Let me be blunt; is there a labor crisis in America today?

Let me be blunt; is there a labor crisis in America today?

Wuhh dat dupundz on vatchu mean by cwysis

one man's crisis is another man's market reaction.

Would you say it's time for our viewers to crack each other's heads open and feast on the goo inside?

The extreme opposite. There are far more people than there are jobs.

Incorrect. There are more job applicants than there are positions offered by employers.

However we are not a post-scarcity society. As long as there is an unfulfilled need, there will always be a job.

If no one's hiring, then become an enterprenuer - start your own business. Even if your business fails, it's better than starving to death.

>Incorrect, except that exactly what you said is true

Also:
>Even if your business fails, it's better than starving to death.
Starting a business that fails is not better than starving to death. It expedites it.

>As long as there is an unfulfilled need, there will always be a job.
Unless the unfulfilled need is needing a job.

Technological progress long ago made full employment impossible, and the number of people needed to do any given task decreases every day.

how does becoming an enterpenuer work when you dont have the money to start the business? how does that keep you from starving?

Youre a fucking faggot, dude.
Great thread guys. Im sure your girlfriends will be proud.

Who "needs" a job? We need food, water, and sometimes clothing and shelter, depending on where you are located. Everything else is a luxury.

And by food I mean calories and vitamins.

Generally, those things require money, which generally requires a job.

Why do you need money to start a business? Kids wash cars, mow lawns, (and used to deliver newspapers), and they have no starting capital. All you need is a clean clothes (so you don't look like you're going to rob the building) and towel/mop to be a housecleaner/janitor - and more than half the time the client provides the mop.

You're not gonna make it rich mopping floors, but you can feed yourself. Illegal immigrants do this every day.

>generalizations

this is why you're a wagecuck

You can't pay the bills and put food on the table by going into every business you see and offering to mop the floors for a quarter.

>All you need is a clean clothes
Costs money. Finding a place to shower when you're homeless also ranges from difficult to impossible.

Faggot.

>why do you need money to start a business

because how the fuck are you gonna pay for your own life on top of the expenses of running a business

seems like youve never had the harsh reality of using your own money for anything.

Back before I had steady employment, housecleaning and janitor jobs were among the ones I hit up all the time. They still required experience and had about 10 applicants for any given opening.

It's not a matter of opinion as to how many jobs there are. It's a mathematical fact that there are less than there are people seeking work.

Even illegal immigrants working for sub-minimum wage aren't guaranteed work, and they just push the floor for wages even lower.

then charge the client more than a quarter...

captain obvious to the rescue!

Kids don't make enough money to live on their own by doing shit like that.

>Kids wash cars, mow lawns, (and used to deliver newspapers), and they have no starting capital.
They also have living expenses of zero.

Who the fuck is going to pay you hundreds of dollars to do that? Janitors and Maids already exist.

have fun going to more than the houses in your direct vicinity without the money to pay for a car, and even if you charge 100 bucks per house and they even pay you that much how can you mow the lawn more than 1 time a week

That's what universal health care and other associated social security is for.

Or are you posting from the united memes of america where such things don't exist?

>pay for your own life

life is cheap yo. head over to /ck/, eat some ramen, then think about how many packets an african can afford to buy each month.

all your cell phone bills and other bullshit are luxuries. you can live without em.

>Or are you posting from the united memes of america where such things don't exist?
And where people cry for the limited versions we do have to be cut.

Kids don't work 60 hours a week. At least not since the 1920's.

A place to live is a luxury? Running clean water is a luxury?

Living exclusively on ramen will have major impact on your health.

Cell phones are a necessity for most jobs now.

And housing is the overwhelming majority of expenses.

How many hours do you work a week?

why does anyone deserve hundreds of dollars? can you not think of the market value of labor as something other than a hypothetical $0.25 or $100.00 (i'm assuming per hour)?

Where are you going to find people who will pay a random person a bunch of money to do menial chores instead of hiring someone to do it?

mow more than 1 lawn.

oh shit captain obvious strikes again!

You can't just fucking walk into someone's house and demand they give you a job mopping floors.

yes and yes.

Humans have been doing it for thousands of years.

Been to India?

Not him, but the market value of labor is far lower than what is livable due to the sheer surplus of labor available.

An employer can offer pathetically low wages and still find plenty of people willing to take that job, because those people have no better options.

Living in India is not living. It's suffering.

>Once those needs are fulfilled, there are no more jobs

A lot of employers can't afford to offer more positions at this time. Anyone who starts and runs a business knows how expensive it is to hire people, maintain people, and offer them decent wages without losing profitability.

