How do you make a good Superman story?

How do you make a good Superman story?

Hard mode: he can't fight another hero, he can't become evil or mind controlled, and he can't become a crazy fascist

What about this, he turns EEEEEEEEEVIL

All-Star Superman

Overrated, pretentious, "muh feels" bullshit

hail hydra

Supermans interests are more than his strength or seeing him turn evil, so there's a lot of a good Superman stories without him fighting another hero, turning evil, or becoming a fascist

>How do you make a good Superman story?

Superman is just a regular guy except he can do near anything. If you ask him to come over and bring Chinese food he stops by Hong Kong not the place a block away. He had an ordinary life growing up, at least for a superhero, and his day job has him interacting with normal people all the time.

You just have him do normal stuff, but on his scale.

>A story evoking emotion from the reader is bullshit
Yeah, okay tough guy. The Spawn rack is over there...

Strip the core concepts of the character down to his roots in a modern context, reexamine what makes Superman "super".

Have him help people in ways physical (lifting sinking ships and the like), mental (dude could probably cure cancer), and emotional (pic related).

Have him fail, have him be questioned, and most importantly, have him overcome these obstacle in a reasonable and timely manner. Superman isn't Jesus, or at least he shouldn't be.

He's a man raised in Smallville, just with powers that exceed that of an ordinary man. Have him apply these powers in interesting ways, while avoiding infallibility, and most importantly, help people.

What's so funny about truth justice and the american way?

What if Superman RAPED a guy?

Just do what Loeb and Sale did.

>Hard mode: he can't fight another hero, he can't become evil or mind controlled, and he can't become a crazy fascist

But all that shit is how you make a bad Superman story

just a thought
>supes finds alternate earth
>like ours in every single way, cept they never had a supes
>superman must decide whether to leave earth 1 and go to the earth that needs him (he'd be there forever) or stay and let earth 2 be consumed by evil

That wouldn't be very super of him.

I have never seen a string of words that meant less in terms of a critique.

A Kid with Cancer fakes a bomb on his school, superman goes there and the kid explains him that he knows that he can't save him, but wants Superman to fly him to space and look the earth from outer space.

I really liked both of those movies.

I imagine this is how Snyder's meetings go.

A story where he's basically a Judge. Some villain tries to do things that look nice in the public eye but only to some, is morally ambiguous etc.
Superman must decide whether and how to punish him fairly, looking fair to the rest of the world.
He is fooled and hated for a while, but in the end he pulls through with a fair judgement, exposing the villain and teaching a moral lesson to the reader/the world.

There could be scenes where the villain hurts him in front of a crowd but he can't/won't react, dialogue and tension with other characters and friends, him making mistakes, or losing his temper, but in the end prevailing through a superior sense of logic and justice.
He could "learn the lesson" himself maybe when fighting a secondary threat that opens his eyes on how the main antagonist should be dealt with.

That's what Superman should be in my eyes anyway, and that's why I like when he ""turns evil"" like in Red Son and Kingdom Come, or Injustice.
The whole point of Superman is that he is "the strongest", if you put in front of him a threat as powerful as him he loses his identity. A God fighting a God has the same tension as a human fighting a human, a child fighting a child, a worm fighting a worm.
He truly is generic-man who fights against generic-evil at that point.

I like to see the difference between him and his opponents, over which he should tower at all times.
His problem shouldn't be "I can't beat them" but "why and how should I beat them in a second".
His character really is perfect for moral dilemmas, at the end of which he inevitably does the right thing.

>tfw I once outlined an entire Superman timeline that lasted approximately 13 years, going through the entirety of Clark's time as Superman, all the adventures he had, his death, and the passing of the mantle of Superman to Superboy

That is easy mode, hard mode would be all of those things and the story still being good

but I can already tell you're going to go HURR THAT SOUNDS LIKE SHIT to anything that I say so I'll just leave you with this pic.

Superman is a bread-and-butter superhero. Instead of trying to make stories about him based on his characterization, comics about Superman should focus on the artistic possibilities of the medium.

