Can someone explain to me this American "college debt"...

Can someone explain to me this American "college debt"? Why do people make such a huge deal out of it if eventually the students themselves chose to take loans which they later struggle to repay?

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How is someone straight out of high school realistically going to save up $30,000+ by having some bumfuck job?

At least in canada, they shove "university degree = money" down your throat so fucking hard in high school (grade 9 - 12)

We had presentation by teachers, student counselors, Group speakers, posters, pamphlets, and handouts during report cards.

All paid for by the universities and colleges of course.

I only escaped it cause a substitute machine shop teacher told me about how bad the trades are doing finding workers but when i brought it up with my student counselor he did everything to steer me away from the trades and go towards "higher" education

I made it in college while working. Earned 15k in three years.

>the students themselves chose to take loans which they later struggle to repay?

Because consequences and inconvenience are cardinal sins for millennials. Expecting them to be responsible for their actions is racism/sexism/bigotry. It's 2016.

That's good for you, non-country, but how is the average person going to do that?

>pro-tip

They can't.

They can live with their parents for 3-4 years, find a good paying job, save money and not waste it on useless shit like gaming consoles, iPhones or expensive clothing.

There is also the option of joining the military, I heard they give great bonuses.

>live like a bum in your parents house for half a decade

or

>join the military

Wow those are some fantastic options.

Well what do you expect, everything handed to you on a silver plate? If you want something done and make somehting of yourself then you gotta work hard and get your hands dirty (not in the illegal sense).

People going for a worthwhile degree tend not to complain, because it's worth the cost in the end when you get a nice paying job.


The ones who are most vocal about it are the ones getting worthless degrees that will not get them any worthwhile jobs, and so they will be unable to ever pay off their debt.

Universities continue to host these worthless degrees because there are plenty of idiots willing to go into debt to get one.

In terms of funding, all the university has to do is hire some ass to stand in front of a blackboard and blame everything on white men. If they manage to convince 100 people in the entire university to take the course at £9000 per year* then they will clear a cheeky £900000 for that year (minus any taxes and shit).

*£9000 per year is the UK maximum, I don't know what it is in the USA.

Many people have little understanding of accepting debt. These people who took student loans without a plan on how to pay them back, are fools.

Young people are really pushed towards university degrees but the previous generation and since manufacturing jobs are mostly gone to the third world it seems like the only option since trades aren't talked about that much. Also they get told to get a degree rather than a useful education so they take loans for jobless degrees, they might have some educational value but university is only seen as a job boost, not as a learning tool, and since government eased up student loans it's much easier to get them so it's just something people do because that's what others do and they never stopped to look at other options.

Because they're bad with finance
If you dont have a scholarship then do 2 yrs at a community college for dirt cheap, and then transfer
Bam

No, I expect some drive to push our society back to the way things were. Bring the factories and the unskilled work back to our countries so higher education isn't the only answer.

What these morons don't understand or don't care about is the fact 3/4 of the population of any given population are pretty much mindless normie drones.

So basically it's socialist and leftists pushing again a non problem and blaming it on "the system" instead of themselves?

Higher education isn't the only answer even now. I know plenty of people who don't have a higher education and yet they started their own businesses or took some skill courses, like welding or carpeting, and now doing well for themselves.

A fair number of US schools charge $50K/year. State schools are at the low end with ~$15K/year for in-state students. Ultimately, it all comes down to students being stupid and taking on loads of debt for worthless degrees. I have $300K in debt myself, but that's because I got a law degree from a top law school, which opens a lot of lucrative doors.

Again, not everyone can start their own fucking business which also requires again, going to school and some money beforehand.

We need mindless jobs for our mindless population, THAT'S the problem. Higher education IS the one answer for a lot of people. School isn't about learning anymore, it's about having agendas pushed on you until they hand you your qualifications for any given job.

Starting a business is pretty easy actually. Espescially in the US.

