The timing was perfect for a Batman Superman film

The timing was perfect for a Batman Superman film.

>It's 2016
>Audiences have accepted capes
>They have accepted the weird worlds they live in
>They Know who Bat-man is who Super-man is
>They had a once in a lifetime chance to catch lighting in the bottle

And he ruined it.

He destroyed it.

A decade could past and a new Bats and Sups team up film would still suffer the wounds of the old film.

They fucked it up so bad that DC heroes will likely wane away in audiences minds and we are going to live in a world where Hawkeye will be better know than Super-man.

And it was all destroyed by a solitary director with free reign to do as he pleased

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Deja Vu

It's not over yet until SS.

If that underperforms, fuck it. Yes I know SS isn't Snyder but it has that DCEU tag with it

Well, because of him, supes is now toxic, so CW can now use him in their tv shows.

The next films having straight shota!?

>They fucked it up so bad that DC heroes will likely wane away in audiences minds and we are going to live in a world where Hawkeye will be better know than Super-man.

meme

I feel bad that Suicide Squad has to be lumped in with the hot garbage fire that is BvS.

Eh, at least we'll get more Batfleck in there.

yep, welcome to hell

>Marvel wins again

IT'S NOT FAIR, WHY CAN'T DC HAVE GOOD MOVIES!?

Never in a million years will Hawkeye be more well known than Superman.

He did, he shocked the world and didnt gave you a shitty generic pop corn flick, instead he tried to actually talk about the characters in a way they deserve. Batman and Superman are cultural icons, not popular characters, they are modern western mythology and Snyder saying those characters would shock the world in real life is right. Keep watching cartoons OP, there's several great B/S interpretations for kids and adults there, enjoy them, Other people don't want yet another quipfest live action movie.

History repeats itself. WB once again kills the CBM craze.

>he shocked the world
Not in the way you think he did

Hell, it's even simpler than that.

People were (and still are) getting tired of Marvel films dominating. People WANTED to support DC, wanted to support Batman and Superman in cinema.

It's so fucking easy to undersell how much leeway WB/DC had with this movie. It could have been a crowdpleaser and people would have gone crazy for it; it could have been dark and straightforward take like the Dark Knight trilogy; it could have been a trippy mindbending ride.

But somehow, Snyder steered BvS towards the one objectively bad/awkward part of Man of Steel: the symbolism. Heavy-handed, less-subtle-than-brick-to-your-face, boring symbolism. Add in Snyder's ineptitude with directing actors and you have one piece of shit film.

Audience good will only goes so far with a giant turd.

The good news is that it seems to still be there for other DC films, like SS and WW. But Justice League will be painful...

I am so upset over it. This was maybe their one shot at establishing a cinematic universe, bringing Batman, Superman, and other characters into the light, and they ruined it.

SS still has a shot. I'm pretty sure WW is dead on arrival

The movie isn't even very good on a thematic level or as a take on modern mythology.

Who let a man who hates Superman make two Superman movies?

He isn't even using symbolism right either.

Yeah well, DC is in second place in the comics, why should things be any different in the movies?

good. maybe this will start the death of cape garbage.

He didn't ruined it. He did exactly what he was supposed to do.

If you wanna put blame on anyone. Blame Morrison, he let him in.

>People were (and still are) getting tired of Marvel films dominating.
You misspelled "neckbeards," because hype and ticket/dvd sales for Marvel cinematic are mad bank.

>People WANTED to support DC, wanted to support Batman and Superman in cinema
This, however, is true. Literally everyone I know was hyped (even the people who hated MoS were being cautiously optimistic)!

>Heavy-handed, less-subtle-than-brick-to-your-face, boring symbolism
I literally said to my friend, "Jesus ... this is gonna fucking SUCK" at the very start of the movie when they had that bit where the gun fires and breaks the pearl necklace. And THEN we had the "flying in a swirl of bats" just to be good and sure you knew what a shit-show of Pretentious Filmschool Freshman faggotry you were in for.