IMO, it's really that simple.

Want his younger self in it? Where he's learning how much power he really holds and learning how much he really should use it.

So, Supergirl?

Haven't seen the show but maybe. I mean I can list so many things wrong about MoS but the idea that Clark didn't even try to test himself until he was 30 when Jor-El told him too was so over the top stupid. It wouldn't have saved it but would have liked it if he started doing minor things as Superboy. Maybe one of his actions almost cost a life which than he tells his parents that he needs to go away and actually learn to better understand himself. Which leads to Jor-El explain where he came from and why he has his abilities.

Set in the future, Superman is approaching 100 years old. He is dying, he decides to fly around the Earth one final time, revisiting locations from his past, remembering previous adventures, be it with Krypto, his time with the Daily Planet, fighting Lex, partnering with Batman and such. The bookends within the story are Superman saving children, with the first one being a flashback having an affect on one child in particular and the second one being Superman's final act on Earth, he saves a school from being destroyed by a villain and he meets the child that he personally affected in the first one, now an old man and the principal of that school. Superman shakes the man's hand, smiles, and flies away from Earth, where he is soon to meet his fate and reminisces of his life.

Lex gets trapped in some machine that's meant to kill Superman. Not knowing what to do, Mercy calls Superman for help and accompanies him into the machine just in case. Along the way, Mercy mocks him with the fact that he could die, just as Lex planed, or he can finally watch Lex die, which would make Supes look like the bad guy. Superman manages to save Lex and Mercy, while nearly actually dying from the machine (but pretends that it didn't hurt THAT bad). Supes reminds the two that he'll try to save anyone he can; even his arch-nemesis. Lex gets pissed at mercy for having to turn to Superman, since he would have "figured it out in another hour or so", but has the machine dismantled and suggest they go to Europe to dinner for having to deal with Superman's "trite moralisms". Meanwhile, Superman, laying in bed and super-eavesdropping on thier conversation, chuckles to himself about good deeds never go unheeded.

Superman becomes the benevolent ruler of the Earth Imperium and the human population considers him as a god.
All the villains form a gigantic coallition against Superman, and try to battle the Imperium.

Superman leads the human race to the victory, but the population is getting scared to his godlike status while the common folk dies horribly, so they start an underground rebellion supported by the Justice League because they fear Superman too.

At the end Doctor Manhattan kills them all.

Part of a huge new "secret origin" that I go back and forth on writing for him involves Mon-El being the one who helps teach him the basics of what he can do besides run fast, punch hard, jump good; which gets tested for the first time when he has to save Mon-El from Ultrahumanite and his young assistant, Lex Luthor.

Simple: Supes finds a Clark Kent anologue, gives him a portion of his powers so that the new guy is as strong as Golden Age Superman, and charges him with protecting Earth.

Nu-Superman: But, now that you're weaker, can you really protect your Earth, too?

Superman: Of course I can. You're going to find out pretty soon that you've got plenty of friends who will make sure that not every job is a job for Superman.

Something about Truth, Justice, and the American Way.
Or just a single issue of SoL stuff at home.

Could work well. I just hate the idea of Jor-El (or hell anyone outside of the Kents) telling him what he should do with his powers. Feel explaining how his powers come to be and explain his origin to give some closure is the only big thing Jor-El should do. Since to Clark Ma and Pa are the only real people truly look up to at that point in his life.

In all fairness, Spawn actually showed respect to Superman

Everything has been done already.

Superman has dreams too - For the Man Who has Everything
Superman's marital life - Secret Identity, Last Son
Superman losing his powers and trying to be good as Clark- Up Up and Away (for a brief time)
Superman battling global issues - Peace on Earth

I wasn't talking about the show because I haven't seen it either.
There was a part in her new 52 series where she saw she was destroying the area around where her and Clark were fighting, and felt bad about it and stopped.
She also went to train with the amazons Pre-FP in order to better control herself.

Superman crime fighting and shit, but with his Golden Age powers. After a bit of beating up bank robbers and the like, we introduce problems he can't solve by punching.

