"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."
Americans. If you're going to keep quoting this as a reason to keep your firearm, have you joined a well regulated militia? Because any idiot buying a rifle at Walmart doesn't constitute a well regulated militia in my mind. That's an armed, untrained mob.
What, exactly, would be the problem with a requisite for owning a gun license be membership in a militia (perhaps unless you prove you use it for hunting or something), which can actually train people how to use them one weekend out of the month or something and perhaps better weed out psychopaths and incompetents. To me this seems far, far less egregious than the current situation. You keep your guns, you actually learn how to defend yourself, and there's some ongoing process wherein people can detect signs of a nutcase. And if a weekend a month is too much to ask, maybe you don't need that gun as much as you think you do.
>10 U.S. Code § 311 - Militia: composition and classes
>(a) The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at least 17 years of age and, except as provided in section 313 of title 32, under 45 years of age who are, or who have made a declaration of intention to become, citizens of the United States
Now fuck off, leaf.
Bentley Carter
Frankly, your opinion doesn't fucking matter. I get to have my gun. So do other law-abiding citizens.
It doesn't say "the right of the Militia." It says "the right of the people."
Shut the fuck up and go back to fucking moose.
Mason Brown
No need to get so defensive, I'm asking a question not attacking you. Frankly you guys can gun each other down all you like, it just shocks me that the people who in one breath say "we need to defend ourselves from an oppressive government! We need to defend ourselves from home invasion!" can't be assed to actually go and train with their community once a month or something.
And in answer to the first poster - is that basically saying "bam you turned 17 you're part of the militia you don't actually have to do anything"? Because I've never once in my life heard of anybody have to attend any form of militia training. That doesn't feel like a well regulated militia to me either, that sounds like a shitty blanket technicality.
Bentley Hughes
Nobody cares one bit what is sounds like to you. The Congress defined our militia. The Supreme Court says we have the individual right to keep and bear arms. What some effeminate left-wing Canadian thinks is simply irrelevant. We kicked you fuckers out in 1776 for a reason.
Ryder Williams
Canada, you should know better than the questions a burger's MUH GUNS. Did you expect an intelligent discussion with gunnuts?
Jackson Baker
Heres your answer leaf
If we ever need a militia, waiting to acquire firearms until needed is too late.
The well regulated part means when activated. The right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed so that the body of the militia are already armed when needed
Samuel Garcia
...
Ryder Bennett
>What some effeminate left-wing Canadian thinks is simply irrelevant.
kek, yeah yeah literally communists etc.
What, exactly, is wrong with the idea of actually doing something with a militia? Why is having a gun so important to you if the very concept of being part of an organization that defends your community brings you to a frothing fury?
Tyler Perry
I guess not. Personally I'm not even against owning firearms, I just considered that militia membership (and actual training) was beneficial both for actually making sure people could use the weapons they own responsibly and also conforming to the usual rhetoric for gun ownership (defending yourself).
It turns out it triggered a bunch of people anyway.
Lincoln Gonzalez
pic related you commie fucks
Dylan Jenkins
>in my mind. Not an argument.
Austin Cox
Do you understand what a republic is, you moron?
Thomas Perez
>What, exactly, is wrong with the idea of actually doing something with a militia? Nothing.
>Why is having a gun so important to you if the very concept of being part of an organization that defends your community brings you to a frothing fury? First, he never said that being part of a militia made him mad. Secondly, the having a gun is important because the constitution recognizes it as an inalienable right, and rights are useless if not exercised.
Adam Evans
You seem to believe that my constitutional rights are up for debate, or open to compromise. I don't know what gave you that impression, but they are not.
Mason Stewart
Ok. Do you argue that any armed mob constitutes a well regulated militia, then?
Explain to me, particularly in the concrete relationship between a republic and poorly regulated firearm ownership. I live in a filthy monarchy or possibly communist dystopia depending on who you ask.
Furthermore, can anyone explain to me why the well regulated militia was mentioned in the same sentence? Would not the right to bear arms and the right to a well regulated militia be separate if there's this distinction? It strikes me as a confusing way to phrase it unless they're directly related to one another.
Jaxon Morales
>You seem to believe that my constitutional rights are up for debate, or open to compromise.