>SS still has a shot
Depends on if they overcompensate and take it too far in the other direction: no one wants grim-derp but you can fuck anything up by trying too hard. Image very much related.

Zack, you should get back to filming Justice League. Do better this time.

not that user, but its pretty great on a thematic level.


Having Luthor and Batman's arcs mirror each other, one being redeemed by Superman's sacrifice and the other being forever damned by it.

Playing on this idea that everyone sees Superman as a savior, so we read into every single shot that might be vaguely religious. Superman himself just trying to be "normal" and not praised, but superman doesn't want to command or tell humans what to do. In fact, outside of saving people directly in danger, Superman tries to stay out of peoples lives as much as possible. And when he finally DOES try to talk to people, Luthor ruins it.


I really loved it, showing how the idea of Batman can be so easily corrupted without an ideal to counter balance it. And how Luthor is driven purely by his hate for Superman, so much so he interrupts his own speech because he just hates superman so goddamn much. They really captured the old golden/silver age mad scientist luthor, just showed it through the modern day lense of the modern tech billionaire.

What he did was push his Ayn Rand fellating shitty politics into superheroes, and the world reacted with revulsion. He should go back to jacking off over The Fountainhead and leave the world alone.

>Yeah well, DC is in second place in the comics
Given the bump from Rebirth and the slump from Civil Bore that might change (at least over the short term: Nu52 and Forever Evil's Villain Month both pushed them into the top slot briefly).

I'm a fan of capeshit rather than a company partisan (so I'd rather we got more like Vision and Green Arrow regardless of the logo on the thing); but currently DC's getting more of my dosh than Marvel is.

>why should things be any different in the movies?
I'm not a fan of the CW generally, nor their cape show's specifically (iZombie excepted although it's not so much "cape") as I find them overly formulaic and way waaaaay too focused on the soapy whiny jr highschool tier 'shipping drama; but DC's currently got an awful lot of IP on the small screen: iZombie, Lucifer, Preacher, Supergirl, Arrow, Flash, just off of the top of my head.

And they've dominated in animation for years.

Tl;dr: they just need to get their shit together as there is no reason that they shouldn't be riding high on the current popularity of capeshit with the causals.

The flying in the swirl of bats was the moment i know the move was going to suck and that he didn't understand Batman.

>And they've dominated in animation for years.
Actually that hasn't been true since Flashpoint movie or Assault on Arkham. DC's animated movies have been hot garbage for a while now

It might be bad.

The trailers aren't exactly filling me with hope, I'm expecting at best mediocre stuff on par with Thor.

Symbolism is the least of BvS' problems, user

>DC's animated movies have been hot garbage for a while now
I've enjoyed the LEGO movies (they're silly but they're also obviously made by fans for fans).

Yeah well I guarantee you once a trailer drops everybody will be on Justice League's nuts once again and the cycle will renew once more.

Same as it ever was
Same as it ever was
Same as it ever was

>tfw Sup Forums is starting to circulate your image
feels great man

Zack Snyder CAN NOT stop sucking the dick

Extended cut fixed the movie for me. Direction was still dumb but at least it's a movie now rather than a choppy collection of scenes. Also Superman calling his mom was cute.

Is it screaming or is it doing sit-ups?

BvS was good though.

Honestly between BvS and Ghostbusters, the naive optimist in me wonders if this is the year Hollywood realizes it has to get its shit together and they can't just coast on name recognition.

He's screaming because he's doing intense sit-ups
NO PAIN NO GAIN SON

No it wasn't.

My mistake. It was great.

Now you're just letting everyone know you're a troll.

Batman vs. Superman is an inherently stupid concept, there was no way it was going to work.

BvS sold really fucking well, even underperforming.

If anything it's taught Hollywood that they need to put even more eggs in even fewer baskets, and that you can sell a film on sheer hype alone.

Maybe not with comic fans, but in terms of movies both Guardians and Deadpool outperformed BvS and MoS domestically. So even if they're better known, fewer and fewer people are giving a fuck about at least Superman (won't know with Batman until the solo movie comes out).