I'd rather pay for welfare and sterilize that mindless population, just as soon as we've made enough progress on automation

> Again, not everyone can start their own fucking business which also requires again, going to school and some money beforehand
Well I'm sorry but if they can't start their own business, do some small cheap skill course or join university then it's their own bloody problem.

But yes, I agree that there needs to be more factory work and other mass and unskilled jobs, maybe that way these people can actually work for their degree.

So basically it's socialist and leftists pushing again a non problem and blaming it on "the system" instead of themselves?

In a sense yes. The universities are definitely taking advantage by hosting worthless degrees that will never land anyone a job good enough to pay off that debt, but the idiots taking the degree should do research into that field, and what potential jobs it might lead to and ones own ability to pay off debt. Also it would be wise to come up with a contingency plan to paying off the debt in the event that it doesn't work out.

But they never do any of that shit, they take the debt and enjoy a few years of university, getting drunk and partying and having fun, then demand their debt be forgiven.

>$50k/year

Holy shit, that's a lot. I guess if you do a good degree like STEM or Law, or one that has a specific field, then you can realistically expect to pay off that debt without worrying.

But Gender studies and Women's studies degree holders are basically fucked.

I don't care for anyone's anecdotal evidence about starting a business, we shouldn't be in this situation. Bring the factories back.

>sterilize the mindless population

Sure thing bootlicker, just don't come crying back when you find out we're never going to reach our automation utopia.

>Automation utopia
Humans need hard work and challenges, if everything will be done for us by machines then we'd having nothing to live for and descend to boredom and depression.

That's if you go to the best school that will take you, rather than the not-quite-as-good schools that will give you handouts because you going there improves their admissions figures. I did not go to the best school I could have for undergrad and made it out with minimal debt. For law school, I went with a top-tier law school (#1 for my practice area) and I didn't receive financial assistance because of the timing. I'm paying it back now and while it is a staggering sum, I'd definitely do it again.

please stfu jew

Millenials basically are like women or children and can't be held responsible for signing a contract.

The "average person" has no business in wasting the universities resources.

Saying humans been hard work and challenges is like saying humans need all essential vitamins and nutrients, sure we do but not everyone is going to be capable of working hard and challenging themselves to eat a piece of celery.

You need drones jobs for the drones and the people who just want to live comfortably like many of our boomer fathers did.

Not an argument

The banks make money off of your work with money that has no back. Learn about the federal reserve system of fractional reserve banking.
youtube.com/watch?v=8Fm5NSeVPog
Please spread the news.

Literally what the rest of the world does, mate

>Kike creating an entire thread to recruit desperate kids to join the US Army and fight for Israel

way to go Chaim, you couldn't last 1 post without trying to fuck over goys

So much this

>Most good colleges will lead to at least $100,000 in debt from school tuition alone if you don't get somebody else to pay it for you, not counting shit like housing
>~$40,000/yr is a typical post-college wage slave job with any degree, depending on your field you can go higher
>Unlucky ones will work for near or at minimum wage
>Subtract all living expenses, taxes, etc from wage and add in consumer-based culture causing normies to waste their money even more
>Enslaved to 10-30 years of paying off that debt plus interest

Because too many of them lost years of their life and hundred of grands to get nothing.
Their number is so high it become an important national problem.

If you aren't exceptionally smart with good grades and don't have rich parents, then you basically have 5 choices when you graduate HS. 1) work minimum wage for the rest of your life 2) find a trade job 3) become a loser/criminal 4) take out loans and go to college 5) join the military.

2 year degrees are a meme, totally worthless. You have to go for 4 years to achieve anything and even then a lot of majors don't mean shit unless you have at least a masters(and even then you'll probably have a hard time finding a job that pays what you hoped for).

So, 4 years of school will put anyone at least 80K in debt, or even twice that much. For most people this is a real kick in the balls, and they forget about owning a home for at least 10 years.

