*federalizes*

*federalizes*

Why are there so many pro-europeanist in this board?

pedos and pedo money running withing thier pedo circles like blueshare

Because EU is objectivly a good thing

>say something about the EU
>A german comes to defend it.

Always...

Because EU is objectivly a good thing

Thank you lord Macron.

Have you guys seen the anti-immigration laws he's just had drafted?

>A german
I am European

Right my European friend, let's turn Europe into a bigger version of Yugoslavia, what could go wrong
In science we trust right?

Because Sup Forums is Sup Forums for people that don't like Sup Forums.

You only said It is good but You are not giving proofs of your statements. All the trade We have in Europe could be done without an European Union.

The Germans would stand to lose the most if the EU actually federalizes, they profit the most off the current state of the Union.

I actually started a thread on that topic just amomen ago.

You are basically doing this to trigger the Sup Forumstards?

You're going to get banned though, watch it Vlad...

You really think we could have the same amount of trade without a single market?

elaborate please

>single market, no quotas
>EU as a whole can negotiate better trade deals than single countries(see all the recent EU trade deals)
>freedom of movement
>cohesion funds
>environment protection
and many more

BASED EU friends

What exactly is wrong with a single European country.

Well, it implies Switzerland has joined, which is of course unacceptable.

I'm doing it because I support the EU.

US butthurt

>you can have common regulations between 27 countries without having a dedicated body to draft them
>you can remove non-tariff bariers without common regulations and standards
>you can have just-on-time delivaries without doing away with internal borders
>you can have all of the above without doing away with national subsidies

Just about everything for you, Ivan.

SI SI SI SI SI
SI SI SI SI SI
SI SI SI SI SI
SI SI SI SI SI

I don't care. My country is dead and I am planning to kill myself soon.

>environment protection

That can be perfectly endorsed by national governments.

>freedom of movement

You can have open borders with other nations, It is a matter of diplomacy .

>EU as a whole can negotiate better trade deals than single countries(see all the recent EU trade deals)

That is true

>single market, no quotas
The single market is benefitial for some countries. The fact is the very year my country entered the EU, our industry went to the hell.

>cohesion funds

I guess that is positive as well.

Get the fuck outta here with your federalisation bullshit.
Y'all already know I'm moving to Switzerland if that actually happens

you will be always a second-class citizen there

Because EU is objectivly a good thing.
It has only increased Trade in Europe at loss of nothing.

Better than living in a federalised shithole country

Traitor.

how would a federalised EU personally affect you?

It may be something positive now but It is starting turning into something that may not be that good. If It is for real and the eurocrats want a further integration, that could be not so good.

It will happen one day, but this is still decades away
hopefully they'll be so wise to give the individual countries as much autonomy as possible, because there's always the question why countries like finland and portugal or ireland and greece for example should share the same government when they have barely anything in common anymore as the farthest extent

not really. the eu makes it even easier for us to control europe.

lol no

Ok Germany

>If It is for real and the eurocrats want a further integration, that could be not so good
why not?

lol no

lol ebic meem

What is wrong with federalization? It would unify the tax code, integrate the markets, create bigger public healthcare unit that would cut costs down etc.

Just by knowing the history of my own country. The ideo of Spain was to unite all iberians under one religion, one crown and one state. Everyone and every culture was respected, people talking of the spains and not spain. Guess what? Centralization happened and one of cultures started dominating the other. sooner or later It will happen in an European federation.

>Yes of course do i want my region to be governed by Brussels
>Yes of course do i want my region to be entirely unimportant because other regions absolutely trump us in population
>Yes of course do i want a government that has no idea about all the different needs of the vastly different regions of Europe

That is a general global trend in the first place, old and small languages die all the time. I don`t really think that trying to hold onto old Europe at the cost of everything else is worth it.

Because a federation is comparable to two centralized monarchies united by a royal wedding

This.
The people in charge even in our national and federal states are way to removed from the common people.
I don't believe that it's possible to govern the EU.
Just look at it now.
We don't care about the problems of Bulgaria or romania, and I doubt that a finnish person really cares about what's going on in portugal. The only ones who will profit are the lobbies, because they can force their shit into politics on a bigger scale.

Read about what a federation is

Just because it happened to Spain doesn't mean it has to happen everywhere. My own country, Germany, is a federation, where the states were able to keep their influence and their identity.

People want an EU federation, not an EU centralised state

Why do all the libshits love the EU so much?

Basically zero democracy at the EU level. Is that what you want?

The crown of Aragon was not centralized, heck they did not even had a common currency in the Aragonese crown and the castillian kingdom gave a lot of privileges and self-govenment to places like the basque country.

>Basically zero democracy at the EU level.
We do have a democratlically elected EU Parliament

Yes, but not to all regions like a federation would.

A federal EU would presumably come with a reshaping of the EU parliament and bureaucracy as it would take on many different functions previously held by national governments. I imagine they would make those positions accountable to the general population if they ever went through with this shit.