World's Finest is a thing and that worked fine

>BvS sold really fucking well, even underperforming.
user, just because the box office is high doesn't mean the studio got the benefits from it

WB shot themselves in the foot by letting Zack Snyder direct the three biggest films in the DCEU and map out its course. Whoever thought that letting a director who had a middling career with most of his movies getting less than 50% on RT direct WB's answer to the MCU should be shot.

This was a historical moment to have a live action meeting of the Trinity and establish the DCEU's brand, but now it's starting at a deficit.

>What he did was push his Ayn Rand fellating shitty politics into superheroes
He didnt, like at all.

You have a lot of spelling mistakes in there.

>Heavy-handed,

There's nothing heavy handed about that when most idiots can't point out the Ubermensch parts of batman, or the extremely in your face Frankenstein arc of Lex got over people heads.

All what idiots talk about is muh , since that's all what americans understand, they can't understand Superman is being compared with the archetype of the sun god and not fucking jesus.

He's like Michael Bay in a way.

>when most idiots can't point out the Ubermensch parts of batman, or the extremely in your face Frankenstein arc of Lex got over people heads.
Sup Forums please just go somewhere else

SS is expected to do very well this Summer. Most so called 'guaranteed hits' have performed dreadfully this year. The only Summer movies to live up to expectations so far are Civil War, Pets, and Dory. And things aren't looking so hot for Ghostbusters. All SS needs to do is NOT BE A TRAINWRECK and it'll be fine.

>All SS needs to do is NOT BE A TRAINWRECK and it'll be fine.
N...no pressure

See that's the kind of dumbass answer you get by the same people that think the symbolism was too in your face. It just wasnt in your face enough.

>And he ruined it.

I know Sup Forumstv/ would love to believe this, as Sup Forums always love to blame Snyder for everything, that it was because of characterization of superman and what not but it was only because of the poor editing that costed WB 100 mill atleast, normies don't give a shit about muh Superman and Batman actually brought some money but then again normies don't want to watch a movie that is exausting and hard to follow, problems which were easely fixed with the director's cut.

>that it was because of characterization of superman and what not but it was only because of the poor editing
Those aren't the only problems with the movie.

The Director's Cut is fucking shit. It's the same awful movie but with 30 extra minutes.

Don't worry, the next movie will be great

Kek. It wasn't even that bad of a movie, but, assuming this isn't bait, people like you are the reason it will never stop being mocked.

>Sup Forums movie reviews

They review movies better than Sup Forums.

DC has had plenty of good movies in the past. Just wait 10-20 years for a return to form.

>Mfw "This is just Superman's beginnings. He'll be a fully realized Superman in the sequel"

>implying I will live that long

I'm sure it made sense at the time. They weren't expecting him to go all "Kickboxer 2" and shit things up before they had a chance to really get started.

Batman v Superman wasn't a trainwreck (it's the fourth highest grossing movie in the world this year) and even that was enough to make Warner Bros. reconsider how it handles its movies:

slashfilm.com/warner-bros-releases/


If Suicide Squad bombs (which I don't think it will, but I also don't think it's going to be a smash hit) then we're probably looking at a cancelled Wonder Woman and Affleck's solo Batman getting bumped up.

>It just wasnt in your face enough.

Stop.

People understood that things were symbolical. They are probably aware that there's more "depth" to the various things that they watched.

That doesn't make them good, though.

Like, holy shit. You must have missed the point of English Lit class if you think symbolism makes a story good. Metaphors, symbols, etc. help an already well-made story have deeper impact and, in general, they're subtleties -- easter eggs, if you will.

But relying on symbolism to boost the quality of a story is misguided.

For example, why am I supposed to care that Lex's character arc is like that of Victor Frankenstein? Does knowing this make the movie better for me?

Admittedly, I said, "huh, i guess that's kinda neat." But I still think Lex was a horribly written character and no amount of pro-symbolism changes the fact that his characterization made little sense.

>And things aren't looking so hot for Ghostbusters.
There's an understatement.