My college is free because of the Army, and a lot of people point to the GI bill as a reason for people to not take out loans, but realistically the amount of people that enlist in the military is less than 1% of the population, once they get upwards of 500,000 people they start cutting bonuses and start looking for reasons to kick people out. Besides that a lot of people either just aren't cut out for the military, or wouldn't be accepted by the military for various medical conditions or a criminal record.

So, it's a pretty shitty state of affairs for young people. Go into crazy amounts of debt to get a job that probably doesn't exist.

Is that supposed to make it right?

What does the fact that "everyone else does it" matter when it's actually not even true? Not everyone either joins the military, but a hell of a lot of people are forced back into mommy and daddy's place.

It depends on what you want to do in school. For law, you should go to any school in undergrad, and get good grades. If you are actually doing something that requires a lot of training, you should go to a good school, because they actually teach you something useful. Pre-law and pre-med is indifferent to an undergrad quality of school as long as you got good grades. I was doing math, so going to state school made no sense, because I was taking grad school classes while undergrad, and in state school the professors are shit, so it made zero sense. Also I think your general education suffers if you have core classes in humanities with multiple choice exams. But it's just me.

because they'er fucking stupid, they are so dumb they don't think about the future only me and what i want and feel like right now, in the moment, they have no plans they have no goals they are lazy and entitled self absorbed morons. People who go into college with a plan with an idea of their career path ahead of them and a decent fucking work ethic have no issue paying off their loans and putting their degree to use. The problem is that in high school were told everyone needs to go to college that it's the only way you're going to make it. it's pushed so fucking hard dumb kids fall into the trap. They take out a fuck load in loans and get a shitty degree that has little to no value and spend the rest of their life giving money to the je- (ahem) banks.

Let me explain it to you as anti-Semitically as possible: the debt will not be paid because it cannot be paid.

OP, you have to realize Sup Forums blames everything on the individual.

When the robots start making everyone jobless, you'll soon find them saying shit like, "Well, that 85% of the population should really stop being a bunch of pansies and just get a job! BOOTSTRAPS! HARDWORK!"

They have no concept of forces outside the individual's control.

Their new generation believe that having a work that involves muscle is degrading and then they choose to become slaves, funny isn`t it?

Because it's much easier to complain

this

Sup Forums is full of lolbertarians

THE FUCKING GOVERNMENT STARTED SHELLING OUT MONEY TO ANYONE AND EVERYONE THAT COULD SIGN THEIR NAME
ABOLISH GOVERNMENT LOANS AND THIS WOULDN'T BE A PROBLEM AT ALL. MEME DEGREES YOU RAG ON ALL THE TIME LIKE GENDER STUDIES WOULD NOT EXIST

Pretty sure the lack of physical labor jobs isn't a choice on their part.

>The problem is that in high school were told everyone needs to go to college that it's the only way you're going to make it. it's pushed so fucking hard dumb kids fall into the trap.
So you're going to blame the people that fall into the trap instead of the trap itself. Brilliant.

You mean those jobs that went to China?

>implying not getting a high paying job after paying big for a worthless degree is an unavoidable natural disaster
It is known beforehand how much it costs and a responsible individual will know whether he can handle the risk or not (also taking into account whichever kind of insurance are available for this).

You know, I just have to stop by and say that I'm glad you people are picking up on the automation truth that I've been preaching for the last five years. I really don't care what side of the issue you fall on, I'm just glad people are recognizing it as an inevitable fact.

With enough notice, we may survive.

A bear should watch where he's walking duh. He knows hunters are trying to get him :^)

Student debt is treated oddly. Because of how student loans often interact with the government, the government often prevents defaulting.

So, what you have is essentially what should be "no risk lending." The issue is that when you remove the option of default from the borrower, you essentially inflate the market for education as lenders can now give loans that would be fundamentally unsound in other circumstances.

Institutions have likewise adjusted for this. With all this cheap loan money flooding the marketplace and the amount of positions available at universities remaining fairly consistent, the loans simply bid up the price of tuition thus requiring more people to take on more debt to attend university.