>EP

First of all the EP is powerless. Secondly, they are a bunch of morons, and worst, traitors.

Don't kid yourself. We don't have democracy. Just look at how the Monsanto thing was handled. When the monied lobbyists come knocking the EC will bend over backwards for them, but not for you.

>doesn't even have a single language

Chosen by politicians. yeah , I know they were elected by the people but I do not trust politicians or the state either even If they were elected.

There will be a dominant culture, You cannot avoid that. Once this happens the rest of cultures will be attacked and seen as things of peasants and people from the countryside till those cultures and people are destroyed forever.

Beshrenkt?
Where the fuck do you live? Besides Bavaria and the difference between the big blocks like east and west, north and south there are almost no differences left between our states?
NRW, RLP, Hessen are all the same.

Notice how everyone itt hates the eu except the germans. Makes you think

Petition to make this the european federation's flag, looks prettier than the EU one

EP is powerless because the sovereignty lies still within the member states, so the head of the states make all the decision. If EU was to federalize, the power would move to the European Parliament

toohabsburg/5

Or this

la creatura...

el goblino marrone...

Good observation from the mutt, the EU objectively benefits Germany above every other country, southern countries were better off without the EU.

>If EU was to federalize, the power would move to the European Parliament

And doesnt that worry you?

I mean, Doesnt worry you that a bunch of politicians that have nothing to do with you, totally strangers and foreigners could rule and decide what you and your folks could and should do?

Not really. What you don't understand is that the Germans are very statist, very subservient to the state, very loyal to the politicians. That is why the NAZI flourished, there. That is why their worker unions work with the employer so effectively. It's a big part of their culture. In a way, if you look at history is it the reason they become Germany. It was all the Germanic tribes who were willing to surrender their power to become a great thing.

>I know they were elected by the people but I do not trust politicians or the state either even If they were elected.
If you generally distrust the politicians, what difference does it make to you if Spain or EU is in charge?

>There will be a dominant culture, You cannot avoid that.
EU gives a lot of subsidize for perservation of local culture and traditions

First one was better.

>"hey lets set up this group to trade coal and steel kinda more effective with the chinks since our economies are so connected anyway"

...

How is it different from politicians who sit in German parliament? You seem to have a problem with politicians in general

That is not true. The EC holds considerable sway. I was contrasting the two.

Of course the Council is most powerful still, but for EU wide legislation you can clearly see that the EC is getting it their way all the time and the EP is for show.

Kinda blank desu

>"I don't trust the pilots, I think the passengers of this plane should pilot it! Who is with me?"

>what difference does it make to you if Spain or EU is in charge?

That the govenment of Spain is closer. If spain becomes a despotic regime, It will beeasier to fight back against a spanish state than fighting against a supranational state like an European federation. The closer the government are to the people, the easier It is to control them.

Oh you meant the first i posted, my bad

EP politicians who are Europhiles do not see themselves as members of their native land, but rather as members of the EU. This is problematic because sometimes they support legislation that actively harms their native land. And they are the ones in charge of representing that land. If they don't nobody will.

>The mechanic is putting sugar in my cars engine, but that's fine, because he's a mechanic

...

Have fun. This should go really well for you, Icarus.

No, their heads of state are in charge of representing their lands in the Council. The representatives in parliament are there for the UE-wide population, which elected them.

Most Americans don't know or care about the European Union

>I mean, Doesnt worry you that a bunch of politicians that have nothing to do with you, totally strangers and foreigners could rule and decide what you and your folks could and should do?

How is that different from national parliaments, do you know them personally?
You probably have a lot more in common with the average Sup Forums user than most of your countrymen, despite most of them being foreigners.

Every time I see someone writing about a lack of democracy in the EU it comes down to "the EU didn't do exactly what I/my country" wanted it to do, therefore it's undemocratic."

So they work for the good of all European people, instead of trying to amass special privileges for their local tribe? And that is a bad thing?

EP can't be powerful as long as the sovereignty lies within the member states

So elect different politicians to the EP.

A multinational federal state would presumably have legal means of secession, if such a polarizing issue arose between one people and the rest, they could then exercise this right.

>If spain becomes a despotic regime, It will beeasier to fight back against a spanish state
Didn't work out so well with Franco, did it?

*dissolves*

Il demonio....

Francos government was benovolent and people had no complaints.

il miscuglio mannaro...

El terrone...

...

>How is that different from national parliaments, do you know them personally?

yes, It does. That is why I am in favour of a smaller government and descentralization. Heck, with all the technology There is, It is not that difficult to implement some kind of direct democracy with a very limited government which its only purpuse would be to ensure the security and rights of the people.

Neither did the EU manage to stop the war in the ukraine, eventhough they are our neighbours.

>implement some kind of direct democracy
Where did you get that from? States have only become more and more complex to run.

>he thinks Americans think about Europe as often as Europeans think about the USA

Franco was helped by Germany and Italy and had a professional army. The republican side was peasants with arms and yet Franco needed three years to win the war.