Can't you already be restricted from firearm ownership if you're a criminal / insane? Is that not already a compromise?
Sebastian Long
I love how all you marxist commie faggots ignore this
Cameron Wood
Her, try and understand this as far as what our 2nd amendment means
Nolan Hernandez
I'm not a communist, I'm supposed to be a monarchist, remember? Either way yes I hate freedom etc, let's get over that.
Sorry if your shitty image macro doesn't constitute an actual discussion - but ok we can get into it. Presumably "well balanced breakfast" stands in for "militia" and food stands in for firearms? I understand the argument, but what exactly is the problem with ensuring people have a well balanced breakfast, as they say? Why is suggesting that so offensive to you that you have to start pulling out the "dirty commies" rhetoric? Please stop being so defensive, I'm asking questions, not trying to steal your guns. It's not like I can, and it's not like me asking a bunch of people on Sup Forums is going to influence anyone with the power to. Rather than feel so threatened, it's better to have a damn dialogue about it.
Grayson Price
>I cannot read We know OP
David Thomas
People on Sup Forums recently have the reading comprehension of 7th graders. >Once I leave college and go to an uncucked state(cali-fag here) I plan on joining a militia. Well regulated was definitely put into the 2a for a reason. It means that we not only have the right, but the responsibility to arm ourselves and train to be able to overthrow the government if needed.
Jaxon Cook
I know you gun haters won't respond to my posts. I just wish I knew how much you hate getting you arguments beat the fuck out once people understand what the second amendment is really about. You fucking commie haters all eat shit.
Jordan Gonzalez
>Can't you already be restricted from firearm ownership if you're a criminal / insane 1 it's only done through due process 2 any laws restricting the possession and ownership of any type of arms without conviction of an individual through due process is unconstitutional 3 people charged with a crime should only have their Rights legally denied during the sentence and immediately restored once their sentence is up
Jackson Price
My state law forbids me from joining a militia, even though I am given that right in the constitution.
Fuck me.
Jacob Lopez
You can tell yourself what ever you need to but you are a full on marxist. LOL..."I'm not a coomunist".... whatever faggot.
Grayson Collins
>leaf Shall not be infringed. Say it over and over.
Nolan Jones
What I wonder is how would americans justify their gun ownership without the second amendment?
>i-its my natural right says literally who? What if you had to move to Canada for a work project or something, do you think "ITS MUH NATURAL RIGHT, LOCKE SAYZ SO" would keep you from getting arrested for waving around a restricted firearm in public?
Christopher Allen
>leafs in charge of understanding the constitution >leafs in charge of understanding due process pottery
Robert Rogers
See Also note that I've already disclaimed I don't hate guns and the entire thread is here to propose that you actually just have a system in place where you learn how to use the damn things responsibly.
Anyway because the only way you seem capable of arguing is reposting a shitty image macro of a half-assed analogy I'll carry on your analogy.
So you need food to have a well balanced breakfast, that's great. You are, rather than accepting the premise of the thread that a well balanced breakfast is a good thing and that maybe you should try and have a well balanced breakfast, shitting yourself in anger and going "I CAN EAT 20 CHOCOLATE BARS FOR BREAKFAST IF I WANT THIS IS THE LAND OF THE FREE FUCK OFF COMMIES REEE STOP TRYING TO TAKE AWAY MY BREAKFAST!"
I'm not trying to steal your damn breakfast, friend, I'm asking you why you don't eat a well balanced one if food is so important to you. Get it?
Connor Sullivan
SHALL
Julian Parker
...
Andrew Green
>Sorry if your shitty image macro doesn't constitute an actual discussion - but ok we can get into it
That macro is perfect. It completely and exactly proves that the right to bear arms is an individual right. Yopu can fuck right off like we told you to fucl off whne we won the revolution and caused you to .ose control over your entire slave empire you fucking fucks, You are going to get everything you deserve as a nation that enslaved most of the planet...your children are paying now, your women are next. Enjoy karma assholes.
Jason Long
All males DO join a well regulated militia, you dolt.
It's called the Draft.
Also, militia encompasses the whole population of the US anyway so it really does not matter
Sebastian Adams
Except you wouldnt get arrested because guns are legal in canada
Henry Reyes
They have restrictions. You can't just show up with whatever firearm you want.