So, what you end up with is a bunch of individuals who have taken usurious loans to buy artificially expensive educations, and most would default, but they can't because of the government.

>mfw I had to work as a janitor during highschool to get some extra income because mom didn't had enough
>mfw worked my ass off during the army and after to earn for a university degree
>mfw I see a bunch of pussy ass millennials demanding free shit when they have never actually worked in their lives

Not meming, I'm legit mad now

I'd say the loans themselves are bringing up the cost of education. The schools are building ridiculously expensive sports facilities and such to attract more students and are paying for them with the loans because they know the students can "afford" it.
Education is essentially becoming a business in the US.

People don't know the future, and likesaid, are often told it's the best thing for them no matter what.

When you say
>a responsible individual
You mean someone who can read the future.

t.Guilian Choquehuanca, Obrero de Construccion Civil

It's cause faggota major in lesbian dance theory taking out a loan. Then they realize after they graduate they have no job for their degree to pay back the loan. Based college students don't have that problem, graduate with a real degree and pay back the loans

Because you don't pick a college/career combo that you can't pay off within a year or two of working that job, faggot

Though I do believe in personal responsibility, I find it atrocious that money movers prey on high school graduates. The government indoctrinates children in school, making them ill prepared for life after school.

nod an argumend :DD

It has nothing to do with knowing the future, you assume the worst case scenario and be honest to yourself about whether you can handle it or not.
Not getting a high paying job after a PhD in womyn studies is not so off the charts unlikely that you could just assume it can't happen.

THIS FUCKING THIS

Underrated.

>kids are brainwashed to equate college with successful life from ages 5-17 because thats how it was for the baby boomers
>kids spend whole childhood working up to good college
>get accepted
>price of school is massively inflated since baby boomer times ("haha i paid for my whole school with 1 summer job sport! you should be able to do it!")
>Literally 10s of thousands of dollars for even a real cheap school like mine (North Texas).
>No way in hell to pay this out of pocket
>have to work some shitty retail job or something to salt away money on the side
>take out a loan with conditions that they dont have to pay until 6 months - 1 year after graduation (a reasonable amount of time to find a job in your field)
>economy is so awful and almost no entry level jobs exist, 99% of jobs want 2-7 years experience
>vast majority of new graduates with bachelors degrees end up unemployed as a result
>people get mad because they finally realize college is a scam for the most part, and bachelors degree does not in fact equal successful life
>spent years working, struggling through school, put yourself in crippling debt
>end up with a piece of paper that means nothing, now you're just a severely overqualified retail cashier

The people who choose option 1 often find their way into jobs slightly above the average income (>$50k/yr) if they're reasonably competent. If they're incompetent and/or lazy, yeah, it's near minimum wage for life.

Financial education is lacking at the high school level in America. I doubt many of them truly understand what they are signing up for.

Also, the cost of tuition has outpaced inflation and wages for a long time. Every year, obtaining a degree becomes a worse deal.

We have free education but its not good as Western schools except a few universities.

Do you mean "socialized" or do you actually keep professors chained up in the lecture hall and cattle prod them if they refuse to teach without getting paid?

>They have no concept of forces outside the individual's control.

Surely taking out a loan is within an individual's control.

You can't blame it entirely on the students, everyone here is basically told nonstop from the time they're 5 years old that college is the only option for them and that it guarantees a good job.

On top of that, because of how much the shit has changed, most parents won't tell their kids to be careful about college because when they were younger it was still a good choice.

That and the outrageous cost of college nowadays ends up with a lot of people getting extremely fucked because they were foolish enough to trust their parents and teachers

15k wouldn't even cover a semester at an ivy league school. Sorry we don't go to shit tier colleges.

Not when it is essentially required to get an education unless your parents are rich or you play sports.

