I don't get the whole concept of "It's okay on paper but not on screen". It's fine to let your eight year old read a girl burning her mothers face off in Out of the Dust or cats slitting each others throats in Warrior Cats but in cartoons there's rarely a drop of blood. I remember being surprised when Dipper bled in GF or when Steven got bruised in SU.
Why is it so rare to see blood on American, Canadian, etc television? Have they met a kid? They fall and scrape their knees from the time they learn to run. I'm not saying write blood spurting out of people when they get cut, but why the complete avoidance of it?
I saw Jet's death in ATLA for the first time a while ago - I don't remember seeing that episode when I originally saw the series - and it was so hard to feel anything because it didn't look like he got hit hard. It was so non-violent for a death scene.
Similarly, alcohol. I don't like alcohol or even "get" it but it's a thing that exists and is exceedingly common for adults to drink. Coloring it purple in cartoons or pretending it's apple juice is just weird. Disney doesn't censor alcohol but everyone else does. Disney has a lot of alcohol in their films, they like to portray it in various ways instead of skitting around the issue.
Adults don't read books, so they don't know they want to censor them.
Aaron Price
fucking tard
books aren't ad supported
if you want to get mad at somebody, blame Reagan, it's his fault there's fuck all public broadcasting left
Colton Gray
You know, it was really unclear.
Xavier Russell
jet is dead
Bentley Flores
Lol because puritans need to protect the children. Meanwhile shows like Evangelion and Blood+ are considered children's tv if you're in japan
Brody Johnson
NGE actually got parents mad over there from what I've heard. It was aimed at middle schoolers but parents got mad that it was inappropriate.
David Cox
Oh boy the weeaboos back at it again
Henry Cruz
I'm still butthurt they rewrote Zootopia, it was going to be amazing so mature and teach kids and their parents that racism is bad.
Fuck you Pixar for making it so cute that I want to vomit when I see these giant rabbit eyes.
Brayden Gutierrez
But they still taught everyone that racism is bad. And for mainstream entertainment is was some of deepest and nuanced take of racism.
Samuel Turner
I haven't seen Zootopia yet but I'm mad that the plot changed. I mean, I should have expected it since Tangled and Frozen changed completely from announcement to release but....
I expected the story being about a rabbit chasing a fox. From what I've heard that was changed?
Brandon Williams
Rabbit doesn't chase fox. She blackmails him into helping her on the case and they eventually bond over their shitty deal (Nobody believes a rabbit could be a good cop and nobody believes a fox could amount for anything worthwhile period)
Then race war starts. It's actually a pretty good look at how prejudice might tear people apart and how latent could they be and how nobody is safe from being a bigot. I love this movie.
Adrian Brooks
Well, traditionally, it's been regarded that cartoons are specifically for children and while it's okay for MLP to teach kids moral lessons or Spongebob/Looney Tunes/etc. to make us laugh, or (original) Powerpuff Girls/any number of shows doing both, lessons about death and loss were reserved for parents and guardians to teach kids about. Western television/animation/movies have always been regarded first and foremost as entertainment, whereas books were seen as both you might say? Books were never considered kids' babysitters (for better or worse) and for the longest damn time, television/animation mediums/movies/etc. were seen as the kids' caretaker. Not saying it's good or bad, but that's how it's been.
It's more of a recent trend to portray more weighty subjects, whether you're sneaking them past censors, outright showing them, or dolling them up with metaphor and allusion, and an even more recent idea that this is even okay.
Brayden Ortiz
That's the plot? I liked the original better. Nick gets framed for something he didn't do and Judy chases him. Funny buddy cop film
Joseph Thompson
"Traditionally" my butt, cartoons were originally just another medium. It wasn't until the 60s or 70s that they began being stigmatized as "children's only". Most early Felix the Cats, Looney Tunes, and Disney shorts were either family oriented or adult geared
Sebastian Scott
There's a frameup going on but in different way. I wouldn't spoil you the plot, but it's a good story about who you are vs what the world sees you as.
Michael Turner
dont watch it. They ruined it , someone from audience said he didn't like the tame collar idea, it was brillaint, powerful tool, this movie would be so emotional. Animators put so many effort into this and then they had to redo every scene.