>you are a troll if you like what i dont like
fucking infantile

D-don't do it user

>a cancelled Wonder Woman

Are you dumb?

They already finished production of it.

No, you're a troll because even the people who like the movie don't think it's "great". Stupid bitch.

Developed so fast that they managed to go straight to his death

>a cancelled Wonder Woman
Holy shit.
Its true.
You people are all fucking stupid as hell.

No, Sup Forums in general doesnt watch movies or read books, Most people here only goes to the movies to watch big blockbusters, Sup Forums is a shithole, but at least they watch movies that don't have toylines.
And he was. In fact a great superman. But some fags want to think that since he wasnt weaving an american flag and smiling while people were dying he was a bad superman.

You might not, but I certainly will. I'll fucking live forever.

Not even the guy you were originally talking to, i just thought you were a retard. Which you are.

> even the people who like the movie don't think it's "great"
Ha, you are absolutely clueless.

>Sup Forums is a shithole, but at least they watch movies that don't have toylines.
Then why do they constantly talk about capeshit?

>Not even the guy you were originally talking to

sure, buddy

>Does knowing this make the movie better for me?

No, but it does give you context and information about his character beyond his words, it means the character can lie to other characters.

He had promise but has been woefully mishandled by a person who doesn't like Superman and is just flat out uncomfortable with having the heroes interact with in their "uniforms".

Unless you're going off technicalities like A History of Violence or Road to Perdition, not counting the Nolan Batmans you literally have to go back to the 1980s to get a good live-action DC movie.

Yeah, I simply just don't get it, just like I don't understand the hidden deeper meanings behind Snyders kino art, right? Just shut the fuck up already.

I know this is Sup Forums but where did i implied they didnt? i was implying Sup Forums only watches movies with toy lines, not that Sup Forums doesnt watch crap.

>by a person who doesn't like Superman
This is false.

Sup Forums watches movies related to Sup Forums

Because this is Sup Forums

Shit, sorry, man. My head's not in the right place at the moment. I haven't slept in three days.

It's true. He likes pictures of him looking angry with glowing red eyes, but thats the extent of his "love" for supes.

Ya'll realize that "finished" means principal photography's wrapped and Gal Godot's finished her scenes, meaning about a third of the movie could be incomplete, right?

>People understood that things were symbolical.
Ha, no they didnt.

>English Lit class if you think symbolism makes a story good.
Most English Lit classes, at least the ones i was in, spent a majority of the time analysing famous literature and poetry, looking for metaphors and allegories to real life events. So i think most people would disagree when you say that it doesnt make them good.

>in general, they're subtleties -- easter eggs, if you will.
Oh right your retarded.

>Lex's character arc is like that of Victor Frankenstein?
Not really, could make something out of his wanting for a son with doomsday but thats as far as you could reach, unless there was some gay subtext i missed.

> his characterization made little sense.
For (you)

And there's nothing wrong with that.
But is terrible to believe this board knows shit about live action movies.

Sup Forums threads about animation are way better than live action threads, this is a board where most people doesnt understand why people say Civil war looks like a tv show or that Flash isnt a good show if you don't feed on easter eggs and fan pandering.

I realise that you are an idiot to think it'll be cancelled now.

>if you don't count all of these great movies from the past 30 years, then you have to go way back

lel

Would you like me to post screen caps, or would you proclaim "photoshop" like a proud little autist.

Judging from that response you probably didnt, even though thats not even what the conversation was about.

How fucking old are you?

Look, dude, I'm the guy you replied to originally. I said I was sorry, I misinterpreted what you were saying about Sup Forums and that. Let's not make a big deal out of this.

>at the very start of the movie when they had that bit where the gun fires and breaks the pearl necklace.
That's literally straight out of TDKR.

>people would disagree when you say that it doesnt make them good.
Most people fucking HATED that shit in school, Poindexter.

You realize that they "finished" a version of Watchmen and never released it, right?

And that Suicide Squad bombing would mean that Batman, Superman, and Joker would be damaged goods.

And that tons of projects get filmed and never released.


Right?