Poor Frank, why do people hate him so much, he's one of the greatest comic writers of the last 40 years

Poor Frank, why do people hate him so much, he's one of the greatest comic writers of the last 40 years.

Because most of his work sucks.

It'd be a little more poignant if you posted something more recent than 2005. Here's one from 2011.

he kind of looks like shit there too

hair, especially defining features like eyebrows and eyelashes, makes a big difference to how we perceive faces, and its absence - especially when there isn't even an indication of shaving because the follicles aren't producing it any more - is unnerving, so we tend to think of that as sickness

which is why people hate Superman now

ANTS

I would bet money that you haven't actually read most of his work.

anybody who hates miller for his politics is a dumb faggot who doesn't deserve to be taken seriously in any medium, probably some regressive john oliver watching faggot

i'm liberal as fuck and i love miller, flaws and all. he's a top 10 writer, his art style is completely unique and recognizable and he is single-handily responsible for EVERY derivative of modern batman and daredevil. that's TWO characters that everybody still copies his influences. not to mention his creator stuff was fun

absolutely based contributions to the medium

he's a bit of an easy target.
People can just mutter some shit about "whores" and think they've delivered some sort of zinger

>anybody who hates miller for his politics

he does put his politics straight into his work unfiltered, so this statement is inaccurate

whether you agree with his views or not, it's possible to hate soapboxers liker Miller, and if we were to accept your argument - well, you're pretty much saying people should have sat through Sin City 2 because fuck their opinions, he made the movie, if anything they owe him money and why should they get to choose what they like or dislike

cuntboi

The Dark Knight: The last Crusade which just came out was amazing though.

Maybe I haven't read everything he's ever done, but what i have was nothing special. Most was shit, in fact.

>he is single-handily responsible for EVERY derivative of modern batman and daredevil
Fuck off casual, to deny the hand of Denny O'Neil in both those characters (O'Neil's run on Batman being the template for how Miller wrote the character and returning to him to his darker roots in the first place, as well as O'Neil being the editor of DD for Miller's run where O'Neil fired Roger Mckenzie from writing and handed it off to Miller who was then just doing art, allowing Miller to become a big time writer in the first place) is to be a fucking liar and shows a deep level of ignorance.

Frank Miller is the Simpsons incarnate

He hasn't written anything good since the 90s though.
But I thank him for Daredevil, Sin City and the 300 movies because those are pretty neat blockbusters.
I still have to read Ronin and Martha Washington. Didn't like his Batman except for Year One.

He dresses like a fedora wearing brony

He's old, he can do so.

Dark Knight: Last crusade came out the other day and is amazing. More similar to Year One than his other work.
DK2 is decent

>Don’t talk to me ‘bout MCs got skills/
>He’s alright but he’s not real.

Sums up Frank and a lot of classic comic creators

Only Super fags hate him because he exposed their favourite mary sue

>DK2 is decent
DK2 is a mess.

I'd prefer DK2s forward thinking misguided progressivism over the reductive nature of Last Crusdae, as good as it was

It's like when a music act goes to Vegas. They know their best days are behind them

he didn't make sin city 2 that's still a film adaption

it's possible to hate soapboxers but nobody hated miller for soapboxing back when he was a liberal in the 70s-90s. when he went full neo-con after 9/11 people started to shit on him which is completely hypocritical

bendis soapboxes, but we shit on him his bad writing
brubaker and fraction occasionally soapbox, but they're mostly liked
fucking claremont soapboxed for a decade but nobody hates that because he was on the right side of history (mostly)
hell even johns occasionally soapboxes

the people who hate miller hate him because of his politics which is what they hate but then they apply it to the man. which is bullshit. i don't care for his politics but i'm not going to hate the man for it, especially when i never did before but then again, regressive left, cognitive dissonance, etc. They're all liars who don't care what somebody says as long as they agree with it

miller could announce a new project involving Puppies vs Kittens and we all know the headlines would be "Crazy old man Miller is going to ruin your childhood dreams" or some shit like that.

also, ronin is great and i'm surprised it hasn't been adapted as a movie

In what way was LC reductive?

>his art style is completely unique
It's heavily influenced by whoever he's interested in at the moment. This is Frank Miller circa 1978.

>why do people hate him so much
He doesn't draw in a style mainstream readers are comfortable with.

>he didn't make sin city 2 that's still a film adaption
He co-directed it.

Nice bait, if you actually read his books you'd see that he really likes Superman, he has him as a great man put in an impossible position

Well yeah, he can
He still looks as stupid as those bronies

The Frank Miller you think of who worked on Daredevil was heavily influenced by Lone Wolf and Cub.

The layouts in Dark Knight Returns borrow liberally from what he saw two artists he shared a loft with doing: Howard Chaykin and Walt Simonson. If you've read American Flagg! and Simonson's Thor/FF, you'll see a lot of the same visual decompression, breakdowns and action.

Frank's a great artist in his own right, but he's as open to influence as any other. What's somewhat unique is his scratchy, angular inking which Holy Terror shows subsuming his style altogether to the point of being visually unappealing to some.