Samuel Parker
The natural right to defend yourself in the same capacity that those who would do you harm oppress you. Why is that so hard for leaves to understand? Saging your shitty slide thread
David Diaz
When the time comes, we'll form in a minute.
Aaron Nelson
we dont have to justify anything. just because youre eternally cucked by a government who refuses to let you protect yourselves, doesnt mean that the right to bear arms isnt one of the most basic human rights. the real question is how would you stop us from owning the guns and the answer is you wouldnt.
Jaxson Perry
They would defend it for the same reason why gamers defend games from the media or how truck owners defend owning a truck after 80 people were ran over.
It's not some object that's the problem, it's fucking people.
Xavier Turner
As OP I'm not that guy, but again, the premise of the thread was "If you like defending yourself so much why not arrange an organization where you learn to actually do it once a month?"
I'm getting the impression you guys are so used to going through the motions with "you can't take my guns away!" that you don't even read the argument anymore.
Blake Johnson
>live in community >own firearms >be trained in their use.
Congratulations, you're part of the 'militia'
Gavin Rogers
If the second amendment limits Americans to muskets does that mean the First amendment limit Americans to manual one page at a time printing presses? You stupid Brits gave up you only defense against the muslim invasion ans now you live with sharia law zones and THOUSANDS of your children getting turned into sex slaves. HAHAHAHAHAHA faggots
Isaiah Hughes
I am my own well regulated militia. The regulated militia is constituted/defined as any white landowning male from roughly late teens to 50s. So yes, let's enforce regulated militia law. No non-whites, non-land owners (if you own but 1% of land which anyone who has made one payment on a house or piece of property does), and non-males. I don't doubt that would improve things immensely.
Adrian Turner
The feds don't let us setup militias any more. Last one I am aware of ended up being 60% FBI agents.
>the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." THAT COMMA IS NOT IN THE RATIFIED VERSION
THAT COMMA CHANGES THE INDEPENDENT CLAUSE
THAT IS A JEW COMMA PUSHED BY JEWS TO MAKE US THINK IT IS THE RATIFIED VERSION
IT IS NOT
Levi Turner
Came here to say that. Thank you user.
Brody Bailey
The rest of the world can suffer from these attacks. In the USA we can defend ourselves...deal with that shit
Camden Edwards
Ok. So what seems to be so offensive about a formal arrangement where an individual is trained in their use? That is what I've been asking.
I did take note of the first post in the thread which basically states as soon as you turn 17 you're part of the militia, so on a technical level I get it, but it's strange to me that people are being so diligent in the idea that being a member of the militia should have absolutely zero responsibilities in times of peace. You should be instructed in how to use your guns if you consider it your right to have them, and it'd probably save a lot of people a lot of headaches from legions of incompetent assholes abusing them.
Leo Howard
You are saying nothing. You are a gremlin. Begone gremlin.
Lucas Jackson
>bam you're in the militia Yes… It was largely influenced by the Anglo-Saxon Fyrd policy… Which means you own a weapon and you are apart of the militia by default when you come of age. No service required but you are apart of the militia, doesn't mean much to you I understand, but it's our way of life, please stop judging us.
Luke Morris
FPBP
Ayden Rogers
>As OP I'm not that guy, but again, the premise of the thread was "If you like defending yourself so much why not arrange an organization where you learn to actually do it once a month?" plenty of people already do that. millions more practice individually.
Jacob Robinson
A well regulated doctorate, being necessary to the safety of an abortion clinic, the right of the people to have an abortion, shall not be infringed.
That's argument I make with libs. Teaches them a grammar lesson. Who has the right to an abortion? The people or the doctors. >inb4 it's different Yeah the 2a is a constitutional right
Gabriel Perry
read DC v Heller, you inbred cuck
Robert Anderson
I would say yes.
Juan Green
>Americans. If you're going to keep quoting this as a reason to keep your firearm, have you joined a well regulated militia? Because any idiot buying a rifle at Walmart doesn't constitute a well regulated militia in my mind. That's an armed, untrained mob.
Congratulations you're capable of making arbitrary distinctions between militias and armed citizenry. Spoilers: There is no difference. They are the same thing.
>What, exactly, would be the problem with a requisite for owning a gun license be membership in a militia (perhaps unless you prove you use it for hunting or something), which can actually train people how to use them one weekend out of the month or something and perhaps better weed out psychopaths and incompetents.