Yeah that sounds right. Feel you can easily have young Clark overstep himself not realizing what he can really do and sadly goes away from his parents so he can learn. And I can see him taking years to really get a hold of everything. Than him coming back kind of older and also wiser from thinking about what problems the world really need solving in that time. Feel too many times people want to skip past his younger self to jump right into Superman but how he grew up is so important to him that fast forwarding (or getting it so fucking wrong like Snyder) all that feels kind of wrong.

Superman was at his best when he was basically an authoritarian nice guy who went on crazy adventures.

Superman has to fight a new speedster who doesn't use the speedforce but has his own natural fast abilities. He is faster than Superman, and is committing crimes faster than Superman can get to him. Superman has to use his wits to both find out where he's going to strike next, as well as a way to stop him.

What was the context of this?

"what if superman shot up an elementary school. you know, while fighting a bad guy or something"

Have Superman do good everyday good deeds mixed in with crazy adventures. But always have him helping people with their problems no matter how small. That's how Superman comics should be. A badass unbeatable person who just helps people.

How about one of Superman shrinking down to Kandor in order to train himself, in case he ever loses his powers? And perhaps also to upgrade his base strength, so he'll be even stronger when hit by the yellow sun's rays.

Isn't that already a story? That is where the name Nightwing comes from

I really wish they'd take a risk and do a tongue in cheek Superman movies set in the 60s or something. Not goofy or campy, but self aware.

What story is it? Anyone know?

>Not goofy or campy, but self aware.
Like a few of the Batman: Brave and the Bold episodes?

>Pre-Crisis Era[edit]
Superman[edit]

Superman and Jimmy as Nightwing and Flamebird respectively. From Superman #158 (1963). Art by Curt Swan.
Nightwing is first depicted in the story "Superman in Kandor" in Superman #158 (January 1963). It is an alias used by Superman in pre-Crisis adventures written by Edmond Hamilton. These stories are set in the city of Kandor, a Kryptonian city that was shrunken and preserved in a bottle. In Kandor, Superman has no superpowers; in the story, he is branded an outlaw there due to a misunderstanding.

To disguise themselves, Superman and Jimmy Olsen create vigilante identities inspired by Batman and Robin. Because neither bats nor robins lived on Krypton, Superman chooses the names of two birds owned by his Kandorian friend Nor-Kan: "Nightwing" for himself and costumes evocative of the birds' plumage, and Flamebird for Jimmy. Nightwing and Flamebird rename Nor-Kan's underground laboratory as the "Nightcave", and use it as their secret headquarters. They also convert Nor-Kan's automobile into their "Nightmobile", and use "jet-belts" to fly into battle.

In Jimmy Olsen #69 (June 1963), "The Dynamic Duo of Kandor" introduces Nightwing's dog Nighthound. In "The Feud Between Batman and Superman" in World's Finest #143 (August 1964), Batman and Robin themselves visit Kandor with Superman and Olsen and the two Dynamic Duos team up.

Van-Zee[edit]
In Superman Family #183 (May/June 1977), Superman's look-alike second cousin Van-Zee and his niece's husband Ak-Var take up the Nightwing and Flamebird identities. The vigilantes take on crime in their city as had Superman and Olsen before them.

Author of Cerebus dis a guest issue on Spawn, #10 I think. It was still Image's early days and it was basically dick waving at the Big Two about Creator's Rights. Funny how that went.

Almost none of his best stories are like that.

He'd probably find out what your favorite Chinese restaurant is and bring you that

No What's So Funny About Truth, Justice & the American Way?

>superman vs shazam
hero v hero
>Kingdom come
>red son
fascist

I've read and really liked Kingdom Come, Peace on Earth, and All Star superman but yea a lot of his stories involve him fighting other capes or being hitler

So, Superman was basically just telling Spawn that he was the Superman of Image Comics?

>Braniac
That's not even the best Johns story

The story about him having a three some with Bruce and Lex.

Cool, thanks.

A Superman version of the B:TAS episode Perchance to Dream

For the Man Who Has Everything?