TCJ:it seems like you take a certain pleasure in beating up Superman.
MILLER: I know. Why is that? I must have issues. I don’t know. There’s always been something about Superman that says, “I can fly and you can’t.”

TCJ: You want to give him his comeuppance?

MILLER: Yeah.

>He hasn't written anything good since the 90s though.
I'm struggling to think of an 80s comics legend who HASN'T become a shambling self-caricature by this point. JRJR draws doughy monsters, Chaykin's characters are all guidos and he's rehashed the same exact ideas about the future at least 3 times, Claremont's gone straight to pure fetish, Byrne is insane and can only draw caricature…

>Poor Frank, why do people hate him so much

It part of the curse of Stan Lee sucking one's life force

Really doesn't change the fact that Miller respects Superman as a character and remains very loyal to his characterization

Sin City was heavily influenced by Alec Sinner

There's also some Hugo Pratt in DKR, but not as much as there was Moebius in Ronin

he also doesn't make Superman take life lessons from a pet OC like Ennis did

i'm not denying denny O

it's just that miller is more influential. everything with gordon and batman and year one is STILL trying to be emulated to this day, not to mention everything about his relationship to his friends and his early years with the mob, etc

denny O brought him back to his dark era after the 60s campy shit but he still dealt with it in a comic booky way, with ra's, other classic super villains. miller grounded bats more

and being editor for DD is just being editor. he did his job, he fired a bad writer and brought in miller but miller still had the ideas and wrote/drew it. give that credit where credit is due. and considering what miller took from DD and transfered it to bats, he is obviously the guy

o'neil is obviously the guy from arrow though

>why do people hate him so much
Because he's been shit since 2001.

I completely disagree. I think Frank dislikes the very concept of Superman, but as evidenced in DKR, DKSA, and Superman 400, he respects the creators behind the character.

It's clear enough since DKSA is Miller having a play around the Silver Age Schwartz/Weisinger toybox of the DC Universe

Walt Simonson did Orion in the 2000's, The Judas Coin graphic novel in 2013, and he's still doing Ragnarok

Dark Knight Returns was actually the book that made me like Superman for the first time since I was a little kid.

>Claremont's gone straight to pure fetish
I must investigate further, tell me what you know.

look at miller user, do you think he really directed anything?

robert rodriguez LOVES miller. he has stated over and over he couldn't have made the films by himself because he borrowed so much from miller's layouts and it wouldn't be fair to not credit miller

he actually RESIGNED from the director's guild because of rules where he couldn't credit miller as "co-director." it's just honorary. like how stan lee gets an exec prod credit in every marvel property even though he has nothing to do with production

rodriguez is a true bro

Because his work appeals to edgelords and basement-dwelling batman "fans"

In what world is DK2 evidence for him hating Supes? You might as well say he hates Captain Marvel

>why do people hate him so much
Because they're plebs, all of them. Plebs. TDKSA and ASBAR are the only patrician capeshit. Anyone who disagrees is wrong.

>What is joking

>look at miller user, do you think he really directed anything?
Yes, The Spirit.

And to continue my point, Frank only let himself be influenced by giants, so you can't fault his taste.

Denny took Batman out of the Silver age but was still writing him as a guy who would trust a street thug enough to get coldcocked by him.

Frank took the characters much more seriously than Denny did. He made Alfred the iron girder we all know and love without compromising him as a gentleman's gentleman. He gave Jim Gordon a reason to exist as a clean cop on a dirty force. These two things are substantial to the book.

The fact that Batman humiliates him consistently until his eyes are opened by his daughter that power isn't to be merciful and chained but the inherent right of the mighty to impose their will?

You know, the kind of thing Superman usually stands against?

And the fact that interpreting Superman as a sneering alien with a holier than thou attitude also runs counter current, considering even in the Super Dickery days of Weisinger he was at least given empathy and remorse

>I'm done talking.
>Get out of my cave.
Sounds like something a typical Sup Forums poster says to their mother.

>basement-dwelling batman "fans"

No they just like the Superman and Batman fight at the end of DKR. Even then only on the surface as a fight without thinking anything about what's going on in the story. Power level shit

I bet you think DKSA is a "satire"

heh

2008 miller is a different person compared to 2014 miller, look at OP's picture for god sakes

O'Neil, though he hasn't really done anything in 10 years he never disgraced himself
Adams to certain extent, his art is still awesome, but he's a batshit writer
Morrison obviously
Gaiman
Perez

>mind control
>dominatrix outfits

>DK2 is decent
It's a mess, and at best "so bad it's good"

Whut Superman doesn't do the might makes right thing, he disagrees with his daughter, which is shown even more definitively by his daughter fucking his shit up in Dk3

>generic response

X-Men Forever is a continuation of the book at the point where he left it, except now no one's reining in his mind control, bondage, body swap, tentacle etc. fetishes.

Guess you didn't read Hitman 34 then. He just gave him some perspective and confidence. By your logic this is a pet OC giving him life lessons

Don't blame other people when you're too autistic to tell when someone is joking in an interview.

We need more Neal Adams insanity and you know it. He should do standalones of Marvel titles next.

