Did atheism contribute to the decline of western civilization?

did atheism contribute to the decline of western civilization?

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It gives no reason to morally act better. The state becomes the highest authority.

they do not preserve it, antinatalism has dropped birth rates for the faithful to fill up/

Video games give no reason to morally act better.

Baseball cards give no reason to morally act better.

Sports cars give no reason to morally act better.

I guess they're all the causing the fall of western civilization. Shame.

Atheism is a lifestyle and actively promotes anti-theist thought (with theism being a critical pillar of civilization), whereas the things you listed are something entirely different. I thought atheists were supposed to be smart...

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>Atheism is a lifestyle

Gunna have to stop you there. It's not.

Disbelief in god is not a lifestyle. It's a disbelief in god. That's what people mean when they say atheist. You must be thinking of something else.

probably atheism is not a lifestyle per se
but believing or not believing in God influences your lifestyle

Do you really think god can change a sociopath? Your naivety gives me a boner.

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yes, but it's more complicated than that since it began with virtual atheism in the form of deism, and all with the enlightenment. first, the mechanistic view of the universe the enlightenment philosophers promoted, which eliminated essentialism and teleology and assumed materialism. second, empiricism which led to the denial of not only essentialism but of any objective reality. all modern philosophy follows this outline set by the enlightenment.

>but believing or not believing in God influences your lifestyle

What you believe influences your lifestyle. Saying your an atheists doesn't say anything about what you believe.

Many atheists live christian lives. Many atheists live jewish lives. Many atheists live muslim lives. Many atheists live marxist hipster lives.

Just saying "atheist" on its own really doesn't imply anything about how you live.


By the same measure, whites are the cause of the downfall of the west because whites have the highest liklihood to be atheists. Therefore whiteness is a degenerate lifestyle.

I have met plenty extremely devout people who were completely amoral monsters.

Hell, some of the most fucked up people I have met in my time on this earth held the personal belief that if God was against their actions he would stop them or smite directly like he did in the old testament.

>many atheists live religious lives


>

think about it

>No God = No one is watching. I can do whatever I want as long as I don't get caught. This means that if I go on a business trip or w/e without my significant other I can cheat on him/her because there's no way he/she will find out so no damage is done (unless I get an STD).
>No God = No universal values. Now that values depend solely on the law and the political interests what was wrong yesterday is encouraged today. Like having sex with animals.
>No God = No life guides. People are lost, don't really find a meaning in life and resort to hedonism or consumerism, some even suicide.
>No God = Weak groups, easy targets for social engineering. Atheists might think they're super smart and evolved but they think what they've been taught to think and want what they've been told to want. All modern needs are artificial.

Religion has always been a tool to control masses. Just look at Islam for example. Mohammed was a cultist and tried to define his own religion. He fucked up big at first and made some excuses about demons polluting his mind and then decided that the real word of god was different and then went from pacifist to warmonger, etc. The royal families always gave The Church power because, in exchange, the church gave them tamed obedient people.
Religion eventually evolved into a more secular component of people's lifes in the modern world but kept the good strong values and the ties with the people within it.


Some intellectual elites have seen this as an impediment for their own agenda and sought to destroy it to weaken the people and reduce them to consumers and labour.

I honestly prefered when I believed in God and I'd honestly prefer that everybody else would too. Maybe there's a better alternative but it hasn't been put in practice, not that I know of.

...

>Atheism is a lifestyle
Thaw out your brain.

>>No God = No universal values. Now that values depend solely on the law and the political interests what was wrong yesterday is encouraged today. Like having sex with animals.

There is literally nothing stopping you from accepting christian values. If you think they're good accept them.

If you think the christian lifestyle is good, go to church, pray, take communion. Make yourself a part of the community. Nothing stops you.

Nothing stops you from always behaving AS THOUGH someone is going to find out what you've done. It's a good practice.

If you think you're not in control of your values and behaviors, you're confused.

You can teach your kids those same values too. They will accept it if you teach them.

Stories about god's and miracles don't actually determine values. It's just a way to label things.

Religion is only a positive influence when it is taken as a metaphor and a guide to life anyway.

atheism isn't a cause of decline, its just another symptom

that is not an argument

No, unifying ideologies don't have to be religious in nature.
Communism, Nazism, etc.

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no. in fact, it accelerated progress.

Leaf thinks I'm going to click his stupid links

Progress:
Liberalism, LGBTWTFBBQ, pedophilia, rabid feminism, bestiality, increased immigration in the name of "equality", just to name a few

Thanks atheism!