People are sick of Superman origin stories, so that's reserved for some short flashbacks or something.
Supes is working at the daily planet, when suddenly some sort of worldly catacalysmic event occurs. Like, aliens are about to destroy the planet. So Supes goes up into the sky and is fighting the alien ships entering Earth's atmosphere, when all of a sudden a giant comet rushes past him. It crashes into Earth in different places killing entire cities and shit. Supes is like "NOOOOO" and proceeds to whip alien butt.
It ends up the head alien is Braniac and is like "Krypton was filled with flawed-minded creatures. Earth appears to be the same. Prove to me that Earth is worth saving and I'll spare it. Otherwise, a bajillion meteors will slam into it and you'll be left alone with eternal sorrow over your adopted planet being gone.

So Supes kills that version of Braniac, only to discover that he's make thousands of copies. So Supes goes down to earth and under the order of Braniac is told of varying events around the planet where bad people are doing bad things, and he needs to prove they're worth saving. So the entire movie is Supes rushing around Earth being put in all these strange moral situations where he either loses badly, or wins fabulously.
By the end of it Braniac decides Earth is not worth saving, and Supes goes off into some sort of human patirotic uplifting speech about why humans are amazing and he's an asshole, which leads to Braniac kinda not caring, but then Supes offers himself as a sacrifice. Braniac can infest Supes brain and body if he leaves everyone alone. Braniac agrees, but it ends up he's trapped and locked out in a chip in Supes brain or something, so Supes has Braniac in his brain but he's unable to do anything. The movie ends with Earth acquiring Braniac's weapons and reverse engineering dangerous technology from it, leaving us to wonder if Supes was right about humanity.

Fuck you that's the best I could do.

There's a great Superman feeling moment going on in My Hero Academia, right now.

user, that's Sodom and gamora.

That is just literally a superman version of Lot arguing with God

Oh yeah like any other Superman story wasn't merely a Jesus retelling!!

I'm trying to make Sueprman look vulnerable here! The only way to do that is 1. The villian can't be killed with force and power. 2. Superman is shown to be weak through defending everyone else, instead of himself.

If you do this, then you'll have an interesting concept.

What would you suggest?

I am not saying it's bad. I am just saying it's the story of Lot

>no superboy origin

For movie I feel the only real way to make a Superman movie is for him to prove there's no such thing as a "Post 9/11" that while tragic it doesn't really change things. With all the war and destruction that happens people always come back. The idea that 9/11 somehow changes every is a fallacy. But good luck WB to ever agree with something like that.

Would it trigger people if Superman stopped 9/11 in a movie?

Have him try and help an alien society and he finds out he can't punch his way through fixing their problems. Basically an off world adventure that doesn't feature his rogues or support characters at all.

Sometimes there's dangers in the world that even Superman can't get to. Have him rebuild and talk about how terrible things happen but the thing we shouldn't do is give up ideas and keep trying to be helpful and kind.

"Post 9/11" mentality is more that we were too complacent. And that lead to a horrible act. So now we much always be fearful and watchful of the evils of the world. And while being watchful is good we shouldn't sacrifice our happiness. That evils happen and while bad every time it happened we rebuild and return to that happy time because that's how it should always be. Never let one horrible act change how you are as people.

Pearl Harbor happened yet we continued on. JLK, his brother, MLK, Watergate all happened in about 10 years but we returned to that happy time.

Did you confuse John and Bobby Kennedy for MLK?

Not that hard if you fulfill two basic conditions:
1. You are a good writer at all
2. Actually read Superman comics

To make an interesting Superman story, every fight must be a struggle. Face Superman against a worthy opponent. His rogues gallery is more than mad scientists (aside from a cool, badass Lex Luthor) and bank robbers.

You want a real challenge? Try writing Batman as anything less than the Batgod and resist the tardrage of TDKR fanboys.

Have him deal with something he can't accomplish with his powers

That has been so overdone that it's a cliche now. Thanks Injustice.

Huh. What is your opinion of Batman v Superman?

Go back to fondling yourself while watching Top Gun, Snyder.