Literally everything, because you're establishing a precedent by which the Government can deny issuing the license whenever it likes. You are essentially creating the means by which the peoples' right to keep and bear arms can be infringed.
>To me this seems far, far less egregious than the current situation. You keep your guns, you actually learn how to defend yourself, and there's some ongoing process wherein people can detect signs of a nutcase. And if a weekend a month is too much to ask, maybe you don't need that gun as much as you think you do.
You don't keep your guns if the Government can revoke your ability to own and purchase them at its discretion, which is exactly what you're proposing. It's no wonder your ancestors sucked British cock and still do.
Xavier Long
Yea because there literally is no argument that can interfere with a natural right. It is a basic premise of nature. Thats why we reply with: Shall not be infringed Get fucked commie Etc. The rhetoical arguments that would talk a free man out of his right to defend himself are the same ones that enable the same slavery and racism that modern liberals are so excited to fight. So no I won't entertain your argument, I won't even read it, it's wrong before it even begins.
Kevin Wright
I have never read US Code: The post.
Colton Campbell
Damn, FPBP
are canadians really this stupid?
Adam Perez
Another question. Why are Americans so anti gun regulation.
Why shouldn't people have to take a gun training course and a psychiatric evaluation before buying a military style rifle?
Thomas Phillips
>Well regulated was definitely put into the 2a for a reason. yeah, any infringement is a badly regulated free society, no infringements is a well regulated one
Xavier Moore
Because fuck you.
That's why.
Samuel Parker
>everyone just keeps responding to the fucking leaf instead of actually looking at the US's codification of English common law
Isaiah Wilson
NOT
Owen Perez
Yes, and they're generally the ones diligent enough to actually use their guns responsibility. I'm talking about the other dipshits who own a gun "just because" or have some power fantasy of "defending themselves" but never take the time to actually learn how to use a weapon responsibly.
Thomas Perry
BE
Caleb Perry
because crime is down yet we have never owned more guns
also your reasoning is "muh feelings"
Sebastian Sanders
>If the second amendment limits Americans to muskets does that mean the First amendment limit Americans to manual one page at a time printing presses? There is a process should one feel like they are put on the list unduly, user.
The Federal Government came to the understanding that well over 120,000,000 law abiding citizens owned more that 500,000,000 million weapons and have more ammunition in their homes that the USA, Russia and China has combined. Disarming Americans is impossible. New York and Connecticut banned specific types of rifles and well over 250,000 Americans said "FUCK YOU , WE WON'T DO WHAT YOU TELL US", NOW WHAT WILL THE GOVERNMENT DO...INCREASE OUR PRISON CELLS BUT 700% TO JAIL THEM. IT'S OVER, GUN CONTROL HAS BEEN BEAT THE FUCK OUT SO BADLY THAT THEY WON'T EVEN TALK ABOUT IT IN THE MAIN STREAM MEDIA.
Xavier Stewart
In the Bill of Rights.
Luis Murphy
What's so offensive about it? Simple it's a barrier that the government can easily control
You already see the damage done through free speech and schools in America Do you think all these sjws pop up because of their parents? No it's the schools Effectively youre saying that everyone should have to go to gun school but who runs gun school?
People already train with their guns on their own There is no need for regulation beyond that Give me stats on "legions of incompetent assholes" please You can't I know
Elijah Ward
NOICE
USA USA USA
Jacob Scott
theres literally nothing wrong with owning firearms solely for self protection or collecting. i would recommend practicing with your self defense firearm but with a shotgun or a carbine, its literally just point and shoot inside a building.
Easton Edwards
Not an argument
The U.S still has very high gun homicide rates. I know I'd feels safer if some random Muslim couldn't walk in to a store and buy an AK47 and 500 rounds in 5 minutes.
Isaiah Sanders
The second amendment was clearly only meant for the police to own guns. We need to kill these gun toting second amendment terrorists.
Daniel Reyes
Go fuck yourself Leaf everyone hate you
Wyatt Sanders
Except if you have a mental or criminal record, in which case it's no longer your natural right or basic premise of nature.
Carson Foster
Who said I was here to argue with a Canadian on US gun laws?
