This is mostly to english speakers, since fellow romantic language speakers probably know the suffering of it already, but do you guys study SYNTAX at school? How deep do you even go at it? I doubt that any other language has as much bullshit thrown at you in tests (school, any level or uni) as portuguese...
I wonder what the hell do english speakers even study in english class at school, please enlighten me about the kind of tests you guys have in this subject, what kind of questions???
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>I doubt that any other language has as much bullshit thrown at you in tests (school, any level or uni) as portuguese...
topkek desu
I do not remember any of the grammatical concepts in school but can construct grammatically correct sentences
I still fuck up Arabic sentences though and it's grammar is absolute pedantic hell
The problem of the romance languages are the ammount of tenses and irregular verbs. There are so many and each one has a specific use so when you are studying the grammar It is a pain in the ass even for the native speakers. It is autism the language family.
The problem is that they are very formal language in their canonical forms, so it sounds very alien to us. Brazil has it worse because their usual expressions stray further from formal Portuguese, but everyone has it bad, no exceptions.
The problem with our syntax is that the verbs suffixes make no particular logical sense beyond "that's how it is". English is more mathematical about it, but not that much more flexible.
but can you even begin to imagine how laughable it would be in a english test to ask them to find the subject, the object direct, indirect, etc...I doubt they even know what this is!!
We literally start studying case systems in elementary school.
But they're sexy, when I hear Portuguese I hear the Angels sing
yes, yes, we speakers of real languages have it hard, but not them.
We mostly learn diction and how to write academically.
WOW!!
You go, buddy! You can do it if you believe in yourself!!
I don’t understand.
Yes you do! You can do ANYTHING!
What's so hard about romance syntax you fucking moron? you can't make correct sentences or what
And it's almost the same in english
I think he means formalizing it and giving it proper names for the constructions.
Not that you wouldn't know how to without it, but just mapping names to stuff.
But that's really nothing
OP is making a big thing out of it as if it was hell
And I'm pretty sure english name them too
I don't think English formalise them until much later on.
At least here we learn the names of syntactic stuff very early on.
English is the perfect language and isn't a bunch of bloated nonsense like 90% of the other languages on this planet, so we are pretty much done with grammar completely by the middle of middle school. After that, we just read novels and write essays.
It isnt taught here, you just learn by hearing others speak.
In english we analyse the language of literature and poetry. Ie what did he mean by this and so on, sentence structure shit like dat. But I only did english up to age 16 so idk what its like in uni.
Hmm.
Most other European languages have an easier time learning how to read (better writing->speaking mapping).
Although Anglo kids always sound more eloquent speakers because they don't have weird conjugations to know, and can focus on less common words instead.
Nobody waits until school to learn how to build sentences. You just learn in school how they are structured in a formal way.
Just like you don't need to learn physics to know that shit falls if unsupported, but you still learn it in school.
>and can focus on less common words instead
This is true, after middle school, all of high school is pretty much, "memorize these 100 words no one uses, read this novel, write an essay about how brown people are oppressed, repeat 5 times, end of class"
Just stop
you're making a fool of yourself
>look at me guys my language is soooooo hard because be and have don't end the same way
>we have to learn sooooo much at school
There's languages with more tenses and suffixes than romance languages so end it
Even worse, some have declension, and afaik portuguese dont
A forma Inglês Genus é grande gênio
I as about to say that, in all school movies I have seen when they are in english class I never seen grammar being taught..
Its not only naming, its analyzing every single thing in a sentence, guess french doesnt have all that stuff either since its the 2nd language that americans learn at school..
ha!, i knew it... you guys have no idea about grammar hell
I'm not saying Portuguese is particularly hard, only how OP thinks Portuguese teaching is bullshit.
I don't necessarily agree with it.
English learners have an easier time with their grammar than we do, is what I mean. Not everything is a rank.
>you guys have no idea about grammar
Not totally true; most English speakers now learn about all the names of the different verb tenses and grammatical details of romance languages when they are forced to take a minimum of two years of Spanish. I took four.
I know in Bongland, grammar hasn't been taught in decades because of a weird pseudo-Marxist bent in the educational faculty. In the US, it's a toss-up. In more left-leaning states, you'll probably find much the same as bongland. In the sort of deep southern conservative state I grew up in though, we had to diagram sentences.