This is actually the best idea on the page. Congratulations.

>You want a real challenge? Try writing Batman as anything less than the Batgod and resist the tardrage of TDKR fanboys.

That's not too hard. The challenge is finding a balance between useless and overpowered.

Show us, user.

Here's a story, nothing original.
>Superman in my vision, would probably the most generous and most caring we have yet.
>Rewarded instead of hated and renowned as a symbol of peace or Guardian of Earth.
>Superman is sympathetic to humans and hates all of the war, destruction, and chaos on Earth.
>He still has remnants and information of Krypton's technology.
>Tries to advance society, technology, creating a better lifestyle for humans Earth.
>Batman or other heroes view this as Superman trying to make a new Krypton.
>Superman does nothing wrong.
>Batman vs Superman commences.
>Superman leaves Earth, sad that he becomes more hated than ever.
>Travels the universe to find anyone in need as well trying to create a new Krypton in honor of his parents.

>Hard mode: he can't fight another hero,

that's easy mode

>You want a real challenge? Try writing Batman as anything less than the Batgod and resist the tardrage of TDKR fanboys.

TDKR is not Batgod, is prep-time Batman.

2 total different versions of the character, you are a fucking idiot. Go and Read Gothic right now, there's an user doing LOTDK storytimes right now,

Fucking Johnsfags.

>I'm happy to protect Gotham while The Batman is away, but are you sure this is how Batman typically deals with The Joker, Mr. Gordon?

A young powerless boy desperately wants to become like him

At first he tells him he can't because while he admires his ambition it's simply too dangerous and that there's nothing wrong with being a cop or a fire fighter

And then Superman witnesses the kid and the kid alone rush in without hesitation to save another life and Superman realizes he was wrong about this kid and trains him to become his successor

young man, you CAN become a hero.

Scratch Batman vs Superman, make it Superman vs The World.

At the end, citizens, countries, governments, superheroes and villains want Superman off Earth.

Kind of reminds me of the Legion of Superheroes episode about Karate Kid.

>>Tries to advance society, technology, creating a better lifestyle for humans Earth.

So.. he acts as a dictator?

They are all bad superman story ideas tho

Supes best storied involve none of that

Essentially, but people don't really view him as a dictator at first. Majority of people trust him, as I said since he's protects the Earth from destructive events. I didn't mention it, but he notices how shitty life outside of the US is. He basically wants to eliminate poverty and prevent death and crime in 1st-3rd world countries. He wants to create peace among other countries, but will create chaos since he tries to help any country/body in need.

Why don't you put the world in a bottle superman?

>Hah hah that was an excellent show you put on there old chum. Lex Luthor never suspected we where on to him for a minute. Still to think that he would go so far as to kidnap Lois Lane in order to make us do battle.
>Thank you, Batman. You know for a man without powers you sure have an excellent right hook *rubs jaw* what's more you certainly trained that Robin well. Why he was able to find where Ms Lane was being kept and free her while Luthor's attention was square on our mock battle.
>Yes, he's quite the wonder that boy. In a few years he'll make a fine fine hero in his own right.
>That he will indeed, friend. Anyways as much as Id love to stay and chat I really best be dropping Lex here off at the local police station. Im sure they and Ms Lane will have much to say. Thank's again for all your help. If you ever need me to repay the favor don't hesitate.
>Oh think nothing of it, chum but I may take you up on that someday. And if you're ever in Gotham be sure to say hello. Im sure we'll have plenty of heroic anecdotes to share.
>Hand shake
>

Why couldn't we have had this? We didn't even get a fucking Handshake

It's a post-Crisis list.

The first one isn't about them fighting, it's more about them meeting.

Kingdom Come is not fascist, you dumbass.

>Kingdom Come is not fascist, you dumbass.
he is

>Superman is doing his everyday shit when he is: plucked out if reality by Braniac/ hit with babby Darkseids Omega beams and teleported/ Boomtubed by Lexseid to Apokolips
>Braniac/Darkseid/Lexseid reveal something troubling about the fate of Earth/ universe
>Superman and the villain overcome the problem then the villain shockingly turns on him
>Superman saves the day but another villain is preparing to attack.