Instead we got some silly buddy cop movie about a rookie rabbit blackmailing a fox, what kind of story is this??
Luis Robinson
>Pixar
Kayden Lee
>it was brillaint, powerful tool, this movie would be so emotional I hate to ask, but do you have any learning disability that you can't pick themes without them being represented by something obvious like shock collar?
Luis Evans
Zootopia beta was essentially Psycho Pass with funny animals.
Parker Kelly
everybody says the old story was better, and i agree , it has more nick , therefore it's better.
just check this out, i'd bawwwl my eyes if i saw it on the big screen, so moving.
oh i know made the movie, disney , they just had no balls and chickened and listened to pixar's advice.
Tyler Campbell
Yeah? well unless it was a Disney animated movie, any kind of death or loss was STILL played for laughs or something sugar coated that was resolved within the span of the seven minute shorts that dominated theaters.
Being poor/destitute, hungry, or without means? You land in a heap of pies or get a giant cartoon sack of money or you save the orphanage or something. Heroes got the girl or there were rough chuckles involved; the only kind of exception I can think of is the Casper short with the fox cub (BTW: Ho-lee shit...) and even that ended on a bittersweet happy note.
Even if the pre-60s cartoons were able to get away with more jokes, and had a wider range of appeal because that put butts in movie theater seats, they were rooted in old vaudeville routines or branching into somewhat different forms of comedy.
Landon Allen
I can't watch it right now, but collars seem like such a transparent device. "OMG look at this symbol of oppression, brace yourself for lecture on how it's bad".
Final produce was so much deeper then this. Prejudice was not in your face, it was something overprotective parents and schoolyard bullies engaged in, while society as a whole had no problem with anything. But then it showed how fragile it all was, and how deep quickly formal divide can turn into actual divide, how everyone has it in them to be a bigot, how designating yourself a meek victim doesn't absolve you from being an oppressor and how you can obliviously make careless blanket statements that can hurt your friends because you might make special exception for them, nobody else would care.
Okay, let me explain to guys. Looking at cartoons and comic books at our age is *not* normal. Even if it becomes the new norm, it's still not normal. Cartoons are made for children. Exposing them to disturbing imagery while their brains are still forming is a bad idea. See, they aren't thinking of us, the middleaged men watching cartoons, but the children who watch and who the cartoons were created for.
Henry Barnes
the funny thing is i remember being sad seeing watership down as a kid but it wasn't til i saw it at 20 or 21 last year that i realized "wow this violence and gore probably wouldn't fly for a kids movie nowadays". kids are edgy and observant, as adults either we forget this or try to repress it.
Hunter Lewis
...
Cooper Mitchell
I agree. The final version of zootopia is fucking cancer compared to the early concepts.
Camden Barnes
Being aimed at adults doesn't mean it's not a comedy after all.
Grayson Cox
Not all kids are four year olds. Twelve year olds can handle a little violence. Heck, kids at that age probably watch Naruto and DBZ. Even minor violence is okay for little kids. A character getting scratched but not bleeding is garring.
Plus, children's books are hella violent. I just read the first Warrior Cats book and it has cats killing each other graphically
Brody Torres
I remember Raving Rabbids: Game of Thrones being shown on the kids channel at 3pm uncensored.
They also aired "stand by me" uncensored. I blame the Jews for this
Sebastian Gomez
when i was like.. 9(?) i saw first episode of a cartoon where a cat adopts a baby squirrel , but there was a forest fire first, her/his parents were missing probably died in that fire.
it scared the shit out of me, it had a happy ending, but the fire was too much to handle.
Gabriel Lopez
is it Oscar-worthy?
Andrew Bennett
>Plus, children's books are hella violent. I just read the first Warrior Cats book and it has cats killing each other graphically
I was going to say that was a massive understatement, but I realized that you've only ready the first book.
The fifth and six books are fucking brutal.
Aaron Peterson
I remember renting Watership Down when I was a kid and being freaked out by it. The weird thing was it wasn't the blood that did it, but when the movie got all stylistic. Like at at beginning where they explain the rabbit creation myth, or the bit where the one guy tells the story of the old warren getting bulldozed, or literally any time the black rabbit was on screen. I don't even remember the gore, but that shit haunted me.
