up and somehow changed history. Maybe we'll see the 'good cap' from that lost timeline fight the new 'evil cap'.

Dammit, Kubik.

Literally none of that is mentioned in the first issue, and if you haven't read the the uncanny avengers shit you couldn't possibly know that, dumbass.

Another thing that they didn't think about when writing this bullshit storyline is the fact that throughout his entire history, he's shown acts of supreme valor.
A Hydra agent would not be able to lift Thor's hammer.

I never read any of that and I knew immediately that they were fake memories. That red coloring is just too obvious. Even if you don't know specifically Red Skull has powers the red should stand out to you and you can see that everything colored in red is not quite right. It's basic comprehension when it comes to comics. The art fucking matters.

There isn't a single mention of Red Skull using Xavier's brain in the issue. Not once.

There is red coloring all over the place, including when Jack hits Zemo and you don't even see Cap in the panel.

>"[T]he one thing we can say unequivocally is: This is not a clone, not an imposter, not mind control, not someone else acting through Steve," said Spencer. "This really is Steve Rogers, Captain America himself."

So not mind control. False memories or alternate universe Steve maybe.

I wonder if Red Skull got to Kobik and somehow convinced her that this is the way Steve is supposed to be.

Again you don't need to know specifically that to know something is up. Standoff is where the seed is planted though.

The red coloring of the flashbacks is much different. It's the only color in those scenes while the black/white/gray doesn't change. Not the same as a tonal red during a fight scene.

>Can you all stop posting about Cap now?
>posts about Cap

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaslighting

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_Faustus_(comics)

Fake memories. Red Skull (through his use of Professor X's telepathic brain) is pulling a "Snap Wilson" on Cap.

IT'S GOTTA BE RED HERRING

It called plot twist, you smartass, and it is something to be built with the right timing. People here can't be so stupid

>7co people complain about the death of Peter, and Otto has the new Spider-man forever.

Never mind, there have always been some retarded in here.

Spencer said it's not brainwashing.

Might be time travel or something though.

but shitposting and memes are the only good thing that come out of comics also making falls narratives into a popular meme will help filter casuals from people who actually read the story

Where is the story time thread?

Snap Wilson was not a mistake

Fuck Bass Lass.

>IT'S GOTTA BE RED HERRING
OF COURSE

I thought Sup Forums not reading comics was a meme and that everybody here who liked capeshit read the weekly wednesday storytimes. This Cap stuff was an eye opener.
Btw I am excited about Cable giving Cap a beating.

>everything is black, white and grey apart from the red
>clearly this is a real memory and has nothing to do with the red skull, who has telepathic powers now and specifically sought Steve out in Standoff

Are you serious? You just want everything spelled out to you on every page?

Kobik is with Bucky and the Thunderbolts, so probably not.

Maybe it was simple a side-effect of when she restored his youth

Spencer is salty enough to change it based on the reaction IMO

is all fault of that Stanley Kobik girl

other than making every other character in the universe look retarded for not noticing cap has turned evil through this whole arc? sure.

..Or maybe it's the other way around, since Red Skull seems like a relatively reasonable guy now.

Cap will have a fight with Cable in Uncanny Avengers. It was spoiled in a solicitation cover.

I'm getting really sick of all this brainwashing shit. No-one at Marvel really seems to understand how it works. When someone gets brainwashed, it's not a different person in the same body. There are permanent, long term repercussions to someone being brainwashed. It's a lame excuse to show characters doing terrible things and then being blameless afterwards.

And on a side note, multiple personality disorder is not two people living in the same body like they show in comics and movies. All of the personalities are different parts of the same person's brain that are not communicating with each other due to trauma. If a man with two personalities commits murder, it doesn't mean that there's a guilty man and an innocent man in the same body. There is a guilty man with a fucked up head.

...

...

Hey genius, don't get your reality all over muh comics!

If there is one divergence from reality that I can never forgive in stories, it's when the writers throw human psychology out the window, because if you don't have characters who are believable as people then you've lost me.

Dude, be real here. 90% of writers have absolutely no background in psychology whatsoever. They are simply re-using plot devices that have been around in multiple forms of media for DECADES if not longer.

am I the only one who thinks that when Kubik reversed his loss of super serum that it warped reality so certain events would play out culminating in cap joining hydra?
Or am I batshit insane?