>Hard mode: he can't fight another hero, he can't become evil or mind controlled, and he can't become a crazy fascist
Ummm... All of those are terrible idea's for Superman stories. People only use those things because they are too lazy to play to the characters strengths.

I mean, "What's So Wrong With Truth, Justice And The American Way" is a perfect example of how to play to the characters strengths. Ultimately, a good Superman story starts with him doing his regular shtick, rescuing planes, suicidal jumpers and opening a jar of pickles for picnicers in the park (No job is too big or small for Superman, this needs to be emphasized.)

Soon, a being that is equally as powerful as Superman starts running amok, maybe taking down an ally like Captain Marvel or Martian Manhunter. The villain and Superman come to blows with the villain berating Supermans convictions, but soon, he proves that his convictions are what make him superior. His ability to care about the well-being of others is why he is able to put his all into a fight.

The day is saved, Supes goes home and has sexy fun-times with Lois.

You said good, not great. It's a simple story that shows off why Superman has been one of the most popular heroes for the last 80 years.

>Superman has been asked to help with a peace between two warring worlds.

>Both have long histories of good and bad. Both have grievances they feel are left unanswered, but both know continued war will only lead to destruction.

>Superman shows up to the talks and is basically there as a "nobody will try sneaky shit" failsafe. He listens and listens to the talks, and has an inner monologue. He's constantly drawing conscious and subconscious parallels between their struggles, and his own life, or the struggles of his friends and families.

>One side speaks, and he see's his own experience fighting Metallo. Another side speaks, and he feels like he gets Metallo's side of things and comes out of the talks a bit more humbled because he saw Metallo's actions as 100% maniac instead of just being a broken man. Even Superman can become complacent or unwilling to listen over time, and this sets him back down after a period of cynicism (a bit of a wink-nod to recent comics).

>Between each talk, Superman learns a perspective or lesson that he takes back to his own life. He solves a relationship problem with Lois by listening to them. He gives Jimmy some good advice. He gives Perry a hint about how to approach an angry investor's board. He even gives pa insight on what's wrong with one of the cows. He even gets Batman to take a few cautious steps into the light. It's like magic. Everything and everyone Superman cares about is getting better.

(continued)

>We get this going for awhile until there's an attack on the peace talks. Superman thwarts it, but he's emotionally struck. He takes it personally, since the talks have been going well and he's become invested and also associates them with his improved life.

>He goes detective mode trying to figure out who sent the assassins and why. The story shifts into a whodunnit. He becomes more and more engaged and active about solving this mystery and his personal life suffers. All the good he had is undone. He's under attack and threat as he gets closer to the truth.

>Finally, he solves the case. It was the nice guide that he never suspected that showed him around the peace talks in the first place.

>"Why?"

>"Because, Superman. It's too late. Our culture is already dead." He goes into a monologue about how their once optimistic civilisation is full of pessimistic assholes that lost all hope. His grand plan was to unleash a weapon that would reset the collective memory of both factions so they'd be peaceful and happy again. "Is that so wrong?" He didn't want anyone to die. Just to stop his own faction from being angry assholes.

>Superman thinks and responds about how pretending all that bad stuff never happened will just ensure it happens again. He talks about peace and happiness being a constant battle, but it's worth it.

>He goes home and there's a montage of him working on repairing all the shit in his life that fell apart. It's not near the same level as when it was all magic and good, but every scene shows a small improvement or hope for the future.

>Everyone in his life is shown as having grown as people and ready to take on their next challenge a little better thanks to it, even if this time things didn't 100% work out.

Just look at his most highly rated stories.

Most of them are origin stories, aka the only time there's any sort of weakness or indecision.

Batman rapes people all the time, nimrod. He rapes The Joker and that's why he loves him so much. Know why he keeps Robin around? Rape.
He raped me too.
Get your dick out, superman, the Riddler's afoot and his ass needs the cock of justice. Toodloo.