Is Europe Christian or Pagan?

Probably one of the biggest divisions we on the Far Right experience, and a point of huge contention, is whether Western Culture is Pagan or Christian.

I'm torn and am struggling to choose one over the other. Whilst I admire the primal nature of Paganism and the values which it represents (a balance between Masculinity, Feminism, honor, pride and Tribal yet also Individualist), and it is also the true original White way of life, Christianity has significantly defined and lead our people since the fall of Rome, and disregarding it seems like a betrayal of recent European history. But, Christianity is ultimately an alien religion and faith with roots in the Middle East, not Europe.

Surely there is a way to blend these two and find a balance, or will we ultimately have to choose one over the other if we are to save our civilization?

Is Europe Christian or Pagan? Help me decide Sup Forums. Bonus question, is the Anglosphere Christian?

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Pagan. Christianity is from the middle east.

>inb4 fedora xd

Evola argued that elements of Christianity in Europe, Roman Catholicism specifically, carries on the spirit of Paganism, just manifested in a different way. Whites are Pagan intrinsically and biologically (hyper Masculine and Tribalistic) so we have morphed the religion to suit us.

It might be too altruistic fundamentally, but the Old Testament certainly holds some intense and right wing values.

Just putting that out there.

Bumparino

Islamic apparently.

Catholicism takes elements of indigenous religions, strains out the idolatrous aspects, and Christianises them. They then become part of the Christian patrimony. There is an obelisk in St. Peter's Square, for example, there is an obelisk originally from Heliopolis which was transported to Rome under Caligula. At its peak is a cross. Christ conquers all. Indeed, this very notion is expressed in the Gospel of John, where he takes a pagan Greek philosophical concept - Logos - and equates it to Christ. By doing this, pagan Greek philosophy has become part of the Catholic patrimony.

Even the Church recognises the pagan spirit of Europeans. In Nostra Aetate (a horrendous document, worth reading if only to see how negatively VII has impacted the Church's evangelizing efforts), the gentiles are referred to "wild shoots" which have been grafted into a well-cultivated olive tree.

This is to say, ultimately, what everyone already knows: Europeans are in origin pagan, and elements of their old ways continue today. Yet, they are Christian, "grafted into the well-cultivated olive tree."

Paganism is dead and has been dead for centuries. There's no real sense of continuity with the past. Most paganism these days is just make it up as you go along shit. It's literally LARPing at this point. The pagan situation is made worse when you consider that the biggest groups of pagans tend to be degenerate libtards like Wiccans, so even if you had some perfect knowledge of the religion of your ancestors, it would be a massive uphill battle to get it out there. This is a huge hurdle really. Purely from a pragmatic pov, there's far more likely to be a Christian revival than a pagan one.

>Is Europe Christian or Pagan?
In practice, neither. It's a spiritual desert. But it was Christian a lot more recently than it was pagan, and any meaningful discussion of a 'Europe' or European civilisation doesn't really begin before Christendom. Before that the different cultures were more distinct and didn't really have a whole lot in common with each other. Even a unified pre-Christian Roman faith is a bit of a misnomer compared to modern understandings of religious unity.

>Bonus question, is the Anglosphere Christian?
If you asked people a hundred years ago, they'd have said absolutely yes. Today though, the Anglosphere is unified more by language and a shared British cultural/legal tradition rather than religion.

Christianity seems to be quite manipulatable and applicable to many contexts and nationalities. Unlike Judaism, which explicitly claims the superiority of the Chosen Peoples, Christ's universal message is easily consumed by any kinds of peoples.

But the Old Testament's fiery intensity and harsh values seems to allow it to adopt the Paganism of Europe, and other general hyper masculine tendencies. Which is why one minute Crusaders can be marching into foreign lands, whilst Pope Francis can kiss the feet of Muslims.

>the gentiles are referred to "wild shoots" which have been grafted into a well-cultivated olive tree.
That's actually an interesting way to put it, I haven't read the document. I suppose the evolution of our culture derives from the two different cultures merging together.

In that case then, which heritage should we choose? Paganism, Christianity, both, or neither? Is it a conversation even worth having?

>there's far more likely to be a Christian revival than a pagan on
This is a pretty fair argument. Paganism is indeed glorified LARPing these days, ignoring the odd Occultist intellectual who worships Odin. Even then, most of these people have died off, most recent causality being Bowden from what I know.