No obviously. If anything, religion creates a culture of oppression. Those who don't fit in or fall in line- effeminate men, homosexuals, intellectuals- are ostracized and attacked. It's wrong.

You think you're born with the ability to discern what's good or wrong? How is that possible? Do you think we have a soul that determines our personality?
No (at least no if you're atheist). People don't have values of their own. They are raised in a certain way and then as they grow up and by experience they decide what's best. That's why most criminals embrace one religion or another, because after fucking up big they try to find answers somewhere else and religion is basically that: how to live your life step by step.

Also, about teaching your kid's vaules. That's the whole issue. We don't anymore. Now that women are told that they HAVE to join the workforce or they're victims of the patriarchy we don't raise our kids at home. We put them early in kindergarden and such. This part of the indoctrination plan, the social engineering I was talking about. Kids are now indoctrinated by the state and the media and the state and the celebrities are their role models.

I'm not saying that going back to religious states is the solution but I'm saying that what we have now is worse and very hardly reversible and going further down.

Really makes me think i'll tell you hwat

A lot of progressive values are a good thing. Feminism has been taken too far but women's rights aren't inherently a bad thing.

Pedophilia and bestiality are clearly awful, and immigration and a welfare net combined are bad too: either one or the other is fine.

>religion tames people
>ideology makes people more manageable
Karl Marx called. He wants his theories back.

>You think you're born with the ability to discern what's good or wrong? How is that possible? Do you think we have a soul that determines our personality?

No, but i don't see the relevance. Whether I have a soul or not, I AM born with some innate characteristics.... That said, I'm not a newborn. As we develop we can look at the concepts of good and evil that exist, and we can decide which one is the best. If you live long enough, and live intentionally enough, you do determine your values.

> That's why most criminals embrace one religion or another, because after fucking up big they try to find answers somewhere else and religion is basically that: how to live your life step by step.
Sure. I don't know. It could be that they like the values that the believe structure highlights that they feel was missing in their previous belief system.
I don't see this as a bad thing. Obviously it's easier to accept some preset lifestyle that has a proven track record than carving one from scratch.


>Now that women are told that they HAVE to join the workforce or they're victims of the patriarchy we don't raise our kids at home.

Majority of these people are christians though. Atheists probably don't even have kids.

If you say feminism is the downfall of western civilization you might have a point.

Rise of atheism is correlating with the downfall of the west. It doesn't mean it's the cause.

Thats jews, not atheism, idiot

the jews mastermind it, but they use atheists as the pawns to do so. So, you are right, it is both groups.

Yes

ideas have consequences.

if you deny essentialism, the idea that things have inherent natures, then it follows that what appears as fixed nature is simply a construct of human will. if you deny our senses touch upon objective reality, then no one can claim to have access to truth or certainty of any kind, making those who believe they do "bigots" and "barbarians".

Video games don't replace religion

Baseball cards don't replace religion

Sports cars don't replace religion

neither does atheism

you're making a category error

That was exactly my point. The result of what we have today is the fruit of people like Bernays, Kalergi, Marx, etc.

In the very Bible people are mentioned as cattle. You can't say religion doesn't tame people. Not saying that being tamed is bad, specially seeing what's been set loose today. But people realized this and they came up with the ideas that are taught in schools and universities and that's destroying civilization for the purpose of controlling the masses.

>Rise of atheism is correlating with the downfall of the west. It doesn't mean it's the cause.
It's not the sole cause. Maybe it's more a consecuence but it's directly related. It's been said numerous times that to undermine a society you have to attack their religion, their family structure and their culture.

I don't think atheism is inherently bad but I think it's being used as a tool for evil purposes (along with feminism, sexual liberation and all that stuff). Just as a way to undermine strong groups of people. Divide and conquer, take what makes group bond together, etc.

Atheist intellectuals said theirselves that in a conflict between atheist groups and religious groups the atheist groups will always lose.

God fills a void in people. Without God, people are empty.. They need to be lead. They fill this with the state.

...

It's not the cause in itself and being religious doesn't immunise you either. Just look at how cucked the catholic church is, or american evangelicals that adopt nigglets.
Europe has had strong historical traditions when it comes to ethics and morality predating Christianity. However nobody denies its influence on European culture, and that it was one of the most important pillars of European identity.

no

just stupidy of singular person for not understanding how stupid they themselves are and how stupid the whole humanity itself is. refusal of cheap and simple choice of fixing problem is also what will bring civilization to ruin

Yes

But it caused modern society to fail the same way christianity led to the failing of rome. A large ideological change leads to other societal changes.