>Living exclusively on ramen will have major impact on your health.
True, living only on any one food blah blah.
but you won't die.

>Cell phones are a necessity for most jobs now.
No. But pretending you're right, most is not all.

>And housing is the overwhelming majority of expenses.
Spending beyond your means.

>all your cell phone bills and other bullshit are luxuries. you can live without em.
You literally cannot, if you live in a first world country.

50-53 hrs/wk. I work 65 hrs for 8 weeks a year when my company releases new products.

Livable until you get some horrible disease due to living in a box and drinking dirty water.

>but you won't die.

You'll die much, much sooner though.

Not a bunch of money, just enough to feed yourself.

I mean if the price is right, wouldn't you? How clean and spotless is your car/house?

>True, living only on any one food blah blah.
but you won't die.
No, you literally will die if you only eat ramen.

>Spending beyond your means.
You cannot survive as a homeless person in America. You can't make money because no one will hire you because you can't look presentable because you have no money.

No one said demand, you entitled brat. Dress in clean clothes, don't smell, don't cuss, ask politely. Try the next one if they turn you away.

Not many people would pay random homeless men to clean up their house.

>I mean if the price is right, wouldn't you?
No. I would not trust a person desperate enough to work for pennies to clean my house.

You sound like a child who has never tried getting a job.

Desire is the cause of suffering - Buddha

ITT: entitled brats who think life without luxury is worse than death.

>Dress in clean clothes, don't smell
Requires money.

Also, no one is going to hire someone who goes door-to-door asking if he can clean your house unless he can show that he has experience.

There is no point to living if there's nothing to enjoy.

Nothing is stopping anyone from becoming an employer. If you see an untapped vein of cheap raw labor, mine that shit!

lol, no better options.

It's always strange to see this attitude on a site that revels in its piracy and throws bitchfits whenever anyone in an artistic field starts trying to sell their craft.

>Nothing is stopping anyone from becoming an employer.
A lack of money absolutely does.

>If you see an untapped vein of cheap raw labor, mine that shit!
That only works if there is anyone who wants that labor. The entire problem is that there is a far, FAR greater supply of labor than there is demand for it.

>market correction

are there diseases which are not horrible?

Dandruff, RLS, the kind of cold that's JUST bad enough to justify missing school.

and yet you trust them enough to flip your burgers...

you have pathetic reading comprehension

>captain obvious

Go back to 9fag.

>enough to feed yourself

You're going to have to go concrete here. How much is that per day?

Not that much money. Seriously illegal immigrants do this all day.

Yes, because they're not making them inside my house.

Also, burger flippers get minimum wage. I can't afford to pay someone even that.

Probably is.

I smell some naive, idealistic Berniecuck.

And even they aren't guaranteed work. For every one that gets hired there's a dozen who don't.

kys?

>Arguing that poor/homeless people are just lazy and that the free market works perfectly by itself
>Being a Benie supporter

Do you actually look up what politicians stances are or do you vote purely based on memes?

>free market works perfectly by itself
I love this meme
I love even more that there are people who legitimately believe it

Depends where you are. Rapidly developing countries by their very nature have no shortage of job openings as they are constantly expanding their output and production (which in turn fuels more jobs and production).

If you live in a developed country, there may be more people than openings, but not by much. The issue is that most of the job openings are for highly educated people. As the manual labour jobs move to the aforementioned developing nations, developed nations are focusing more on innovation which requires higher standards of education. One of the biggest problems in America right now is that their education system has stagnated while their manufacturing has been lost to free-trade agreements with China.

You may have misread my post.

I was saying that calling a person who believes that a Berniefag is like calling Anita Sarkeesian a Trump fan.

The sad thing is, in my country you can't just "start a business". You have to jump through myriads of hoops and pay money for permits etc. before you can start. Otherwise you will get raped by the state in no time.

Actually you're right. The free market does work. That's why you're losing all your jobs. My people are cheaper because you whities have gotten used to being "worth more".

That's why your companies go over here, pay exorbitant bribes and crazy fees, building their own buildings, renting land at high rates, then paying my people way more than 10x our minimum wage for jobs that require very little skill and training. Because it's cheaper to do that then to get you people to do it.

Enjoy globalization.

But suppose that your house was ransacked by thugs, your family tied up in the basement with socks in their mouths. You try to open the door but there's too much blood on the knob...

What makes you think I vote?