I think though that Paganism, and it's respective gods, are more metaphorical representation of primal emotions and the nature of man.

If you could choose one over the other to become "Europe" right now instantly, and a majority of Europeans would adopt the spirituality or values of the respective choice, which would you choose? i'm curious.

lol it's neither; muslim.

Im pretty sure the west part is islamic and the eastern part is catholic/orthodox

Interestingly enough, plenty of far right philosophers tend to convert to Islam (in the past that is), there's a lot to admire when it comes to the nature of Jihad. At least they inherently have a intense militaristic and tribal way of life.

But of course, paedophilia isn't quite my cup of tea.

More like "Secular" in the west (codeword for incoming Islamic diversity), and the east is Orthodox.

Kek

>this thread

>If you could choose one over the other to become "Europe" right now instantly, and a majority of Europeans would adopt the spirituality or values of the respective choice, which would you choose? i'm curious.

Interesting question which I'd have to chew over more to give a good answer on. For a quick and dirty answer I'd say Christianity, simply because it's more likely to be true. I think any religion based on a Platonic noble lie is going to come undone eventually. You just can't keep a lie going forever, no matter how many times you spin it anew. The human spirit will eventually dissent when it knows falsehood. I don't think metaphors are enough ultimately. I really don't think paganism has a future in that respect; even with the best will in the world, we don't have access to the religion of our pre-Christian ancestors, it's gone and isn't coming back. So I think it's either Christianity of some form and embracing the spirituality of the ancestors that we do know despite our doubts, or we jettison religion entirely in favour of something else. But what that new creed would be, who knows. Everything we've seen so far is that where religion retreats, degeneracy fills the secular void. Without moral codes grounded in (what people believe to be) objective immutable laws, you have a liberalism without end.

I'm not a Christian (maybe one day), but one of the strongest indicators that Christianity is a better option is that 2000 years later and Christianity is still going strong, at least in terms of numbers. The capacity for moral revival is there. Paganism, where it even exists, is tiny, fringe, and incoherent.

If the world is christian, its because the Spanish.

Catholic is Europe.

>(hyper Masculine and Tribalistic)
>whites
cmon m8

You need to build an army and leave the EU.

There is very little of Catholicdom that is non European as the Church and Authorities for it are European, the very first Church founded of the religion was given to Europeans.

Catholicdom and Europeans are tied to one another.

As a Nordic American who was raised Roman Catholilic by my German/Irish father and yet still inculcated with traditional mythology of Norse paganism by my 100% Norwegian mom and grandmother, I think that the two cultures are 100% compatible, so long as a philosophical foundation of life-affirmation and ancestral honor is present.

Orthodox

Christianity is the monotheism of Europe, One God One Truth One Authority, the Church.

paganism is dead, and its just not coming back in any real way. christianity might be dead, but it could conceivably come back if restored quickly

the best option might be a new religion based on something tangible

The development of the European side of the faith was done by only Europeans.

Protestantism was the Jews trying to revert our religion to a barbarous pagan one.

>the best option might be a new religion based on something tangible

Which made us strong and which made us weak?

Objectively Protestantism killed half of Europe.

We're not all cuckmutts like you burgers, it makes a huge difference when you know what you are instead of being a mash of various peoples of Europe and beyond.

Do you really think that issue is that simple?

>Protestantism was the Jews trying to revert our religion to a barbarous pagan one.
"I'm talking out of my ass and rambling about jews" The post
Therefore be on your guard against the Jews, knowing that wherever they have their synagogues, nothing is found but a den of devild in wich sheer selfglory, conceit,lies,blasphemy, and defaming of God and men are practiced most maliciously and ceheming his eyes on them

Christian but slowly returning to pagan.

>pagan Europe= white niggers in mudhuts
>Christian Europe= apex of civilization

>the best option might be a new religion based on something tangible
Based on Our sacred People. Not to (((worship))) but rather to preserve.

BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD
SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE

forgot the end quote there
It's from Martin Luther's "On the Jews and their lies"

That explains Belgium, Sweden, France, and Germany.

If anything is barbarous and pagan, it's catholicism. Images, rituals, figureheads, body and blood, etc
Protestantism is dominant in the good/white european countries and catholicism dominant in the shit/brown ones

...