...

will he be defeated by marvel's new hero, Captain Mohammed?

Wait...I thought he was assassinated by Crossbones after Civil War? Since when did Steve Rogers come back? Fuck I hate comic writers at times. It's like nothing fucking matters so there's no point in any of these dumbass storylines where dead characters keep coming back.

It happened four years ago, it should be common knowledge among Marvel readers

Thanks OP, like i said, just like the superior spiderman.

Natzi cap vs American cap could be kinda cool I guess

I was thinking about this today, honestly I'm just glad they had the restraint not to call this book Superior Captain America

Where the fuck have you been? He's been back for yeeears

Apparently not keeping up with Marvel since they began screwing with everything. I stopped reading around She Thor, Spider-Ock, and the constant X-Men line up changes. I was just done. I read Necrosha and Siege after Civil War and that's it. And Death of Wolverine. Marvel's been fucking terrible since. How the hell did Steve Rogers come back from the dead? Was it some stupid shit like "not the real Steve" or some multiverse crap?

thanks for the kek

Prophetic.

He's been back since 2009/2010 and it was because of stupid shit, if you'll excuse the wikipedia quote
>"as Arnim Zola explains to Osborn during a meeting, the gun did not kill Steve, " it froze him within space and time."

>Can you all stop posting about Cap now?
Not when we have little gems like pic-related.

There's plenty of possibilities.
>Red Skull is brainwashing Cap
>Kobik turned him evil
>Kobik turned Zemo/some other villain into him

So do you guys think that this is pay back for all the people who complained about Captain Falcon?

>Dude, be real here. 90% of writers have absolutely no background in psychology whatsoever.
Aside from an introductory pscyhology class I took as one of my required electives in college, I have no background in psychology either. That's what research is for.

In Batman: The Animated Series they actually brought in real psychologists to discuss what kind of personal trauma would make the characters act in such a way as to drive the characters. In the case of Two Face they gave him a childhood incident that made him feel extremely guilty over his anger so that he would try and lock it away, and eventually it became his alternate personality "big bad Harv." It was believeable and made the character that much more tragic.

If you are going to do a story that involves brainwashing, you should do research on what happens to people who have been brainwashed in real life, and even better yet, interview psychologists who have studied brainwashing victims.

>They are simply re-using plot devices that have been around in multiple forms of media for DECADES if not longer.

And the "he was brainwashed so it doesn't really count" plot device is one that should have been put to bed a long, long time ago. The way Marvel (and DC occasionally too, let's be fair) uses brainwashing has no relevance to human nature anywhere in reality, and their stories using brainwashing feel childish and fake, like a little kid saying "it's not my fault, the devil made me do it." That's not how people work, and it comes across as phony and insincere to anyone who's dealt with a lot of people both good and bad in life.

I really love that all these people are pretending to care about Jews as a marginalized group, when the rest of the year they think Jews are privileged white people.

Also that they get really huffy if you accuse them of not knowing how serialized storytelling works. Which is kind of the point. They know it's a fake-out but are pretending it's just as bad as if it were real. I don't mind some kid crying because he actually thinks Captain America turned evil. People who know better, and pretend to be angry anyway, are scum.

>Lady Thor doesn't even matter, everything will be reset in six months
>Two years later

user, comics are a visual medium. Use your fucking eyes.

This is just another ploy by marvel to write in some diversity.

Nazis have been pretty poorly represented anyway, it's as if every form of media tries to depict them as the bad guys.

>we can't feel conflicted about characters, ever
You're retarded, twitter person

He's probably turned double agent.

Well, yeah, the reaction to this twist pretty much guarantees an extra year of Nazi Cap.

Jesus, I'm glad I stopped reading comics around that time. I just collect the occasional mini series or event thing now and not even all that often any more.

>inb4 Marvel tries this

Nazis are not a race, anyone can be a nazi

>Let's make this the greatest 10 minutes of our lives, Buck.

The great thing about evil organizations in fiction is they will hire anyone regardless of race, color or creed.

Why can't we all be as diverse as HYDRA, SPECTRE or the Empire?

