Grandma? did it, grandma. I finally stood up for myself. I got real mean and beat the shnozz our of Dr. Oz. I can't lie, it felt kind of good. At first. But since then all I have is just... a kind of dark, empty feeling. Then I realized... that's how you must feel. All the time. Poor old grandma. You know, I've been gettin' lots of advice how to deal with you. Stand up to you, tell on you... But I kind of realize there's just people like you out there. All over the place. When you're a kid, things seem like they're gonna last forever. But they're not. Life changes. Why you won't always be around. Someday you're gonna die. Someday pretty soon. And when you're layin' in that hospital bed, with tubes up your nose, and that little pan under your butt to pee in, well I'll come visit ya. I'll come just to show you that, that I'm still alive and I'm still
happy. And you'll die. Being nothin' but you.
Grandma? did it, grandma. I finally stood up for myself. I got real mean and beat the shnozz our of Dr. Oz. I can't lie...
Dat sum real shit, yo!
I don't watch fucking cartoons. Fuck off.
rekt
>When you're a kid, things seem like they're gonna last forever. But they're not. Life changes.
When I was a kid I thought the world was horrible and the only hope was the future, but the world only got progressively worse every day since.
I wonder why....
Capitalism, I think.
Millions of muslims invading your country and raping your culture
Probably right. Look at how happy these children look under Mao. Who needs food when you have communism, right cuck?
>blaming the acts of dictators on ideology they didn't even pretend to follow
...
>didn't even pretend to follow
He literally followed Marx's word to the letters. Sure, he was authoritarian, but how else do you change a society that massively?
OK, how would communism work in a perfect world?
It's more than that. You can easily make a successful business that pleases the shit out of your consumer to the point they'd take up arms to defend you if necessary. But instead, every business would rather make shittier and shittier products while spending all their money on advertisement to make the product appear to be better than the previous one, all the while trying to fuck the customer as much as possible (secretly collecting and selling their info, or serving them what amounts to poisoned food, for example). This stems from the fact companies operate on an infinite growth mindset: you made $1b revenue last year? If you don't make $1.2b this year, you might as well die.
In other words, it's something more specific than capitalism that is still entailed by it.
>the dozens of communist regimes that have, without fail, turned to corrupted hellholes with starving civilians within a short timespan weren't real communist regimes. but i swear that if i were in charge of a communist regime, things would be different and better.
>central tenant of communism is no central authority
>every "communist" entity immediately established central authority
The laborers control the means of production
There is no way society can change that extremely without force. If you're ignorant of that then you might as well say 'yeah the best society is one where people never get sick, can fly and live until they're 200'. Its fantasy.
I ask again, how would your perfect society work?
>100 million dead in the last century
>b...but that wasn't real communism I swear
Every time.
>There is no way society can change that extremely without force.
I see you were given a hammer and taught everything was a nail.
ditto famalam
And who invests in the labourers, and the factories, and innovation to make the factories more efficient?
The state?
Obviously these things wouldn't happen spontaneously, as the worked have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo - their livelihoods and their children's livelihoods. Change introduces uncertainty.
So I ask again, how would your perfect system come about, and how would it function?
>dude communism can't work because I think in entirely capitalist terms
...
Organized internet propaganda campaigns designed to reinforce and excuse all flaws with the status quo
No, I've studied history. Give me one example of a massive peaceful societally shift involving millions of people. The only one I can think of is the British Industrial Revolution, and that's pretty much the posterchild for (mostly) successful captilism.
>Give me one example of a massive peaceful societally shift involving millions of people.
The internet.
You still have no argument I see. No wonder communism always fails, communists are retards.
Or whats really happening is every time someone criticizes capitalism you pop up and start wiggling your ass about stalin and mao as if its the 70s and there are only two societal structures that could ever work and capitalism is obviously the superior because you speak english and no other languages... and no one really wants to engage with you, because you don't have any arguments, just a lot of specious bullshit designed to silence opposition for... whatever purpose.