>you're too autistic to tell when someone is joking in an interview

Dude that's most of Sup Forums. People get bent out of shape over every dry joke Alan Moore or Brandon Graham make

Keith Giffen.

It's certainly a parody of then current cape comics.
Not a great one, but not a shit one either

I expected something less vanilla

He used to be....40 years ago

>Guess you didn't read Hitman 34 then
I did, and I found it trite as fuck. This is a guy who has served in the JLA for at least 5 years by that point and has seen death. He doesn't need Tommy to explain The Big Picture to him and it was cringe to read.

What you posted is pretty typical "letter to superhero" like has been done in multiple books like Thor. It's not giving a life lesson to a superhero, it's juxtaposing the public's perception against their reality.

Worse, Hitman 34 cements the entire Space Jesus thing as hard as Snyder in MoS with Christ-El standing in space saying "IF YOU ONLY KNEW HOW MUCH YOU WERE LOVED" which is as on the nose as fuck for an otherwise decent writer.

Um... biracial girls? Storm was supposed to transracial and shit.

IDK, I found the last Ambush Bug he did to be depressingly dry. But I'll agree he's not a burnout.

>I expected something less vanilla
It's not a MAX title dude, if you were expecting Dolcett I have bad news for you

>also, ronin is great and i'm thankful to every god in the sky that it hasn't been turned in to a movie and ruined by normie bandwagoning
I agree.

Does he have cancer?

...

The convergence mini? I don't know I enjoyed it. Also liking his current Sugar & Spike strip in Legends of Tomorrow.

Also I mostly know Giffen from his New52 work. The only thing of his before then I've read so far is his Justice League run. So I'm more commenting on him still being good rather than as good as he used to be.

Year None? It had a few good jokes in it like all the dead female bodies just shoved into objects in the background of panels

>fucking claremont soapboxed for a decade but nobody hates that because he was on the right side of history (mostly)

The entire point of the book during his run was that his characters represented a hated and feared class of people, 1980s comic books weren't going to be subtle about that no matter who wrote them.

Also, it gave us Tourette's Kitty

He hasn't officially said anything but people assume so, yes

DKSA rules because it's just straight up MAD Magazine shit.

>The only thing of his before then I've read so far is his Justice League run.

Same here. I wasn't a Legion fan.

In terms of getting a visceral reaction from a comic, DK2 is fucking great. I admit the Robin subplot is weak and unnecessary, but when Bats let that Hawk kid get RETRIBUTION, it gave me good and bad chills at the same time.

Even if you hate the politics or even the execution, you have to give the man points for trying to do something interesting. How many beige and grey comics out there just flow over you without rustling your neurons at all?

Like, everything Geoff Johns every wrote? Not actually bad, but you can't remember a thing that happened a day later.

Hal living as green construct with his weirdo wife and kid is an image that's stuck with me. Even if it's an alt version of Hal, it's made me like the real one better, thinking about how he has it in him to tell Earth and everyone else to fuck off and go live in a giant disco ball.

he was certainly getting treatment for something serious. He looks better now so it's probably in remission

>someone else appreciates outsider art, satire, and batshit roller-coaster insanity
hi friend. Varley's colors are kinda hard on the eyes, but otherwise DKSA is truly under-appreciated by the mainstream.

>This should be agony. I should be a mass of aching muscle - broken, spent, unable to move. And, were I an older man, I surely would ... ... but I'm a man of thirty - of twenty again. The rain on my chest is a baptism - I'm born again ...

He looks better than he did a few years ago and The Dark Knight: The Last Crusade was great.

In the TCJ interview he specifically states his intention was to write his version of a Silver Age story.

There's nothing current about DKSA besides the format, coloring, and structure. The characters and plot are clear throwbacks

Miller looks like he transforming into Robert Crumb

I don't hate him. I feel sadness. This guy was the father of the Dark Age. A titan. One of the few American capeshit writers who writes readible stuff.

It's like Marlon Brando, or Orson Welles, except he didn't get fat.

Brian Hibbs reviewed it years ago and thought it was more like the Mad Magazine Superduperman than a DKR sequel, and Miller later told Hibbs that he got it.

Linkara hates him, so I love him.

...

I wouldn't have a problem with Miller if every 12-18 year old out there didn't think he was the second coming of hardcore Jesus.

Call me a hipster or elitist or whatever, but he and Moore are almost singlehandedly responsible for the current generation of comicbook egdelords, and at least Moore has the grace to feel bad about it.

This is one of the best moments in comics. The whole issue is gold.

source?
Please spoon feed me, i'm sorry.

But that's one of the best issues of anything ever.

All Star Batman and Robin #9

All star batman and robin

Never read him so can't really be bothered about him. I just know enough about him to know that I'm not interested in reading anything he put out. And I agree with the folks who blame him for the shit across all book publishing (indie, big 2, etc.) that's crappy as being at minimum a focusing factor on bringing it about.

>starts having sex
>panel of flash of lightning
>then throws a tantrum over Canary mentioning Superman and making fun of his car
That's great
ASBAR is great

All Star Batman and Robin.

>I just know enough about him to know that I'm not interested in reading anything he put out.

No, you don't know enough.

Thanks guys. Love you.