Every day.
lmao kek
It should be "the terrorist for whom everyone had been looking" though...
>I as about to say that, in all school movies I have seen when they are in english class I never seen grammar being taught..
you ever watch top gun??? we don't need learning books!
In the Netherlands you spend your entire school career dissecting Dutch sentences.
Which is useful when you want to learn other languages. And smart kids have to learn like 5 or 6 languages at the same time..
>She speaks Dutch, German, French, and English
she could stomp on my nuts any day
what is the purpose of that?
Dumb kids get Dutch + English + French/German
Normies get Dutch + English + German + French
Smarties get Dutch + English + German + French + latin/greek
So you will spend countless hours on different types of words, word orders, cases, times, suffixes etc. So you can apply the rules properly when you study a foreign language.
Anglo kids sound more eloquent because from the time we become literate (around age 6) until we finish school, we're spending all of our time reading literature and discussing the merits of it in both writing and speech. For me growing up, high school English usually followed a strict regiment of:
1) Come into class. In the first five minutes, you are given two incorrect sentences. Correct them and spend the next five minutes discussing the corrections.
2) Read longform prose for 30 minutes aloud, breaking every so often to discuss what's happening in the long from prose.
3) Read poetry for 15 minutes, breaking every so often to discuss what's happening in the poetry
4) Get assignments to be done at home. This usually consists of more longform prose and poetry you're expected to read and answer questions about.
5) Sometimes you'll get extra shit to do just because. I did everything from composing a resume to writing every goddamn class of letter imaginable.
And that's not even getting into the tests...
How the hell do you guys manage all of that and still study your field and what not? I can barely study one other language without feeling like I'm wasting my time by not studying my field.
I meant, preschool kids.
The smarter you are the more subjects you get, the more hours you will make and the longer you middle/high school will take to finish. So dumb kids don't hold the class back. They simply go to different schools.
That's how it's done.
I'm getting PTSD from this thread
lmao who cares about grammar nißßa just speak the words and they'll come out
why the fuck do you learn latin and greek
this
Por que diabos você aprende espanhol e português? Mesma resposta.
deez euro nibbaz tryna say grammer is on one hunna, but real shit my motto has always bin PMW.
Pussy
Money
Weed
hold it down for your nibbas. cash money over everythang nigga
>t. guiri
Besides that's not syntax you mong. Syntax is about identyfing the direct object, subject, circunstantial complements, etc.
It's not really complicated except when you come across a "se" o "lo" or certain reflexive or impersonal constructions and locutions. Then it can be a bitch to make a syntax analysis.
Preschool kids learn their letters. Kindergarteners learn how to sound out sentences and if they're clever, they'll start composing their own.
First grade takes you from sentence composition to paragraph composition, and you're taught different classes of words to compose sentences out of.
You should see it as part of philosophy and history. You learn it so you can read and understand the classics. Which is important if you want to follow a master degree in such a field afterwards.
You mean direct/indirect object and relative stuff ?
This is the hardest problem for me in english language, your pronunciation has no fcking locic
so the smartest kids go to philosophy and history?
that's pretty funny
We do that too
>hey everybody look how hard and complex my language is its soo much more complex than english
Just TRY to give me one other reason why you made this thread.
L'anglais est chanté par tous et parlé que par un génie.
One human wanted to connect to another human over the internet because everyone here has more in common than those we could interact with at this moment in time.
but why
After high school people will also go to a different follow up education yeah.
Dumb kids get to work with their hands (fixing cars, nurses, hair dressers etc).
Normies get a bachelor degree in applied sciences (IT, business economics, accounting, architecture, city planning etc)
Smart kids get access to theoretical masters (history, law, math, biology, chemistry, medicine, archaeology, languages, etc)
Engineering is also for normies.
But who ends up making the most money? Probably the normies right? So who's really the smartest?
medicine is a pretty applied science and you do work with your hands though
what is also funny is that a lot of normie jobs you cited are better paid than the smart kid jobs
It can be useful in science,
For instance you find numerous latin words in biology and greek in mathematic/physics
>The English-speaking world may be divided into (1) those who neither know nor care what a split infinitive is; (2) those who do not know, but care very much; (3) those who know and condemn; (4) those who know and approve; and (5) those who know and distinguish....