If you think the internet is peaceful you clearly don't know shit. Its literally the old west.
We are lucky to live in an era where its pretty much unregulated. Our children won't have that luxury. Its not comparable to communism in any way, websites have moderators. Companies control access. Its a better argument for Polis style city states ala ancient Greece.
The look about as happy as the workers in foxconn and the diamond miners in china who are necessary to make the nintendo that you'll trample three children and a fat pregnant woman over during black friday
>the internet is the old west
I can attest to this. I've had to replace my bulletproof vest ten times this month from getting shot at by twitter posters.
100 million people have died horribly because of communism. You can put your blinkers on and imagine its all MLP, but that doesn't detract from the death toll.
Once again, for the fifth time, how would your perfect society look/function?
Again with blaming the acts of absolute central authorities on an ideology that specifically requires the absence of such things.
ah lost mah legs in the habbo hotel incident but I'd do it again in a heartbeat boy lemme tell ya what
Pretty sure Foxconn won't ensure 100 million dead communists. Also, Foxconn is in China, and China is still a communist country, so your argument is doubly shit.
Can you look at a modern, western constitutional democracy and compare that tho North Korea or China? Countries that espouse human rights and choice?
I'll wait.
so capitalism allows a minority to be happy while everyone must be miserable under communism?
don't know about you but I'll pick the former.
Step 1: proper education
I see I've already lost you.
But a society that cannot be realised without it. The acquisition of capital is human nature.
>china is communist
China is arguably more capitalist than the west at this point.
And can you think of any communist country that hard educational standards as well as, say, the US?
>the British Industrial Revolution, and that's pretty much the posterchild for (mostly) successful captilism.
U wot? Charles Dickens is a world-famous author exactly because the industrial revolution ISN'T a posterchild for successful capitalism, unless your qualifier for successful capitalism is what's being built rather than the survival-rate of the workers who build it, like in Dubai. It's the posterchild for what unfettered capitalism will inevitably revert back to if people don't stand up for the worker's rights that men have literally died for.
I'm not cheering on for communism here, the Industrial Revolution just isn't a positive posterchild for capitalism, just as there isn't a single communist state that's a positive posterchild for communism.
>mfw the I accidentally wrote poserchild and my computer wanted to correct it to Rothschild
Automatization will be the catalyst for societal change. If we end up as 1800s capitalist hellholes like London was or something new, more socially conscious, we can only guess
and you probably think people are good-willed at heart too, and that a society can function solely based on 'proper education'.
The Project Chanology reservation was a trap.
proper education such as? an electrician is far more valuable to society than whatever underwater basket weaving degree most libtards are taking these days. the thing with communism is you think that theoretically your labor has value while you don't actually provide anything that benefits anyone in a meaningful way. you then call the electrician and the plumber uneducated idiots because they didn't go to college and get your degree that can't get you a job
you know, the bright side of a communist revolution is that we would get to execute you retards first. you would be discarded immediately in a communist society. you think you'll be a party member? top lel
>it isn't live action so its bad
kys
>the thing with communism
you mean capitalism
>100 million people have died horribly because of communism.
Let me play devil's advocate here: How many millions have died horribly because of capitalism? Add up every person who's been killed because safety protocols were "too expensive" for a company and I'm sure you'll get a whopper of a number, especially if you start counting with the start of industrialism. Surely every person who died so a company could save some money is a victim of capitalism just as those people were victims of communism?
Education would be detrimental, as it would allow people to sell their labour as they see fit. This is why education was always heavily regulated in communist societies and people were allocated a position in life.
This was the GOAT Butters episode.
This is literally the only reason I'm for democratic socialism being introduced. Because it's either that or we gimp our future productivity by outlawing automatization, all to keep capitalism afloat in some weird new system. That, or mass starvation and societal upheaval as there's not enough jobs to go around and nobody to care for those at the bottom. Better to just ready society for it beforehand than to take the shock when the last industry is finally automated, kicking the last workers to the curb and forcing us to change.