Just like Stalin the antisemite, right?

>pagan Europe= white niggers in mudhuts
literally hang yourself

Protestantism is pagan because everyone has their own God and their personal views.

>pagan Europe= white niggers in mudhuts

You as noodle nigger should know better.

Pagan Europe = Individualism.

>[adjective] [noun] = [unrelated description]

>muh Roman empire
The Romans were degenerates. What modern Europe is was built by Christianity

nice may may

Pagans ultimately all died or converted to Christianity. Christians went on to build the greatest empires the world had ever known.

more like
>tfw no Imperium
>tfw you will never purge the xenos and heretics from the galaxy

>The Romans were degenerates.
>What modern Europe is was built by Christianity
Modern Europeans are degenerates.

Looks like things have come full circle.

>What modern Europe is was built by Christianity
I know right, what a fucking degenerate suicidal weak pathetic mess, only a desert semitic cult born out of traitorous jews bullied thoroughly by the alpha masculine roman empire could conceive such a mess

Because modern Europeans are not Christian

Not entirley true, there is (OBOD) but they're a fuck load of pretenders which fucking annoys me.

The fake pagans lean to the left.

The real pagans in britain are now underground or at least well isolated, they are not to be messed with. They are absolutely red pilled my friend it can take years of study and service to become a druid. Some notable people in the media are plants of this group. They hve influence they if anything are happy there was a culling of the weak and the chrlatans can have their wands the true weapon of a druid is his voice....SKYRIM!

>muh no tru Christians

Muzzie tier desu

Fuck middle eastern monotheism to be honest. It's cancer and forbids fun. How the fuck do people subscribe to any religion that promotes living a shitty life?
Some paganisms were good, you had to fear a God's wrath for you bad actions but you were also incited to have fun and celebrate a God's glory during ceremonies where people sang, drank, danced etc.

are you gonna meme on me or present me some facts or quotes

modern Europeans are ideologically more Christians than their more traditionalist ancestors who didn't follow the actual book, pope Francis goes more by the book than their ancestors
that's what protestantism unleashed, pure Christfaggotry by the book, unmitigated by Pagan European tradition

>he thinks modern mean contemporary
oh boy

you are conflating the bitter old hags who still practice christanity today with christiantiy

Huh?

modern = post French Revolution
do you think this sort of contemporary faggotry was born in a vacuum?
the reformation, the French revolution and everything that came afterwards are intimately related

The Book is not Christianity.

It's both, christianity adapted to appropriate all european pagans.

Christianity is the worship of the One True God, and lead by his representative on earth, the Church.

and everyone knows
the French Revolution was started by faithful Christians, that then proceeded to take the money from their own church to finance a defensive war then proceed to follow a manlet
yup
Chrisitians did all of that it just didn't happen the previous 1800 years

Che religione segui?

the book is the source of the semitic shit of Christianity
I can maybe recognize some merits in Catholicism/Orthodoxy for instance but if said merits have little to do with the book itself and are mostly things adopted and molded out of Pagan tradition, then I'd go with Pagan Europe.

WE WUZ VIKANGZ

Which church? :^)

The Book has little to do with Christianity.

Almost everything that was great about classical Europe was built by Pagan civilizations (Greece and Rome) and whilst the fall of Rome wasnt a quick and simple affair, the spread of Christianity was a significant factor and is partly responsible for the dark ages that followed.

Theres a strong argument to be made that it was Europeans that uplifted Christianity from the frothing doomsday beggar-cult into the grand institution we see today, rather than Christianity that enriched Europe.

That said authentic Paganism is dead in the dust today. For all the sentimental fondness I have for it and as much as I would like to see an authentic Odinist-cult sweep through our armed forces to counter the Jihadists. It aint gonna happen and time spent on any kind of pagan revival is time wasted.

none but I have more sympathy for the Aryan(Pagan) tradition of Europe than to its weird conflicting semitic-aryan tradition that was developed with the advent of Christianity in Europe

used to be christian, pretty much athiest now isdn't it. soon to be muslim. hehe

The Only One.