After modern society rebuilds we should get some pretty kickass atheistic/non-religious societies

Nothing bad with being an atheist that follows traditions. Decline comes because of materialism caused by insanely fast modernization.

many atheists have proposed humanist ethics as an alternative.

>God fills a void in people. Without God, people are empty.. They need to be lead. They fill this with the state.
Not an argument (ironic, I know)

Observe:
The church creates an emptiness in people that they convince people that god will fill, without god, people break the illusion and realize they are already full. They see that they are mighty and become independent. They break away from the shackles of illusion and lies and have the autonomy to do what's truly good.


> It's been said numerous times that to undermine a society you have to attack their religion, their family structure and their culture.

Agreed. And I think in a society with free speech, there are always going to be people trying to undermine society. Undermining society is the only way to fix the bad things about it. This is a natural churning that's going to happen in a free society.

The idea is that the good ideas are going to draw people to them, and the bad ideas are going to tend to repel people.

It's not that atheism destroyed the family structure, it's that the family structure was weakened and therefore atheism was given a foothold.

The weakening has to come first. This means daycare, working moms etc etc are the true culprits. If parents don't teach kids family values, obviously the kids are going to be more likely to choose something else.

Aren't most of those humanist ethics found already in the bible though?

>humanist ethics
Another reason they have a hand in this

>The church creates an emptiness in people that they convince people that god will fill, without god, people break the illusion and realize they are already full. They see that they are mighty and become independent. They break away from the shackles of illusion and lies and have the autonomy to do what's truly good.
this is fourth-rate atheist boilerplate. truth is meaningless if you subscribe to a materialist worldview that necessarily precludes its existence. this is why a nietzsche could reduce everything to power.

there is overlap. the idea is that the conclusions regarding right and wrong are reached through a common consensus as opposed to an outside influence (religious dogma).

>this is fourth-rate atheist boilerplate
exactly. That's the point. It's a parody of the stupid story the other guy made up.

>truth is meaningless if you subscribe to a materialist worldview that necessarily precludes its existence.

I regard this as nonsense as well. "Materialism" is a view of the proper usage of the word "truth". Obviously it doesn't preclude the existence of truth.

Atheism IS the decline of western civilization.

Absolutely. Those insufferable faggots are worse than the most zealous christfag and their undermining the Christian church is what is letting Islam run rampant

>Yeah man rebel against Jesus! Christianity sucks!
>The church looses prominence among society
>Something infinitely worse takes its place
Good going you fucking nerds you traded loud mouthed bible thumpers for suicide bombers

No shit.

You can accept and live by God's rules while doing any of those things, but can you do that while being an atheist? Hardly so.

Western Europe's obsession with feminist/globalist induced self-destruction is not synonymous with atheism

The only rule you cannot follow as an atheist is "you must believe in god"

>"Materialism" is a view of the proper usage of the word "truth".
materialism is a worldview and hence it does preclude the existence of truth. if everything is simply matter, then everything reduces to cause and effect interactions, making literally everything human (morality, free will, consciousness, truth, etc) also cause and effect relations, i.e. deterministic, and therefore what appears to us as morality, free will, consciousness, truth, etc are simply illusions.

>did the default position that every human starts with until they get brainwashed lead to the decline of civilization

no...

I would argue it was atheism undermining the church that allowed that progressive bullshit to take root in the first place

Atheism is not the decease, just a sympton. The establishment have, for the past 60 years, implementing a socialist, and by extention communist, live style in the west. By Stalin own admision, christianity is the biggest enemy of communism, because it creates a core of devotion that is not the state (church, family, etc...), so they have to destroy christianity in order to make society approch the government, since without God, men would have to seek the next big power for help a.k.a the state.

So the promotion of atheism, as well other anti-chirstian kind of behavior (procrastination, sexualization, etc...) has been happening to devite sociaty from religion.

The promotion of islam is also another way of extinguish christianity, considering how muslims kills more christians then any other kind of people in the world. Of course, once christianity is officialy destroyed, muslims will also take the bucket.

TL.DR communism is the one to blame once again.

>materialism is a worldview and hence it does preclude the existence of truth.

It's not a world view. It's a component of a worldview. There are many possible worldviews that have a materialist component. Specifically, materialism is the component that says what statements about reality can be true, and what statements about reality can not be true.

Even more specifically, materialism says that statements about reality which do not refer to matter, can not be true. In other words, such statements refer to things that don't exist.

Now, the concept of truth and falsehood is inherent to the concept of materialism. It cannot be taken out.

This statement is absurd. You are taught morality by your society.

>most blacks are religious
>blacks commit most the crimes
Yeah, god be teachin us he been a good boy dat dindu nothin