Literally no where near as bad as parents that were forced to eat their children in Holodomor.
But you really want to know the difference between the systems? Yeah people died under capitalism, but that changed the system. Things were made safer. The market reacted. Because capitalism is human, and humans care about their own welfare.
Do communists not realize that communism guarantees a single giant corporation (a.k.a. the government) complete monopoly over every industry and the power to kill any employee (a.k.a. the citizen) that doesn't comply? Communism literally is a parody of the perceived flaws in capitalism. I have tried and honestly cannot imagine a system more exploitative of workers. It guarantees that you will never be anything more than a slave laborer grunt - that is unless you are a (((Party member))). How is it current year and people still believe in this? The kikes are so impatient and pushy that they're already pushing it just 20 years after the Soviet Union collapsed. Let the goys take a five minute break before they have to deal with this shit again
I'm liking how your false dichotomies are supported by false equivalencies and appeals to emotion.
>can't counter an often repeated argument?
>make it sound stupid and comment on how its always repeated!
>Add up every person who's been killed because safety protocols were "too expensive" for a company and I'm sure you'll get a whopper of a number, especially if you start counting with the start of industrialism.
Sounds more like people being killed by greed, which isn't unique to capitalism.
industrialism bridged the gap between rich and poor unlike it has ever been throughout human history. as far as capitalism killing? whenever was there a capitalist revolution, you stupid nigger? capitalism isn't a government type unlike communism. capitalism is an economic model
so communism is bad because when thought of in capitalist terms it's just like capitalism
wow
capitalism and communism are means of distributing resources that, because of people like you, have come to be elevated to ideology.
nothing i said was incorrect. your religion is a failed one
Surely if anything the useless degrees you see in American colleges today is a symptom of Capitalism, not Communism? Under Capitalism there's always someone willing to pay to learn how to weave baskets underwater, even if it's a completely useless skill. And since they're paying for it the class keeps making money and getting taught.
Also, I'm no fan of communism but I've definitely seen more than one communist memorial or whatever dedicated to menial workers. Again, it's capitalists who talk shit about the workers simply because they make less.
you're not making any sense, but i guess it's summertime and all the underage edgy commie kids are home. you'll grow up one day and if not you can always kill yourself
capitalism vs communism is a false dichotomy
talking about all education as if it is liberal arts degrees is a false equivalency.
"you'd die first lol" is an appeal to emotion
Not even mentioning the adhoms.
That's not an argument and its not a criticism of either system.
Its literally just words in place of an argument. Don't you see how that's intellectually bankrupt?
I'll prove it. What is the difference between a capitalist and a communist mindset?
The market economies will lose their driving force, the middle class will cease to exist and make way for a massive throng of plebs, many of them refugees in the coming 50 years. How can capitalism keep going without turning out like Brazil is my question.
>I don't understand how capitalism and communism are, at core, systems to distribute resources therefore you are the stupid person.
stellar post.
>I should dictate how people spend their money
Literally the problem with communism senpai. If people want to learn to weave baskets underwater who are you to say they can't?
>whenever was there a capitalist revolution
The American revolution? Threw off a monarchy with the rallying cry of "no taxation without representation" and one of its more famous moments was throwing merchandise off a boat.
it's a symptom of communists taking over the universities for the last 50 years, actually
> Again, it's capitalists who talk shit about the workers simply because they make less.
no, it's libtards who constantly talk shit to the white working class because the think they are uneducated retards
>What is the difference between a capitalist and a communist mindset?
Functionally nothing, according to you.
>t. person who's never so much as set foot on a college campus
But I wasn't the one talking shit about underwater basketweaving... Follow the conversation.
>when your retarded system fails but it's okay because it wasn't real communism so you try again and your retarded system fails but it's okay because it wasn't real communism so you try again and your retarded system fails etc.jpg
Communists are fags
you're one dumb nigger. the constitution and the bill of rights established a democratic republic
Once again, not an argument. What is the difference according to you?