There is nothing Semitic about Christianity.

hehe

Well yeah, i'm talking about how christianity or any other middle eastern monotheism (islam, judaism) is practiced nowadays. They've all degenerated into this :
>no fun allowed
>mostly developps thanks to ignorance (Christianity developps in 3rd world shitholes, Islam developps in Europe through retarded ghetto dwellers, Judaism hardly convert anyone anymore)
>victim complex
>demand special treatment everywhere
>are hated everywhere unless they represent the majority of the population
>promote universal values like love, peace, equality, freedom etc. only when it suits them

concepts nigga, concepts
people act following certain ideas
Catholicism was the focal point in middle ages Europe until some of them proceeded to say fuck it to the Catholic tradition and go protestant

the subsequent ideological environment was key to sparkle in later times the French revolution and all the faggotry that slowly made its way to the modern liberal ideology

>The Only One.
Which is? Don't be such a vague faggot.

>There is nothing Semitic about Christianity.
Except for the god, the historical setting, the place of origin, the main characters...

>There is nothing Semitic about Christianity.
Except for the fact that it branched off of Judaism right?

>the gentiles are referred to "wild shoots" which have been grafted into a well-cultivated olive tree.

That's actually from the Bible originally, a fact which you should know if you want to be taken seriously when discussing Christianity you fucking illiterate, ignorant pleb.

>where people sang, drank, danced etc.
You generally drink and sing during your average Catholic Mass. If you want to dance join a nigger church.

Also,
>incited to have fun

Clearly a sodomite. Fuck off.

Ultimately the question is a stupid one. If you choose Paganism no one will give a shit. Paganism is irrelevant. Paganism has been irrelevant for 1000 years. Christianity however still has some power left.

Neither Celts of Anglo-Saxons believed in Nordic shittery
educate yourself on your people's traditions and history before memeing on the internet my "aryan" man

define "Christianity" since apparently only you know what it means

The God is the only GOD not any Semitic or Jewish God which Talmudist's worship.

>There is nothing Semitic about Christianity.

These priorities are with Christians inverted:

>my universalist, proseltysing religion
>my deist, atheist and pagan racial/ethnic brothers

Paganism is interesting, I love learning about my ancestors beliefs, however, it was perhaps a very degenerate way of life.

However, Christianity in its current form is exactly what Jesus was against. It's extremely corrupt and is more of a business than a religion.

It fulfilled the worship of GOD, it was not anything Judaic anymore than ants are Lithuanian because you spoke to them.

Christianity is the worship of GOD not A God as the Jews worship.

>Christianity however still has some power left.

And looking at how that power is used, that's not a positive.

Nice meme picture by the way. Read through this catholic thread if you have the time: forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=870532

He's like Joseph!

>Neither Celts of Anglo-Saxons believed in Nordic shittery
educate yourself on your people's traditions and history before memeing on the internet my "aryan" man.

Im not aryan and I didnt say that they did....

Christianity means apostolic succession and worship of One God, One Truth.

Christianity is universal in teaching not in immigration.

>The God is the only GOD not any Semitic or Jewish God which Talmudist's worship.

Then what's the point of the Old Testament if the New one doesn't reference that same god in it?

that doesn't mean shit to me
is the bible a Christian book? is it the word of your God?

Christianity itself isn't even Christian. Just look at the Christian fish, that's clearly a cunt, representing various fertility goddesses

The God of the Old Testament was GOD speaking to a tribe, this was not the Jews God, Talmudism is the worship of their Jewish God.

the modern liberal ideology was spawned in the 60s during the begining of the age of Progressiveness and has been continualy funded by external (((agents))) throught the 20th century, few decades after most European nations have given women's suffrage and communism spread to global levels
As the French revolution was actualy triggered by few people who wanted to accomplish their intrests so they indoctrinated the people during times of hardship to follow their lead
Blaming all of that on Christians is inherently wrong, but it's an easier target and less distant and less untouchable that (((them)))
know your enemy
Christian

>very degenerate way of life
How does being true to your own nature and to the nature of your land "degenerate"?
Fucking memewords

It is compliation of Church traditions which looked legit and thus legitimized by the Church for more continuity and better research in future doctrine, sort of a guideline.

>dark ages that followed.
Dude...

then why do you advocate odinism when it would be another invading external religion diffrent from your people's?
is that not what you want?
a return to traditions of the original settlers of Europa?