Because a lot of parents don't want to make their kids sad, which speaking as a parent i can understand.
However i think that doing so stunts kids. Sadness and empathy are often two sides of the same coin and empathy i feel is an incredibly important trait to try to instill.
Sadness can also make you consider things in a different way. The allies winning WWII is a good thing, but a film like Grave of the Fireflies can make you consider the impact it had on Japanese children for example.
I don't think kids should be kept away from sad or traumatic films, not deliberately and repeatedly exposed perhaps, but not kept away. A lot of parents don't think that way though
Xavier Bell
It doesn't have any basis in actual logic. It's all about what makes retarded parents who want the television to babysit their kids for them uncomfortable.
People who can't enjoy something without the message being easily digestible or people who just hate something because it changed and assume the original was better?
The original idea was bad, it had the same concept as the final but it botched the delivery. It centered around Nick and what a shitty deal he and the predators had, it gave you a lot of reasons to hate the city. But none to want to see it saved. And that is where the plot broke down, you were watching Nick try to accomplish a goal you had no investment in, no reason to care. It was boring after the initial set up (which is all you've seen on the original story boards) the test audiences were right that the movie was tough to watch because they just weren't interested in what was happening.
Kayden Reed
Because certain parents underestimate/condescend to their children constantly, and are very vocal about making sure everyone accommodates them. Just read Blacksad >Cartoons are made for children Archer, Venture Brothers, ect.
Furthermore many cartoons are made with adults in mind since parents often watch with their children. Thus listed as "family" entertainment and not "children's."
But the fundamental mistake you're making is assuming a medium is tied to a demographic.
Liam Cruz
Contrarians, edgelords and.. fangirls. user.
the previous movie was thinly veiled leftist propaganda, you realized that when you see all the deleted scenes, concept art and people behind it. (Hi Jossie!)
Shame about that colorful themepark they designed and had o remove from movie, but that's the price for not thinking *enough* on tackling such difficult subject.
I love the movie,not the story behind it but then it was clear why it was treated so reluctantly by Disney. It could cost them alot (not money, reputation).
IMO it's much better than their last three movies, which were nothing but money milking machines.
Ethan Ortiz
Christ, a child gets traumatized if he gets beaten up by bullies every day or if they nearly die in an accident, not by a fucking cartoon.
Easton Green
What did i do? What did i do?
Brayden Miller
because people have pussified their kids. 100 years ago 5 year olds would be helping on the farm seeing and even helping butcher animals
Adam Wilson
>100 years ago everyone worked on a farm >Kids these days are so much worse than my generation
Grandpa's off his meds again
Dominic King
t. 19 year old from the suburbs who watches Chinese cartoons and needs to take five types of meds a day
Carter Wright
It's hard to surpass the immature idiocy of the post you responded to, but you succeeded. Well done!
>pic related, that's how I'm spending my day now.
Christopher Hughes
>100 years My dad did those things as a kid. I've also watched my grandfather kill a pig. Kifs probably shouldn't watch that stuff
Caleb Sanchez
It would have been depressing as shit though. Look at how well The good dinosaur did with its depressing mature themes
But it is true. You can show blood in kids aimed anime atleast used to.
Dominic Brown
Who was reading Out of the Dust to 4th graders?
I remember that being a middle school book.
Charles Baker
>Kifs probably shouldn't watch that stuff Yeah Kif probably shouldn't.
As for children, it was a necessity of the lives they lived. It was just a thing they had to live with, and it's only by today's standards that it seems like too much.
Kayden Garcia
I didn't even know Out of the Dust was like a widely-used book for middle schools until this thread.
Lincoln Diaz
And all the world shall be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies.
Thomas Lopez
And if they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you.
Brandon Rivera
The original Zootopia concept wouldn't have worked. The final version was much more effective, because it could actually be related to and engaged with by an audience.
Instead of being so over-the-top that it bore no immediate resemblance to the struggles faced by disenfranchised people in the modern day.
Lincoln Nelson
..and this is why magicians dont reveal their secrets until their death.