>taking half-assed bait like that

Yes yes. Nazi Steve. Whatever. What about what's REALLY important here?
What's gonna happen to Jack Flag?

Would it be better if cap's reveal was that he was still in the Illuminati

Jack Flag shouldn't have come back to Earth :(

ok guys
what if
get this
what if it really was time-travel bullshit
but it creates two different Captain Americas
y'know, due to time-travel bullshit
and while one Cap is being a Nazi the other is a true blue patriot who fixes everything evil Cap does
and then
get this
they fight each other
and then someone tries to kill the "wrong' Cap
and there's a scene where everyone thinks they killed the good cap
but like
they didn't
but they think they did
so like good cap infiltrates hydra
then
get this
then beats the shit out of hydra
and punches Red Skull
and it recreates the cover of the first Captain America comic

"When it's a Cosmic Cube, you can ignore past storylines, characterization, and sense!"

If you honestly think throwing him off a plain is going to actually kill him (or that if it does he'll actually stay dead) you haven't been reading enough comic books

>Red Skull is brainwashing Captain America
Like Trump is brainwashing America, amirite XD

no he literally has Professor Xavier's powers

>Can you all stop posting about Cap now?

The irony.

The Empire stayed pretty much human exclusive (and pretty against women moving up in the ranks) while it was running shit.

Now if you're talking about after RotJ, then sure, but that was more put off desperation for bodies to fill the uniforms. Plus Thrawn being a badass and trying to rebuild without that speciest and sexiest leaning.

ok

JUST in time for 75th Cap Anniversary.

This is basically Cap's SpOck. Bait-and-switch publicity stunt that Marvel claims is the new status quo, but will later be proven to be lying.

People are mostly just posting that casuals are mad about it.

you can't prove that faget

Confirmed for not having read it

I'm guessing some form of time travel. Red Skull had the past altered so Steve would be sucked into Hydra in a way that would lead to him getting "activated" 75 years or so later. Think of it like Inception. He went back in time and planted an idea in cap's head to harvest in the future.

>Fuck, fuck, I want to know immediately what is going on.

Instead of whining like a retarded child, read the story. Today's readers are a bunch crap, every not reassuring thing, frightens them.

This isn’t a twist as much as it is the entire hook of this new series

(OP)
>FUKKIN MARVEL MAKING CAP EEBIL 'N SHEEEET
It is...truly amazing what you geniuses will fall for. This shit was old in the 80s. REAL old.

Spencer's next issue: It is revealed that the Red Skull is not an evil Nazi and this whole time has been brainwashed by the evil Captain America to shame him for his homosexuality. And Zemo was a poor black man who got his hoodie glued to his face because Cap's a racist.

But why wouldn't someone shoot a man before throwing him out of a plane?

Because kill someone with a gun is a brutal act that irritates people. Throw him out of a plane is a more aseptic gesture, less annoying because it has no blood and in the comics, the victim has a hope to save himself.

Yes, is the general hypocrisy and still a murder, but it is perceived less cruel, even as falling from a plane is perhaps worse than a bullet to the head,

This is very obvious

This has got to be some sort of reality altering shenanigans.
Things is, who's going to fix this shit? Scarlet Witch?

Either Kobik altered Steve's history to make him a Hydra agent, or Steve is simply under cover and as we see more and more of the events in the past its revealed that his mother never went through with committing to Hydra and that he was never indoctrinated. I understand how people who don't read comics wouldn't see these cop-out angles, but come on Sup Forums you should... oh yeah... never mind.

False Memories: Like mind control, but not.

For those who've been following Captain America in recent years, the cues are apparent.

For the hundreds and thousands that from social media that are just tuning in due to the movies, or because they just saw a horrified headline, it's shocking. They're the reason the signal strength on this issue is being boosted so hard.

>and the constant X-Men line up changes.

So... around 1977 or so? Because like most big team books, the lineup has always, always been in a state of constant flux.

Yeah, but when we're dealing with a story where things like telepathy and technology which can re-write the human brain, we have to accept the idea that there are things which make sense within the context of the story which don't make sense in real life.

It seems odd that this needs to be pointed out with regards to a story that also includes things like eye-lasers, faster than light space travel and immortal mutants.