I was told the reason you can't default on student loans is because you can't get knowledge taken out of your brain. Someone can always come for your house or car, but not for an education

It's not required to get an education though.

>Every year, obtaining a degree becomes a worse deal.
That's because they're in such high demand. Best get one sooner rather than later

A university is after all, not a job training facility but a place of higher learning. If certain topics taught at an institution, like the arts, or philosophy don't get you on the path to being CEO, thats ok. A university is for learning of all kinds. Not everyone has to study engineering or finance or business management.

Of course most people are only beginning to understand that the whole "College degree = money" concept only holds true with a degree in something useful to industry.

There are cheap educations available.

My best friend paid virtually nothing for undergrad in maths and is a PhD candidate who is paid to pursue his PhD on top of tuition+expenses being covered. It all depends on the value you bring and what you do with the opportunity. Nobody should be going to college for underwater basket weaving except as a very expensive hobby for rich kids to subsidize useful students.

I suppose it isn't. Of course, when those people are kicked out of their parent's basement, we call them homeless people.

Most homeless people are homeless because of a combination of drug addiction and mental illness, in short;

Not an argument.

A contract is a piece of paper. You can technically default on anything; you can even default on current government student loans, but the government can and will garnish your wages.

Logically, in a situation where there is no collateral being offered for a loan interest rates have to be reasonably steep to warrant the risk, and the lender has to have a strong assurance that their loan will be repaid.

You cannot default on these loans because if you were able to, lenders would not be able to accept the current amount of applicants at the current rates. It's essentially a subsidizing measure for education.

That's assuming they know what the worst case scenario is.

A lot of people go into college thinking that they are guaranteed a job, because that's what people have told them either implicitly or explicitly.

Yet again you are assuming perfect or near-perfect information.

You're right, most people who work shitty dead-end entry level jobs end up finding 4 other people to help pay for a cramped apartment living like a bunch illegal immigrants.

>go to a "shit tier" school
>never ever get a job because you didn't go to Yale or Harvard or Brown or something

such is life in america

It isn't but you have significantly lower chances to be middle class if you don't.
>America

I am pretty sure that they get paid well.And you can get some scholarships depending on your placement.For example if you are in top 5000 and you choose math,physics,chem or biology you get a 2000 TL scholarship.And its almost twice the minimum wage.

None of that is true

The worst case scenario of taking a 100000$ loan without a job is having to pay it back without having a job.
I think even a chimpanzee could figure that out, if an American college student can't, I weep for your country.

most homeless people only get those things later; most homeless people start their homeless career as underagers who are kicked out of home for various reasons.

Reasons that may include not having a high-paying job by the age of 17.

Maybe 50 years ago, things change. Unless you want to go into a few specific careers you don't need an Ivy league education to get a job.

it is literally true, why do you think the blue collar meme is so strong? there are no jobs for white collars who didn't graduate from Ivy League schools.

College loans became guaranteed by the government.

They are not dismissible even in bankruptcy.

They can collect them in perpetuity.

And most of the degrees these idiots borrowed money for have no value in the workplace.

hes right, the pressure you face in America to go to school is literally retarded. My parents literally cant into letting me work a decent government job at their house to make money. Its no take out 20 grand a year to get a degree because theyre already sunk into debt because they were retarded and cant pay back their mortages.

If they get paid it is not "free", because the money has to come from somewhere. You mean socialized, i.e. everybody pays even people who get nothing from it.

Do you mind explaining the difference between community college and "normal" college to some mountain jew ? In terms of price/degree you get/ etc.

The DC Metro area is heinously expensive, but you can easily rent a large house or townhouse (the latter being Metro-accessible to boot) with 3+ bedrooms for $700/head if you're living with others.

People who are worried about debt don't see college as an investment in their future and should not be going to college.

Unfortunately in America you're branded a failure if you don't go to college so highscool students get corralled into them like cattle by their guidance counselors.

Show me a good job for which you don't need a college level education.
>Inb4 muh trades