The smart kids often become the specialists that should oversee the quality of the work of a team of normies.
But the normies often become the managers because managing and working in projects is part of their education.
I'm a biologist and the only ones who use latim are zoologists/botanists who just know enough to name species
The one with the most free time.
Motion = Money / Time
Time > Money
If money accrues at a rate greater than the time able to spend it (and have the free time to optimize how you would spend it beyond your generating of it) then it is worthless. Ultimately.
I am the most distinguished discriminator I know, for I discriminate based only on distinguishable precedence presented to myself.
2bh I think the smartest people in life are the ones who end up doing what they enjoy and follow their dream.
English class was literally a conversation for a hour.
The teacher would introduce the topic then we'd converse as a class, discussing the piece of literature we've been reading or even current news.
Grammar has never been taught, but you pick it if youre serious from reading cannonical literature.
I fondly remember taking turns to read several pages to the class. Very funny lesson.
If you had talent in English you'd always exceed. It wasn't like the sciences where there's a clear method of learning.
I am too , in france you had to know the latin names of the mains bacteria / virus / animal you are studying
why the fuck would you learn the whole language just to know the name of the species you are studying dude
it is like, the least important part of your research
I always imagined becoming a cook would be nice. But that's for dumb kids. So studying such a thing would be considered throwing your future / education away here.
>throw away dreams because you are too blindly proud
In second grade we learned cursive.
>So studying such a thing would be considered throwing your future / education away here
It depends on your upbringing I guess. For me I was always supposed to be a business man, but I couldn't do that shit. It's like I'd rather be NEET honestly. I do filmmaking, and am actually pretty successful and it wasn't even that hard. Hardest part is listening to the criticism from all of those people who haven't ever found what they actually like doing/what they actually are good at. Those folk always end up clinically depressed at some point, live the boring 9 to 5, and end up old and senile in a nursing home until their family pulls the plug. Fuck that shit. I'll never be a suit in a corporation, no sum of money is worth it.
Yeah, same here.
It's not about money. It's more of a form of intellectual elitism.
>no, you can go become a lowly chemical engineer, while I - with my superior intellect - will follow a master degree in English
In Dutch universities students unironically laugh at people with a bachelor degree. While the masters might study the most useless shit.
lol
smart netherland kids sound retarded
but what about tests???? What kind of questions are asked in english tests in the SAT exam???
...
collegereadiness.collegeboard.org
here. we also write a persuasive essay for the writing portion if I remember correctly. I can't believe how much time I spent doing all of these practice exams in highschool kek, even tho my scores would always end up being the same.
Mind you, the questions might look easy, but in the ACT, you have 45 minutes to read 5 passages and answer 75 questions, and in the SAT you have 35 minutes to read 4 passages and answer 44 questions.
You have to be able to quickly digest information and synthesize it in order to do well.
but it is just basic text interpretation and some semantic and conjunction changes questions....whats up with that???? Foreign english tests are harder than that...
...
well show us an example of your english tests. I'll be shocked if it's more complicated than SATs or ACTs.
This is an actual exam paper for an English Language A Level, the qualification you get at 18 and determines which university you go to.
Of course, you can stop studying English completely at 16.
I didn't even know the difference between their there and they're until engaging in internet debates post-highschool, and I graduated with honors. Here in English class you learn way more about reading comprehension(do you understand the big picture?) rather than syntax, spelling, and other pedantic shit
Fuck me that's easy.
Seriously though this sort of thing should be taught 'more' of. It isn't a case of whether or not something is difficult (as everything gets easier over time) but if "X" many people speak a language, the better the 'shared understanding' of it the better.
Don't you have a literature class for that? Here I had 3 "portuguese classes": Literature, Portuguêse (Grammar and Syntax) and Essay. Thought most people here can't even use plurals properly...
Nah it's all combined into one class called language arts, then it's divided into 3 streams, the smart people stream, the average stream, and the retard stream
Poor, stupid people from the third-world need a way to feel superior. Just let them have it.
That's hard for us because we don't have grammatical case.