>scene from south park turn's into argument over communism in less than 10 posts
I really hate you fucking faggots
>expecting non-political discussion on Sup Forums
Get with the time, gramps.
Oh you're 5 century old sociopolitical system is out of date and directly responsable for the Death and subjugation of millions of people let's replace it with my one century old sociopolitical system that's never worked and directly responsible for the Death and subjugation of millions of people
We've outgrown capitalism yes and need to replace it but I'm not sure if communism is the answer
What about today? Is today the worst day of your life?
With post-scarcity and sufficient automation a collapse of capitalism and rise of anarcho-communism (a term that would be redundant if not for murrican eduka$hun) is essentially inevitable.
>a society without central authority
ahahahaha, talk about a utopian dream
No revolutionary is going to give up their power, and if they do you'll get invaded by outside forces, communism is a dream at best
hahaha right hahaha humanity will always have and need authority figures right hahaha otherwise no one would ever get anything done or do anything right hahahaha please don't stomp on me master but I love the feeling of boot on my neck who doesn't hahahaha
nice strawman.
I never said society needs it, I said people in power will not give it away which is exactly what happens after the revolution.
Face it, anywhere where a socialist came to power there was huge abuses of power and a shit living standard.
And if it's not ''real socialism'' then it's simply an idea, not on par with other ideologies since those have been in place and we know what they do
t. ledditor tourist
>With post-scarcity and sufficient automation
we are not even close to achieving a silver of that.
Yeah we've got more like a bronze.
Are you fuckers actually Communists or some gay offshoot of it?
uh yeah
did you think people didn't just kill each other and steal things before governments?
communists are fucking dumb I swear
it's not like Marx didn't make some good points against capitalism
culture is meant to be shared, you're just a racist
Multiple industries are already well past the technological level required for full automation, just human labor is cheaper and self-replacing, especially if, as a corporate entity, one can simply buy a shitty third world government.
Then scarcity, as a market force, needs to be artificially maintained in order to keep a stupid number of economies functional.
To say, we're closer to post-scarcity than our corporate masters would have you believe, just, oddly, they correctly view the economic viability of inequity based business models as unviable in a post-scarcity environment.
Most people who talk about communism are anarcho-communists. An odd term that would be redundant if murrican education didn't teach kids that fascist dictatorships were communist simply because they called themselves that.
>I'm a passive aggressive little bitch: the post
I always wondered why murrican education doesn't teach that socialism is bad because of the things hitler did, as hitler claimed to be socialist.
America? What culture? Lmao
You're implying that capitalism's success depends on long life expectancy of the lower strata. If the person is valuable and has a particular set of skills that make them uniquely capable of performing a task that is useful at the time then those who have acquired wealth will ensure they live. In our modern society, that's through better pay, benefits, and working conditions. Worker rights are an artificial baseline that the government sets up, not the capitalist system itself.
Not him,but I think communism could work on a small scale. Maybe a county at the most.
Thoughts?
those self proclaimed anarcho communists are no bigger than communities of like hundreds of people, or more often than not just a hippie shithole apartment in oakland
anarcho-communism is an oxymoron. In order to have communism you must enforce it, it's as simple as that.
and that's when purges, red terrors, mass famine, over complicated bureaucracy, low standards, etc.. becomes abundant. whats not abundant? the good things that communism promises.
That's an awfully naive scenario you've imagined there.
Since no amount of money will make a person live forever, the uniquely skilled are simply viewed as point of failure in any business model dependent upon them. Thus the unique are replicated and their value reduced so as to maximize profits for the owners of business.
>In order to have communism you must enforce it
If everyone is equal then who has the right to enforce anything? Who has authority?
So what you're describing is automatically not communism.
You're both wrong. Resource based economy focused on scientific research/automation/technology and the arts is the only way to achieve utopia.
Not our fault they squirt kids out like niggers on fertility drugs.
How do you create total equality?