Asher Carter
n-not you too Norway.
Robert Anderson
ITT OP proves why nobody likes Canadisn posters. They ask a (retarded) question, they get told the answer multiple times in multiple ways, and they ignore it every time because they're too cuckolded by their government to even fathom the concept of inalienable individual rights.
Asher Adams
INFRINGED
Wow my posts are underrated
Brody Nelson
1) Are the any other sources of the regulations of this militia? Since the militia must be "well regulated", according to the 2nd amendment (the amendment you so love)
2) Since the 2nd amendment states that the right of the people to bear arms is for the purpose of being in a well regulated militia (there's literally no other way to parse the sentence), why should Americans carry guns OUTSIDE of their participation in the militia?
I.e. why doesn't the "militia headquarters" or something like that keep all the guns? Then they'll give them out to you when it's needed?
>It says "the right of the people"
Yes and it also says "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State"
The right of the people is only being granted here FOR THE PURPOSE of having a well regulated militia - as I stated above there's literally NO OTHER SENSIBLE WAY of parsing the sentence.
If I say "Vegetables, being necessary for good health, the right of the people to eat broccoli, shall not be infringed", I am saying that the people have a right to broccoli BECAUSE vegetables are good for you.
If militias weren't the reason for granting a right to guns, then why are they mentioned in the amendment at all?
Therefore, what should happen is, as I stated to the other guy, the militia headquarters (and there should be such a thing, since this militia has to be well regulated, according to what the amendment allows) should keep all the guns and hand them out to people when militia activity is undertaken. Because this amendment DOES NOT GRANT ANYBODY THE RIGHT TO USE ARMS, OUTSIDE OF THE CONTEXT OF A MILITIA
GET THAT THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULL
Camden Hughes
>and they ignore it every time
I've replied to most people arguing with me. It doesn't help that most are ad hominem calling me a communist cuck, and a majority of the rest aren't actually addressing what I asked and instead whining about me trying to take away their guns.
Nicholas Sanchez
And the majority of those gun homicides happen in strict gun places that have tons of black people. Also, why do non-US western counties only care about Gun homicide, and not any other type?
Nicholas Brooks
Look up common usage of the word regulated in the 1700s
Jackson White
more like those sluts you posted are overrated
Adam Morales
Am I shadow banned or are the anti gunners just BTFO that bad that they won't respond?
Brody Flores
Okay so then citizens have no rights to bear arms in a personal context? They have a right to bear arms within the context of the well regulated militia. Which you say is the Army reserve. The Army should keep all the guns and then just give them out to you when the militia is needed.
The wording of the 2nd amendment does not grant the right of anybody to bear arms outside of the context of a "well regulated militia". It ONLY grants you that right within the context of a well regulated militia. The wording is quite clear.
Robert Bennett
>defend yourselves Americans >WOAAAH RELAX ITS JUST A PRANK
Ian Young
Well regulated refers to the maintenance of the firearms that a militia has.
Leo Cruz
I did. Most of what you've said is brainless shitposting and you ignored my actual rebuttal to the premise of your image macro.
I agree, you're right, etc. Can you fuck off now?
Andrew Anderson
>Let's learn the lessons of old and stop our people being oppressed and killed... by making it easier for citizens to possess weapons to kill, giving companies more power to oppress and having a shit system
Well done, yankee... you fucked yourself up.
Hudson Kelly
>The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males
So women and non binary genders aren't included? sexist tbqhfamalam
Angel Russell
If you own a gun you are actually a part of any militia that may crop up as needed.
Jackson James
>membership in militia newsflash: some of us actually train to use our guns. I don't need some bureaucrat telling me to go target practice on the weekend.
Fuck off leaf. Go drink some maple syrup, eh?
Adam Ross
No infact the supreme court ruled that the second amendment does give anyone the right to own a gun. Regardless of the militia.
Its just fun pointing out to you idiots that even if the second amendment said only people in the militia get of have guns that it doesn't matter. Everybody is in the militia anyways.
Also
>The Army should keep all the guns and then just give them out to you when the militia is needed.
You are forgetting the KEEP part.
Chase Morales
We really need to remove canada from the internet.
Mason Anderson
All that goal post shifting.
At least when aussies shit post its usually funny. fuck off trudeau jr.