>Berniecuck is triggered

You clearly don't, because the voting age is 18.

You mean your country is driving the standard of living down for the entire globe.

hypothetical - would a company invest into building a manufacturing robot if human labor could manufacture the same product for cheaper?

what does RLS stand for?

depends on your location.

>Yes, because they're not making them inside my house.
wash car, mow lawn, windows?

>Also, burger flippers get minimum wage. I can't afford to pay someone even that.
then pay them less, do you think the IRS is gonna get you?

not at all. in fact if you really want to stem the overwhelming tide of competitively priced labor, go ahead and let trump build his wall. (not sarcasm)

Mmmmm, yes I would, Kent.

You are giving a way different example making a comparison of a kid and starting a company when you have no money for it.

Capitalism breeds innovation and success -- to a point. Once it became more profitable to grind miserable employees to a powder and move on to the next clinically depressed Mexican looking to feed his family, capitalism sort of defeated itself into obsolescence. Communism was the Boogeyman word for the dictatorship of the USSR, and capitalism will be remembered as the Boogeyman word for the United States' 21st Century Feudalism.

The wealthy stay wealthy, and have stayed wealthy since they were kings in Europe. We've been riding on a fading glimmer of hope into the sunset of Late Capitalism, a nation diagnosibly depressed and longing ti recapture brief glory days we'd found ourselves in almost a century ago-- glory days made possible by progressive socialistic policies that promoted community.

The climate is perfect; fascism is ready for another round against the world. Economic disparity and rampant hate, what's left of the middle class being tied up, blindfolded, and hearded like cattle. Really, all I look forward to is getting a firsthand observation of what a world war will look like with wifi.

>hypothetical - would a company invest into building a manufacturing robot if human labor could manufacture the same product for cheaper?
No.

But they do invest into machines that do the labor for cheaper than the cost of human labor would be. And this only increases as technology advances.

>double that in a year
Lol

how is self employment not a business?

BYOB
be your own boss

Nah. You whities barely reach a billion. The rest of us? We ARE the globe.

The free market is simply correcting for centuries of you people mining precious minerals from our countries and using us as cheap labor.

>do you think the IRS is gonna get you

>he's never been audited

>Nah. You whities barely reach a billion. The rest of us? We ARE the globe.
Yes. I'm including you in that.

You're cutting off your nose to spite your face.

so when
1) we have an overwhelming supply of human labor, and
2) the market value of labor decreases as supply increases

how can machines cost less than humans?

Not to mention that human labor gets more expensive as time goes on, while machine upkeep costs go down or reach a stable state.

You don't need to pay retirement for decomissioned machines.

Machines don't care about subsidized health care.

Machines don't go on strike or get dissatisfied and ask for a promotion/raise..

Because minimum wage laws exist, and humans cannot survive below certain incomes.

>people actually are debating off of a Simpsons joke
Fuck you Sup Forums

I'm zero percent white. We win, you lose.

No, fuck YOU! Off-topic Sup Forums threads are always informative and interesting.
I remember when that guy posted the Noah comic, we had a discussion about early monotheistic religions and how the flood myth came to be.

You completely missed what I said in that post.

You are lowering the standard of living for everyone. Not just people more well off than you. INCLUDING you. You're eating shit and laughing about it because it means other people have to eat shit too.

You know what, I think you are bait. I will play along for a bit anyway.

To start a business, you need money. To get money you need a job or a bank to loan you money. You can't have a business when you have a low-minimum paying job to support it, and you can't just get a loan from a bank just like that. And don't get me started on what you need ro spend to get a degree in beinga entrepreneur.

I don't think you understand how statistics work.

We're poorer.
You're richer.
We're taking your money.

You know how my people now have broadband internet access and smartphones when they used to be well-above the purchasing capability of our middle-class? And now our maids and taxi drivers have iPhones?

Yeah, thanks.

:D

He's been bait since the star of the thread. Incredibly thin arguments with mostly rhetoric and almost nothing to support them. I'm just enjoying throwing him a curve-ball right now.

The cost of unskilled human labor has been flat for the majority of history, until we created fiat money. On an individual basis, some people obtain skills, so their higher pay is a result of better performance.

You don't need to pay retirement for people either. The people with 401ks etc. are thusly compensated because they are worth more.

Health care is a luxury, not a right. We didn't magically gain rights in the past 200 years that the pilgrims didn't have. If health care was a right, doctors would be slaves.

But the manufacturers of machines can raise prices.

>You don't need to pay retirement for people either
What specific country does this apply to again?